List Mgmt. DFA targets

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AmellyPies said:
Not the point, If they can still play at a level good enough, they play.
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Brisbane apparently thought he couldn't for them so makes me wonder why you think he can for us. Who does he take games away from? Scharenberg?, Aish?, Maynard, Oxley?, Marsh?, Langdon? Sinclair?.. why would you want to play a 30 year old average footballer, who has just been delisted by the team that finished second last? Why would you want to play him ahead of these exciting young players who we need to develop and get games into? Or are you another who believes in recruiting players for the VFL side?
 
doodles98 said:
Brisbane apparently thought he couldn't for them so makes me wonder why you think he can for us. Who does he take games away from? Scharenberg?, Aish?, Maynard, Oxley?, Marsh?, Langdon? Sinclair?.. why would you want to play a 30 year old average footballer, who has just been delisted by the team that finished second last? Why would you want to play him ahead of these exciting young players who we need to develop and get games into? Or are you another who believes in recruiting players for the VFL side?
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If those young players you mentioned are good enough, they'll get games over him. If they don't it's their problem.

You also have to consider, Adcock doesn't have to play in the backline, Injuries can happen and he costs next to nothing.
 

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JollyBallsUp said:
Adcock is not in Swans class level. Swan is a aging A grader whilst Adcock at his best was a B grader who is currently playing as a C grader.
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I explained this in another comment, not the point on how they stack up to one and other, Its if they can still play at an elite level, they can keep going.
 
Knightmare said:
His standard of performance still is of best 22 quality. It didn't look like it this year, but he was played out of position (as a half forward). So I'd put a line through his performances this year and pay attention to who he was 2014 and earlier when assessing his on field capabilities.

Adcock I'd probably consider starting 18 going into the season. But as we saw with a number of our veterans through 2014, if the young ones improve enough he could be displaced from our best 22 which could plausibly happen with Adcock also.

And even in that scenario. Great veteran leadership and depth as a worst case scenario.
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Who would you take out in your best 22 for Adcock?
 
mike123 said:
Who would you take out in your best 22 for Adcock?
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You don't have to. A list of 40 players will compete for the 22 playing each week.
Clubs require depth going into the 30's if they are to play finals footy.
For example Caff is probably now rated 25-33 i.e a depth player.
You need those type as a back up, to help win games through the year, when players tire or injuries creep up.
 
MyManLynch said:
You don't have to. A list of 40 players will compete for the 22 playing each week.
Clubs require depth going into the 30's if they are to play finals footy.
For example Caff is probably now rated 25-33 i.e a depth player.
You need those type as a back up, to help win games through the year, when players tire or injuries creep up.
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I get that, was just asking Knighta what player he'd take out from his specific best 22.
 
Knightmare said:
I'm hearing and liking the recent Jed Adcock to Collingwood rumours. Great list addition as someone who can improve our ever improving best 22 and offer some veteran leadership down back with a relative lack of veteran leadership outside of Pendlebury on our list, Adcock with a point to prove would be a great list fit.

Given it's a shallow draft and given our lack of success with depth types, Adcock as someone who can definitely still play along with his leadership qualities as a previous captain would be a perfect list addition.
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Hmmm.
Personally I would probably go after Gorringe first, just because of the age difference - he could be ruck insurance for a number of years, but the more I think about Adcock, the more i think he could be useful for us.

Ive been a fan of Adcock for a while, but thino he just played his best footy at the wrong time for Brisbane. 5 years older and he couldve played in a flag, 5 years younger and they would be desperate to keep him. I can understand Brisbanes decision to delist him, though i disagree because i think he could be very useful in their leadeship group right now.

When he first came onto the market I immediately thought he was too old and doesn't fit our list profile, but with how our trade periods gone, i think that might have changed. We have added top end talent that should have us pushing up the ladder, but have lost quite a bit of depth.

