Draw Statistics

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Ron The Bear said:
<= 6|Player|M|W|L|D|Club(s)|Career
\43|Nankervis, Bruce|253|119|134|0|Ge|1970-1983
\42|Blakey, John|359|190|169|0|Fi,NM|1985-2002
\37|Archer, Glenn|311|183|128|0|NM|1992-2007
\37|Carter, Rod|293|126|167|0|Fi,Sy|1974-1990
\37|McAlpine, Ivan|179|71|108|0|WB,Ha|1927-1937
\36|Bisset, George|207|92|115|0|WB,Co|1963-1974
\36|Edwards, Tyson|321|175|146|0|Ad|1995-2010
\36|McLeod, Andrew|340|185|155|0|Ad|1995-2010
\36|Thompson, Scott|308|172|136|0|Me,Ad|2001-2017
\35|Lynch, Quinten|227|128|99|0|WC,Co|2002-2013
\35|Stokes, Mathew|200|145|55|0|Ge,Es|2006-2016
\34|Carey, Wayne|272|164|108|0|NM,Ad|1989-2004
\34|Martello, Alan|255|168|87|0|Ha,Ri|1970-1983
\34|McKay, Hec|152|83|69|0|Sy|1926-1935
\33|Bell, Peter|286|156|130|0|Fr,NM,Fr|1995-2008
\33|Clarke, David E.|211|102|109|0|Ge,Ca|1971-1982
\33|Torney, Hugh|173|83|90|0|Es|1933-1943
\32|Bickley, Mark|272|138|134|0|Ad|1991-2003
\32|McCartney, Jason|182|100|82|0|Co,Ad,NM|1991-2003
\32|Moore, Kelvin D.|300|201|99|0|Ha|1970-1984
\32|Pavlich, Matthew|353|170|183|0|Fr|2000-2016
\32|Wright, Roy|195|87|108|0|Ri|1946-1959
\31|Blake, Rod|176|86|90|0|Ge|1971-1983
\31|Gaspar, Darren|228|97|131|0|Sy,Ri|1994-2007
\31|Goodwin, Simon|275|155|120|0|Ad|1997-2010
\31|Morrow, Alan|163|96|67|0|St|1957-1966
\31|Neal, Robert|220|105|115|0|Ge,St|1974-1988
\31|Neitz, David|306|140|166|0|Me|1993-2008
\30|Bell, George|120|52|68|0|Es|1933-1942
\30|Hawkins, Jack|182|88|94|0|Ge|1973-1981
\30|Rutten, Ben|229|129|100|0|Ad|2003-2014
\30|Scanlan, Joe|148|75|73|0|Sy|1923-1931
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And now if you could sort the tables by what colour underwear the players were wearing in the drawn game that would be great...





Joking, but very impressive response time! Thanks for the info, very interesting.
 
Tarkyn_24 said:
Sneaks into the top 20 then but I was expecting him to be much closer to the top!

Surprised Presti hadn’t played in a draw before that same match, must’ve missed our draw with the Dogs in the late 90s.

Intrigued if you can come up with a list of most games decided by 6 points or less without ever playing in a draw? Just to see who has come closest without actually nabbing one.
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Presti debuted in 1996, Collingwood's last drawn game against the Bulldogs was in 1995.

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/S/Simon_Prestigiacomo.html
https://afltables.com/afl/teams/collingwood/allgames_tm.html#7
 

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Ron The Bear said:
1. 7 - Bill Hutchison (Es), Barry Davis (Es,NM), Brad Johnson (WB)

2. least career games for x draws:

Code: 
D Gms Ratio Player       Club(s)
--------------------------------
1   1  1.00 Ted Flynn         Es
    1  1.00 Sid O'Neill       Fi
    1  1.00 Ron Larking       Un
    1  1.00 Tom Hanson        Ca
    1  1.00 Arthur E.Harrison Ca
    1  1.00 Colin Dufty       Co
    1  1.00 Eric Crompton     WB
    1  1.00 George Kanngieser Co
    1  1.00 Ted Wellington    NM
    1  1.00 Ray Davies        Fi
    1  1.00 Garry Cameron     NM
2   7  3.50 Dick Maynard      Es
    7  3.50 Harry Bruce       Me
    7  3.50 Jeff McGee        Sy
3  20  6.67 Tom M.Jones       Ca
4  50 12.50 Bert R.Taylor     Fi
5 105 21.00 Jack Wells     St,Ca
6 116 19.33 Viv Valentine     Ca
7 289 41.29 Barry Davis    Es,NM

3. 38 players have played in consecutive draws (spread over 9 separate matches). The last were St.Kilda's Jeff Sarau and Russell Tweeddale in 1977.

