Emmanuel Macron, President of the French Republic

[Bojan KantKick]

Well I'm obviously guessing but I think Macron calculated that the RN's big showing in the European Parliament election was just a protest vote, and that when it came to an election to decide who runs France then the people wouldn't be crazy enough to vote for a far-right party. So by calling a snap election he would stop the RN's momentum in its tracks. Turns out however that a lot of French people feel no shame in voting for a far-right party.

Le Pen has moderated her beliefs for quite some time. Her dad's influence is long gone.

 

[Seeds]

Can someone explain to me why the riots in France from the losers of the election are in any way different to the Jan 6 riots in the US?

Surely Macron should be held accountable because he has not stopped them.

Thanks.

Well for one, its not macrons supporters that are rioting. Its the left parties supporters. So there is that.

But two, have they tried to overthrow the government and threatened to imprison and hang politicians?

 

[Upstart Swan]

Le Pen has moderated her beliefs for quite some time. Her dad's influence is long gone.

No, you're right, they've become more respectable recently (apart from a few stray Nazis and unashamed racists). Le Pen doesn't even praise Putin anymore.
Just never thought I'd see the day when they are the biggest party in France...

 

[Upstart Swan]

Well for one, its not macrons supporters that are rioting. Its the left parties supporters. So there is that.

But two, have they tried to overthrow the government and threatened to imprison and hang politicians?

#3 difference - no one has stormed the Palais Bourbon
#4 difference - no one is claiming the elections were "stolen"

What I find interesting is how quickly Sky and the Murdoch press have sided with the RN in their coverage. I find that very instructive

 

[burge13]

Well I'm obviously guessing but I think Macron calculated that the RN's big showing in the European Parliament election was just a protest vote, and that when it came to an election to decide who runs France then the people wouldn't be crazy enough to vote for a far-right party. So by calling a snap election he would stop the RN's momentum in its tracks. Turns out however that a lot of French people feel no shame in voting for a far-right party.

People are well and truly over mass immigration. Happening all over Europe, Trump will win by pointing to border security, Aussies are sick of 700k arrivals a year here too

 

[MPMonkeys]

#3 difference - no one has stormed the Palais Bourbon
#4 difference - no one is claiming the elections were "stolen"

What I find interesting is how quickly Sky and the Murdoch press have sided with the RN in their coverage. I find that very instructive

What do you mean by 'they have sided'?
Can you provide any examples?

Also, there must be a reason for the riots. Are they just doing it for fun?

 

[swingdog]

What do you mean by 'they have sided'?
Can you provide any examples?

Also, there must be a reason for the riots. Are they just doing it for fun?

Are you new to French politics?

 

[rodney86]

Isn't striking/protesting the French national sport?

 

[Bojan KantKick]

No, you're right, they've become more respectable recently (apart from a few stray Nazis and unashamed racists). Le Pen doesn't even praise Putin anymore.
Just never thought I'd see the day when they are the biggest party in France...

Make people desperate and they will act out of desperation.

 

[Upstart Swan]

What do you mean by 'they have sided'?
Can you provide any examples?

Also, there must be a reason for the riots. Are they just doing it for fun?

FMD I hate having to cite my sources everytime someone disagrees with me, like it's a PhD thesis, not an anonymous opinion on a football message board.

This New York Post article has some good examples of barracking, including:
"The dead-last finish marked a stinging defeat for Macron, who called for the snap runoff election the day after his party was defeated by NR in June’s parliamentary elections as a Hail Mary attempt to thwart the NR’s continued rise.

But the ascent of right-of-center party in a free and fair election proved too much for many Paris youths to bear, who directed their anger toward vandalizing their own city’s landmarks and businesses."

Macron's coalition didn't finish dead last. The Republicans only had 10%, not to mention the various minor parties. The sanitised "right of centre" term is a nice, cuddly description of the RN, much less frightening than the more accurate "far right" and "hard right". The headline "Paris Burns!" seems a bit hyperbolic, to describe flares and fireworks.
The Sky News clip breathlessly promising "left wing riots", but the only close-to-riot thing I saw was a handful of people over turning what looked like a skip. (With this logic my hometown has a riot once or twice a month). People marching in the streets is not a riot.

Please Professor MP Monkeys, may I be exempt from future research assignments? I have other things to do.

 

[Happy Mastenator]

Le Pen has moderated her beliefs for quite some time. Her dad's influence is long gone.

has she, or has she just kept quiet on the more "offensive" elements in order to win votes? I'd suggest it's much more the latter

 

[swingdog]

has she, or has she just kept quiet on the more "offensive" elements in order to win votes? I'd suggest it's much more the latter

Exactly - there's a lot of "trust me" in that pivot.

It's not a given that right wing leaders have to suck up to Putin (though most seem to love doing it).

Georgia Meloni has been a consistent Ukraine supporter, which was probably influenced by the fact that she was on the ground in Bucha not long after the Russian atrocities were discovered. You could see in the coverage that she was visibly affected.

As far as I'm aware, none of the others (Le Pen, Urban, Farage) have been there - always easier to be a prick from a thousand miles away.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Exactly - there's a lot of "trust me" in that pivot.

It's not a given that right wing leaders have to suck up to Putin (though most seem to love doing it).

Georgia Meloni has been a consistent Ukraine supporter, which was probably influenced by the fact that she was on the ground in Bucha not long after the Russian atrocities were discovered. You could see in the coverage that she was visibly affected.

As far as I'm aware, none of the others (Le Pen, Urban, Farage) have been there - always easier to be a prick from a thousand miles away.

What makes you think the French people support Ukraine?

