List Mgmt. Draft Night 2 - What to do with picks 23,37 and 58

[Keys]

First off, ignoring the possibility of trading picks with the myriad of options that entails, the reality of academy and father/son bidding means that come night two of the draft those picks will likely fall around 28,38,48 or thereabouts

It’s an area of the draft that is particularly even and the top WA talents like Curtin, Tholstrup, Hardeman and Collard are likely to be gone based on most predictions. Other than Curtin, it is possible one or more of the others might slide as may other predicted R1 fancies like Schoenmaker, A Reid, DeMattia and Roberts

So in the absence of any sliders, who might be in the frame at those picks?


Small-medium Forwards

• Jack Delean (SA) - 185cm, 75kg Range 25-40
• Phoenix Gothard (NSW) - 178cm, 72kg Range 25-40
• Koen Sanchez (WA) - 177cm, 69kg Range 25-40
• Ashton Moir (SA) - 187cm, 85kg Range 25-40

Tall Forwards

• Luke Lloyd (Vic Metro) - 193cm, 84kg Range 30-50
• Logan Morris (Vic Metro) - 191cm, 90kg Range 30-50

Small-medium Defenders

• Angus Hastie (Vic Country) - 190cm, 74kg Range 25-40
• Tew Jiath (Vic Country) - 188cm, 72kg Range R2
• Luamon Lual (Vic Country) - 182cm, 72kg Range 25-40
• Nathan Philactides (Vic Metro) - 179cm, 80kg Range 40-60

Tall Defenders

• Zane Zakostelsky (WA) - 196cm, 89kg Range 30-50
• Will Patton (SA) - 192cm, 79kg Range 40-60

Midfield

• Charlie Edwards (Vic Metro) - 191cm, 85kg Range 20-30
• George Stevens (Vic Country) - 189cm, 101kg Range 20-40
• Cooper Simpson (Vic Country) - 181cm, 79kg Range 25-40
• Joel Freijah (Vic Country) - 190cm, 88kg Range 30-50
• Clay Hall (WA) - 189cm, 87kg Range 35-50
• Aiden O’Driscoll - 175cm, 70kg Range 40-60
• Tarkyn O’Leary - 178cm, 70kg Range 40-60
• Kane McAuliffe - 187cm, 86kg Range 40-60


Ruck

• Will Green (Vic Metro) - 204cm, 93kg Range 20-30
• Taylor Goad (SA) - 206cm, 97kg Range 25-40
• Mitch Edwards (WA) - 206cm, 89kg Range 25-40

Inevitably some of these names will be gone in the first round and it’s not an exhaustive list but it does indicate there’s some good option’s across all 3 picks should we hold them as they currently stand

Personally, I think Zakostelsky is a priority to add to our KPD stocks so taking him with our 2nd overall pick makes sense

The other two picks should probably be a running defender and a midfielder as I think those positions are more of a need than a ruck or small forward. The two tall forwards are also tweeners when we already have Waterman and Maric

That said if Moir is still there at our 4th pick I wouldn’t be unhappy if we took a punt on talent taking into account our 5th pick will be in the mid 50’s if we choose to use it

Really important that we nail these picks. Who do people like

 

[BeornJ]

I'm not a draft watcher but we've had success picking tall defenders with later picks and besides Bazzo we are light on for KPD. ZZ sounds good for that.

Other than him, we appear to be no good at unearthing midfield talent outside the top 20 so I would go best available in any position.

 

[Wce17]

Havery johnston is another one I'd be looking at. Mid/Fwd rated in the 30-50 range.

 

[Doashuey]

There is something about Kane McAuliffe I like. He's my smokey.

 

[Wooshaaaa]

In order of availability.

Charlie Edwards
ZZ
Joel freijah
Clay Hall

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[Bleedblueandgold]

Keep our start of 2nd round pick if Edwards or a slider is available, otherwise if the remaining talent pool is even split the pick.
One of the picks should still be ahead of Freo's pick to avoid losing Collard to them.

 

[Bender_]

I feel like Keys keeps making more threads so it's harder for me to stay across possible future personal humiliation memes from pantskyle and BeornJ, with a sprinkle of ridiculousness from Carbine Chaos.

Working full time here just to keep up.

 

[Bleedblueandgold]

While we're at it, someone might as well start a thread for the rookie draft, PSD and potential SSP signings now.

