F1 F1 2024 thread

[Skull Face]

Despite peoples opinion the T4 incident, based on the rules as they stand (where only the apex matters), lando had the right for room.

As the car on the outside, he was ahead / level with Max....which is what the rules say he has to be.
Whether you agree with the ruleset or not (i don't FWIW), at least they were consistent in their application of them for both weeks.

Max tried the same trick as last week. Dived for the apex (because that's all that matters when defending).
But this time he didn't get there.
As soon as he didn't get there, it's on him to give room. He didn't.
It was actually an easy call.

I'm all on Ferrari for the constructors.
At least its gong to be an exciting end to the year.

People who don't think the 1st incident was a penalty for max may as well come out and say they want to ban all overtaking.

If you can run someone off the road because you have the inside line defending even when you are behind then no overtake will ever happen again because you can just defend inside go deep and block the exit so its drs clean or overtake in pits no wheel to wheel racing ever.

 

[Barrybran]

People who don't think the 1st incident was a penalty for max may as well come out and say they want to ban all overtaking.

If you can run someone off the road because you have the inside line defending even when you are behind then no overtake will ever happen again because you can just defend inside go deep and block the exit so its drs clean or overtake in pits no wheel to wheel racing ever.

When you're turning left, you're looking left. If someone tries to come around you on the right, you're not seeing where they are.

No doubt Max knows he's there but it is not unreasonable to defend a space while you're looking in the opposite direction. There are other places and ways overtakes can be done but the onus is on the car with the greater visibility to do so safely.

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

People who don't think the 1st incident was a penalty for max may as well come out and say they want to ban all overtaking.

If you can run someone off the road because you have the inside line defending even when you are behind then no overtake will ever happen again because you can just defend inside go deep and block the exit so its drs clean or overtake in pits no wheel to wheel racing ever.

Agree.
I want cars overtaking. inside and outside.

Its the guidelines that are a problem.
but now that they are published, its clear they are wrong and they will be changed ASAP.

To have a ruleset that doesn't take into account the defending car staying on the track is just insane!
To only have the apex as the deciding factor on how the defending car behaves is mind boggling.

Also the notion of "defending" car needs re-thinking because there needs to be clear understanding of when an overtake is "done".

It explains why Max is at the centre of controversy year after year.
He is driving to the guidelines....he's just the only one to apply them verbatim.
Everyone else will give room on exit (look at Saintz on Max in T1).
Max just runs the car to the rules.....and the rules say he doesn't have to stay on track if he is defending and first to the apex.

 

[Skull Face]

When you're turning left, you're looking left. If someone tries to come around you on the right, you're not seeing where they are.

No doubt Max knows he's there but it is not unreasonable to defend a space while you're looking in the opposite direction. There are other places and ways overtakes can be done but the onus is on the car with the greater visibility to do so safely.

When you are battling a car you are checking in your mirrors down the straight to see if the car behind is close enough to go for a move, you realise this you defend to the inside.

Trying to pretend he couldn't see him is perhaps the most delusional take ive seen on here



May as well say he cant see carlos sainz either, he knows he is there which is why he defends inside then squeezes norris to the edge of the track and if you bother to watch the onboard footage he doesnt run him off until halfway to turn 5 when he opens the steering up to run norris off the road

 

[Barrybran]

When you are battling a car you are checking in your mirrors down the straight to see if the car behind is close enough to go for a move, you realise this you defend to the inside.

Trying to pretend he couldn't see him is perhaps the most delusional take ive seen on here

View attachment 2154246

May as well say he cant see carlos sainz either, he knows he is there which is why he defends inside the squeezes norris to the edge of the track and if you bother to watch the onboard footage he doesnt run him off until halfway to turn 5 when he opens the steering up to run norris off the road

How is it delusional? Drivers can see where opponents line up but once they're in the corner they're looking in, not out. The driver on the inside is entitled to drive in the racing line. The onus is on the driver on the outside to make the overtake safely.

 

[Skull Face]

How is it delusional? Drivers can see where opponents line up but once they're in the corner they're looking in, not out. The driver on the inside is entitled to drive in the racing line. The onus is on the driver on the outside to make the overtake safely.

It is delusional to pretend he couldnt see him for 2 reason.

#1 norris gets ahead before braking making it impossible not to be able to see him
#2 If you watch the on board you can see max intentionally open the steering briefly to run himself wide to the kerb and run lando off when he normally would be starting to open up for 5.

Verstappen is not on the racing line as he chose to give it up to defend the inside line, if you want to get technical about it norris was ahead before braking so max is the one trying to overtake offline to regain the position.

It still amazes me the sim racing community can get this so much better then the fia and it's a very basic concept in that if another car has overlap on you then you must give each other space through the turn.

 

[ReidBetweenTheLines]

It will never happen, but there’s a bit of speculation about Ric after Perez’ disastrous weekend.

 

[Barrybran]

It is delusional to pretend he couldnt see him for 2 reason.

#1 norris gets ahead before braking making it impossible not to be able to see him
#2 If you watch the on board you can see max intentionally open the steering briefly to run himself wide to the kerb and run lando off when he normally would be starting to open up for 5.

Verstappen is not on the racing line as he chose to give it up to defend the inside line, if you want to get technical about it norris was ahead before braking so max is the one trying to overtake offline to regain the position.

It still amazes me the sim racing community can get this so much better then the fia and it's a very basic concept in that if another car has overlap on you then you must give each other space through the turn.

You realise how limited the vision is, right? If a driver is looking one direction, they're not going to see the car attempting to overtake on the outside. They know they're there from their mirrors before the corner but they don't know if the driver on the outside is going to back off or do something stupid because they're looking in the other direction.

