Coach Fages and the coaching group

[Cubs2Lions]

I know Clarkson goes to lots of games, but it is interesting that he was there today.

Considering that the North Melbourne match was also on at identical times and the links between those two counterparts as well, something tells me that Fages could give the job to Clarkson next year.

 

[M Malice]

I am starting to think ***'s should head up to the coaches box and get a broader view of the game, send one of his assistants down to the bench, time for a change up.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

There is no way that Hardwick or Clarkson would have left a press conference like that without firing a shot at the playing group. All Fagan did was offer up a series of excises whilst smirking his way through the interview. I am not calling for his sacking but certainly can see some weakness in our one dimensional game plan and our pattern of team selection.

What does airing it publicly achieve though? It may make those supporters feel a little validated in their frustration, but a private baking always seems much more likely to be effective than a public one.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

Leon Cameron parted way with the Giants after winning a final last year.

Mind you that came after 6 finals appearance in 7 seasons.

 

[The Flying Belgian]

Nah the pressure has rightly started to come on to not just Fages but the club, as it should.

Been watching footy for far too long to write anything off. Just saying if there were a market on him getting sacked, I'd be shorting it. For the record, I've been questioning for most of the season whether he's the man to take us forward. Just think calls for sacking are an overreaction from a few who are still a bit raw over the result today.

 

[lioninthesand]

Been watching footy for far too long to write anything off. Just saying if there were a market on him getting sacked, I'd be shorting it. For the record, I've been questioning for most of the season whether he's the man to take us forward. Just think calls for sacking are an overreaction from a few who are still a bit raw over the result today.

There is no way he is in line to be sacked. He will see out his contract, rightfully so.

He should try and refresh/re-tool and not just continue to run this set up into the ground, it’ll just be a wasted year.

The Clarko thing, whilst highly unlikely next year, makes sense for this.

 

[Squizz89]

Been watching footy for far too long to write anything off. Just saying if there were a market on him getting sacked, I'd be shorting it. For the record, I've been questioning for most of the season whether he's the man to take us forward. Just think calls for sacking are an overreaction from a few who are still a bit raw over the result today.

Yeah I’ve also said I don’t believe he will be sacked and nor should he. But I am starting to wonder whether he’s having doubts on himself and how far he can take this group. He’s publicly questioned his own decisions now twice in the past month (Matho and then Fort today).

One thing I would say, is if Clarko doesn’t accept the North or Giants role and ends up having another year off next year, I’d have us in the top 2-3 chances as the team he coaches the year after, especially if we have another year like this year, where we are around the mark without ever (at this stage) looking like a legitimate chance.

 

[mpal6]

I know Clarkson goes to lots of games, but it is interesting that he was there today.

Kiddy would've got him all excited if he's thinking about coming in.

 

[lioninthesand]

What does airing it publicly achieve though? It may make those supporters feel a little validated in their frustration, but a private baking always seems much more likely to be effective than a public one.

You are speaking to the players at your press conference. You are putting the pubic face to your organisation in terms of expectations on the field. I don’t think they are getting baked behind closed doors either?

The presser was nauseating.

Kiddy cramping, best game we’ve played on the G in years, Richmond had their best side in, Richmond are great. Barely even addressed the level of disserpointnent everyone was feeling, acted like it was normal, just a shrug of the shoulders.

I love Fages, I don’t want him sacked, we owe him a lot - but his ‘softly, softly’ approach to everything has 100% given us a soft underbelly.

Setting some expectations, talking more objectively to your supporters and putting players and the team on notice in a presser (without going overboard) is perfectly reasonable and and healthy tool a coach can use to put players on notice, clear the air with supporters and set expectations, on record going forward.

The 2 minutes spent each week bigging up the oppo is just so obviously not what you should be talking about every week.

He didn’t even talk about the mental aspects to the 42 point capitulation? Like come on man, talk honestly without aiming to protect your and the players reputation.

 

[McIvor]

There is no way that Hardwick or Clarkson would have left a press conference like that without firing a shot at the playing group. All Fagan did was offer up a series of excises whilst smirking his way through the interview. I am not calling for his sacking but certainly can see some weakness in our one dimensional game plan and our pattern of team selection.

Was disappointed by the smirking but also equally at the meek questions thrown up by these supposed hard hitting journalists who only seem to have a crack when club - coach - players arent around. Nonetheless Fagans press conference didnt instill me with any confidence and if anything underlined that this years should be his last. Time to start playing Dev and Payne or otherwise risk losing them.

 

[jjami15]

You are speaking to the players at your press conference. You are putting the pubic face to your organisation in terms of expectations on the field. I don’t think they are getting baked behind closed doors either?