 

[Patron]

After hypothetically drafting Reid, I reckon our needs in this part of the draft would be:
1. KPD, KPF
2. HBF/outside mid
3. Ruck

We don’t really have the picks to fill these holes properly but I reckon we will be able to get a few options in some of those roles with promise.

28* - Would hope a hardeman, Archer Reid, Schoenmaker, Jiath will be available. Archer Reid is probably our only chance to grab a KPF in this draft with AFL potential, but there are plenty of KPD options. We need to find a designated kicker off half back.

38* and 48* - will have similar group of players available, and I would hope we might get two of ZZ, Hastie, Edwards/Goad, Moir.

In general, I want to go tall this draft because that’s the weak spot in our rebuild having got Ginbey, hewett, Reid already.

Given the expected availability of this draft I would be disappointed if we didn’t take a KPD and Ruck at these picks.


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[BeornJ]

I feel like Keys keeps making more threads so it's harder for me to stay across possible future personal humiliation memes from pantskyle and BeornJ, with a sprinkle of ridiculousness from Carbine Chaos.

Working full time here just to keep up.

Oh that reminds me....

Bender_ ....

 

[Hoskin300]

After hypothetically drafting Reid, I reckon our needs in this part of the draft would be:
1. KPD, KPF
2. HBF/outside mid
3. Ruck

We don’t really have the picks to fill these holes properly but I reckon we will be able to get a few options in some of those roles with promise.

28* - Would hope a hardeman, Archer Reid, Schoenmaker, Jiath will be available. Archer Reid is probably our only chance to grab a KPF in this draft with AFL potential, but there are plenty of KPD options. We need to find a designated kicker off half back.

38* and 48* - will have similar group of players available, and I would hope we might get two of ZZ, Hastie, Edwards/Goad, Moir.

In general, I want to go tall this draft because that’s the weak spot in our rebuild having got Ginbey, hewett, Reid already.

Given the expected availability of this draft I would be disappointed if we didn’t take a KPD and Ruck at these picks.


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Surely OM and HBF are of greater requirement than key position players. If we are looking five years ahead we already have one elite key forward and most likely Barrass is still around. We dont have an elite outside mid or HBF now let alone in five years. Outside players have a huge influence on the modern game when considering the two grand finalists.

At 28 we probably will only have Jiath left to pick out of that mid range group. At 38 we should grab delean / friejah / hall. At 48 O'Driscoll could be a good pick.

 

[Rowan18]

Surely OM and HBF are of greater requirement than key position players. If we are looking five years ahead we already have one elite key forward and most likely Barrass is still around. We dont have an elite outside mid or HBF now let alone in five years. Outside players have a huge influence on the modern game when considering the two grand finalists.

At 28 we probably will only have Jiath left to pick out of that mid range group. At 38 we should grab delean / friejah / hall. At 48 O'Driscoll could be a good pick.

What is an OM?

We desperately need to draft KPD now as they can take 4 or 5 years to be reliable. Freo and North made the mistake of leaving this late and have pretty much needed to start a second build.

 

[twadds]

What is an OM?

We desperately need to draft KPD now as they can take 4 or 5 years to be reliable. Freo and North made the mistake of leaving this late and have pretty much needed to start a second build.

Outside Mid I’d guess

 

[BeornJ]

Omnipotent Magician

 

[Hoskin300]

What is an OM?

We desperately need to draft KPD now as they can take 4 or 5 years to be reliable. Freo and North made the mistake of leaving this late and have pretty much needed to start a second build.

Freo and north restarting rebuilds has nothing to do with not taking KPDs. Freo would be elite if they didn't hemorrhage very good midfielders and found a key forward. Not to mention their key defensive stocks have been elite so not sure what you are talking about there. North have been terrible because their midfield has been terrible.

Just have to look at Collingwoods and Brisbanes gameplay in the GF to see which positions are important in the modern game.

Regardless we are already using list spots on Bazzo, Edwards and Rotham and have Barrass for another four years. Would much rather move on Edwards and Rotham on before committing to another key defender.

The fact we have Gaff, Hunt and Chesser as our outside mids is a far greater concern.

 

[Rowan18]

Freo and north restarting rebuilds has nothing to do with not taking KPDs. Freo would be elite if they didn't hemorrhage very good midfielders and found a key forward. Not to mention their key defensive stocks have been elite so not sure what you are talking about there. North have been terrible because their midfield has been terrible.