4. Also R1 1914, R5 1921, R6 1944 and R7 1977.

5. Carlton, R1 & 2 1911; Carlton again, R4 & 5 1921

6. someone else can do that one. :)
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Ron The Bear said:
536 Adelaide v St R14 1994
221 Western Bulldogs v Ri R5 2008
182 North Melbourne v Ri R16 2009
172 Brisbane v Es R19 2009
169 Hawthorn v St R17 2010
153 Collingwood v St GF 2010
145 Melbourne v Sy R1 2011
107 Port Adelaide v Ri R23 2012
106 Sydney v Fr R8 2013
105 Richmond v PA R23 2012
100 Fremantle v Sy R8 2013
58 Essendon v Ca R23 2014, Carlton v Es R23 2014
45 West Coast v GC R18 2015
41 Gold Coast v WC R18 2015
37 St.Kilda v Ge R21 2015
0 GWS v Ge R15 2017, Geelong v GWS R15 2017
(332 Fitzroy v Ca R1 1982, 90 Un v Fi R18 1909)
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So, worst case scenario, I’d have to wait until about 2030 for a club to be approaching Adelaide’s record?

Also, out of curiosity.
I see you don’t include games in finals which after 4 quarters are a draw

So, West Coast/Collingwood, West Coast/port Adelaide wouldn’t be counted as draws

But do you count finals games in the running tally for droughts?
 
Dirty Bird said:
So, worst case scenario, I’d have to wait until about 2030 for a club to be approaching Adelaide’s record?

Also, out of curiosity.
I see you don’t include games in finals which after 4 quarters are a draw

So, West Coast/Collingwood, West Coast/port Adelaide wouldn’t be counted as draws

But do you count finals games in the running tally for droughts?
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Think of 'draw' as the final outcome of a match. Finals now can be 'even' or 'tied' at the end of the standard playing time but never 'drawn'.
 
Dirty Bird said:
Also, out of curiosity.
I see you don’t include games in finals which after 4 quarters are a draw

So, West Coast/Collingwood, West Coast/port Adelaide wouldn’t be counted as draws
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That would be silly, IMO.
 
Dirty Bird said:
No, my point was meant to be
As the games can’t be considered draws
Is it worth including them in the stats ‘drawless streaks’
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You could asterisk them I suppose. But for the simple definition "consecutive games without a draw", I'd say they qualify.
 
One of the strangest statistics on draws is how infrequently they occur in the WAFL competition.

Consider the following stats:

1. Claremont - Last drew in 2010 against Swan Districts, this the Tigers' first draw since 1993. This is only one of two WAFL draws in the 2000s to date.
2. Subiaco - The Lions' last draw was against West Perth in wet conditions in 2001.
3. West Perth - Played the most recent draw to date, in 2012 against East Perth. They were the only team to play a draw in the 1950s against South Fremantle in 1957.
4. East Perth - West Perth's opponent in the 2012 draw, the Royals were in the only two draws played in the 1990s against Claremont in 1993 and South Fremantle in 1997, but prior to that East Perth hadn't drawn since 1969.
5. Perth - The Demons played in draws against West Perth in 2008 and Swan Districts in 2009, but before that hadn't drawn since 1986.
6. Swan Districts - Swans played in two draws in 2009 and one in 2010 (their last to date). They also drew in 2003 against East Perth, but before this hadn't drawn since 1988 against Claremont in a top vs. bottom game.
7. South Fremantle - The Bulldogs haven't drawn since 1997 against East Perth, and this is the Bulldogs only draw since 1984.
8. East Fremantle - The Sharks last drew in the 1989 first semi final against West Perth, Easts winning the replay and going through to the preliminary final. Two years later this game wouldn't have been drawn, as the WAFL introduced extra time for drawn finals from 1991 onwards (not that they have ever had to use it). The 1989 game is East Fremantle's only draw since 1974.
9. Peel Thunder - Peel commenced in 1997, and to date have never played a tie.

There were no WAFL draws at all between 1974 and 1984.
 
emuboy said:
One of the strangest statistics on draws is how infrequently they occur in the WAFL competition.