 

[Black_White]

When you are battling a car you are checking in your mirrors down the straight to see if the car behind is close enough to go for a move, you realise this you defend to the inside.

Trying to pretend he couldn't see him is perhaps the most delusional take ive seen on here

View attachment 2154246

May as well say he cant see carlos sainz either, he knows he is there which is why he defends inside then squeezes norris to the edge of the track and if you bother to watch the onboard footage he doesnt run him off until halfway to turn 5 when he opens the steering up to run norris off the road

Freeze frame can be very deceptive. The pic no doubt shows he could see him at that point.
Would need to see video to judge exactly when the car came into view. Would be even better if there was in helmet vision to show where he was looking and just when Lando was seen.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

It will never happen, but there’s a bit of speculation about Ric after Perez’ disastrous weekend.

View attachment 2154283

They are just stupid fluff articles. He is not coming back.

 

[Skull Face]

You realise how limited the vision is, right? If a driver is looking one direction, they're not going to see the car attempting to overtake on the outside. They know they're there from their mirrors before the corner but they don't know if the driver on the outside is going to back off or do something stupid because they're looking in the other direction.

You can see your front tire champ and if you can't see Norris tire directly beside that you should not be behind the wheel of any motor vehicles because you WILL kill someone

 

[Cromulant]

Fair overreaction

 

[Skull Face]

Freeze frame can be very deceptive. The pic no doubt shows he could see him at that point.
Would need to see video to judge exactly when the car came into view. Would be even better if there was in helmet vision to show where he was looking and just when Lando was seen.

Watch the f1.com review on YouTube

 

[Skull Face]

Fair overreaction

Maybe but imagine Norris uses this excuse at turn 8 we got 2 cars heading nose 1st into the barriers at 200kmh

 

[Cromulant]

Maybe but imagine Norris uses this excuse at turn 8 we got 2 cars heading nose 1st into the barriers at 200kmh

Like when Lewis ran Max off the road at nearly 300 at Silverstone ??

 

[King Of Money]

It will never happen, but there’s a bit of speculation about Ric after Perez’ disastrous weekend.

View attachment 2154283

That would be an admission by Marco and Horner that they got it wrong.

Two chances of that happening,...

 

[Skull Face]

Like when Lewis ran Max off the road at nearly 300 at Silverstone ??

You think I'm a waamilton fan? He should have been crucified for that

I want to see wheel to wheel racing the rules need to prevent cars being able to push each other off to gain a position/penalty for another driver

 

[Cromulant]

You think I'm a waamilton fan? He should have been crucified for that

I want to see wheel to wheel racing the rules need to prevent cars being able to push each other off to gain a position/penalty for another driver

Nah I dont think that, but he got a slap on the wrist for it.

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

Like when Lewis ran Max off the road at nearly 300 at Silverstone ??

Lewis got 10 seconds for causing the collision (if i recall correctly).
He was called out by the stewards and the same rules applied, which he was found to be at fault.

What do you think they should have done differently?

 

[Cromulant]

Lewis got 10 seconds for causing the collision (if i recall correctly).
He was called out by the stewards and the same rules applied, which he was found to be at fault.

What do you think they should have done differently?

Shouldve been way more than 10 seconds for starters.

Almost the fastest corner on the F1 calendar and he put his title rival into the wall. Everyone talks about how dangerous Max can be (he can), but this was far worse.

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

Shouldve been way more than 10 seconds for starters.

Almost the fastest corner on the F1 calendar and he put his title rival into the wall. Everyone talks about how dangerous Max can be (he can), but this was far worse.

Right.
No doubt it was a massive accident.

The only provisions they have above 10 seconds are a drive through, stop/go, or black flag.
Don't think anyone would have been unhappy at a Drive through.

But you're asking F1 to change to an outcome / corner based system.
Which absolutely isn't in any rules apart from "stewards discretion".

At the time they made the call, Max was out of the car....so they would have had limited knowledge of the impact etc.

 

[ReidBetweenTheLines]

The whole Verstappen running others drivers off the circuit goes back to Austria 2019 when he did the same thing to Leclerc in the dying laps to steal the win. The FIA didn’t penalise Max because Mercedes were still dominant and they wanted to cash in on Maxs popularity especially in Europe.

Since then he’s believed that he can always just get the inside line and force opponents off the track. He doesn’t even need to make the corner exit himself just so long as his rival isn’t too far in front.

F1 was never like that. It was leave a cars width if two drivers were alongside each other, which is self explanatory when it’s a street circuit with a wall. The FIA created this monster and now they have to deal with it.

 

[Cromulant]

The whole Verstappen running others drivers off the circuit goes back to Austria 2019 when he did the same thing to Leclerc in the dying laps to steal the win. The FIA didn’t penalise Max because Mercedes were still dominant and they wanted to cash in on Maxs popularity especially in Europe.

Since then he’s believed that he can always just get the inside line and force opponents off the track. He doesn’t even need to make the corner exit himself just so long as he’s rival isn’t too far in front.

F1 was never like that. It was leave a cars width if two drivers were alongside each other, which is self explanatory when it’s a street circuit with a wall. The FIA crested this monster and now they have to deal with it.

F1 has always been like it.

 

[happy_eagle]

Just glad we are heading to Brazil where Max has no history of questionable racing moves.

Oh wait

 

[TheVillageIdiot7]

Just glad we are heading to Brazil where Max has no history of questionable racing moves.

Oh wait

To be fair.....Ocon deserved to be punched after that one!