EDFL Premier Discussion 2023

[stroketurboego]

It’s a top 6 bottom 6 set up

Bottom 6 play each twice = 10games
Bottom 6 play top 6 once = 6 games
Remaining 2 games will be made up from top 6
Ie bottom 6 teams will play two teams from top 6 twice.


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[Route 59]

Clubs have who they are going to be playing next year. In Div 1 u have the top 4 & deer park/St Albans playing each other twice, the bottom 4 side only play Deer park & St Albans once . With the bottom 3 sides In 2023 going down to Div 2.

Be good to hear something official from head quarters on a number of issues.


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[MortlockWatcher]

First you have to break 'the cone of silence' ...

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

Well the Calder player drafted wasn’t even really a local rather a boarder from assumption college

Tac cup is dead, the best players, rarely play due to school commitments in aps, the kids leftover are better off playing premier league seniors then travelling all over the state

 

[BlueJet]

I was thinking the same thing. It looks like the Calder region has gone back over the last few years. Then again, the AFL is pushing expansion in NSW and QLD and suddenly local Victorian leagues become less of a requirement.

That said, the Eastern regions seem to have lept well ahead of the others when it comes to developing kids.

It's almost as if this region is more inclined to buy than develop..

 

[red_ranga]

All TAC Cup Under 18s Drafted Players​

See all clubs

Drafted From	League	Players ↧	Games	Zero Gamers	100 Gamers	Goals	Brownlow Votes	Premiership Players
Sandringham Dragons	U18	175 players	50.1 games (avg)	30% 0 gamers	21% 100 gamers	29.0 goals (avg)	7.9 votes (avg)	13 prem players
Oakleigh Chargers	U18	168 players	56.6 games (avg)	27% 0 gamers	23% 100 gamers	25.4 goals (avg)	7.5 votes (avg)	13 prem players
Geelong Falcons	U18	163 players	70.0 games (avg)	25% 0 gamers	27% 100 gamers	39.0 goals (avg)	12.3 votes (avg)	24 prem players
Murray Bushrangers	U18	159 players	66.3 games (avg)	28% 0 gamers	26% 100 gamers	42.5 goals (avg)	9.0 votes (avg)	14 prem players
Dandenong Stingrays	U18	153 players	59.2 games (avg)	28% 0 gamers	25% 100 gamers	36.9 goals (avg)	7.5 votes (avg)	10 prem players
Calder Cannons	U18	142 players	65.3 games (avg)	27% 0 gamers	28% 100 gamers	34.2 goals (avg)	8.6 votes (avg)	16 prem players
Northern Knights	U18	131 players	74.0 games (avg)	25% 0 gamers	30% 100 gamers	42.3 goals (avg)	10.8 votes (avg)	19 prem players
Eastern Ranges	U18	128 players	62.2 games (avg)	24% 0 gamers	24% 100 gamers	30.3 goals (avg)	7.3 votes (avg)	13 prem players
NSW-ACT Rams	U18	113 players	58.4 games (avg)	35% 0 gamers	24% 100 gamers	38.9 goals (avg)	6.5 votes (avg)	15 prem players
Gippsland Power	U18	111 players	60.8 games (avg)	27% 0 gamers	22% 100 gamers	36.7 goals (avg)	7.3 votes (avg)	16 prem players
North Ballarat Rebels	U18	105 players	73.8 games (avg)	17% 0 gamers	33% 100 gamers	33.5 goals (avg)	8.0 votes (avg)	15 prem players
Tassie Mariners	U18	90 players	53.8 games (avg)	26% 0 gamers	20% 100 gamers	37.3 goals (avg)	3.3 votes (avg)	5 prem players
Bendigo Pioneers	U18	86 players	68.1 games (avg)	23% 0 gamers	28% 100 gamers	43.0 goals (avg)	13.8 votes (avg)	11 prem players
Western Jets	U18	85 players	62.3 games (avg)	28% 0 gamers	22% 100 gamers	44.1 goals (avg)	8.1 votes (avg)	9 prem players
Queensland Scorpions	U18	39 players	34.4 games (avg)	13% 0 gamers	13% 100 gamers	17.1 goals (avg)	2.0 votes (avg)	0 prem players
Northern Territory Thunder	U18	6 players	35.5 games (avg)	33% 0 gamers	17% 100 gamers	13.8 goals (avg)	2.8 votes (avg)	1 prem players

