Hawthorn’s 2019 Trade/FA - Targets/Incoming players discussion only

[Judd2Sewell]

Wowser if there was one player in the league I could see Clarko salivating over with the chance to improve his game and develop him would be Sam Powell Pepper.

Just an average ball butcher IMO.

 

[Brant]

And turn him into a rebounding defender.

Given that he's short, we'd likely prefer him to be a one-paced midfielder that can rackup possessions at the lower levels

 

[TheWaffles]

I think not much is being played into Coniglio and O'Meara being friends, especially media-wise. Look at Durant going to the Nets and getting his buddy DeAndre Jordan to go along. Even at AFL level, I'm pretty sure Devon Smith and Dylan Shiel are good pals? It does play a huge part..

My understand is that dev and sheil are not friends beyond teammates.

Dev is mates with stringer and Hurley.

 

[Brishawk]

Just an average ball butcher IMO.

Be fair. He is an elite butcher

 

[Bugs1977]

I know it was a while back but I remember we played GWS in Tassie (maybe 2017?) and we had them on toast until Patton stood up and kicked 5 or 6 goals. Game ended in a draw, Will Langford kicked a dribble kick behind that bounced over Heath Shaw on the siren to level the scores..
Every time they went forward in that game Patton looked really dangerous both on the lead and contested- he looked like he could be the best key forward in the game if things were going right.. it was at that point I hoped the hawks would one day be able to recruit him..
Obviously a lot has changed since then with the injuries but I reckon if he could get back anywhere close to that form it would be a massive steal..
By all reports he has dropped weight and hopefully got the knees right to the point he can get some footy in before the end of the season..
Think this is a no brainer given our lack of genuine key forwards on the list and Roughy retirement coming at the end of the season...low risk- could be very high reward..

It needs to be mentioned that Patton who has suffered 3 x ACL (2 in the left and 1 in the right) most definitely has a big hill to climb in coming back from those injuries but it's most certainly not impossible. It's not like he has suffered all 3 ACL's in the one knee and I really believe that the extra weight that he has dropped will stand him in good stead to make an unprecedented return. He more than likely will not reach the peak of his powers that his budding talents promised but the reality is if he never suffered that last ACL then we wouldn't be getting him. The HFC will get him back on the park and by all reports he's already ready to do so now but has probably been advised (Michael Makdissi) to hold back until next season through a previously agreed trade more than likely by us.

For everyone doubting the Patton recruitment I think it's really important to remember the lack of quality depth we have in our KPF stocks. If all goes well the we'll likely have Patton lining up for the HFC come round 1 in 2020 and if not then he will be pushing the likes of Lewis to keep his spot in our best 22. Completion for spots underestimated factor in all of this and if you don't have depth on all lines then guys can get too comfortable / settled and stagnate. For example someone like Puopolo really hasn't go anyone pushing him for his pressure forward spot and even though his forward pressure is top notch he hasn't kicked a goal in who knows how long and that is just unacceptable but who pushes him out due to the lack of depth. Point of the matter here being that we need KPF depth more than any other position at the moment and will eventually nee the same down back too so hopefully we can at least rectify one of them in the off-season. Depth depth and more depth IMO.

 

[Mrzohs]

I understand the reasoning for Patton, he is a good key forward who is a lump of a bloke with obvious talent but a wretched injury history. When he comes to Hawthorn, he’s coming to play a role and nothing more, he is not the saviour but more like an added piece who can supplement and take pressure off Mitch Lewis.

Mitch is the young bull with the most upside, he has every opportunity to become a 50 a year goal kicker for the next decade.

Once we get Cogs and Patton as well as Finn as a F/S then we are set both through the middle and up forward, particularly if Ollie continues to develop.

Our strategy must be to then shore key defensive slots, Chip is literally a migraine or injury away from missing footy/possibly retiring and Kosi isn’t yet ready and KB has proven to be more **** on a bill than **** on a cow.

We also can’t forget the importance Clarko places on outside footy, we are ageing in that area. Whilst Scully has 4-5 years left, guys like Hendo/Izzie are short term, we must find the next gen of outside runners.

Spot on mate you hit the nail on the head
Re Patton/Lewis and our tall defensive stocks.
I'm still hearing there will be a follow up conversation with b.hill at seasons end desipte post on here. it's just not a priority atm alot depending on our landscape, i see it occurring in the event i.smith is moved on same position extra room in the cap, its a no brainer.

 

[MrPremiership]

80 days til trade period

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

80 days til trade period

I love these reality checks.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

80 days til trade period

And at least 160 more pages of this until then!

 

[Bugs1977]

Of course pick 8 and scraps is a better deal than the compo they'd receive, but I just think if Cogs leaves as a FA they'll be stubborn and will make a stand that they don't want to lose 2 of their best 4 players in the same off season. Just my hunch that's all, I wish Compensation was just scrapped all together, then it really might force clubs hands if they thought they stood to lose quality free agents for absolute zilch.

The only problem with scrapping compo picks is if you do that then clubs will then be more inclined to ask for priority picks. Imagine a team like the Suns not being able to replace a gun kid with at least another draft pick. Maybe the solution could be that if you lose a top line player and your team doesn't make finals then you get a compo pick right after where you finished on the ladder but if you make the top 8 and you lose a top line player you don't get any compensation. The problem I could see with this solution would be is that if a team that is rumoured to be losing a top line player and is likely to finish in 7-8 spot might pull the pin and tank their season so they get a compo pick. It wouldn't be a perfect solution but it would stop the rick getting richer and the poorer getting poorer (in theory).