Although talented enough to be in our 22, i wouldnt want Adcock being prioritised for games at the expense of Marsh/Scharenburg/Maynard, but he would be great as veteran depth and leadership that can come in to the backline whenever required.

Also, if Oxley does walk to Brisbane in the PSD, then getting Adcock back would be very good returns.
 
mike123 said:
Who would you take out in your best 22 for Adcock?
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In the immediate from my best 22 probably Scharenberg.

Leaving Moore, Scharenberg, Aish and Broomhead as those "name" young guys I would with the addition of Adcock be leaving out of my best 22 for round 1.

That doesn't mean that won't change over the course of the year and if any of those guys perform strong no reason a Varcoe, Fasolo, Langdon, Greenwood, Witts or whoever can't get passed by.
 
didaksrightfoot said:
Hmmm.
Personally I would probably go after Gorringe first, just because of the age difference - he could be ruck insurance for a number of years, but the more I think about Adcock, the more i think he could be useful for us.

Ive been a fan of Adcock for a while, but thino he just played his best footy at the wrong time for Brisbane. 5 years older and he couldve played in a flag, 5 years younger and they would be desperate to keep him. I can understand Brisbanes decision to delist him, though i disagree because i think he could be very useful in their leadeship group right now.

When he first came onto the market I immediately thought he was too old and doesn't fit our list profile, but with how our trade periods gone, i think that might have changed. We have added top end talent that should have us pushing up the ladder, but have lost quite a bit of depth.

Although talented enough to be in our 22, i wouldnt want Adcock being prioritised for games at the expense of Marsh/Scharenburg/Maynard, but he would be great as veteran depth and leadership that can come in to the backline whenever required.

Also, if Oxley does walk to Brisbane in the PSD, then getting Adcock back would be very good returns.
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Gorringe doesn't excite me and offers objectively nothing as a ruckman who would behind Grundy, Witts and Cox receive no senior games. As a rookie I would not look to add Gorringe with our list filled with young ruckmen, with a second young ruckman already having joined our rookie list this offseason. Grundy, Witts and Cox all are suitable number one ruckmen and more than enough ruck depth, with Moore, White and Gault as required all able to play the relief ruck role.

In the scenario we add Adcock. The priority would not be him receiving games. If he dominates. He will earn games. If the young ones dominate/improve they have the opportunity to plausibly pass him by. Though that probably isn't right away with Adcock still productive and from all reports highly motivated to play on for a few more seasons.

Last year Adcock was poor because he played at half forward. It's not his position and was poor utilisation by Brisbane.

The important factor with Adcock other than the fact he can still play is the leadership. That's what we need from him most.

Also why do you mention Oxley walking into the preseason draft? He is still on the club list? Have there been any particular rumours suggesting this?
 
Knightmare said:
In the immediate from my best 22 probably Scharenberg.

Leaving Moore, Scharenberg, Aish and Broomhead as those "name" young guys I would with the addition of Adcock be leaving out of my best 22 for round 1.

That doesn't mean that won't change over the course of the year and if any of those guys perform strong no reason a Varcoe, Fasolo, Langdon, Greenwood, Witts or whoever can't get passed by.
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Why Leave Moore out. He is at least as good as White
 

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TradeDraft said:
Why Leave Moore out. He is at least as good as White
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I have Reid and Cloke as my forwards and Grundy and Witts as my rucks. Marsh and Brown as my key defenders.

Moore can work his way into that team over the course of the season, or may well pass a Witts by with a strong preseason.

But on immediate performance. Given he is only at this point a goal a game forward, he from round one probably if we're looking for a top four position is not likely to start the season with him in our best side.
 
Knightmare said:
Gorringe doesn't excite me and offers objectively nothing as a ruckman who would behind Grundy, Witts and Cox receive no senior games. As a rookie I would not look to add Gorringe with our list filled with young ruckmen, with a second young ruckman already having joined our rookie list this offseason. Grundy, Witts and Cox all are suitable number one ruckmen and more than enough ruck depth, with Moore, White and Gault as required all able to play the relief ruck role.