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

All TAC Cup Under 18s Drafted Players​

See all clubs

Drafted From	League	Players ↧	Games	Zero Gamers	100 Gamers	Goals	Brownlow Votes	Premiership Players
Sandringham Dragons	U18	175 players	50.1 games (avg)	30% 0 gamers	21% 100 gamers	29.0 goals (avg)	7.9 votes (avg)	13 prem players
Oakleigh Chargers	U18	168 players	56.6 games (avg)	27% 0 gamers	23% 100 gamers	25.4 goals (avg)	7.5 votes (avg)	13 prem players
Geelong Falcons	U18	163 players	70.0 games (avg)	25% 0 gamers	27% 100 gamers	39.0 goals (avg)	12.3 votes (avg)	24 prem players
Murray Bushrangers	U18	159 players	66.3 games (avg)	28% 0 gamers	26% 100 gamers	42.5 goals (avg)	9.0 votes (avg)	14 prem players
Dandenong Stingrays	U18	153 players	59.2 games (avg)	28% 0 gamers	25% 100 gamers	36.9 goals (avg)	7.5 votes (avg)	10 prem players
Calder Cannons	U18	142 players	65.3 games (avg)	27% 0 gamers	28% 100 gamers	34.2 goals (avg)	8.6 votes (avg)	16 prem players
Northern Knights	U18	131 players	74.0 games (avg)	25% 0 gamers	30% 100 gamers	42.3 goals (avg)	10.8 votes (avg)	19 prem players
Eastern Ranges	U18	128 players	62.2 games (avg)	24% 0 gamers	24% 100 gamers	30.3 goals (avg)	7.3 votes (avg)	13 prem players
NSW-ACT Rams	U18	113 players	58.4 games (avg)	35% 0 gamers	24% 100 gamers	38.9 goals (avg)	6.5 votes (avg)	15 prem players
Gippsland Power	U18	111 players	60.8 games (avg)	27% 0 gamers	22% 100 gamers	36.7 goals (avg)	7.3 votes (avg)	16 prem players
North Ballarat Rebels	U18	105 players	73.8 games (avg)	17% 0 gamers	33% 100 gamers	33.5 goals (avg)	8.0 votes (avg)	15 prem players
Tassie Mariners	U18	90 players	53.8 games (avg)	26% 0 gamers	20% 100 gamers	37.3 goals (avg)	3.3 votes (avg)	5 prem players
Bendigo Pioneers	U18	86 players	68.1 games (avg)	23% 0 gamers	28% 100 gamers	43.0 goals (avg)	13.8 votes (avg)	11 prem players
Western Jets	U18	85 players	62.3 games (avg)	28% 0 gamers	22% 100 gamers	44.1 goals (avg)	8.1 votes (avg)	9 prem players
Queensland Scorpions	U18	39 players	34.4 games (avg)	13% 0 gamers	13% 100 gamers	17.1 goals (avg)	2.0 votes (avg)	0 prem players
Northern Territory Thunder	U18	6 players	35.5 games (avg)	33% 0 gamers	17% 100 gamers	13.8 goals (avg)	2.8 votes (avg)	1 prem players

I'm not sure how this system works, when such a low percentage of players get drafted anymore from each team. The effort put in, impacts on their schooling (majority doing year 12) where they are fed by coaches they'll get drafted, many stop playing footy if they don't get drafted. Add the travel for country clubs, it's not the viable of a system, just let have the aps school system and let the other kids play senior footy for their club and have under 21 interleague, once a month as curtain raisers to AFL games, so recruiters see other kids playing

