F1 F1 2024 thread

[Not Important]

Ain't no way he dumps Lance. It will be Alonso that Max would replace.

that would be quite a payout. not so good for the companies reputation either

 

[Not Important]

mclaren has talent coming out of their rear.

 

[happy_eagle]

I didn't realise that Aston Martin have also signed Andy Cowell, who is meant to have been the brains behind the dominant Mercedes hybrid engine of 2014-2020.

So they have the masterminds behind arguably the best aero (Red Bull) and Engine (Mercedes) packages the sport has seen in the modern era. If Alonso still has it in 2026, he'll fancy his chances at some more race wins and even a title.

 

[Pugz89]

Fantastic chat with Newey. So insightful and definitely worth a listen - stick it through til the end if you can.
Covers AM, design elements of the RB18/RB19, designing the car Senna died in and many other things.

 

[Jatz]

I didn't realise that Aston Martin have also signed Andy Cowell, who is meant to have been the brains behind the dominant Mercedes hybrid engine of 2014-2020.

So they have the masterminds behind arguably the best aero (Red Bull) and Engine (Mercedes) packages the sport has seen in the modern era. If Alonso still has it in 2026, he'll fancy his chances at some more race wins and even a title.

Will be interesting to see how Alonso goes with this new car incoming.

I've no doubt he's very talented but he's often spoke about in the same conversations as Lewis and Max etc. I just don't see it. Some of it is luck with where he's been at certain times but I don't know. I'm just not convinced he's quite as good as he's always made out to be.

 

[DamoESP]

Will be interesting to see how Alonso goes with this new car incoming.

I've no doubt he's very talented but he's often spoke about in the same conversations as Lewis and Max etc. I just don't see it. Some of it is luck with where he's been at certain times but I don't know. I'm just not convinced he's quite as good as he's always made out to be.

Alot of the hype has to do with the fact that he was the one who ended Schumacher's era of dominance. There is also a lot of "what could have been" with ALO (Could have easily been a 4xWDC, missing out in 2010/2012 by a combined 9 points). ALO has always been seen as a "drivers drivers", the fact that he has driven in many other categories and pretty much dominated from the get go is a testament to his ability.

Hell, even just his performance in the 2012 season alone (which was mentioned a few pages back) is all the proof you need of his ability. He had NO business being in contention for the WDC in the final race with that absolute dog of a car that was the Ferrari F2012, but yet, there he was, going down to the final few laps.....in fact he was probably one Grosjean attack missle away from winning that year

TBF about the only ability he seems to lack is the ability to change/choose a team at the right time.

This reddit thread from a few years back goes over plenty of examples:

 

[Jatz]

Alot of the hype has to do with the fact that he was the one who ended Schumacher's era of dominance. There is also a lot of "what could have been" with ALO (Could have easily been a 4xWDC, missing out in 2010/2012 by a combined 9 points). ALO has always been seen as a "drivers drivers", the fact that he has driven in many other categories and pretty much dominated from the get go is a testament to his ability.

TBF about the only ability he seems to lack is choosing to change teams at the right time.

Hell, even just the 2012 season alone (which was only discussed a few pages back) is all the proof you need of his ability. He had NO business being in contention for the WDC in the final race with that absolute dog of a car that was the Ferrari F2012, but yet, there he was, going down to the final few laps.....in fact he was probably one Grosjean attack missle away from winning that year

This reddit thread from a few years back goes over plenty of examples:

I think this is the bit that troubles me the most. Yes he has reasons but there's also no guarantee he does win if in the right team. You look at the competition he still would've been up against had he been with Mercedes during their golden years. How many times is he beating Hamilton? Rosberg managed it once and that was partly/mostly due to his DNF in Malaysia that year.

I guess my thing is everyone seems to look fancifully/hypothetically when it comes to Fernando, unlike our genuine champions in recent times. I just personally don't see how he could be ahead of Lewis, Seb or Max - therefore to me, he's a rung below.

If that Aston is quick but he doesn't win '26, I guarantee it'll be put down to his age etc. There's just always an excuse.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Last year, Hamilton finished 3rd in the WDC, and his team was 3rd in the WCC. Alonso finished 4th in the WDC and his team finished 5th in the WCC.

In 22, Hamilton finished 6th in the WDC when MB finished 3rd in the WCC. Alonso finished 9th WDC when Aston Martin finished 7th in the WCC.

2010, 11 & 13, Alonso finished ahead of Hamilton in the WDC when his team finished below Hamilton's in the WCC.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Sebastian Vettel spent six years at Ferrari, scoring 14 wins and twice 2nd in the WDC.

Alonso spent five years at Ferrari, with 11 wins, and 3 times was 2nd in the WDC.

 

[jabba5114]

McLaren going for team orders towards lando for rest of year.

Sent from my SM-A556E using Tapatalk

 

[Festerz]

McLaren going for team orders towards lando for rest of year.

Yep. McLaren will give Lando Norris priority over teammate Oscar Piastri in this year’s Formula 1 championship battle with Red Bull’s Max Verstappen, team principal Andrea Stella has told the BBC.

“The overall concept is we are incredibly determined to win, but we want to win in the right way,” Stella told the broadcaster on Thursday.

“We [will] bias our support to Lando, but we want to do it without too much compromise on our principles."

“Our principles are that the team interest always comes first. Sportsmanship for us is important in the overall way we go racing. And then we want to be fair to both drivers.”

“The team interests comes first and these are the situations that above all we need to fix because eventually, as a matter of fact, the way we entered the race in Monza left the door open [to] this situation,” said Stella.

