News Hawthorn Racism Review - No player name speculation - opposition posters tread very carefully

[Strapping Young Lad]

Wrong. Hawks did what they had to do by the rules of the AFL.

Correct. For reference below, once the HFC had the report outlining serious allegations they were duty bound by the AFL’s protocol to hand over the report to the AFL integrity unit.

I will pin this post, as it seems to be a constant query.

 

[Charchi]

The club has insurance

Which I am sure will have a liability limit and Gowers said at the AGM that it had cost the club over $1M and they had made provision this year for $1.5M as I recall. Directors and Officers insurance has become prohibitively expensive with low liability limits and high premium costs because of the massive increase in claims in last 5 years.

 

[I wanna pash Nash]

He'd prefer the coin.

Look, I obviously don't know Cyril personally. But his life choices after ending his Hawthorn career don't really seem like the money grabbing type.

Maybe, just maybe, he feels wronged and this is part of his healing process? Maybe he wants justice? Maybe in some weird way he still loves the club and wants to see it be better, and, this is the best way he thinks change will happen? Maybe he feels a level of responsibility given what supposedly happened to other players whilst he was at the club? Who knows?

 

[I wanna pash Nash]

Because he has engaged ambulance chasing lawyers to sue our club and cost our club millions of dollars already, this would send most other clubs to the wall financially.

Which is his right, especially if the claims can be proven in court.

It is comical that some people here think this is the easiest way Cyril could make a bit of coin.

 

[theiaofseed]

Racist name said to Cyril- Humphrey B. Bear....

It's points like that which hurt a lot of the more serious and legitimate accusations. Clearly given the name due to his shy nature, which does show a bit of the mean spirited nature of Clarkson and the work place cultural in place, but racism it's clearly not.

 

[brad sue well]

Look, I obviously don't know Cyril personally. But his life choices after ending his Hawthorn career don't really seem like the money grabbing type.

Maybe, just maybe, he feels wronged and this is part of his healing process? Maybe he wants justice? Maybe in some weird way he still loves the club and wants to see it be better, and, this is the best way he thinks change will happen? Maybe he feels a level of responsibility given what supposedly happened to other players whilst he was at the club? Who knows?

Agree.

Coin, wedge, grey nurse… All sounds like the footy club culture that got us into this mess. No nuance in life. All a bit of banter. All in good fun. I’m not offended, nobody would be. When you meet these types in the AFL some just want to out bloke you.

Danny Jacobs came for the money didn’t he, from a South Melbourne commission? Bought his mum a house.

Indigenous people on average are financially worse off.

Families put out a pretty good road map for the industry. It’s over to decision makers now.

 

[Dragz]

Oh I have been online since 1996 and there has always been just the utter worst of humanity on show since day one from what I can remember. Possibly this was a softer, kinder place back then though.

There were dicks on the old Bulletin Boards before we had a WWW tbh. Just less of them.
#OldguyMemory

 

[wanderlust1985]

If it was about my post, I believe we moved away from recruiting players with any sort of off-field issues. Giving up talent to pick the 'clean skin' - safe picks that won't have similar off-field issues. So many private school boys with good upbringings, good family connections.

Players that cannot be trusted to appear at official functions, to present to training, to maintain appropriate levels of professionalism - just won't (don't?) get drafted anymore - or at least until their talent undeniably exceeds the alternate options.

100% this.

It doesn't excuse what happened, but part of the reason the coaches might have applied unprofessional levels of pressure to the players is due to the scarcity of the draft. I can see how it would be tempting to push the limits if you've already invested.

If litigation is the future of the sport then clubs will get more cautious and I don't blame them. Some players will be better off. Other players will miss out on a great career because they didn't get the push they needed.

 

[brad sue well]

100% this.

It doesn't excuse what happened, but part of the reason the coaches might have applied unprofessional levels of pressure to the players is due to the scarcity of the draft. I can see how it would be tempting to push the limits if you've already invested.

If litigation is the future of the sport then clubs will get more cautious and I don't blame them. Some players will be better off. Other players will miss out on a great career because they didn't get the push they needed.

Sounds a bit Rendell.

Earlier quote tweet mentioned private school kids from good families, good upbringing. Isn’t that Cyril? Buddy? Campbell Brown?

Private schools dominate the draft, scholarships play a part. A private school solving all this is problematic.