 

[swingdog]

What makes you think the French people support Ukraine?

I don't know if they do or don't and, to be honest, this is one where leaders have to show, well, leadership.

To be fair, the FN's policy statement on Ukraine sounds reasonable:

"To defeat Vladimir Putin's war of aggression and make him answer for his crimes before international justice: Unfailingly defend the sovereignty and freedom of the Ukrainian people, as well as the integrity of its borders, by delivering the necessary weapons, canceling its foreign debt and seizing the assets of the oligarchs who contribute to the Russian war effort."

If FN wins and they follow through on that, then I'll applaud them. And to distribute brickbats equally, Scholz of Germany (from the centre left) has been generally rubbish on Ukraine, slow-walking delivery of weapons.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

I don't know if they do or don't and, to be honest, this is one where leaders have to show, well, leadership.

To be fair, the FN's policy statement on Ukraine sounds reasonable:

"To defeat Vladimir Putin's war of aggression and make him answer for his crimes before international justice: Unfailingly defend the sovereignty and freedom of the Ukrainian people, as well as the integrity of its borders, by delivering the necessary weapons, canceling its foreign debt and seizing the assets of the oligarchs who contribute to the Russian war effort."

If FN wins and they follow through on that, then I'll applaud them. And to distribute brickbats equally, Scholz of Germany (from the centre left) has been generally rubbish on Ukraine, slow-walking delivery of weapons.

France’s political upheaval is bad news for Ukraine

Marine Le Pen has been a fierce critic of Macron’s support of Zelensky this year, particularly his suggestion that French troops could be sent to Ukraine

www.spectator.co.uk

 

[swingdog]

France’s political upheaval is bad news for Ukraine

Marine Le Pen has been a fierce critic of Macron’s support of Zelensky this year, particularly his suggestion that French troops could be sent to Ukraine

www.spectator.co.uk

Odd article, Leads with a photo and opening about FN but is mainly about the far left, which you'd expect from the Spectator.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Odd article, Leads with a photo and opening about FN but is mainly about the far left, which you'd expect from the Spectator.

The French don't seem to want to continue supporting that particular war.

 

[geoffjennings79]

What do you mean by 'they have sided'?
Can you provide any examples?

Also, there must be a reason for the riots. Are they just doing it for fun?

Nice deflection after two people shot down the idiotic assumptions in your previous post. Do you ever actually think before you post? (That's a rhetorical question btw. We all know the answer.)

 

[swingdog]

The French don't seem to want to continue supporting that particular war.

Hence my earlier post about leadership.

 

[DaTBird187]

Isn't striking/protesting the French national sport?

They didn't get a retirement age of 60 and more holidays than anyone else in the western world by asking politely.

 

[MPMonkeys]

FMD I hate having to cite my sources everytime someone disagrees with me, like it's a PhD thesis, not an anonymous opinion on a football message board.

This New York Post article has some good examples of barracking, including:
"The dead-last finish marked a stinging defeat for Macron, who called for the snap runoff election the day after his party was defeated by NR in June’s parliamentary elections as a Hail Mary attempt to thwart the NR’s continued rise.

But the ascent of right-of-center party in a free and fair election proved too much for many Paris youths to bear, who directed their anger toward vandalizing their own city’s landmarks and businesses."

Macron's coalition didn't finish dead last. The Republicans only had 10%, not to mention the various minor parties. The sanitised "right of centre" term is a nice, cuddly description of the RN, much less frightening than the more accurate "far right" and "hard right". The headline "Paris Burns!" seems a bit hyperbolic, to describe flares and fireworks.
The Sky News clip breathlessly promising "left wing riots", but the only close-to-riot thing I saw was a handful of people over turning what looked like a skip. (With this logic my hometown has a riot once or twice a month). People marching in the streets is not a riot.

Please Professor MP Monkeys, may I be exempt from future research assignments? I have other things to do.

Is that it?
The term 'right of centre' is correct. The definition of far right has been so corrupted that anything to the right of the Greens is now considered 'far right'. I think people are overwhelmingly sick of the term to be honest as it has lost all meaning in the clamour of some to label people as racists.

It wasn't just 'flares and fireworks'. There have been reports of vandalism, monuments being destroyed, graffiti, riots and clashes with police.
It's not a motley crew of 10-20 people sitting around a campfire singing kumbaiya as much as you want to downplay it.

 

[burge13]

The French don't seem to want to continue supporting that particular war.

Does anyone?

The only benefactors are the weapons manufacturers and the politicians getting undisclosed kick backs from those weapons manufacturers. No one else wins out of it

 

[swingdog]

Does anyone?

The only benefactors are the weapons manufacturers and the politicians getting undisclosed kick backs from those weapons manufacturers. No one else wins out of it

Apart from those Ukrainians who'd rather not get slaughtered by Russians.

 

[burge13]

Apart from those Ukrainians who'd rather not get slaughtered by Russians.

But they are, their houses are being bombed and everything ruined. I'm sure it could have been handled better if the US weren't such warmongers but need to keep wars going for the gravy train

If it wasn't Ukraine they'd have found some oil in Nigeria right next to some WMD. It's all fugazzi imo. US love the conflicts then they love them going on forever = $$$

 

[swingdog]

But they are, their houses are being bombed and everything ruined. I'm sure it could have been handled better if the US weren't such warmongers but need to keep wars going for the gravy train

If it wasn't Ukraine they'd have found some oil in Nigeria right next to some WMD. It's all fugazzi imo. US love the conflicts then they love them going on forever = $$$

Yeah, nah.

Not everything needs to be a conspiracy.