Great grand final matchups we were robbed of

[Doss]

Essendon vs Footscray 1985. This was a GF that I think would have been closer than the 78 pt thrashing the Hawks received. Maybe even an upset. As much as I hate to admit it, that 85 Essendon side was incredible. I actually didn’t want us to make the GF that year cos I sensed a belting, and the Bullies seemed to match up against the Bombers much better than we did.

Footscray are the only Victorian side (including Sydney when they were South) that Essendon's never played in a grand final too. Well technically University too, but then they sort of don't count as they never even made a finals series.

 

[Doss]

2001 Brisbane v Hawthorn

hawks just went down to dons with some horrid umpiring in the PF. Would have prob pushed the lions more than the dons did. For the best the hawks lost or we would never have gotten clarko.

You're having a lend - Brisbane would have demolished Hawthorn in 2001. I'll readily admit that we got the rub of the green in the prelim against you guys, but Hawthorn was not a grand final-worthy team that year.

 

[Roobs321]

Knew the pies would attempt to create echoes of 2007 (when I think Port would've beaten them anyway). Pies lost to the two grand finalists in this finals series, therefore they didn't belong there.

And yes, the 2001 Hawks would have been annihilated.

 

[loki04]

Lol I knew this would come up as I was sitting there in the third quarter. Not only did they lose to the two grand finalists in the early finals, they went 0-4 against the two grand finalists this season. It's easy in hindsight, but people were expecting a classic going in.

Grandfinal isn't played on the SCG. Swans we would account for at mcg we just never play them there.

Geelong scraped home twice vs us and the game would of been vastly closer and a much better contest.
Still think Geelong the way they played would of had our measure on the day but a lot better spectacle would of ensued.

Geelong deserved premiership winners in 2022. They were the best team all year.

 

[kranky al]

Eagles vs norf 2022

Couldnt have been any worse than that shittruck just rolled through the mcg

 

[loki04]

80 or 90 points instead of 119

Within 4 goals imo.

 

[kranky al]

Grandfinal isn't played on the SCG. Swans we would account for at mcg we just never play them there.

Geelong scraped home twice vs us and the game would of been vastly closer and a much better contest.
Still think Geelong the way they played would of had our measure on the day but a lot better spectacle would of ensued.

Geelong deserved premiership winners in 2022. They were the best team all year.

I think collingwood would have been better than sydney but still run out of legs after half time.

Last week was a better gf than this

 

[eth-dog]

Anybody suggesting Collingwood would have been a better match up are simply put crazy. Let's compare everything relevant between Sydney and Collingwood this year. Sydney:

1. Were better offensively
2. Wer better defensively
3. Had the better percentage
4. Won both head-to-head match ups
5. Had a superior record against top 8 sides (8-3 compared to 4-7)

So yeah, this result was happening either way. The idea that a side that lost the prelim to the losers would have been better is always a silly one to me. If that were the case you would have won the week before.

 

[Footy_Fan2007]

Eagles vs norf 2022

Couldnt have been any worse than that shittruck just rolled through the mcg

It was beautiful.

 

[kranky al]

It was beautiful.

Oh taking nothing away from the cats bud, just a shit game for neutrals

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

Grandfinal isn't played on the SCG. Swans we would account for at mcg we just never play them there.

Geelong scraped home twice vs us and the game would of been vastly closer and a much better contest.
Still think Geelong the way they played would of had our measure on the day but a lot better spectacle would of ensued.

Geelong deserved premiership winners in 2022. They were the best team all year.

I don't think anyone could have stopped us after the start we got today. In hindsight, after Blicavs goal, or maybe Smith's first, no-one was going to catch us.

I was still a bit concerned at halftime that Sydney looked OK in the second quarter, but in retrospect our guys could see it, they were hungry and beyond Dangerfield and Selwood, there were 8-10 Cats in their late 20s-early 30s who were never going to let the opportunity slip and were going to keep the foot down for all four quarters.

