Moved Thread Hawthorn - Excuse Now?

[witsend]

Agree with all this. On the other hand, I do believe yesterdays game was a bit more of a coin toss than our previous close encounters, where yesterday Geelong was able to capitalise on our mistakes, whereas in previous games they just turned the game by pure force of will, and seemed to leave Hawks players with no control over the outcome. Yesterday Hawthorn had some control over their fate , but still lost. God damn Geelong, and their perpetually "lucky" coin

I think it was easily the most "even" of the recent encounters. I can't honestly say I expected a win at 3/4 time. I was bracing myself all week for a 1-3 goal loss on the basis that Hawthorn were up and about with a relatively fit list for this time of year and more than owed us one.
Feels like the first few games last year tbh where we jagged a couple early to help set our season up.
I do worry about Hawthorn's defensive structure deep in September though.
Schoenmakers is a good case in point. He needs stronger players around him to learn from right now. But let's not forget that Scarlett and Harley hardly set the world on fire when they were thrown in the deep end in their first couple of years!
I've been saying for 2-3 seasons now that Roughead MUST play CHB permanently to shore up the Hawk's spine if they are to be a genuine chance.
All the other contenders have at least 2 big-bodied key forwards who take contested pack marks.

 

[tige19]

Roughead absolutely 100% could and would be a multiple All Australian if he went to the defense, the sooner he and Clarkson realise this the quicker we will be to another flag! People want to look to the exterior for a solution well guys we have a 196cm 100kg athletic monster staring right at us in our own backyard! Ruffy to defense and were sorted down back for the next 8 years! We have Gunston/Franklin/Hale in the forward line, no need for Ruffy there.

 

[Hawks1523]

Why would we need to make an excuse?

We gave it our best with what we had, we missed some chances and at the end of the day we were not good enough to get the 4 points and geelong were.

It's as simple as that really.

 

[Ugle Dick]

I call bullshit on this claim. We just had what is a very bitter loss - against what for many Hawk's fans is our most hated rival - and yet this thread is full of Hawk's fans congratulating Geelong on the win. There would be an even higher ratio of Hawk's posters in this thread, if it wasn't being diluted by the deluge of Pie's fans gloating at the team that beat them last week going down in a close one. Poor form, but not unexpected from your classless bunch.

You can call anything you want champ but it still doesn't excuse the manner of some of the hawks fan last week. After a somewhat fortunate win over us, some of your fellow supporters were kicking the boots into clubs like Melbourne and Richmond questioning the culture and fabric of those clubs. (To what end? Purely and simply to gloat and hide your own insecurities).

Like you I don't like Geelong but at least Pies fans can acknowledge Geelong's success and dominance over the last 5 years. I don't doubt that some of the congratulations being offered by Hawks fans in this thread are sincere but after the last weeks win and many supporters and media proclaiming the arrival (finally) of the hawks as a legitimate contender, some of the excuses in this thread reek of a poor attempt at saving face.

Fact is you were heavily back to win and choked. Geelong (in my eyes) had more forced changes pre game and still triumphed - that's the mark of a champion team.

Hawks show the footy world yet again they are more hype than substance - until you beat a full strength contender like Geelong or the Pies, Hawks are still an also ran and not a legitimate threat.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Indeed, very fair and correct throughout.

No, not really. Have a look at the soft ones that Hawthorn were paid, try and look for all the ones Geelong weren't paid. Harder to notice, but it was a one-sided affair.

 

[Ugle Dick]

Why would we need to make an excuse?

We gave it our best with what we had, we missed some chances and at the end of the day we were not good enough to get the 4 points and geelong were.

It's as simple as that really.

This is a quality post.

Very refreshing to see an honest and blunt assessment from a Hawks fan - certainly could use more in this thread.

My hats off to you good sir/madam

How well the hawks bounce back from this will define their season and finals aspirations.

 

[PatrickBateman]

Why would we need to make an excuse?

We gave it our best with what we had, we missed some chances and at the end of the day we were not good enough to get the 4 points and geelong were.

It's as simple as that really.

Just watching the replay, pre-Osbourne's mistake in the goal square, Franklin clearly went out of bounds with his kick. Justice.

 

[hk89]

(To what end? Purely and simply to gloat and hide your own insecurities).

How ironic.

I don't doubt that some of the congratulations being offered by Hawks fans in this thread are sincere but after the last weeks win and many supporters and media proclaiming the arrival (finally) of the hawks as a legitimate contender, some of the excuses in this thread reek of a poor attempt at saving face.

Most posts I've seen agree we choked, and at the same time acknowledge the cats amazing will to win. Regret for wasted scoring opportunities is not the same as making excuses, and is not the same as saying Geelong did not deserve to win. They did, as would we have if we'd managed a single goal in the last quarter, but we didn't and Geelong got up for a great victory. The fact that you don't seem to acknowledge the MANY posts by hawks fans acknowledging these facts suggests you have filtered this thread through the offended of your loss to Hawthorn last weekend, may it be the first of several this year.