 

[Turbos mail]

Tac cup is dead, the best players, rarely play due to school commitments in aps, the kids leftover are better off playing premier league seniors then travelling all over the state

I think going VFL is better than metro/country footy especially if you have talent and wish to get drafted however Cadman from Darley and more so Richard’s from Wangaratta were great examples. Personally watched both metro and country over recent years and any kid wanting to get drafted should play premier country footy as it’s more inclined to be like AFL/VFL than premier metro. Fitter players, more open and spacious grounds, more free flowing footy. If your dreams are done go play metro and get the extra $$$. That’s my personal views!

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

I think going VFL is better than metro/country footy especially if you have talent and wish to get drafted however Cadman from Darley and more so Richard’s from Wangaratta were great examples.

Yep no doubt turbs, but play vfl when your 19, I think the tac/nab cup is irrelevant now, due to scholarships with school footy and they get better coaches into their school programs compared to the tac cup now

 

[Turbos mail]

Yep no doubt turbs, but play vfl when your 19, I think the tac/nab cup is irrelevant now, due to scholarships with school footy and they get better coaches into their school programs compared to the tac cup now

Problem is APS footy is not a great overall standard and on smaller school ovals. The top players stand out much more than they do at TAC cup level. Having said that it’s been a while since I’ve watched either of these leagues.

 

[Donald D]

Yep no doubt turbs, but play vfl when your 19, I think the tac/nab cup is irrelevant now, due to scholarships with school footy and they get better coaches into their school programs compared to the tac cup now

How many NAB League & APS games did you watch in 2022?

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[Trent the flight Steward]

How many NAB League & APS games did you watch in 2022?

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How many of the top 10 picks miss large chunks because of school commitments? And how do the regional sides go with their best players away boarding?

Add to the fact if you play Gippsland and live in Bairnsdale the travel involved, or Yarrawonga, Swan hill the travel can't be conducive to playing your best footy or for your school results, this was brought in 1993, a lot has changed since then and it's time for a revamp of the system

 

[Silver Tongue]

How many of the top 10 picks miss large chunks because of school commitments? And how do the regional sides go with their best players away boarding?

Add to the fact if you play Gippsland and live in Bairnsdale the travel involved, or Yarrawonga, Swan hill the travel can't be conducive to playing your best footy or for your school results, this was brought in 1993, a lot has changed since then and it's time for a revamp of the system

St Patrick's College, Ballarat have had about 40 drafted since Drew Petrie in 2000 and including Aaron Cadman and James Van Es this year. An oval designed and constructed to the same dimensions as the MCG. School footy is alive and well. Plenty of boarders recruited from across Victoria and NSW. Pioneers and Bushrangers lose plenty to St Pats.

 

[Donald D]

How many of the top 10 picks miss large chunks because of school commitments? And how do the regional sides go with their best players away boarding?

Add to the fact if you play Gippsland and live in Bairnsdale the travel involved, or Yarrawonga, Swan hill the travel can't be conducive to playing your best footy or for your school results, this was brought in 1993, a lot has changed since then and it's time for a revamp of the system

Not while the private school silver tails are running the AFL nothing will change

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[local footy fan]

Not while the private school silver tails are running the AFL nothing will change

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Really a lot boils down to who you know what school you go too and not how good you are

 

[BlueJet]

It's what happens when you let the wannabe corporate elite run the show..

 

[409]

Heard Deer Park premier division, St Albans Div 1. 2 divisions of 11 teams, play 8 teams twice & 2 teams once !

 

[Biggest Choker]

Are there any staff still working at EDFL Headquarters? The North West Football league could be happening ( WRFL & EDFL) in early discussions with AFL VIC -This has been discussed sometime ago but may be gaining some traction within the next 5 years !