For Collingwood specifically, Sydney won against them twice... yeah Collingwood could have won the Prelim, but it was a earned home game for the Swans and on balance, they were the superior team both times they met in my opinion. Yes they only lost narrowly, but they had a fair bit of fortune go their way with some wins throughout the season to make it to the top four in the first place. If Collingwood had won, Reid's injury would have helped. Got to take the good with the bad. At the end of the day, it made the Pies pretty compelling viewing for 2-3 months of the season.

It's just... we've been hearing this from Pies supporters for 15 years. Now we'll hear it for another 15. Geelong got that away MCG final monkey off their back in the qualifying final. I think the grand final is a different beast.

From being there in 2011, it was much more pro-Geelong than I expected, nothing like our regular match-ups. Probably due to neutrals barracking against Collingwood. I imagine something similar would have happened in 2018 against West Coast, much more of a split crowd than if it was the PF. If Sydney had given a yelp yesterday I think the crowd would have turned for them. But 2011 is also an interesting case study in that we had a lucky win early in the season against the Pies and them piled on the goals in the final home and away round 1 v 2 dead rubber. For a lot of people, it didn't matter and Collingwood were still the superior team. Then the Cats comfortably accounted for them in the grand final.

 

[PieLebo87]

Anyone that doesn’t believe a Collingwood v Cats GF wouldn’t have been a much better GF match up after the QF have rocks in their head and just can’t put their own biased hate against Collingwood aside.

“Ow but they lost against them in the QF!”

Lions got beat in the ‘03 QF yet went on and smashed the Pies in the GF. Not saying we would’ve smashed the Cats - just saying it would’ve been a bloody good contest, especially with the quality of games Collingwood had provided in their 2 finals against the two Grand Finalists.

 

[Doss]

It’s such a pointless hypothetical ultimately.

Collingwood were not quite good enough to make the grand final and you cannot possibly argue they were the second best team over the course of the year.

I suspect they might have provided a stiffer contest than Sydney did yesterday but there’s no guarantee that’s the case. At all. We hear this after every preliminary final loss.

 

[PieLebo87]

It’s such a pointless hypothetical ultimately.

That’s the point of the thread. Just like every other GF match up we were robbed of. All are technically pointless hypotheticals but still being discussed.

Collingwood were not quite good enough to make the grand final and you cannot possibly argue they were the second best team over the course of the year.

That’s not what is being discussed. It’s about whether it would’ve been a great GF match up. The QF and even Round 3 tells us it could’ve been.

I suspect they might have provided a stiffer contest than Sydney did yesterday but there’s no guarantee that’s the case. At all. We hear this after every preliminary final loss.

There’s no guarantee, there’s also no guarantee the Cats would’ve won considering the QF. All hypotheticals.

 

[eth-dog]

Anyone that doesn’t believe a Collingwood v Cats GF wouldn’t have been a much better GF match up after the QF have rocks in their head and just can’t put their own biased hate against Collingwood aside.

“Ow but they lost against them in the QF!”

Lions got beat in the ‘03 QF yet went on and smashed the Pies in the GF. Not saying we would’ve smashed the Cats - just saying it would’ve been a bloody good contest, especially with the quality of games Collingwood had provided in their 2 finals against the two Grand Finalists.

You know, apart from the following:

Anybody suggesting Collingwood would have been a better match up are simply put crazy. Let's compare everything relevant between Sydney and Collingwood this year. Sydney:

1. Were better offensively
2. Wer better defensively
3. Had the better percentage
4. Won both head-to-head match ups
5. Had a superior record against top 8 sides (8-3 compared to 4-7)

So yeah, this result was happening either way. The idea that a side that lost the prelim to the losers would have been better is always a silly one to me. If that were the case you would have won the week before.

But yeah, it's just bias, not that you're biased at all.

 

[Doss]

But using that logic Sydney should have been expected to provide a really stiff contest yesterday - they’d beaten Geelong the past two times they’d played afterall.

It’s just a bit too Plugger moral premiers-y for my liking.