Consider the following stats:

1. Claremont - Last drew in 2010 against Swan Districts, this the Tigers' first draw since 1993. This is only one of two WAFL draws in the 2000s to date.
2. Subiaco - The Lions' last draw was against West Perth in wet conditions in 2001.
3. West Perth - Played the most recent draw to date, in 2012 against East Perth. They were the only team to play a draw in the 1950s against South Fremantle in 1957.
4. East Perth - West Perth's opponent in the 2012 draw, the Royals were in the only two draws played in the 1990s against Claremont in 1993 and South Fremantle in 1997, but prior to that East Perth hadn't drawn since 1969.
5. Perth - The Demons played in draws against West Perth in 2008 and Swan Districts in 2009, but before that hadn't drawn since 1986.
6. Swan Districts - Swans played in two draws in 2009 and one in 2010 (their last to date). They also drew in 2003 against East Perth, but before this hadn't drawn since 1988 against Claremont in a top vs. bottom game.
7. South Fremantle - The Bulldogs haven't drawn since 1997 against East Perth, and this is the Bulldogs only draw since 1984.
8. East Fremantle - The Sharks last drew in the 1989 first semi final against West Perth, Easts winning the replay and going through to the preliminary final. Two years later this game wouldn't have been drawn, as the WAFL introduced extra time for drawn finals from 1991 onwards (not that they have ever had to use it). The 1989 game is East Fremantle's only draw since 1974.
9. Peel Thunder - Peel commenced in 1997, and to date have never played a tie.

There were no WAFL draws at all between 1974 and 1984.
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Actually, excluding the 1950s, the frequency of ties in the WAFL before 1974 was approximately the same as in the VFL, VFA and SANFL. In fact, there were more draws in the WANFL (as it was known) in the 1930s was higher than in the VFL – eleven vis-à-vis nine.

Comparative frequency of draws in the WAFA/WAFL/WANFL/WASFL/Westar Rules:​
  • 1900 to 1974: 53 draws in 5,206 games – about equal to the 1 in 89.5 frequency in the VFL
  • 1900 to 1946 and 1960 to 1974: 52 draws in 4,110 games – 1 in 79 or slightly greater than contemporary VFL frequency
  • since 1975: 14 draws in 3,825 games – 1 in 275 or one-third historic frequency
The most likely reason for the near-nonexistence of draws in the WAFL since 1975 is the radical drying of Perth’s football season climate since that year, which owing to a steady poleward shift of the winter storm belt has occurred at a rate of about 4 millimetres per year, or a total loss of approximately 170 millimetres or thirty percent of the virgin average winter rainfall as I write this.

Owing to the sandy nature of Perth’s soils, wet-weather play there is related much more to luck than on the heavy soils of Melbourne or Adelaide. Moreover, because Perth’s sandy soils do not inhibit speed or jumping in wet weather nearly so much, but make marking more difficult than with the “grip” possible in Melbourne and Adelaide, very tall people stand at greater disadvantage in a Perth wet. Consequently, with a drier climate, the importance of height would have increased much more than in the eastern states, and height is purely genetic and cannot be increased by training. Hence – much more than in eastern Australia – drying and heating of Perth’s climate has greatly reduced the likelihood of luck playing an important role, or talent being equal enough for a draw.

The absence of draws in the WANFL in the 1950s (one draw in thirteen seasons from 1947 to 1959) was replicated in the SANFL, where there were no draws between 1945 and 1954 nor between 1959 and 1961. These draw “megadroughts” were different from the climate-driven megadroughts of the WAFL since 1975. They occurred because:
  1. at least in the SANFL, inequalities in zone populations dating from before World War One had not been corrected due to pressure from successful clubs
  2. most of the rapidly developing new suburbs were unzoned and players there gravitated to successful clubs.
Consequently, inequality of talent in the postwar WANFL and SANFL was akin to that in Perth’s hot, dry post-1975 football season climate, with the major difference being greater predictability due to less influence from unpredictable injuries. draws under this level of inequality were vanishingly improbable.
 
An example of three draws in a season by one team: Yarra Glen, 1976 Eastern FL Division 3. Against Montrose, Warrandyte and Nunawading, within the space of 8 rounds.

There were three other draws in that season: Olinda-Ferny Creek against Rowville, Mooroolbark against Boronia, and South Wantirna against Montrose.
 

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RedmanWasHere said:
Have any 2 teams in any league drawn multiple times vs each other in the same year?
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Never in senior VFL/AFL, SANFL, WA(N)FL or VFA/VFL football, though it did happen in the Under-19s in 1978:
  • Round 6, 1978: St. Kilda 15-16 (106) drew with Melbourne 16-10 (106)
    • the seniors in that game set the record aggregate of 345 points
    • I doubt whether there is any so notable (statistically at least) senior League match where the Under-19s drew, although I have not checked all 65 U19s draws
  • Round 17, 1978: Melbourne 14-20 (104) drew with St. Kilda 14-20 (104)
In the VFL Reserves, Footscray and St. Kilda drew twice in 1954:
  • Round 1: St. Kilda 10-9 (69) drew with Footscray 9-15 (69)
  • Round 12: Footscray 8-16 (64) drew with St. Kilda 9-10 (64)
 
Might have found the draw jackpot in senior football. Presenting perhaps the only time in senior football where a team drew FOUR times in a single season:
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/wafootyforum/west-kimberley-2010-results-t5806.html
Cable Beach drew Looma in Round 2, Peninsula Bombers in Round 8, then managed back-to-back draws against Derby and Saints to close out the season. At some point the agony must have been too much.
 
