News Hawthorn Racism Review - No player name speculation - opposition posters tread very carefully

[Strapping Young Lad]

Wrong. Hawks did what they had to do by the rules of the AFL.

Correct. For reference below, once the HFC had the report outlining serious allegations they were duty bound by the AFL’s protocol to hand over the report to the AFL integrity unit.

I will pin this post, as it seems to be a constant query.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Everybody knew Shaun was very close to Clarkson so may be they didn't trust him to share their woes. Shaun said the same thing when asked about Cyril incident some time back too.

That's a fair point. Possibly with all of the senior players too being entrenched there these kids didn't feel there was anyone in the playing group they could trust and that by going to them it could just set them back even further.

 

[The Jet From Poowong]

still scratching my head wondering if I should try and read the rest of the article I started reading this morning. I just can't understand how anyone would think it was okay to do such things, irrespective.

I am in disbelief still. WTF

 

[edster]

At times like this it's good to remind ourselves the club is always bigger than any individual - precisely why I supported Sam Mitchell being appointed coach despite many posters here insisting we should remain loyal to Clarko at all costs.

Hawthorn Football Club will be around for a long time yet and like all organisations evolves over time. Sadly this incident proves it's been lagging behind the times in some ways, but the fact these revelations are the product of an internal review suggests efforts are already being made to rectify that.

People absolutely need to hold the club to account for the actions of individuals who've tarnished its' name, but this isn't time to jump ship and desert an organisation that's given us so much joy over the years. Being a true supporter means sticking together through thick & thin so by all means demand a higher moral standard from those involved with the club, but don't forget all the wonderful memories Hawthorn has given us. This is still the family club.

Blindly say club is bigger than the individual is what got us into this type of mess the first place. Remember a "club" is not a living thinking breathing being. An professional football club at the end of the day is a workplace that provide entertainment to the messes. It is not an essential workplace like government, police, firefighters, ambulance, hospitals etc.
however an individual living being at the end of the day is someone's son/daughter/brother/sister/husband/wife/father/mother etc... therefore I would argue no club is bigger than an living individual's well being both mentally and physically.

 

[MistyAvalon]

Let's all be calm about this..................... Sure it is a dreadful thing. sexism homophobia racism are all methods which have been used since time immorial to control the population, to style it in a way deemed best for society. Believe me this behavior is not limited to our first nation players, but is applied evenly across the spectrum. It is dreadful and it must be stopped...............across all society.

I find t his particular case heartbreaking when I think of some of our wonderful first nation people who have played in our game and in our club, but of truel calm considered action is required not a lynching mob

 

[rei154]

 

[Ned Ryerson]

How silly of me to reserve my judgement until natural justice is afforded. How poor of me to give a benefit of the doubt. And Ned - spare me the straw man

It's not a straw man - it's a literal thing that happened 10 years ago and many of us, myself included, were happy to enjoy the constant media articles about before anyone was found guilty. I am assuming your inability to answer my question directly was an answer though - so thanks for proving my point.

 

[Wingnut19]

Love the club. Always will. Dark day sure, but I’m gonna wait till Clarko/Fages speak and get the facts/context in all of this. They are not evil people. Our indigenous players idolised Clarko, Hill was like a son to him. I’m sure they would of been offering advice and options in a bad situation that they were probably not culturally educated in to do so. Would of been no malicious intent I’m confident of that. Keep your powder dry until we hear from them

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Love the club. Always will. Dark day sure, but I’m gonna wait till Clarko/Fages speak and get the facts/context in all of this. They are not evil people. Our indigenous players idolised Clarko, Hill was like a son to him. I’m sure they would of been offering advice and options in a bad situation that they were probably not culturally educated in to do so. Would of been no malicious intent I’m confident of that. Keep your powder dry until we hear from them

Step me through the way telling someone who is excited to be having a child being told that their partner seeking a termination is an option is done with good intentions? Hearing both sides is fine - but I fail to see how this is a well meaning course of action.

 

[Larry G!]

I assume this report is true, is motivated by the desire to unearth issues, awful in the nature of its findings and requires corrective action whatever that might be.

But here are some questions that I would like answered:

- Firstly, I seem to recall that a few weeks ago the HFC warned Clarkson about the final payment being withheld if he meddled with HFC?

- Secondly, I wonder if this will impact Gunston's decision?

- Thirdly, could the timing be useful in allowing a line to be drawn (pardon the pun) between the old HFC (led by Kennett) and the new?

- Fourthly, Is the club surprised by the findings? Why else would they commission a First nation consultancy?

- Fifthly, is the content of the report a surprise to the HFC board? I imagine the consultants would be sharing the findings as they were identified and not waiting until the final report was written and delivered 2 weeks ago?