If a club is worried about off field issues, get really good people. Innovate. Don’t just listen to Jordan Lewis who said Cameron Matthews is a good bloke he met at Xavier, get highly trained professionals with appropriate backgrounds and use them. AFL mandates the roles, it doesn’t need an NBA or Harvard study trip to improve 1-2% this way. One private school has done this and has an awesome and qualified worker who should be poached, does it matter he mentored a pick 1? Clubs are risk averse, they turn into robots. When I was at one the culture was soulless the year after their flag. The accountant tells me the coaches are greedy, Football Manager is full of himself, players literally avoided him. Some players were actually normal, really friendly and normal. When people are trusted and treated well, you get the best out of them.

 

[Mercy Seat]

It's points like that which hurt a lot of the more serious and legitimate accusations. Clearly given the name due to his shy nature, which does show a bit of the mean spirited nature of Clarkson and the work place cultural in place, but racism it's clearly not.

It’s a pretty common affectionate name for shy / quiet people used by people of an older generation. I can see why it might have gone over Cyril’s head.

 

[Wingnut19]

He'd prefer the coin.

BINGO! The video of Cyril with Bruce McVaney and the podcast with Howie on Howie games where he multiply states how much he owes and loves Clarko makes this is all even more bewildering. In the Howie games pod, he says he would only come back to play at Hawks and only Hawks such as his love and gratitude for club. I think we all know who's pulling Cyrils strings here....

 

[Mississippi]

Because he has engaged ambulance chasing lawyers to sue our club and cost our club millions of dollars already, this would send most other clubs to the wall financially.

Absolutely wrong.

First, ABL are the exact opposite of an ambulance chasing firm. They do not do the work associated with ambulance chasing. They do a huge amount of pro bono work and a lot of work for the indigenous community throughout Australia, including the NT.

Secondly, I have some local knowledge of what Cyril’s been doing in the last few years and how he’s been living. He’s been living very modestly and has turned down many opportunities to make money. He’s simply not that sort of person.
Of course this claim has a damages component but if you read the statement of claim you’ll see that the grievances of the players, Cyril included, and the relief they are seeking from the court, extend far beyond money.

Cyril is a very proud indigenous man and the reputation he is protecting has nothing to do with “coin” as TylerDurden so inappropriately asserted.

 

[brad sue well]

Absolutely wrong.

First, ABL are the exact opposite of an ambulance chasing firm. They do not do the work associated with ambulance chasing. They do a huge amount of pro bono work and a lot of work for the indigenous community throughout Australia, including the NT.

Secondly, I have some local knowledge of what Cyril’s been doing in the last few years and how he’s been living. He’s been living very modestly and has turned down many opportunities to make money. He’s simply not that sort of person.
Of course this claim has a damages component but if you read the statement of claim you’ll see that the grievances of the players, Cyril included, and the relief they are seeking from the court extend far beyond money.

Cyril is a very proud indigenous man and the reputation he is protecting has nothing to do with “coin” as TylerDurden so inappropriately asserted.

Exactly. They have literally used a company they know intimately and trust, long before any of this came to light.

Awareness raising

Arnold Bloch Leibler is a leading Australian commercial law firm with offices in Melbourne and Sydney.

www.abl.com.au

So many organisations have an ‘Indigenous’ web page, it looks pretty and never gets updated. What! I see a name here, how dare he. He can’t do that. That’s not allowed. Maybe the families should represent themselves.

AFL used lawyers with one who had a professional history with an afl executive, Jack Latimore article.

Bundy vibes. Imagine being a player in that environment. Setting people up to fail.

HFC paid Clarkson more to do nothing for 12 months than will eventuate here. Clarkson could retire right now, if he counter sues, how does all this look.

You see the finance world in football departments and you see how that part of the industry will struggle to fully understand the players they work alongside. But analytics. Going to a private school alongside a ‘diversity’ scholarship holder is as close as they will get. What a shame because they miss out on knowing so much more, worth more than money.

Throw away lines then go into hiding. Footy club banter ay. Then venture back to the hypothetical trade thread to talk about money again with perfectly fine cash grabs.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

He'd prefer the coin.

