News Hawthorn Racism Scandal

[Holden Hillbilly]

Former footballer and ABC presenter Tony Armstrong

Tony Armstrong

Age

35

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183cm

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80kg

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Def

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Last 5

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14.9

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9.1

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5.8

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4.0

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1.9

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MG

255.0

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No current season stats available

D

17.8

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11.4

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6.4

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7.8

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asked viewers this morning to “spare a thought” for the First Nations community, saying it had been a “tough little period” following coverage of the queen’s death, the banning of spit hoods which are disproportionately used on Indigenous peoples, and revelations of racism in the Kumanjayi Walker inquest.

“We’ve had 517 deaths in custody since the royal commission to date and now these allegations, contextually on all of that, it is not easy,” he said.

Alleged mistreatment of Hawthorn's Indigenous players reveals sport's deep-set racism

Horrific allegations around the Hawthorn Football Club's treatment of Indigenous players and families have been laid bare.

www.crikey.com.au

 

[Jojay]

The hawks moved on Clarkson, a four time premiership coach, with a year left to run on his contract ... with full pay.

Did Hawthorn know what was coming?

 

[shewho]

The terms “classy” and ”magic” are not racist. This is more deflectory BS to suit someone’s PR machine.

For starters, Stevie J was magic, Shaun Burgoyne

9

Shaun Burgoyne

Age

42

Ht

186cm

Wt

89kg

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18.0

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9.9

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8.1

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3.5

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T

3.8

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MG

162.7

3star

D

10.0

3star

K

5.6

2star

HB

4.4

3star

M

1.7

2star

T

2.6

4star

MG

162.7

3star

D

6.2

2star

K

3.2

2star

HB

3.0

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M

1.2

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1.6

4star

was classy. Daddy Daicos was magic, Peter Burgoyne

Peter Burgoyne

Age

46

Ht

183cm

Wt

84kg

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D/M

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Last 5

D

19.6

5star

K

12.5

5star

HB

7.1

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

15.0

4star

K

9.2

4star

HB

5.8

4star

M

2.2

3star

T

0.8

3star

was classy. Wanganeen was classy playing in the midfield, magic as a forward pocket.

The term “magic” is used mainly for goalsneaks who seem to make something out of nothing. Milne was magic. Colour doesn’t matter.

“Classy“ is a term used to describe smooth movers with great kicks- Liam Henry is classy. Houston is classy.

This is the second or third journalistic piece which tries to blame the system instead of those truly at fault. It looks to me like a concerted campaign.

 

[TazD]

The old man hit me with the "they've hung them out to dry" and "who are player 1,2,3?" perspective this morning. Wish I could say I was surprised.

 

[Willsy10]

What happened to all the posts about yesterdays bombshell?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Pt Augusta Power]

The system is absolutely at fault.

These football clubs operate in a system where what they did is not questioned by those victims because the system means they have no voice.
it took an external investigation for these allegations to come out.

517 deaths in custody since a royal commission into deaths in custody

It can’t be ‘the system is fine - it’s the individuals at fault’. Especially when close to ZERO if those individuals ever face any ramifications

Look at the inquest into Kumanjayi Walker as a current example. The text messages sent by police to police would be heartbreaking but terrifying for ATSI peoples in the NT.

 

[Alyx]

What happened to all the posts about yesterdays bombshell?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

News - Hawthorn Racism Scandal

A disgusting read about the sort of person Alastair Clarkson is and how football clubs (Hawthorn) operate. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-09-21/alastair-clarkson-and-chris-fagan-named-in-hawks-review/101452320

www.bigfooty.com

 

[AFC AFeederClub]

after reading the article there are more questions than answers, there seems to be a lot of third party translations of the actual events and a lot of context missing.

"Three families involved told ABC Sport about incidents in which club staff allegedly bullied and removed First Nations players from their homes and relocated them elsewhere, telling them to choose between their careers and their families"

1st question is are these the players themselves or the families? 2nd question, What does remove them from their homes mean and relocate them elsewhere? Does it mean the club asked the player to be closer to the club in order to be a more professional player? I think clubs would encourage every player to do that and it wouldnt be rare for most players to do something like that in their career, 3rd question. Telling them to choose between their careers or families. Does that mean they were told in order to be a professional player you have to make sacrifices like time with your family, this is the case for any player and i dont think their isnt a player that would tell you any different.