 

[PieLebo87]

Anybody suggesting Collingwood would have been a better match up are simply put crazy. Let's compare everything relevant between Sydney and Collingwood this year. Sydney:

1. Were better offensively
2. Wer better defensively
3. Had the better percentage
4. Won both head-to-head match ups
5. Had a superior record against top 8 sides (8-3 compared to 4-7)

So yeah, this result was happening either way. The idea that a side that lost the prelim to the losers would have been better is always a silly one to me. If that were the case you would have won the week before.

So you have to pass eth-dog ’s 5 point argument to warrant a GF berth? Is that how finals works?

Try telling that to Sydney when they played against the Dees in finals with a better defence, finished higher on the ladder and had a home ground advantage. Sydney shouldn’t have won that QF based on your 5 points not being all ticked off.

Should’ve also told the doggies of 2016 this after winning their flag from 7th with the worst offensive score of the whole top 8 that season.

Anyone can use stats anyway they like to forge their argument - doesn’t mean the other person is wrong.

 

[eth-dog]

So you have to pass eth-dog ’s 5 point argument to warrant a GF berth? Is that how finals works?

Try telling that to Sydney when they played against the Dees in finals with a better defence, finished higher on the ladder and had a home ground advantage. Sydney shouldn’t have won that QF based on your 5 points not being all ticked off.

Should’ve also told the doggies of 2016 this after winning their flag from 7th with the worst offensive score of the whole top 8 that season.

Anyone can use stats anyway they like to forge their argument - doesn’t mean the other person is wrong.

No, but when comparing the two teams, when everything overwhelmingly favours one team making the Grand Final (including winning the preliminary final, shocking I know) to say the other team would have done better is pretty silly.

What's the argument for Collingwood having a better show of it? They had two close losses to Geelong through the year? Sydney beat Geelong in their only match up before the GF.

 

[Doss]

MC Extra Dollop I have come to the conclusion that 2011 Geelong really got exceptionally lucky that your grand final opponent wasn’t the might of Essendon.

I mean Collingwood were just okay I guess but we were the only side Geelong didn’t beat that year. Proof’s in the pudding m8.

 

[kranky al]

Anyone that doesn’t believe a Collingwood v Cats GF wouldn’t have been a much better GF match up after the QF have rocks in their head and just can’t put their own biased hate against Collingwood aside.

“Ow but they lost against them in the QF!”

Lions got beat in the ‘03 QF yet went on and smashed the Pies in the GF. Not saying we would’ve smashed the Cats - just saying it would’ve been a bloody good contest, especially with the quality of games Collingwood had provided in their 2 finals against the two Grand Finalists.

Of course collingwood would have provided a better game, its their home ground.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

That’s the point of the thread. Just like every other GF match up we were robbed of. All are technically pointless hypotheticals but still being discussed.

That’s not what is being discussed. It’s about whether it would’ve been a great GF match up. The QF and even Round 3 tells us it could’ve been.

There’s no guarantee, there’s also no guarantee the Cats would’ve won considering the QF. All hypotheticals.

It just looks a bit rich when you've gone 0-4 against those teams and it has a bit of the eye rolling with the Pies where it seems that every time they lose a prelim, they'd have made for an absolutely cracking grand final. I think it's a bit hard to argue it when you've either a) lost to both of the grand finalists in September; or b) been absolutely belted out of the finals. I see this thread more for a top two team who was decimated by injury and was a shock preliminary final loser against a Cinderella opponent.

This year I'd say Collingwood's September is quite similar to Geelong in 2013. Hawkins was carrying a back injury and probably shouldn't have been playing, Dawson Simpson had become a key in the ruck for us but broke his leg, Chapman and Enright were out for the preliminary final and the Cats almost stole (repeat: stole) it against Hawthorn. If the Preliminary Final had been the grand final, it would have been one of the best ever, same as the 2022 QF against Collingwood.

But, forget it - Geelong lost, albeit narrowly, to both grand finalists in the earlier finals. Freo and Hawthorn beat us fair and square. So I don't think they qualify. Similar to 2016, I feel with some justification, we could have given the Dogs a huge run for their money. But we had our chance and got absolutely humiliated by Sydney in the PF.

MC Extra Dollop I have come to the conclusion that 2011 Geelong really got exceptionally lucky that your grand final opponent wasn’t the might of Essendon.

