NO TROLLS Hawthorn Racism Review - Sensitive issues discussed. Part 3

[Wosh]

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NO TROLLS - Hawthorn Racism Review - Sensitive issues discussed.

Don’t use this thread as an opportunity to troll North or any other clubs, you’ll be removed from the discussion. Stick to the topic and please keep it civil and respectful to those involved. Keep personal arguements out of this thread. Help moderators by not quoting obvious trolls and use the...

www.bigfooty.com

Link to Hawthorn Statement. - Link to ABC Sports article. - Leaked Report

Process Plan - https://resources.afl.com.au/afl/do...erms-of-Reference-and-Process-Plan-FINAL-.pdf

AFL Ends Investigation - 'Imperfect resolution' as Hawks probe ends, no one charged

DO NOT QUOTE THREADS FROM OTHER BOARDS

 

[Soggy2112]

The cycle for many Aboriginal people just keeps hitting rinse and repeat. So sad that people are gloating. Maybe look a bit deeper as why an entire club is being named, not just individuals.

I have no idea what went on but find it hard to believe Clarkson and co are squeaky clean on all this.

Sadly I think in 10-20 years time this’ll be like the Winmar stuff, like the Goodes stuff etc.

People fight it at the time, then as time passes realise it was all kinds of ****ed up and yet somehow still not learn the lesson and deny/argue/downplay the next incident that pops up.

 

[Hawks_4478]

if it goes to trial, the loser pays both sets of legal fees. Very risky …

 

[kickazz]

if it goes to trial, the loser pays both sets of legal fees. Very risky …

Classic threat used when there is a power imbalance like this. Disgusting

 

[western royboy]

if it goes to trial, the loser pays both sets of legal fees. Very risky …

Not necessarily - judge will make an order costs - its not that simple - believe me

 

[Hawks_4478]

Not necessarily - judge will make an order costs - its not that simple - believe me

That’s true, but the most common order for legal costs requires the unsuccessful party to pay the other side's costs.

 

[Hawks_4478]

Classic threat used when there is a power imbalance like this. Disgusting

It’s the law, mate. No threat. You can’t just create your own laws…

 

[matthew_s]

Classic threat used when there is a power imbalance like this. Disgusting

Think of the alternative. Even worse for the little guy.

 

[Satan]

craig kelly interested in this thread

 

[DogDaySonny]

Classic threat used when there is a power imbalance like this. Disgusting

Power imbalance? The players are represented by ABL, the rumoured second-most profitable law firm per partner on the planet. The player's claims certainly won't die for lack of trying.

In fact, the ABL lawyer who ran the AFL's inquiry was recognised as the best public law lawyer in Australia. Now another ABL lawyer is representing the players in court. I guess the old adage that no one gets rich but the lawyers rings true again. ABL is doing quite the number on this issue - getting in on all sides.

 

[Sinjin Smith]

Ummm you used Aboriginal, so can you point out which term was offensive?

It is possible to learn cultural words, practices etc without being racist. I honestly had no idea the term "aborigine" was offensive until recently, neither did my kids. I honestly thought it was an appropriate term for a singular use case for an indigenous person. Now I know, now my family knows that it can cause offence and I am happy to admit that we were naively ignorant of that fact and we would not address or use that term in front of an indigenous person.

Apologies to South of the Yarra for detailing that term here, was just getting getting my point of view across.

 

[peetoo]

It is possible to learn cultural words, practices etc without being racist. I honestly had no idea the term "aborigine" was offensive until recently, neither did my kids. I honestly thought it was an appropriate term for a singular use case for an indigenous person. Now I know, now my family knows that it can cause offence and I am happy to admit that we were naively ignorant of that fact and we would not address or use that term in front of an indigenous person.

Apologies to South of the Yarra for detailing that term here, was just getting getting my point of view across.

So we should stop saying ‘aboriginal flag’?

 

[JackOutback]

So we should stop saying ‘aboriginal flag’?

Why would you when that is not the word that is considered offensive?

 

[Soggy2112]

So we should stop saying ‘aboriginal flag’?

You’re being deliberately ignorant if you can’t differentiate between the word aboriginal and the word that is deemed offensive.

I’m sure if you are actually interested there are aboriginal people who can help you understand why. However, as a non-Aboriginal person I don’t need to understand why, I just need to treat people as humans and respect their wishes. It’s not that hard.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Indigenous Australians: Torres Strait Islanders: Working with Indigenous Australians

Working with Indigenous Australians Website

www.workingwithindigenousaustralians.info

The term 'Aborigine' was commonly used up until about the 1960s but is now generally regarded as outdated and inappropriate. This is in part because 'Aborigine' is a noun, while 'Aboriginal' is an adjective sometimes employed as a noun. The distinction is important as the term 'Aboriginal' recognises that there are hundreds of diverse Aboriginal groups and languages throughout the nation, not just one mob. 'Aborigine' also has connotations of colonial Australia, and the injustices afflicted upon Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people from that time on.