 

[Gremlin77]

Heard Deer Park premier division, St Albans Div 1. 2 divisions of 11 teams, play 8 teams twice & 2 teams once !

Where did you get this from ? It’s been said in here that fixtures have already been released with both in B grade

 

[Bashen]

Where did you get this from ? It’s been said in here that fixtures have already been released with both in B grade

Correct.


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[Bunk Moreland]

How many of the top 10 picks miss large chunks because of school commitments? And how do the regional sides go with their best players away boarding?

Add to the fact if you play Gippsland and live in Bairnsdale the travel involved, or Yarrawonga, Swan hill the travel can't be conducive to playing your best footy or for your school results, this was brought in 1993, a lot has changed since then and it's time for a revamp of the system

APS League is 10 games (11 weeks with a bye), NAB League is 14 (16 with 2 byes) I think. Some NAB League games are also on Sunday and some kids will play both on a weekend where the club is happy for them to do so.

I'd be surprised if gun kids don't play an absolute minimum of 4-5 NAB League games each year, so it's not as though they're not exposed in the NAB League. They could play 6 or 7 easily.

If you take the example of Calder they had trips this year to Swan Hill, Ballarat, Tassie and Shepparton for the season. Hardly the end of the world and to be honest, not the worst experience for kids looking to make the AFL.

The country kids obviously travel more but that is a simple fact of living in the country and has always been the case. This year Gippsland finished on top, Tassie second, GWV fourth, Geelong 6th. So hardly an issue for performance. Murray (9th) and Bendigo (12th) had poorer years.

You will get the odd good school game but the quality overall is better in the NAB League.

Plenty of people suggest merging the two but the problem with school footy is it's a major change that involves uprooting a kid's whole life and moving schools, sometimes to boarding. That will not suit all kids. The regional NAB League teams are very important for kids who want to stay at home, as many reasonably do at 17yo. There is a big travel factor but that's just life in the bush.

Also who knows the longer-term future of the school footy system. We have had decades of Liberal govts who pour endless money into private schools. They honestly have so much money they don't know what to do with it, which is why they all employ so many "elite" coaches (generally a gravy train for big name ex-AFL types who may or may not be good coaches) and throw scholarships around like confetti. The APS competition will always exist - it always has - but with the Liberal Party on the nose for possibly a fair while, the rivers of gold may not flow so freely in future.

 

[Come on Cents]

Really a lot boils down to who you know what school you go too and not how good you are

I believe Assumption, Kilmore and Wallan have a dedicated Cannons recruiter for the area. Knowing the right people and playing for the right team helps and being FS or NextGen gives you the best opportunity. You still have to be able to play but there are better players in U16 and U18 EDFL but wont get that chance.

 

[red_ranga]

I believe Assumption, Kilmore and Wallan have a dedicated Cannons recruiter for the area. Knowing the right people and playing for the right team helps and being FS or NextGen gives you the best opportunity. You still have to be able to play but there are better players in U16 and U18 EDFL but wont get that chance.

Maybe assumption but definitely not Wallan and kilmore

 

[Trent the flight Steward]

APS League is 10 games (11 weeks with a bye), NAB League is 14 (16 with 2 byes) I think. Some NAB League games are also on Sunday and some kids will play both on a weekend where the club is happy for them to do so.

I'd be surprised if gun kids don't play an absolute minimum of 4-5 NAB League games each year, so it's not as though they're not exposed in the NAB League. They could play 6 or 7 easily.

If you take the example of Calder they had trips this year to Swan Hill, Ballarat, Tassie and Shepparton for the season. Hardly the end of the world and to be honest, not the worst experience for kids looking to make the AFL.

The country kids obviously travel more but that is a simple fact of living in the country and has always been the case. This year Gippsland finished on top, Tassie second, GWV fourth, Geelong 6th. So hardly an issue for performance. Murray (9th) and Bendigo (12th) had poorer years.