In the scenario we add Adcock. The priority would not be him receiving games. If he dominates. He will earn games. If the young ones dominate/improve they have the opportunity to plausibly pass him by. Though that probably isn't right away with Adcock still productive and from all reports highly motivated to play on for a few more seasons.

Last year Adcock was poor because he played at half forward. It's not his position and was poor utilisation by Brisbane.

The important factor with Adcock other than the fact he can still play is the leadership. That's what we need from him most.

Also why do you mention Oxley walking into the preseason draft? He is still on the club list? Have there been any particular rumours suggesting this?
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Agree with everything re: Adcock.

Re: Gorringe. Personally i don't have much hope of Cox (or Wyatt) ever being able to provide much at AFL level (should include Gault there). Right now, Grundy and Witts are our only AFL level ruckmen. (with White, and soon Moore, able to backup, but hopefully never as a solo ruck). Gorringe would automatically be 3rd in our ruck depth and should stay at that level for a few years. In the even that one of our rucks gets injured, (or as can occasionally happen, both), I would much rather have someone like Gorringe come in than any of those alternatives. It may be a bit of a luxury, but if we are just talking about a rookie spot, one i would want to take.

And for Oxley - nothing new has happened. I am just a bit cautious/anxious that nothing has happened with his contract, and as we get closer to the deadline, wonder if that is because hes already decided what he wants to do. (and with Brisbane having pick 2 in the PSD, even if we knew he wanted to walk, there wouldn't have been much leverage in including him in any tradr discussions)... Probably absolutely nothing in it - just my worry.
 
Knightmare said:
I have Reid and Cloke as my forwards and Grundy and Witts as my rucks. Marsh and Brown as my key defenders.

Moore can work his way into that team over the course of the season, or may well pass a Witts by with a strong preseason.

But on immediate performance. Given he is only at this point a goal a game forward, he from round one probably if we're looking for a top four position is not likely to start the season with him in our best side.
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The Difference between you and Me. I have Reid Down Back where I think is his Best Postion.

I don't have Grundy and Witts in the Same side as well as I think we will be way too slow/

So I would have Forward line of Cloke,Moore and White/Howe
 
didaksrightfoot said:
Agree with everything re: Adcock.

Re: Gorringe. Personally i don't have much hope of Cox (or Wyatt) ever being able to provide much at AFL level (should include Gault there). Right now, Grundy and Witts are our only AFL level ruckmen. (with White, and soon Moore, able to backup, but hopefully never as a solo ruck). Gorringe would automatically be 3rd in our ruck depth and should stay at that level for a few years. In the even that one of our rucks gets injured, (or as can occasionally happen, both), I would much rather have someone like Gorringe come in than any of those alternatives. It may be a bit of a luxury, but if we are just talking about a rookie spot, one i would want to take.

And for Oxley - nothing new has happened. I am just a bit cautious/anxious that nothing has happened with his contract, and as we get closer to the deadline, wonder if that is because hes already decided what he wants to do. (and with Brisbane having pick 2 in the PSD, even if we knew he wanted to walk, there wouldn't have been much leverage in including him in any tradr discussions)... Probably absolutely nothing in it - just my worry.
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Where our views differ somewhat is our levels of optimism regarding Cox.

I loved Cox's improvement over the course of the season. Tap work improved. That last month of the season forward of centre he was a genuine marking and goalkicking threat. Skills are fine. He needs to get stronger and better around the ground. But his rate of improvement has been such, along with his play forward of centre being the better than Grundy and Witts that I would not be at all surprised if Cox was to pass Witts by as that second best ruckman on our club list. It's a speculative call, but I don't see Cox being all that far off and my expectation is that he at some point or another receives senior opportunities (with my respect for his rate of improvement and reported work ethic on that level).