"the gravest accusations relate to the club's alleged intimidation tactics to separate couples at the earliest stages of pregnancies and parenthood, and the alleged demand that one player should instruct his partner to terminate a pregnancy — actions the families say created multi-generational traumas"

this is most worst accusation, what were these intimidation tactics? and why arent they detailed in the article if they are know? It seems strange that a journalist wouldnt find out what these tactics were?

what does it mean the club instructed a player to terminate a pregnancy? maybe it was a case of the player talked to the club doctor who then said that 1 option is that an abortion, this would be the case that any doctor in Australia would tell you if he saw you were apprehensive or distraught

The most glaring part of this whole story is that non of the other Aboriginal players at the time seems to be aware of these stories. I mean if this is all true then i suspect through direct contact or through the grapevine these stories would have been made know to them somewhere along the way in the 10 years since. To me these stories seem to far fetched to be true or have been manipulated by journalists to sound like something they are not with people's words twisted to create a narrative?

 

[Janus]

The terms “classy” and ”magic” are not racist. This is more deflectory BS to suit someone’s PR machine.

For starters, Stevie J was magic, Shaun Burgoyne was classy. Daddy Daicos was magic, Peter Burgoyne was classy. Wanganeen was classy playing in the midfield, magic as a forward pocket.

The term “magic” is used mainly for goalsneaks who seem to make something out of nothing. Milne was magic. Colour doesn’t matter.

“Classy“ is a term used to describe smooth movers with great kicks- Liam Henry is classy. Houston is classy.

This is the second or third journalistic piece which tries to blame the system instead of those truly at fault. It looks to me like a concerted campaign.

It’s an opinion designed to create division and pushback against it, like all woke pieces are. Because without division, there is nothing to fight against. Community consensus is the enemy of the SJW.

It goes like this. Something that everyone agrees is ****ing shit and should have never happened, happens. The entire community condemns it, with only a handful of racists/bigots/misogynists voicing their irrelevant opinions. Then some woke ****wit gets up and makes a statement like this, and suddenly instead of the consensus you once had, now you have half the people agreeing with him, saying that it somehow disparages the skill level of Indigenous players (I have many books on magic and it is a skill in of itself, but that’s a discussion for elsewhere) and half of them saying that using the word “magic” to describe someone doing something that would be impossible for you is not actually a bad thing. The woke ****wit then will say that if you don’t agree with their view of the world, it must be because of systematic racism and they will then tar you with the same brush as the very people you condemned at the beginning.

The solution? Don’t engage in discussion with woke ****wits. Don’t post their bullshit. They aren’t trying to promote anything but discord while everyone else is trying to move forward - acknowledging the past so the same mistakes don’t happen again and we learn from them, but not letting the past dictate what the future should be.

 

[Rexie J]

I can still remember the first time I heard `go walkabout ' used in reference to an indigenous footballer.
It was back in the very early 1960's when a pre-season night comp was played at the Norwood oval and the Maggies were playing the deadlegs.

It was used as an obviously derogatory term by deadleg barrackers to a Port player named Vince Copley, who was giving one of their Parade favourites the run around.

Vince was a magnificent looking athlete, he was only about 18 at the time, around 6' tall in the old money and was I believe a very highly rated junior at Alberton, looking back his playing style reminded me of Bruce Light.

I don't think Vince ever played league footy, but I believe he is still alive and has written a book about his experiences in the game, no doubt it would be a very interesting read.

I haven't as yet read his book but Vince passed away at Goolwa in January 2022.

Vincent Copley

Vincent Copley — Profile on The Conversation

theconversation.com

Please note, this story includes a photo of Vince.

 

[shewho]

What’s your agenda, AFC? If you really read the article you’d know the answers to all your questions.

The article quoted both the partners and some of the players.

The intimidation was ”your career is over if you don’t do what we say”.

How the Hawks instructed players to procure an abortion is set out in detail.

Finally, this is supposedly not a journalist’s handiwork but a summary of an independent investigative report by individuals appointed by Hawthorn. Independent. If those involved think the journalist made shit up they can release the report they’ve been sitting on for two weeks.

And of course they can sue the ABC for defamation if they published stories made up by the victims. It is certain the ABC’s legal team poured over every line and ensured they could back it up. Hell, Clarkson just signed a $5m contract, which he will lose because of this. That’s the first item on his defamation claim.

Read the article and come back with informed questions.

 

[raptalia]

What happened to all the posts about yesterdays bombshell?