You will get the odd good school game but the quality overall is better in the NAB League.

Plenty of people suggest merging the two but the problem with school footy is it's a major change that involves uprooting a kid's whole life and moving schools, sometimes to boarding. That will not suit all kids. The regional NAB League teams are very important for kids who want to stay at home, as many reasonably do at 17yo. There is a big travel factor but that's just life in the bush.

Also who knows the longer-term future of the school footy system. We have had decades of Liberal govts who pour endless money into private schools. They honestly have so much money they don't know what to do with it, which is why they all employ so many "elite" coaches (generally a gravy train for big name ex-AFL types who may or may not be good coaches) and throw scholarships around like confetti. The APS competition will always exist - it always has - but with the Liberal Party on the nose for possibly a fair while, the rivers of gold may not flow so freely in future.

Aren't the best players in the aps system already, where they miss large chunks of the nab season and the standard drops. Majority of kids in the nab cup are in year 12, the majority don't get drafted, the impacts on their schooling would be major, as most get told to put all their eggs into getting drafted and their school work suffers.

School footy has all of the coaches, compared to the nab cup, and they are still getting plenty of handouts from Labor, I can't see it stopping

I'd also think that guys on scholarships are drafted higher, even if they aren't in the top 10 players, as it looks better for the aps schools and their results. Kids outside the scholarship system, would be better off playing under a Mick mcguane in senior footy and learning from team mates straight out of an AFL system, who they'd play alongside them under 18s, then go to the vfl. I reckon vfl clubs need zoning for this.

 

[andleanback]

How many of the top 10 picks miss large chunks because of school commitments? And how do the regional sides go with their best players away boarding?

Add to the fact if you play Gippsland and live in Bairnsdale the travel involved, or Yarrawonga, Swan hill the travel can't be conducive to playing your best footy or for your school results, this was brought in 1993, a lot has changed since then and it's time for a revamp of the system

The aps players have always missed large chunks of the season. Even back when Calder was successful they had players like wallis, libba missing most of the season playing for st kevs, or players at pegs etc.
I think the issue is 3 pronged.
1. The talent in the north west ( Calder and western) is not at the same level it once was, the quality coming through has significantly dropped off in the past 10 years. So there is a smaller pool of talent to pick from. Just have to look at greenvale as a case study. They used to have 4-5 players every year on calders list that actually grew up in the suburb. Junior numbers playing u16 and u18 in the wrfl have shrunk, while they’re strong as ever in the East and top that with a lot are coming through the aps system and getting top quality development.
2. A lot of clubs in the region don’t invest in their junior development, most money is put into the senior program. Compare that to the East where a lot of juniors come through the Yarra junior football league where there are no senior teams involved with the club, so all money is reinvested in the junior players. Better coaching leads to better development, compare that with some dad who is volunteering with little coaching experience.
3. The aps system has got so strong which afl clubs actually like, and can often have more scouts at aps games than nab league during the school football period. Even though it’s a lesser quality to nab league, it can only take 1 dominant performance and suddenly they get the attention of scouts who then watch them closely for the rest of the season, it’d be like scouts coming down and watching a kid dominate for Keilor or strathmore - suddenly they’d see them in a different light, but that doesn’t happen. These days it can be a bigger tick for players if they’re part of an aps program in eyes of recruiters, for the off field side of things.

Couple that with calder and westerns program being significantly worst in coaching, and identification of talent. Kids don’t even get a look in unless they’re situated at certain clubs. Recruiters now see western as the second rate program and often kids slip past the point of where they should be drafted. Calder is heading the same way and it needs to be addressed. It’s worrying that literally the whole north west side of Melbourne is no longer getting elite talent consistently into the afl. Calder has not had a top 20 pick that was a junior in the region since 2014, having 3 in the top 14 that year(would’ve been 3 in the top 10 if lever didn’t do his knee). Western has only had 2 players taken in the national draft since 2018. They are horrible statistics.