Just have to look at Collingwoods and Brisbanes gameplay in the GF to see which positions are important in the modern game.

Regardless we are already using list spots on Bazzo, Edwards and Rotham and have Barrass for another four years. Would much rather move on Edwards and Rotham on before committing to another key defender.

The fact we have Gaff, Hunt and Chesser as our outside mids is a far greater concern.

Brissie is stacked with KPP and arguably win that GF if the umps didn't rob them. Either way, it was less than a goal so they put up a great performance.

Collingwood has done exceptionally well with their tactics and coaching. The AFL seems to always be very slow to adapt to a winning style, but let's see what happens next year now they have the target on their back. We achieved the opposite to them in 2018 (gun KPP average mids) and they'd pick our gameplan apart by round 6.

 

[Patron]

Surely OM and HBF are of greater requirement than key position players. If we are looking five years ahead we already have one elite key forward and most likely Barrass is still around. We dont have an elite outside mid or HBF now let alone in five years. Outside players have a huge influence on the modern game when considering the two grand finalists.

At 28 we probably will only have Jiath left to pick out of that mid range group. At 38 we should grab delean / friejah / hall. At 48 O'Driscoll could be a good pick.

KPF and KPD take 5-7 years to really get into it.
Rebounders and OM's are some of the quickest - 2-4 years.

That's a big part of it for me, but we also have some players like Chesser and Hough who are rated. I don't think we have that for our 2 future KPD spots and our 1 unfilled KPF spot. I also think it's optimistic to expect Barrass to be around much after 30 given his durability.

 

[Hoskin300]

Brissie is stacked with KPP and arguably win that GF if the umps didn't rob them. Either way, it was less than a goal so they put up a great performance.

Collingwood has done exceptionally well with their tactics and coaching. The AFL seems to always be very slow to adapt to a winning style, but let's see what happens next year now they have the target on their back. We achieved the opposite to them in 2018 (gun KPP average mids) and they'd pick our gameplan apart by round 6.

Brisbane traded in Daniher. Outside of that they have drafted one elite key position player (Andrews). They had guys like Hipwood, Gardiner and Lester as their key position players.

2018 had a completely different set of rules compared to the following years.

 

[Hoskin300]

KPF and KPD take 5-7 years to really get into it.
Rebounders and OM's are some of the quickest - 2-4 years.

That's a big part of it for me, but we also have some players like Chesser and Hough who are rated. I don't think we have that for our 2 future KPD spots and our 1 unfilled KPF spot. I also think it's optimistic to expect Barrass to be around much after 30 given his durability.

But we already have Allen as an elite KPF. Not to mention four other KPFs on the list.

Your argument is that it takes 5-7 years for key position players to develop but you are already wanting to write off Maric, JWilliams, Bazzo and HEdwards when they have been around for 2-4 years? BWilliams will play more forward this year as well. Cant just keep adding key position talent when we already have players developing in those positions.

Under the age of 25 we have like Hough, Chesser and Burgiel across the half back line and wings. This is a huge hole in the list. Bazzo and Maric have shown just as much if not more than Chesser.

Barrass has also barely had a long term injury in his career. Which is saying something when we have had incompetent S+C team.

 

[Patron]

But we already have Allen as an elite KPF. Not to mention four other KPFs on the list.

Your argument is that it takes 5-7 years for key position players to develop but you are already wanting to write off Maric, JWilliams, Bazzo and HEdwards when they have been around for 2-4 years? BWilliams will play more forward this year as well. Cant just keep adding key position talent when we already have players developing in those positions.

Under the age of 25 we have like Hough, Chesser and Burgiel across the half back line and wings. This is a huge hole in the list. Bazzo and Maric have shown just as much if not more than Chesser.

Barrass has also barely had a long term injury in his career. Which is saying something when we have had incompetent S+C team.

I didn't say anywhere I was writing off any of those players in fact, I never even mentioned them.

Regardless, I don't think any of the young players you mentioned are suited or able to be a true number 1 KPF or KPD at AFL level.

Maric - clearly a 3rd tall type.
J Williams - could get there as a stay at home FF, but atm is more a KPF/Ruck.
Bazzo - We'll be lucky if he makes it as a 2nd tall defender, projects more as a 3rd tall.
B Williams - is 23 with his best season as a ruck, may play fwd more this year but hasn't shown much up forward other than taking the occasional clunk.