 

[yeahmate]

and so who gets to decide all of this on behalf of a whole lot of other people who didnt elect them to speak on their behalf

 

[peetoo]

You’re being deliberately ignorant if you can’t differentiate between the word aboriginal and the word that is deemed offensive.

I’m sure if you are actually interested there are aboriginal people who can help you understand why. However, as a non-Aboriginal person I don’t need to understand why, I just need to treat people as humans and respect their wishes. It’s not that hard.

Believe it or not, I come here partly to be educated

 

[western royboy]

The allegations at the heart of the Hawks’ racism case

When Hawthorn First Nations players threatened a boycott, Alastair Clarkson reached for his guitar, court claim alleges.

www.theage.com.au

 

[Makeshift Park]

Statement of claim available here:

https://fedcourt.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0015/120048/2024-07-26_Statement-of-Claim.pdf

 

[South of the Yarra]

“Mr Clarkson, Mr Fagan and Mr Burt were present in the room before Mr Peterson arrived,” the document says.

“There was initially some friendly and positive discussion about how impressed the coaches were with Mr Peterson’s development and skills as a player.

“Mr Burt then informed Mr Peterson that he had shared Mr Peterson’s news with Mr Clarkson and Mr Fagan.

“Mr Burt said words to the effect: ‘Carl, being a father is a huge responsibility and we don’t think you’re ready to be a father.’

“Mr Clarkson said words to the effect: ‘Carl, you need to break up with Nikita and focus only on your football.’

“Mr Clarkson said words to the effect: ‘Unless you break up with her and tell her to terminate the pregnancy, your football career will be in jeopardy.’

“Mr Fagan nodded his head during the meeting”.

 

[EconomicDecline]

66. On 8 February 2010, Ms Rotumah gave birth to their son, LP.

...

70. In or about July 2019:

(a) Mr Peterson took his young family members – his stepson, his two sons, and Ms Rotumah’s younger brother – to Hawthorn’s training facilities;
(b) while there, they incidentally met Mr Clarkson;
(c) Mr Clarkson pinned Mr Peterson’s son LP up against the wall with his forearm on LP’s chest and his hand gripping LP’s shirt.

Behaviour of a psychopath to pin a 9 year old against a wall. If any body were to characterise him as insensitive or weird would have blinkers on.

 

[Makeshift Park]

Behaviour of a psychopath to pin a 9 year old against a wall. If any body were to characterise him as insensitive or weird would have blinkers on.

Devoid of context, its hard to know what to make of that.

I have two small kids around that age. Sometimes we play footy in the cul-de-sac with their mates. Sometimes there's playful tackling involved. It doesn't make me a psychopath.

 

[EconomicDecline]

Devoid of context, its hard to know what to make of that.

I have two small kids around that age. Sometimes we play footy in the cul-de-sac with their mates. Sometimes there's playful tackling involved. It doesn't make me a psychopath.

Mate. You don't pin other peoples kids to a wall with your forearm. Pretty simple.

Also given the incident is referenced in Section C: Unlawful Discrimination

C.1.4 Stereotyping or domineering conduct—Hawthorn vicarious liability

212. Further or alternatively, the act pleaded in [70(c)]:

(a) constituted Mr Clarkson treating Mr Peterson, and his family, in a domineering and inappropriate manner (domineering conduct);
(b) involved a distinction, restriction, or preference based on race (viz, Mr Peterson’s Aboriginality), in that the child of a non-Aboriginal person would not be pinned to the wall by a Hawthorn employee in the presence of that non-Aboriginal person;
(c) had the effect of nullifying or impairing Mr Peterson’s recognition, enjoyment or exercise, on an equal footing, of a human right in the economic and/or cultural fields of public life, being the right to private life (including to personal integrity, privacy, autonomy, reputation, family);
(d) would be unlawful by reason of s 9(1) of the RD Act if it were done by Hawthorn;
(e) by reason of s 18A of the RD Act, is treated for the purposes of the RD Act as though Hawthorn had also engaged in it;
(f) is unlawful conduct of Hawthorn within the meaning of s 9(1) of the RD Act.

Pretty clear the "context" it isn't the fun playful act you're trying to paint it as.

 

[hilly]

Behaviour of a psychopath to pin a 9 year old against a wall. If any body were to characterise him as insensitive or weird would have blinkers on.

Try and think it through a bit.

On SM-S901E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Satan]

At the end of the 2013 season … at an end-of-season player’s trip, an Indigenous player (Mr Bradley Hill) was asked by a non-Indigenous player (Mr Grant Birchall

14

Grant Birchall

Age

36

Ht

193cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

21.9

5star

K

12.6

5star

HB

9.3

5star

M

5.8

5star

T

1.6

4star

MG

250.0

4star

D

13.3

3star

K

9.2

4star

HB

4.2

3star

M

4.3

4star

T

1.3

2star

MG

250.0

4star

D

14.0

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

6.4

4star

M

2.6

3star

T

0.6

3star

) whether Mr Hill’s partner was also a ‘boong’,” the document alleges.

“Mr Hill told Mr Rioli of this comment at the first pre-season training session around late November 2013 … Hawthorn did not take any action in response to this incident.”

 

[Elixuh]