“The conversations have been very collaborative,” he said. “Even when I said to Oscar, ‘Would you be available to give up a victory?’ He said, ‘It’s painful, but if it’s the right thing to do now, I will do it.’”

If all of this is true then smart move from Oscar imho. Lando has a very very slim chance of grabbing this championship from Max. But by publicly backing his teammate to take that chance at his own expense, Oscar's put nice guy team credits in the bank to get top service from a team on the up for 2025 or leave.

Oscar also puts all the pressure on Lando to get race wins from here to the end of the season, allowing him to focus on team building and race craft. He can no longer be judged by his team-mate's relative performance as his own team has demanded he play second fiddle for the sake of the team which is public recognition of just how good Oscar is as a driver.

A very good position to be in for a 2nd year driver about to enter a proper F1 salary negotiation with a team that is now regarded as being the top of the F1 pile in terms of winning potential.

All credit to Mark Weber for the way he has handled this too. Forcing McLaren to make their rest of season call on driver preference publicly is something truly unique - something he knows from bitter experience is important to have recognised for both driver credibility and contract negotiation capital.

 

[gaskin]

It is all well and good to say it now but they have waited too long. I fully believe Lando wins Monza if they told Oscar before the race to hold position.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

McLaren going for team orders towards lando for rest of year.

Sent from my SM-A556E using Tapatalk

...like they haven't been doing that already? Short of asking a driver the give up an earned position, Lando's side of the garage has had priority all year.

Which races has Oscar been given preferential pit strategy to necessitate this public call?

 

[Jatz]

...like they haven't been doing that already? Short of asking a driver the give up an earned position, Lando's side of the garage has had priority all year.

Which races has Oscar been given preferential pit strategy to necessitate this public call?

They haven't.

The giving up the earned position will literally be what they're talking about.

That call needed to happen a while back but they've left it too late now.

 

[Duck Farmer]

“The conversations have been very collaborative,” he said. “Even when I said to Oscar, ‘Would you be available to give up a victory?’ He said, ‘It’s painful, but if it’s the right thing to do now, I will do it.’”

Inb4 Oscar flies past Lando at Turn 1 on the opening lap.

 

[skam85]

Oscar P1, Charles P2, Lando P3 late in the race would be hilarious.
Ain't nothing you can do about that McLaren

 

[DamoESP]

So looks like while McLaren may ask PIA to swap positions with NOR if required during a race (Say swap P2 and P3), I don't think they are going to make him give up a win for it.

When asked whether he was anticipating Piastri, who is 44 points back, to slow down to hand him the lead in upcoming races, Norris told Autosport: “No.

“In general, probably for lower positions, but if he’s fought for a win and he’s deserving of a win, then he deserves to win.”

Norris ‘doesn’t want to be given a championship’, rules out Piastri relinquishing F1 wins

Lando Norris has expressed he "doesn't want to be given a championship" as he ruled out McLaren team-mate Oscar Piastri

www.motorsportweek.com

EDIT: Then again its easy for NOR to say he doesnt want McLaren to make PIA give up a win (I'm sure deep down all drivers would rather win on merit) but bet when he is out there racing he would "Follow the team order" and take the win anyway if McLaren asked them to swap.....Good ole plausible deniability

 

[Festerz]

Inb4 Oscar flies past Lando at Turn 1 on the opening lap.

Yep. The thing about that overtake and every other subsequent lap of that opening stint at Monza is that Lando was consistently and significantly slower than his team mate so he was never in with a chance of winning the race as it turned out. I still fail to see what all the fuss was about - the three points he lost to Oscar by finishing 3rd rather than 2nd?

 

[Duck Farmer]

Will lol if Lando wins the WDC only because Oscar gives up the lead in multiple races. Will be the most undeserving champ ever.

 

[Jatz]

Yeah, team orders have never helped champions before...

 

[skam85]

Will lol if Lando wins the WDC only because Oscar gives up the lead in multiple races. Will be the most undeserving champ ever.

The Eddie Irvine of 99 if he had won

 

[skam85]

Yeah, team orders have never helped champions before...

I can't think of many seasons that it has directly helped them win a title.

The biggest team orders have been for drivers like Schumacher, Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel who were obviously and comprehensively ahead of their teammates, so on the rare occasion they were swapped.

There aren't many that have had teammates that are close in pace like Oscar and Lando. Maybe the closest being Hakkinen and DC but even then DC was comfortably behind most of the time.

 

[imadodgyumpire]

Will lol if Lando wins the WDC only because Oscar gives up the lead in multiple races.

This year might be his only chance to win a WDC

Will be the most undeserving champ ever.

No such thing when it's the first title. The fact he's got himself in the position is a validation of his ability.

The Eddie Irvine of 99 if he had won

Gave up points to Schumacher in France.

Also Irvine's only chance at a championship.

 

[happy_eagle]

I can't think of many seasons that it has directly helped them win a title.

The biggest team orders have been for drivers like Schumacher, Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel who were obviously and comprehensively ahead of their teammates, so on the rare occasion they were swapped.

There aren't many that have had teammates that are close in pace like Oscar and Lando. Maybe the closest being Hakkinen and DC but even then DC was comfortably behind most of the time.

Alonso v Hamilton in 07 was like that, and it probably cost either driver a world title.

 

[skam85]

Alonso v Hamilton in 07 was like that, and it probably cost either driver a world title.

Which puts egg on my face considering Massa effectively let Kimi by in Brazil