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

Moved to a separate thread.

 

[dirty2]

We all know this is how the AFL works.

 

[edgie]

What’s the problem in being “magic”?

White players = Classy, something they've worked hard to achieve, or are born gifted
Black players = Magic, their skills and ability is due to some supernatural phenomena, not dedication to their craft, not born that way

 

[1954]

I haven't as yet read his book but Vince passed away at Goolwa in January 2022.

Vincent Copley

Vincent Copley — Profile on The Conversation

theconversation.com

Please note, this story includes a photo of Vince.

Thanks for that Rexie, I had no idea how much Vince achieved outside of football, but I did see something on SBS about a month ago which included some very positive comments about his book, and that it was written by a highly respected Aboriginal elder.

Sad to hear of his passing, but mid 80's is a decent innings.

 

[edgie]

Former footballer and ABC presenter Tony Armstrong asked viewers this morning to “spare a thought” for the First Nations community, saying it had been a “tough little period” following coverage of the queen’s death, the banning of spit hoods which are disproportionately used on Indigenous peoples, and revelations of racism in the Kumanjayi Walker inquest.

“We’ve had 517 deaths in custody since the royal commission to date and now these allegations, contextually on all of that, it is not easy,” he said.

Alleged mistreatment of Hawthorn's Indigenous players reveals sport's deep-set racism

Horrific allegations around the Hawthorn Football Club's treatment of Indigenous players and families have been laid bare.

www.crikey.com.au

OH **** OFF

The deaths in custody thing again, how to undercut an argument with a bullshit dog whistle. Aboriginal deaths in custody are not, or barely, within standard deviation, more common than non aboriginal in custody. The statistics do not backup that aboriginal people are disproportionately murdered in custody at all when you bother to look in to it and do comparisons. They are more likely to die of natural causes than non aboriginal, in custody.

If you are gonna reference the royal commission, do it properly.

• Aboriginal people do not die at a higher rate than non-Aboriginal people in custody.
• The rate at which Aboriginal people are taken into custody is "overwhelmingly different".

Tony, you are better than this.

 

[edgie]

The system is absolutely at fault.

These football clubs operate in a system where what they did is not questioned by those victims because the system means they have no voice.
it took an external investigation for these allegations to come out.

517 deaths in custody since a royal commission into deaths in custody

It can’t be ‘the system is fine - it’s the individuals at fault’. Especially when close to ZERO if those individuals ever face any ramifications

Look at the inquest into Kumanjayi Walker as a current example. The text messages sent by police to police would be heartbreaking but terrifying for ATSI peoples in the NT.

Another one.

 

[Powerage]

This reads as correct to me:

Making Jack Watts the exception that proves these rules???

 

[Jason K]

The old man hit me with the "they've hung them out to dry" and "who are player 1,2,3?" perspective this morning. Wish I could say I was surprised.

Facebook comments of this ilk are in the vast majority from what I can see

 

[TazD]

Facebook comments of this ilk are in the vast majority from what I can see

Trust me, the old fella didn't arrive at these views by himself.

 

[1954]

Does anyone know if/when these racist allegations as outlined by Jackson will be on ABC tv, or at this stage is it radio only?

 

[Ford Fairlane]

 

[EskimoPAFC]

OH * OFF

The deaths in custody thing again, how to undercut an argument with a bullshit dog whistle. Aboriginal deaths in custody is are not, or barely, within standard deviation, more common than non aboriginal in custody. The statistics do not backup that aboriginal people are disproportionately murdered in custody at all when you bother to look in to it and do comparisons.

If you are gonna reference the royal commission, do it properly.



Tony, you are better than this.

What statistics are you referring to?

This is pretty clear from the Australian Institute of Criminology:


To put this in context, from the associated text:

The death rate of Indigenous people in police custody was 0.45 per 100,000 Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander population aged 10 years and over (at 30 June 2020; see Table B5). The death rate of non-Indigenous people in police custody was 0.06 per 100,000 non-Indigenous population aged 10 years and over (at 30 June 2020)

 

[Grave Danger]

Making Jack Watts the exception that proves these rules???

Hardly an exception - most of the WCE naughties went to the best private schools.

 

[Jojay]

We all know this is how the AFL works.

Ordinarily I'd agree. I mean Clarkson's been caught on camera punching a fan after a Port game back in 2015 - pretty much without consequence.

But this is on another level all together. If any of these accounts actually stick, he's toast.