The presser was nauseating.

Kiddy cramping, best game we’ve played on the G in years, Richmond had their best side in, Richmond are great. Barely even addressed the level of disserpointnent everyone was feeling, acted like it was normal, just a shrug of the shoulders.

I love Fages, I don’t want him sacked, we owe him a lot - but his ‘softly, softly’ approach to everything has 100% given us a soft underbelly.

Setting some expectations, talking more objectively to your supporters and putting players and the team on notice in a presser (without going overboard) is perfectly reasonable and and healthy tool a coach can use to put players on notice, clear the air with supporters and set expectations, on record going forward.

The 2 minutes spent each week bigging up the oppo is just so obviously not what you should be talking about every week.

He didn’t even talk about the mental aspects to the 42 point capitulation? Like come on man, talk honestly without aiming to protect your and the players reputation.

Maybe he taught at one of those Positive Behaviour Learning schools? Carrot and the Stock Fagan, Carrot and the stick!

 

[Thomasno]

Considering that the North Melbourne match was also on at identical times and the links between those two counterparts as well, something tells me that Fages could give the job to Clarkson next year.

Well hello there, this certainly makes things interesting

 

[lionraven]

The Fort decision is one of those risky plays that will either make you look like a genius or a dunce based on a retrospectoscope rear view analysis.

The logic seems to be that the Lions would be more rooted by the loss of a tall than a small player (ie. what happened to us when McStay and Paine were injured mid game at the end of last year). So it would make sense to use that med sub to cover for that sort of catastrophy.

However, losing a small early in the game now makes it look completely foolish. Fort being completely ineffective and us losing the centre bounce clearances in the 4th compounds this.

We got too clever for our own good. Good learning point for any finals. The medisub should ideally be a medium sized runner type of player. Someone like Lester/Prior/Cockatoo who can play tall or small so we can slide him in as a bigger body midfield, talll or small defender etc.

We need to be flexible in our talls. If Oscar goes down we need to be prepared to throw someone like Rayner just to compete in the ruck as a secondary ala JSOS at the Blues. If a tall back goes down we need to flip McStay back and simply play Rayner as a tall. If we lose a tall forward we need to play Rayner tall or consider playing small.

Having Fort as the medisub just completely limits what we can do with our setups. At we learnt this lesson now instead of during an EF.

 

[lioninthesand]

The Fort decision is one of those risky plays that will either make you look like a genius or a dunce based on a retrospectoscope rear view analysis.

The logic seems to be that the Lions would be more rooted by the loss of a tall than a small player (ie. what happened to us when McStay and Paine were injured mid game at the end of last year). So it would make sense to use that med sub to cover for that sort of catastrophy.

However, losing a small early in the game now makes it look completely foolish. Fort being completely ineffective and us losing the centre bounce clearances in the 4th compounds this.

We got too clever for our own good. Good learning point for any finals. The medisub should ideally be a medium sized runner type of player. Someone like Lester/Prior/Cockatoo who can play tall or small so we can slide him in as a bigger body midfield, talll or small defender etc.

We need to be flexible in our talls. If Oscar goes down we need to be prepared to throw someone like Rayner just to compete in the ruck as a secondary ala JSOS at the Blues. If a tall back goes down we need to flip McStay back and simply play Rayner as a tall. If we lose a tall forward we need to play Rayner tall or consider playing small.

Having Fort as the medisub just completely limits what we can do with our setups. At we learnt this lesson now instead of during an EF.

There is only 1 situation it would be a good thing and that is if Oscar goes down. That is a 1/22 gamble.

Even if joe/McStay went down today, a runner coming in would have been ideal.

There is no genius/fool/heindsight situation here IMO, it was an absolute howler, that a lot of us have been predicting would f*** us over and it did.

Massive error, that should NEVER, ever.. ever… ever… happen again.

 

[Thomasno]

There is only 1 situation it would be a good thing and that is if Oscar goes down. That is a 1/22 gamble.

Even if joe/McStay went down today, a runner coming in would have been ideal.

There is no genius/fool/heindsight situation here IMO, it was an absolute howler, that a lot of us have been predicting would f*** us over and it did.

Massive error, that should NEVER, ever.. ever… ever… happen again.

Agreed. And what ****ed us in the finals last year wasn’t losing a tall, it was losing a tall after already losing talls throughout the season and leaving us severely undermanned up forward…. TWICE in two consecutive games.

 

[Gadzorks]

a single all powerful coach is not as good as a team of coaches, as long as that team can challenge each other in a supportive way.