Hawks show the footy world yet again they are more hype than substance - until you beat a full strength contender like Geelong or the Pies, Hawks are still an also ran and not a legitimate threat.

If you saw no substance in the Hawks yesterday then you are indeed as astute as your posts in this thread suggest.

Cats are the real deal. Get back to us when Pies actually win a game against a top 4 side from last year. Hawthorn and Cats already have, given form lines so far, you're still a few weeks away from that.

 

[Ugle Dick]

How ironic.

Most posts I've seen agree we choked, and at the same time acknowledge the cats amazing will to win. Regret for wasted scoring opportunities is not the same as making excuses, and is not the same as saying Geelong did not deserve to win. They did, as would we have if we'd managed a single goal in the last quarter, but we didn't and Geelong got up for a great victory. The fact that you don't seem to acknowledge the MANY posts by hawks fans acknowledging these facts suggests you have filtered this thread through the offended of your loss to Hawthorn last weekend, may it be the first of several this year.

If you saw no substance in the Hawks yesterday then you are indeed as astute as your posts in this thread suggest.

Cats are the real deal. Get back to us when Pies actually win a game against a top 4 side from last year. Hawthorn and Cats already have, given form lines so far, you're still a few weeks away from that.

I saw the same old hawks - a reasonable list with some super talents but mentally incapable of beating a top side in the competition. Sure it was a cracking game and if I'm honest, Hawks should have won if they had the mental mettle to do so (ultimately, they don't possess the nerve and mindset to be the best). A narrow loss to a team coming back from Perth and with many missing players is not something that should easily be accepted. Hawks had an additional day to rest and no arduous flight back to Victoria.

Come back to me when the 'mighty' hawks aren't living off the credibility and hype generated off their 2008 flag triumph. You can cut it any way you want but at the end of the day, Hawks have failed to deliver since their lucky flag win in 2008. I think that speaks volumes of the culture of the club.

Maybe you are happy to get mentioned next to the legitimate heavyweight teams like Geelong and Collingwood but surely a club as proud as the hawks needs to start asking for more than squabbling with Richmond fans over big 4 status (doesn't that show how insecure the Hawthorn club is when they are fighting with a club that's been down and out for 30 odd years over an antique piece of jargon?)

Surely your time would be better spent asking why the club continues to fail when the pressure is on? The only way to get real credibility is to earn it and that is something that your club is unable to do currently.

 

[witsend]

We are simply doing to Hawthorn now what Hawthorn did to us in the mid 80's-early 90s.
Can't imagine how many times Hawthorn pipped us at KP back in those times no matter what the ladder positions.

 

[Sidebottom2Beams]

Just watching the replay, pre-Osbourne's mistake in the goal square, Franklin clearly went out of bounds with his kick. Justice.

I have been surprised nobody has mentioned this earlier. I thought i must have been seeing things but i am glad someone else saw it.

 

[Off The Couch]

Just watching the replay, pre-Osbourne's mistake in the goal square, Franklin clearly went out of bounds with his kick. Justice.

I was actually waiting for the whistle on that one as well and I thought at the time that the ump was in a good position to see it, but I also thought that about Yarran on Thursday night so who knows if it was completely over the line or if the ump had blurred vision from the rian.

 

[Hawkforce]

Yep. Hawks no chance. Move focus to Eagles and Crows now please.

 

[TheFourPillars]

Is that really any excuse? Hawkins is 23.

umm yes what was he doing at 21? being berated by his own supporters and questions were being raised about the validity of his place in the team.

 

[Hawkforce]

umm yes what was he doing at 21? being berated by his own supporters and questions were being raised about the validity of his place in the team.

Exactly.

And then he developed core strength. And became a very good prospect.

Unfortunately too many Hawthorn supporters are behaving like the idiots who wrote Hawkins off at 21

 

[hk89]

A narrow loss to a team coming back from Perth and with many missing players is not something that should easily be accepted. Hawks had an additional day to rest and no arduous flight back to Victoria.

While I agree we had an easy training run in last weeks game compared to the cats, you think only one team had outs? (and no this is not an excuse, but you can't say one team was lucky to be close because of the outs of the winner, without analysing outs on both sides).

Come back to me when the 'mighty' hawks aren't living off the credibility and hype generated off their 2008 flag triumph.

It is you that brings 2008 into the discussion. Any credibility we have right now is based on the team that was within a kick of playing in the GF last year, not the team that won in 2008 and failed badly in 2009 and 2010. Yes, losing in the 2011 PF to the team that got done by the cats by 16 goals only a few weeks before was a pity, but we move on.

You can cut it any way you want but at the end of the day, Hawks have failed to deliver since their lucky flag win in 2008. I think that speaks volumes of the culture of the club.

Really? I think that paragraph speaks volumes about your ability to put together a coherent argument. You claim 2008 was lucky, but the fact that we didn't back it up is an issue with club culture? Surely if we were just lucky, it would be highly unexpected for us to back it up with another flag? Which is it? A lucky side who fluked a flag, or a good side , who with better culture should have delivered a few more? Make up your mind.

doesn't that show how insecure the Hawthorn club is when they are fighting with a club that's been down and out for 30 odd years over an antique piece of jargon?