This post is pretty ****ed mate

 

[I wanna pash Nash]

BINGO! The video of Cyril with Bruce McVaney and the podcast with Howie on Howie games where he multiply states how much he owes and loves Clarko makes this is all even more bewildering. In the Howie games pod, he says he would only come back to play at Hawks and only Hawks such as his love and gratitude for club. I think we all know who's pulling Cyrils strings here....

It's undoubtedly a complicated situation.

Cyril would not be the first person in history to publicly display affection for an organisation and then later in life reflect on his time and change his mind about parts of his journey. Granted, this does seem like a drastic shift in tone. But that does not mean it isn't genuine.

Which is why I think we should all try to not reduce this issue down to this being about coin or Cyril being micromanage by someone else. Cyril is not an island here, are you trying to insinuate that none of the players involved have genuine grievance with the club?

I fricking love this club, but it's obvious some of our indigenous players did not feel supported and are expressing hurt. Having genuine feelings of hurt is not the same thing to say that everything in the report is true. That will be worked out in due time. But can we all please stop with the alterior motive rhetoric.

 

[Hawk88]

Which I am sure will have a liability limit and Gowers said at the AGM that it had cost the club over $1M and they had made provision this year for $1.5M as I recall. Directors and Officers insurance has become prohibitively expensive with low liability limits and high premium costs because of the massive increase in claims in last 5 years.

They have far more then 1mil and almost all the legal bills will be covered via a D&O policy

There is a confidentiality clause within a D&O policy so Gowers or anyone else are unable to confirm the existence of said policy in any way or they will jeopardise the cover within the policy

 

[Hawk88]

He'd prefer the coin.

Just maybe he is trying to better his people by calling out sh** behavior (rightly or wrongly)

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

BINGO! The video of Cyril with Bruce McVaney and the podcast with Howie on Howie games where he multiply states how much he owes and loves Clarko makes this is all even more bewildering. In the Howie games pod, he says he would only come back to play at Hawks and only Hawks such as his love and gratitude for club. I think we all know who's pulling Cyrils strings here....

It’s not ****ing bingo at all.

Some of you actually think that he would put himself through all of this, be targeted by ****ing people like you all over social media just to get a bit of extra money…. Give me a spell.

I played under 18’s with a team that absolutely crushed every single side we came up against and we won the premiership. We had two aboriginal players in our team and that entire year we called them the ‘n*****’ or coon most of the time, in fact when it come to the premiership T-shirts being printed, we even got those names printed on the back of the T-shirt.

Now those players had a great time, are still mates with pretty much everyone that they played Footy with, but do you think that at some point they didn’t look back at that polo and thought “**** we were treated like shit”. Of course they have.


The idea that Cyril just had a lightbulb moment and decided to go through all of this to get some money is just plain ****ed in the head. Stop it.

 

[TylerDurden]

This post is pretty ****ed mate

He's suing the club yeah? For money right?

 

[brad sue well]

He's suing the club yeah? For money right?

Jesus.

 

[Rhayader]

He's suing the club yeah? For money right?

What else would you sue for?

Money is often an imperfect and inadequate instrument, but it’s how courts measure and remedy civil wrongs.

 

[killerspud]

He'd prefer the coin.

For years you've been my favourite go to poster here. But this isnt one of your better efforts and not thought through. Theres no money for him in this route. Its about respect which he feels due and given the countless hours and amazing moments he's given this club I am more than happy to give that to him. Not adulation, respect

 

[TONYC3163]

He's suing the club yeah? For money right?

What a simplistic, nonsense response to a complex situation.

 

[Kanga Commando]

Does anyone know how much ( if any ) Hawks have offered so far ? During mediation at HRC perhaps ?

It seems to me if they have rejected a financial offer then there is more to this.

 

[Harper_Hawk]

He's suing the club yeah? For money right?

You’re a good poster and letting yourself down with this line. This is far bigger than just a money grab and is a society wide problem of racial discrimination. HFC is just a microcosm reflection. HFC need to take their medicine, apologise and DO BETTER. We support a great club but they aren’t immune to making mistakes when it comes to ALL players and staff welfare when they enter their doors for a work day.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[thehardway]

Jake Niall who's been covering this extensively said today that people should be very circumspect about drawing any conclusions based on what's been presented in the court documents.

Most of it is disputed, and a lot questions still to be answered.

Given that, I reckon we'll be hearing it played out in court.

I do think there will be a last ditch attempt to resolve the dispute by mediation.