Connor7395 said:
An example of three draws in a season by one team: Yarra Glen, 1976 Eastern FL Division 3. Against Montrose, Warrandyte and Nunawading, within the space of 8 rounds.

There were three other draws in that season: Olinda-Ferny Creek against Rowville, Mooroolbark against Boronia, and South Wantirna against Montrose.
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WAFL team West Perth drew three times in 1960. This must have strengthened the Falcons' nerves, as they won the premiership that season over arch-rivals East Perth.
 
Connor7395 said:
Might have found the draw jackpot in senior football. Presenting perhaps the only time in senior football where a team drew FOUR times in a single season:
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/wafootyforum/west-kimberley-2010-results-t5806.html
Cable Beach drew Looma in Round 2, Peninsula Bombers in Round 8, then managed back-to-back draws against Derby and Saints to close out the season. At some point the agony must have been too much.
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That's an amazing season! One loss by 12 points, four draws, and nine wins including margins of 2, 4, 8, and 11. Coming into the last match, they were narrowly ahead of Saints (9W+3D+1L=42 vs 9W+1P?+3L=38? 40?) but behind on percentage, needing at least a draw against them to finish on top. They got exactly that, but went out in straight sets in the finals. The club has a quaint webpage that mentions a host of draws.
 
Ron The Bear said:
2. least career games for x draws:

Code: 
D Gms Ratio Player       Club(s)
--------------------------------
1   1  1.00 Ted Flynn         Es
    1  1.00 Sid O'Neill       Fi
    1  1.00 Ron Larking       Un
    1  1.00 Tom Hanson        Ca
    1  1.00 Arthur E.Harrison Ca
    1  1.00 Colin Dufty       Co
    1  1.00 Eric Crompton     WB
    1  1.00 George Kanngieser Co
    1  1.00 Ted Wellington    NM
    1  1.00 Ray Davies        Fi
    1  1.00 Garry Cameron     NM
2   7  3.50 Dick Maynard      Es
    7  3.50 Harry Bruce       Me
    7  3.50 Jeff McGee        Sy
3  20  6.67 Tom M.Jones       Ca
4  50 12.50 Bert R.Taylor     Fi
5 105 21.00 Jack Wells     St,Ca
6 116 19.33 Viv Valentine     Ca
7 289 41.29 Barry Davis    Es,NM
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Daniel Lloyd has emerged as a draw card (HAHA... :().

Equaled the record for two draws (seven games) and smashes the record for three draws (12 games).

Ron The Bear said:
3. 38 players have played in consecutive draws (spread over 9 separate matches). The last were St.Kilda's Jeff Sarau and Russell Tweeddale in 1977.
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I see #5 was updated later in the thread, but I guess this is now 58 players after 20 players backed up from Round 15 to Round 16 last year.
 
Highest known drawn games for each major comeptition:

VFL/AFL: 132 Essendon 20.12 (132) vs Carlton 19.18 (132), 1993
VFA: 141 Prahran 21.15 (141) vs Preston 20.21 (141), 1978 (Division 1)
SANFL: 131 West Adelaide 19.17 (131) vs Port Adelaide 19.17 (131), 1934
WAFL: 119 Swan Districts 18.11 (119) vs West Perth 17.17 (119), 1946
TFL: 137 Devonport 21.11 (137) vs New Norfolk 20.17 (137), 1989
NWFU: 146 Ulverstone 22.14 (146) vs Cooee 23.8 (146), 1977
NTFA: 122 Launceston 18.14 (122) vs Penguin 18.14 (122), 1982
SFL: 124 Balmain 19.10 (124) vs North Shore 17.22 (124), 1979
ACTAFL: 119 Queanbeyan 17.17 (119) vs Southern District 18.11 (119), 1993
QAFL: 141 Wilston-Grange 22.9 (141) vs Kedron 21.15 (141), 1976
NTFL: 141 Waratah 22.9 (141) vs Tiwi Islands 22.9 (141), 2012-13
 
VFL team the Coburg Lions are having a terrible 2018 season and at the time of posting are last with only a draw to their credit against the Sandringham Zebras so far this year.

What is remarkable is that it is the first time Coburg has drawn a match since 1983, when the Lions tied with Port Melbourne. To give some perspective on how much has changed in 35 years since then, that year the VFA had two divisions of twelve clubs, and some of the teams that Coburg played in First Division in 1983 were Camberwell Cobras, Dandenong Redlegs, Prahran Two Blues, Geelong West Roosters and Waverley Panthers, while current team the Northern Blues was then the Preston Bullants.
 

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