30 years? We've won a few more flags than your mob in the last 30 years, quite a few more. You could have said 20 years, over which time it has at least been even!

Surely your time would be better spent asking why the club continues to fail when the pressure is on?

I think we were under a fair bit of pressure to win last week , given the pre-season hype. One plus for the Hawk that comes out of the loss to the cats is that it takes some of that pressure off the team, and they can pass the 'april favourites' title onto another team.

 

[Lunchlady Doris]

Every Cats win over the Hawks brings them one closer to a loss. Hawks will get us one game soon, hopefully it's not an important one.

 

[phreeze77]

It is nothing new for a top 4 side to lose to another top 4 side. However Hawthorn vs Geelong have a history and it stings to lose to each other .. My side more often over the last few years.. It doesnt hurt any less over time.. but it will swing around one day and hopefully soon .. hopefully it will be sweet .. and hopefully in september/october ;P

I cant stand people that say we'll we beat them when it counts .. when has 8 points a season not counted? when has last years qualifying final not counted? They all count and they all in some way determine your fate.. be it finish position , players traded/delisted , flag shot etc.

Look forward to next time .. just cant stand the heart break.

 

[Salisbury]

Hawks were not good enough on the day. They had their chances and they missed them. It was heartbreaking yesterday. But today is another day and this supporter has moved on to the next game versus Adelaide.

Congratulations to the Cats.

As for Collingwood supporters. Get back to Hawthorn supporters when your actually won a game against a side that matters this season. Carlton vs Collingwood should be a ripper of a game. It will be a good measure.

The team that nobody seems to be talking about is the West Coast Eagles. I think they are the real deal this season. Looking forward to the game in Round 4.

 

[Londoner86]

Well, I give up on 2012.

Round 1: we only just beat Collingwood who were missing 14-15 players, and could have been 10-15 goals ahead at half time. They had to rely on first-gamers and even Daisy Thomas. How could a club that's only won 2 premierships in 54 years nearly beat us?

Round 2: with Geelong shredding our midfield, the Hawks with no backline and with a full team against Geelong missing 8 premiership players (including 4 ruckmen,) and we get thrashed by 2 points.

That's it!

Footy is dead for me - I'm going to follow the EPL and a great club like Liverpool.

.

 

[Off The Couch]

Well, I give up on 2012.

Round 1: we only just beat Collingwood who were missing 14-15 players, and could have been 10-15 goals ahead at half time. They had to rely on first-gamers and even Daisy Thomas. How could a club that's only won 2 premierships in 54 years nearly beat us?

Round 2: with Geelong shredding our midfield, the Hawks with no backline and with a full team against Geelong missing 8 premiership players (including 4 ruckmen,) and we get thrashed by 2 points.

That's it!

Footy is dead for me - I'm going to follow the EPL and a great club like Liverpool.

.

Off you go then and don't let the door hit you on the way out.

 

[David the Cat]

Well, I give up on 2012.


That's it!

Footy is dead for me - I'm going to follow the EPL and a great club like Liverpool.

.

Mwuhahahahahahhahaaaa....good luck with that bunch of losers.

 

[Bardo State]

This is a quality post.

Very refreshing to see an honest and blunt assessment from a Hawks fan - certainly could use more in this thread.

My hats off to you good sir/madam

How well the hawks bounce back from this will define their season and finals aspirations.

Certainly mentally fragile against Geelong.

No excuses for losing today.

No excuse. We had the game on the platter and poor misses lost it for us.

No excuses, we had chances to put the game away and didn't take them while geelong took their chances. Only round 2 however - onwards and upwards.

I'll concede it's a mental thing. We would have won the game except for bad misses in the final quarter. Buddy, Bruest, Roughy and Osbourne all should have been goals, but they weren't and we lost.

As we all know bad kicking is bad football, as Geelong will testify.

Congratulations to Geelong the better side on the day.

A question for the OP. Wasn't last Saturday a close game?

No excuses.

We did have some horrible performances in our team today but we were in a position to win and didn't. Teams who go on to win flags win those games. Collingwood, Carlton and West Coast all would have won from the position Hawthorn were in at 3/4 time.

Hawthorn certainly have the talent to win the premiership but they are currently lacking the mental toughness.

I've been saying that for years.

No excuses from me.

We don't know how to win against quality teams. Pies kicked themselves out of last week and the Cats kicked themselves out of th 08 GF.

It is a mental issue

Clarkson needs to go

I couldn't be bothered quoting anything past the third page.

We beat you, deal with it princess

 

[Forward Press]

Off you go then and don't let the door hit you on the way out.

The internet needs a universally accepted sarcasm tag.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

I just watched the game again.

Franklin must have taken a fair bit of damage to that vest.

Play the ball and not the umpire and he'd be absolutely unstoppable and most certainly would have got the Hawks over the line.

It happened in the match before the '11 final when he got shot instead of taking the mark and cost the Hawks victory in the closing stages.



Memo Lance: You will never make it onto the set of Home and Away.