Fagan is all over the player connection and personnel management. Players seen happy with him.

I'd like another coach to come in who can take a fresh look at our list and focuses on game day structure.


I'd happily have Nobel back in that role, or Clarkson part time, which is probably all we can afford. He and Fagan have the history of working well together. Think that could be magic.

 

[briztoon]

Just two points that haven’t been raised by anyone else yet.

1) Fagan was asked why the selection of Fort?

And he answered that, that is something the club would like to keep in-house.

I’m wondering if one of our talls is carrying an injury they are worried about.


2) Danny Daly is our Director of Football. Was he hired by Fagan, or inherited? I wonder if there is a strong voice that can challenge Fagan, since Noble moved on.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Just two points that haven’t been raised by anyone else yet.

1) Fagan was asked why the selection of Fort?

And he answered that, that is something the club would like to keep in-house.

I’m wondering if one of our talls is carrying an injury they are worried about.


2) Danny Daly is our Director of Football. Was he hired by Fagan, or inherited? I wonder if there is a strong voice that can challenge Fagan, since Noble moved on.

Daly came with Leppa from Richmond IIRC

 

[3KZ is Football]

Fagan is cooked. We need a new coach with a new set of eyes. His word salads at press conferences are not cutting it anymore and his selection decisions are just terrible. People have been saying for nearly half the season that our defensive structures are a shambles, but he has done ZERO to address this. As an illustration from today ... go to the AFL highlights package for the game and at 4:10 in, you can watch Adams actually spoiling Gardiner, who had the sit and was set to mark. Ball goes out the back and Richmond goals. It was one of the dumbest things you are ever going to see.

As for Fagan, if you want proof that he is not a coaching proposition after this season, just look at how he reacts at the selection table for the Carlton game. Rinse and repeat for a coach who appear too stubborn to admit he is wrong about a number of players who get gifted games despite rubbish performances.

 

[BangyBangy]

Fagan is cooked. We need a new coach with a new set of eyes. His word salads at press conferences are not cutting it anymore and his selection decisions are just terrible. People have been saying for nearly half the season that our defensive structures are a shambles, but he has done ZERO to address this. As an illustration from today ... go to the AFL highlights package for the game and at 4:10 in, you can watch Adams actually spoiling Gardiner, who had the sit and was set to mark. Ball goes out the back and Richmond goals. It was one of the dumbest things you are ever going to see.

As for Fagan, if you want proof that he is not a coaching proposition after this season, just look at how he reacts at the selection table for the Carlton game. Rinse and repeat for a coach who appear too stubborn to admit he is wrong about a number of players who get gifted games despite rubbish performances.

You'll take that all back if he drops Dizzy for Lester next game.

 

[3KZ is Football]

You'll take that all back if he drops Dizzy for Lester next game.

Nah, I'd keep Gardiner, but Adams has to go. He is just plain terrible. He has ZERO football sense. Before the game I said exactly how Riewoldt was going to beat him and it happened perfectly to script.

 

[BangyBangy]

Nah, I'd keep Gardiner, but Adams has to go. He is just plain terrible. He has ZERO football sense. Before the game I said exactly how Riewoldt was going to beat him and it happened perfectly to script.

Disagree 3KZ. Late last year & early this year I thought he was our best back. He's not right atm, I won't deny, but not sure a spell in the 2's fixes that at this point in the season. Don't see anyone on our list that can take his role when he's playing well, not Payne, not Lester, not anyone.

 

[trikster]

2) Danny Daly is our Director of Football. Was he hired by Fagan, or inherited? I wonder if there is a strong voice that can challenge Fagan, since Noble moved on.

Inherited. Fagan joined 2016, Dally was an assistant since 2014 as best I can tell

 

[3KZ is Football]

Disagree 3KZ. Late last year & early this year I thought he was our best back. He's not right atm, I won't deny, but not sure a spell in the 2's fixes that at this point in the season. Don't see anyone on our list that can take his role when he's playing well, not Payne, not Lester, not anyone.

The problem is he is beyond not playing well, Adams is just atrocious. The number of times his opponents get goal side of him and score is just embarrassing. Then there is the ‘comedy capers’ stuff like spoiling Gardiner or displaying the slowest decision making time I have just about ever seen. Ball in hand, in traffic,he is just woeful.

 

[3KZ is Football]

The shelf life on this rubbish is pretty short. This is just nine days old.

Fagan: Ready to Prove the Doubters Wrong

When’s the next reset? What will the next article be? Perhaps, “Fagan ready to prove those who doubted he could prove the doubters wrong, wrong.”