I mean Collingwood were just okay I guess but we were the only side Geelong didn’t beat that year. Proof’s in the pudding m8.

Lots of happy Freo and (dare I say) Hawthorn supporters today.

 

[PieLebo87]

No, but when comparing the two teams, when everything overwhelmingly favours one team making the Grand Final (including winning the preliminary final, shocking I know) to say the other team would have done better is pretty silly.

What's the argument for Collingwood having a better show of it? They had two close losses to Geelong through the year? Sydney beat Geelong in their only match up before the GF.

If you need it explained to you, then you obviously don’t watch enough footy. Collingwood defied a lot of statistics in their run late in the season before putting up two unbelievable finals against Sydney and Geelong.

No-one is even arguing Collingwood was more deserving than Sydney, and I’m not either, so I don’t get why you’ve got your knickers in a twist about Collingwood having put up a better fight than Sydney. I don’t think Collingwood would’ve lost by 81 points to Geelong. It’s pretty straight forward.

It just looks a bit rich when you've gone 0-4 against those teams and it has a bit of the eye rolling with the Pies where it seems that every time they lose a prelim, they'd have made for an absolutely cracking grand final. I think it's a bit hard to argue it when you've either a) lost to both of the grand finalists in September; or b) been absolutely belted out of the finals. I see this thread more for a top two team who was decimated by injury and was a shock preliminary final loser against a Cinderella opponent.

This year I'd say Collingwood's September is quite similar to Geelong in 2013. Hawkins was carrying a back injury and probably shouldn't have been playing, Dawson Simpson had become a key in the ruck for us but broke his leg, Chapman and Enright were out for the preliminary final and the Cats almost stole (repeat: stole) it against Hawthorn. If the Preliminary Final had been the grand final, it would have been one of the best ever, same as the 2022 QF against Collingwood.

But, forget it - Geelong lost, albeit narrowly, to both grand finalists in the earlier finals. Freo and Hawthorn beat us fair and square. So I don't think they qualify. Similar to 2016, I feel with some justification, we could have given the Dogs a huge run for their money. But we had our chance and got absolutely humiliated by Sydney in the PF.



Lots of happy Freo and (dare I say) Hawthorn supporters today.

I’m with you - I also said yesterday I don’t reckon anyone would’ve stopped Geelong yesterday. I still reckon it would’ve been a far more cracking contest if it was Cats v Pies.

Don’t understand why it’s such a big deal for some of these other nuffies if someone has this opinion.

 

[HolyRioli]

In my opinion, the only team this year that has been consistently capable of matching or bettering the Cats level of performance yesterday, is Melbourne. But we haven't seen that version of the Dees since before the byes.

Melbourne from the first half of the season vs Geelong from the second half of the season would've been an excellent match.

 

[Doss]

It’s because at very few stages of the year did Collingwood seem genuinely convincing. Yes they ran Geelong close twice and Sydney close once but they also came perilously close to losing to rubbish sides like Essendon (twice), North, Hawthorn, Adelaide and GWS. And did lose to West Coast.

Collingwood’s never say die thing throughout the year was very admirable, but the lack of convincing wins means you will also never shake the feeling completely that it might fall apart completely for them eventually.

So no, thinking there is no guarantee that Collingwood would definitely have done better does not mean one has rocks in their head. And might I also say that it’s rather hypocritical to get cranky at others’ standard of discussion if you’re going to carry on like that.

 

[SSSSSS]

Anybody suggesting Collingwood would have been a better match up are simply put crazy. Let's compare everything relevant between Sydney and Collingwood this year. Sydney:

1. Were better offensively
2. Wer better defensively
3. Had the better percentage
4. Won both head-to-head match ups
5. Had a superior record against top 8 sides (8-3 compared to 4-7)

So yeah, this result was happening either way. The idea that a side that lost the prelim to the losers would have been better is always a silly one to me. If that were the case you would have won the week before.

Collingwood have a lot more experience on field who would have settled the younger kids better than Sydney.

Geelong still would have won but the result much closer.

Sydney simply shit the bed. Was boys against men.