Nothing is guaranteed with Cox I'll be the first to concede. But my level of optimism regarding Cox as a genuine option is high with his height, tap work and marking forward of centre (particularly contested and 1v1) and straight goalkicking is enough to work with and make me think he has a shot.
 
TradeDraft said:
The Difference between you and Me. I have Reid Down Back where I think is his Best Postion.

I don't have Grundy and Witts in the Same side as well as I think we will be way too slow/

So I would have Forward line of Cloke,Moore and White/Howe
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Overall my view is if Witts and Grundy don't work as a combination that's when Moore plays that relief ruck and mostly forward role, which would lead to again Reid and Cloke in that same front half.

White I'd rather not have to see in the 1s which by default places Reid forward.

The only way Reid back would work is if Grundy and Witts share the ruck load (perhaps Cox could be a further alternative to Witts) and Moore would play alongside Cloke as that other full time key forward.
 
doodles98 said:
Brisbane apparently thought he couldn't for them so makes me wonder why you think he can for us. Who does he take games away from? Scharenberg?, Aish?, Maynard, Oxley?, Marsh?, Langdon? Sinclair?.. why would you want to play a 30 year old average footballer, who has just been delisted by the team that finished second last? Why would you want to play him ahead of these exciting young players who we need to develop and get games into? Or are you another who believes in recruiting players for the VFL side?
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In total agreement don't waste a pick on him. Better a young player to develop
 
Knightmare said:
Where our views differ somewhat is our levels of optimism regarding Cox.

I loved Cox's improvement over the course of the season. Tap work improved. That last month of the season forward of centre he was a genuine marking and goalkicking threat. Skills are fine. He needs to get stronger and better around the ground. But his rate of improvement has been such, along with his play forward of centre being the better than Grundy and Witts that I would not be at all surprised if Cox was to pass Witts by as that second best ruckman on our club list. It's a speculative call, but I don't see Cox being all that far off and my expectation is that he at some point or another receives senior opportunities (with my respect for his rate of improvement and reported work ethic on that level).

Nothing is guaranteed with Cox I'll be the first to concede. But my level of optimism regarding Cox as a genuine option is high with his height, tap work and marking forward of centre (particularly contested and 1v1) and straight goalkicking is enough to work with and make me think he has a shot.
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Good to hear your assessment of him.
As someone who lives in WA, i dont get to see VFL games, but do watchthe videos and clubs that get uploaded to the collingwood site... More than happy to accept your assessment as much more valid than what ive seen from the videos.
 
Pies63 said:
In total agreement don't waste a pick on him. Better a young player to develop
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So you prefer to add 6 more 18 year olds to a very young list?
We have lost a bit of experience this year...our depth is more shallow than previous years.
A DFA & or mature age draftee may assist. Then can still add 4-5 new 18 year olds from draft.
 
Bard said:
Actually Adcock is another decent option but not directly comparable to Lake as a) Lake is a KPP which are much harder to find and develop quickly and b) Lakes best prior to being recruited was far far far better than Adcock's.
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I was only using Lake as an example age wise.
Yeah Lake is a different type of player and a KPP.
I have seen Adcock play some blinders.
He's touched us up a few times.
He is not a battler. He can seriously play.
 
JollyBallsUp said:
Lake was not sacked by his team, but the bulldogs more or less entertained a trade because the draft pick was to enticing. Lake is also a KPP that could play gorillas. Adcock does not offer anything from a playing sense that will help the team win matches.
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Adcock is not a dud & everyone is baffled why he was de-listed.
Only stupid Brisbane can make such a decision.
He will be picked up by someone.
 
Vampire013 said:
Adcock is not a dud & everyone is baffled why he was de-listed.
Only stupid Brisbane can make such a decision.
He will be picked up by someone.
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This is entirely me reading between the lines, but I don't think he was enamoured with the current leadership there.
 

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List Mgmt. DFA targets

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