Allen is our only solid true KPF/KPD option U28. It's a hole on our list.

 

[Hoskin300]

I didn't say anywhere I was writing off any of those players in fact, I never even mentioned them.

Regardless, I don't think any of the young players you mentioned are suited or able to be a true number 1 KPF or KPD at AFL level.

Maric - clearly a 3rd tall type.
J Williams - could get there as a stay at home FF, but atm is more a KPF/Ruck.
Bazzo - We'll be lucky if he makes it as a 2nd tall defender, projects more as a 3rd tall.
B Williams - is 23 with his best season as a ruck, may play fwd more this year but hasn't shown much up forward other than taking the occasional clunk.

Allen is our only solid true KPF/KPD option U28. It's a hole on our list.

The difference is we actually have players already developing in the key post positions. Theres a big difference between having questionable players developing and no players developing. Saying Allen is our only solid option below 28 is extremely unreasonable.

Bazzo is in his second year and had his mum die in the preseason. It makes no sense to rule him out yet.
HEdwards is a big question mark but he is still a 200cm tall that has shown glimpses at AFL level. Also has been injured.
BWilliams will play as a second ruck next year, he hasn't shown much there because he currently doesn't play in the forward line. Maric is 6 months into his AFL career, is 195cm tall and is playing at a very respectable level for a young key forward. No reason why he cant make it as a second tall forward.
A forward line of Allen, Maric and BWilliams has the same potential as the key forwards Collingwood and Brisbanes played in the GF.

Teams very rarely win flags on the back of having two super star key forwards or two superstar key backs. The eagles are a prime example of that. One of the best spines ever seen and we only won one flag.

Gaff was our worst player this year and was undroppable because there was zero depth beneath him. Every AFL team plays three wingers in the 22 and we have three on the entire list of which 0 are great. Currently we have five key forward and five key defenders of which three are elite. No clue how anyone can look at that and say we need more key position players.

 

[Avalor]

The difference is we actually have players already developing in the key post positions. Theres a big difference between having questionable players developing and no players developing. Saying Allen is our only solid option below 28 is extremely unreasonable.

Bazzo is in his second year and had his mum die in the preseason. It makes no sense to rule him out yet.
HEdwards is a big question mark but he is still a 200cm tall that has shown glimpses at AFL level. Also has been injured.
BWilliams will play as a second ruck next year, he hasn't shown much there because he currently doesn't play in the forward line. Maric is 6 months into his AFL career, is 195cm tall and is playing at a very respectable level for a young key forward. No reason why he cant make it as a second tall forward.
A forward line of Allen, Maric and BWilliams has the same potential as the key forwards Collingwood and Brisbanes played in the GF.

Teams very rarely win flags on the back of having two super star key forwards or two superstar key backs. The eagles are a prime example of that. One of the best spines ever seen and we only won one flag.

Gaff was our worst player this year and was undroppable because there was zero depth beneath him. Every AFL team plays three wingers in the 22 and we have three on the entire list of which 0 are great. Currently we have five key forward and five key defenders of which three are elite. No clue how anyone can look at that and say we need more key position players.

We definitely do need some elite winger/half forward material. Gaff and Sheed don't cut it there anymore - need speedsters who tear up and down the outer areas of the ground.

 

[Knifey Spoony]

Any chance we pick up Livingston, possibly as a Cat B? I like the cut of his jib from the little I have seen.

 

[Art OF war]

Any chance we pick up Livingston, possibly as a Cat B? I like the cut of his jib from the little I have seen.

How many Cat Bs are we allowed? Have we signed up the other 2? Don’t mind especially if it’s Cat B

 

[Keys]

How many Cat Bs are we allowed? Have we signed up the other 2? Don’t mind especially if it’s Cat B

We’re allowed to have 2

Woodcock in the west has reported that Baker and Dewar have both been, or will be offered extensions

He’s on an island with that news though as nobody else has reported it and, most importantly, there’s been nothing from the club

Assuming he’s right we could transfer one, or both, to the regular rookie list opening up a cat b spot (or two)

Keep in mind that we only have 6 positions available across all list categories, of which a minimum of 4 will be used in the main draft

So the question becomes are there two better options than Livingstone we can access either through a very late draft pick, a rookie draft pick(s) or an SSP signing post draft

I suspect there is better options