 

[triple treat]

Trading with Port usually pays big dividends for us - but fu** me if it is rly costly. If Whitfield is indeed the target this off season I doubt we’d have the assets for both unless Port really want SPP gone.

Do you think The club is in a position to have these guys considering the off field discretions?

 

[PenAndPaper]

The only problem with scrappy compo picks is if you do that then clubs will then be more inclined to ask for priority picks. Imagine a team like the Suns not being able to replace a gun kid with at least another draft pick. Maybe the solution could be that if you lose a top line player and your team doesn't make finals then you get a compo pick right after where you finished on the ladder but if you make the top 8 and you lose a top line player you don't get any compensation. The problem I could see with this solution would be is that if a team that is rumoured to be losing a top line player and is likely to finish in 7-8 spot might pull the pin and tank their season so they get a compo pick. It wouldn't be a perfect solution but it would stop the rick getting richer and the poorer getting poorer (in theory).

No club that is looking likely to play finals is going to tank just to get a compo pick, the only clubs that tank are the ones who can't make finals so then they have zero to lose.

 

[MrPremiership]

I love these reality checks.

Yep. Just so everyone is aware that any positive confirmation from Cogs is still that far away.

No trades will get done in the next 80 days. Plenty of time to speculate and worry about. Still so many players to get linked to. So many clubs that Clarko can coach too

 

[Millsie69]

Wowser if there was one player in the league I could see Clarko salivating over with the chance to improve his game and develop him would be Sam Powell Pepper.

Dear God I hope not....arguably my most hated player on an opposition team.

Complete ball butcher and an absolute grub of a human being too.

 

[Bugs1977]

No club that is looking likely to play finals is going to tank just to get a compo pick, the only clubs that tank are the ones who can't make finals so then they have zero to lose.

So what your trying to say is my solution is a good one then?

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Yep. Just so everyone is aware that any positive confirmation from Cogs is still that far away.

No trades will get done in the next 80 days. Plenty of time to speculate and worry about. Still so many players to get linked to. So many clubs that Clarko can coach too

Let’s talk in circles some more!!! Yeaaaah!

 

[Phil McCreviss]

Ok, sorry.. Do tell us your expertise?

Vanders is head of the LCW Group isn’t he? Don’t they produce multiple wines and doing so quite successfully? Wine industry is a money spinner if you get it right, but like most industries it’s difficult to get a real handle on. I’d suggest he has done extremely well, in fact anyone jumping head first into business and doing well deserve a huge amount of credit.

My expertise is working with entrepreneurs in New York - it's my full time job. Not suggesting Vanders hasn't done well but he's in a tiny middle of nowhere market.

You want real entrepreneurs, Melbourne ain't your spot.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Do you think The club is in a position to have these guys considering the off field discretions?

SPP was never formally accused of anything - so I would tread lightly there.

If you are trying to compare Whitifield's history to Bennell's then you are drawing a longer bow than a 10 metre tall Robin Hood would use.

 

[Brishawk]

The only problem with scrapping compo picks is if you do that then clubs will then be more inclined to ask for priority picks. Imagine a team like the Suns not being able to replace a gun kid with at least another draft pick. Maybe the solution could be that if you lose a top line player and your team doesn't make finals then you get a compo pick right after where you finished on the ladder but if you make the top 8 and you lose a top line player you don't get any compensation. The problem I could see with this solution would be is that if a team that is rumoured to be losing a top line player and is likely to finish in 7-8 spot might pull the pin and tank their season so they get a compo pick. It wouldn't be a perfect solution but it would stop the rick getting richer and the poorer getting poorer (in theory).

The solution is to have more free agents. Lose a player through free agency and get another through free agency with your cap space. The heavy restrictions impose a penalty on clubs when a player leaves because the pool of free agents is so small. This year wasn’t a very good group and neither is next year’s pool. More could be done to encourage player options during free agency similar to kelly’s Deal. You sign them at 24 for a 3 plus 2 contract. Player has the option of leaving as a free agent or staying on. Also you could lower the eligibility Down to 5 years. I don’t see why Cripps should have to wast 3/4 of his career at Carlton before he can be in a position to leave given Carlton will never trade him.

 

[Brishawk]

Thats the doomsday scenario in my view. Missing an A-grader this year. Wonder what we do. Don't want the Carlton full rebuild, but we couldn't just top up in 12 months time.

Bring in two first round players plus Finn plus trade in Patton, greenwood and keep our picks for next year would still be a good offseason. Give us a shot at Whitfield next year.

 

[TazHawk15]

80 days til trade period

**** me.

If my boss thought he got nothing out of me last trade period, he ain’t seen nothing yet.

 

[SuperSic]

Just get an A Grader back in Tom Mitchell and still be in the mix, injuries permitting.

Everyone drastically overestimates what is required to compete in the AFL at the moment and drastically underestimates what we have.

Well said, the calls for a 'mini-rebuild' through the draft are a bit ridiculous.

 

[RoughysMullet]

80 days til trade period

Agh how will we survive??

 

[triple treat]

SPP was never formally accused of anything - so I would tread lightly there.

If you are trying to compare Whitifield's history to Bennell's then you are drawing a longer bow than a 10 metre tall Robin Hood would use.

Only going on what was said in the “media” with SPP.
Are you saying that the difference in the level of there ( Whitfield’s and Bennells) history ( as reported in the media) is relevant if the club is in a position to take them or not?

 

[MrPremiership]

Fat kids like more things than just cake.

Hence why they're fat.