 

[TylerDurden]

I'll always love the club.
But you need to separate the individual from the club. If this was all Clarko, then it's a Clarko issue.
To be frank, he had way too much power as the years went on.

 

[Danger Zone]

Hawks fans, I take no joy in knowing that this is going to be really awful for you. Take it from a Crows fan speaking from experience when I say that this is going to hang around for years. It will be brought up at every opportunity. Stuff will likely come out piecemeal and you will need to reconcile with each new bit of information. Unless there is some dramatic revelation, this is really, really going to hurt as you watch your clubs name get dragged through the mud.

Make no mistake, the victims in this are the young indigenous men and their families, along with any others who have had to revisit generational trauma due to it. But I feel a large measure of sympathy for you fans who are deeply connected with the club and will feel justifiably betrayed by them. Collectively, you supporters have done nothing wrong and the reactions I've seen online have spoken to a general good character amongst you. Hopefully the AFL as a whole improves as a result of this coming to light.

 

[mookieb]

Are we not going to wait until Clarko and Fagan give their opinion on what went down or are we just going to lynch them anyway?

Two sides to every story and often things that are said can be misconstrued.

Must admit though it's some disturbing allegations.

 

[Suntory Boss Coffee]

Difficult job for Clarkson and Fagan to try and explain without naming the players.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Difficult job for Clarkson and Fagan to try and explain without naming the players.

Using 'the players involved' instead of their names wouldn't be overly taxing.

 

[Xtreme]

Interesting 24 hours!

 

[Suntory Boss Coffee]

Using 'the players involved' instead of their names wouldn't be overly taxing.

They would be easily identifiable. They are easily identifiable even now. Few years old articles have suspicious edits around 8AM this morning. Complainant welfare at the forefront

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

He’s not wrong - but Robbo’s undying love of Hird makes him a massive hypocrite.

Robbo is the last bloke whose opinion I want on this.

 

[Philhawk]

Using 'the players involved' instead of their names wouldn't be overly taxing.

The allegation of standing over a young indigenous woman and her partner and strongly suggesting an abortion is going to be the single allegation that makes or breaks Clarkson and Fagan.

 

[KermitJagger]

The allegation of standing over a young indigenous woman and her partner and strongly suggesting an abortion is going to be the single allegation that makes or breaks Clarkson and Fagan.

Can't imagine any circumstance where that allegation would "make" either of them.

 

[Ned Ryerson]

They would be easily identifiable. They are easily identifiable even now. Few years old articles have suspicious edits around 8AM this morning. Complainant welfare at the forefront

Oh definitely agree it's easy to narrow down the likely players. I just don't get how either Fagan or Clarkson couldn't do an interview, if they were cleared to and felt compelled, and just say 'the player in question' or something similar rather than mention specific names. It wouldn't be that hard - particularly for coaches who often use sporting doublespeak to chat to the press.

 

[Philhawk]

Can't imagine any circumstance where that allegation would "make" either of them.

When I say “make”, I mean them providing some context to try and justify their perspective of what happened (I know this sounds ludicrous)

 

[Stars align]

Using 'the players involved' instead of their names wouldn't be overly taxing.

They would know who the players are.If they believe they have been wrongly accused why can’t they name them given there names are in the public domain?

 

[Ned Ryerson]

Robbo is the last bloke whose opinion I want on this.

Hilarious thing was you could insert the name 'James Hird' in that quote and it would still make sense. Funny that the 'everyone deserves a second chance' card would not apply to Clarkson and Fagan if these accusations are accurate but Robbo is happy to go hard on that angle for Hird.

If Clarkson and Fagan have done what they are accused of then I agree fully they should be out of the game for good - but I think that standard also goes to blokes who use experimental drugs on 18 year olds and deliberately don't have governance around that to cover their tracks. Funny that Robbo can see a distinction there. All would be spectacular failures of duty of care.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Hilarious thing was you could insert the name 'James Hird' in that quote and it would still make sense. Funny that the 'everyone deserves a second chance' card would not apply to Clarkson and Fagan if these accusations are accurate but Robbo is happy to go hard on that angle for Hird.

If Clarkson and Fagan have done what they are accused of then I agree fully they should be out of the game for good - but I think that standard also goes to blokes who use experimental drugs on 18 year olds and deliberately don't have governance around that to cover their tracks. Funny that Robbo can see a distinction there. All would be spectacular failures of duty of care.

100%

 

[Ned Ryerson]

They would know who the players are.If they believe they have been wrongly accused why can’t they name them given there names are in the public domain?

Something tells me you're not a PR expert?