Hawthorn the Team most Likely: Pfft

[Gavin Excell]

I reckon Hawks are still pretty dangerous. The frist qtr proved that. Losing Rioli is big for them and Burgoyne was also down as was buddy.

The player they may really feel the loss of though is Stratton. They look one good defender short.

 

[GarethHale]

Carlton fans are writing off Hawthorn.

Carlton have not beaten Hawthorn for five years.

"Pfft"!

Hey nobjock only one Carlton poster has posted on this thread. (the op)

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Hey nobjock only one Carlton poster has posted on this thread. (the op)

Go watch reruns of Hale & Pace

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

I can assure you that 'confusion' is about the last emotion I feel toward you after reading your two posts. 'Pity' would be a much more accurate way of summing it up.

Fessing up, and admitting you didn't understand the context of what I posted would have been a far better approach than now claiming it was all part of some extravagant psychological game.

Another condescending, supercilious Richmond supporter trying to denigrate a stranger on an internet forum. Tsk, tsk friend

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

Hey absfab, you told me you had stopped trolling Hawthorn. What gives?

 

[Japes]

Another condescending, supercilious Richmond supporter trying to denigrate a stranger on an internet forum. Tsk, tsk friend

I think you'll find, if you look back, that denigration in the conversation between him and me didn't originate from me.

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

I think you'll find, if you look back, that denigration in the conversation between him and me didn't originate from me.

Perhaps

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

There is no way Hawthorn is a contender.

Writing us off in round 5?

 

[84GF]

Given that Rd5 has just finished, it's clearly too early to make a call on Hawthorn's chances in 2011 and it would be wrong to write them off given the top-end talent they have on their list.

I think the real issue for the Hawks is a longer-term problem in that they don't have enough young talent on their list to make the club strong beyond the next 2-3 years. Their recruiting over recent years in my view has generally been poor (Cyril the obvious exception in 2007 draft, then you have to go back to Franklin/Roughy in 2004 draft). They've obviously focused on topping up their list with experienced players to try to sneak a flag (who could blame them after the success they had with Stewart Dew), but this has come at the expense of talented young players. Admittedly, I haven't seen enough of Suckling and Stratton and it's obviously too early to make a call on the younger 2010 draftees but as a group, the recruits from 2005 to 2009 drafts don't look that great.

 

[SA HAWK]

Given that Rd5 has just finished, it's clearly too early to make a call on Hawthorn's chances in 2011 and it would be wrong to write them off given the top-end talent they have on their list.

I think the real issue for the Hawks is a longer-term problem in that they don't have enough young talent on their list to make the club strong beyond the next 2-3 years. Their recruiting over recent years in my view has generally been poor (Cyril the obvious exception in 2007 draft, then you have to go back to Franklin/Roughy in 2004 draft). They've obviously focused on topping up their list with experienced players to try to sneak a flag (who could blame them after the success they had with Stewart Dew), but this has come at the expense of talented young players. Admittedly, I haven't seen enough of Suckling and Stratton and it's obviously too early to make a call on the younger 2010 draftees but as a group, the recruits from 2005 to 2009 drafts don't look that great.

I agree 100% i think we will probably be a top 8 contender for the next 2-3 years but in 4-5 years i can see us being down the bottom.

The 2005 & 2006 draft debacles have hurt us and will continue to hurt us for years to come.

 

[absfab]

Hey absfab, you told me you had stopped trolling Hawthorn. What gives?

What makes you think it's a troll?

Legspeed ain't the be all, but if you aint got it.....

I stand by the OP. Geelong ARE a relatively slow team across the field, and they have been exposed at times by less capable outfits over the past 18 months as a result.

If you aren't mighty concerned that Hawthorn were made to look slow by Geelong, you're living in dreamland.

 

[tazhawk]

What makes you think it's a troll?

Legspeed ain't the be all, but if you aint got it.....

I stand by the OP. Geelong ARE a relatively slow team across the field, and they have been exposed at times by less capable outfits over the past 18 months as a result.

If you aren't mighty concerned that Hawthorn were made to look slow by Geelong, you're living in dreamland.

Do you think we look slow against your team?

Why do you think the Hawks have tore Carlton a new one 7 times in a row by an average of 44 points?

FFS we lost to a very good team in a fantastic game and all of a sudden we are not contenders.

I know you from the bay so stop pretending that this thread is anything but a troll.

Still I am interested in your theory as to why the Hawks Flog Carlton all the time.

 

[FRUMPY]

The fact is the geelong-hawthorn result doesnt mean anything to who challenges Collingwood. It comes down to who plays better against collingwood and i would say hawthorn play collingwood better than any other side and would be the side collingwood supporters would least like to play (even then they would still be confident). Collingwood devised a gameplan to beat geelong and handle them pretty comfortably.

 

[tazhawk]

The fact is the geelong-hawthorn result doesnt mean anything to who challenges Collingwood. It comes down to who plays better against collingwood and i would say hawthorn play collingwood better than any other side and would be the side collingwood supporters would least like to play (even then they would still be confident). Collingwood devised a gameplan to beat geelong and handle them pretty comfortably.

Bingo.

Well said young man.

I have about 15 Collingwood supporters who all say they are not concerned about Geelong.

The Hawks have beaten Collingwood 5 times out of the last 6 and for whatever reason worry the life out of Collingwood.

 

[JoondalupJ]

Don't get me wrong. Even without GAJ Geelong are an immensely talented outfit. But nobody would dare to accuse them of being possessed of dangerous pace.

And yet they made Hawthorn look slow. Geez.

Hawks will embarrass a few low ranked sides, and might get over the occasional better team on the back of their top few having blinders.

Contenders? Nope.

Waiting waiting waiting, since 2008 and I think your probably right. When the chips are down and we need to prove something we can't do it . It was time to beat Geelong and we couldn't , our players looked a little bewildered at times in that game . A lot of short passing and my pet hate overhandballing. For me the over handball thing is a sure sign that the Hawks are lost for a minute , I ,ve seen it countless times even when they were building in 06 and 07 , then bang we struck a perfect little plan , but after that
the dynasty thing in my brain kept going, but the team stopped , GF hangover maybe in 2009, it was shocking , 2010 well the excuses have to stop and as far as our little adventure to Subi last finals , well I won't say any more.
Hawks people always keep the faith and I think we are a little better than some people are saying , but we have to satrt showing it all the time. Now I don't know if we've got a game plan even? And I get the feeling other things may not be OK in the camp, Hodgy looked out of sorts and Burgoyne looked confused. I don't know it was just a feeling I got a couple of times, well they have to come together . Jeff might have to get angry.
Any thoughts Hawks?

 

[JoondalupJ]

Bingo.

Well said young man.

I have about 15 Collingwood supporters who all say they are not concerned about Geelong.

The Hawks have beaten Collingwood 5 times out of the last 6 and for whatever reason worry the life out of Collingwood.

You have to beat others to get to play Collingwood, in a GF don't you?
We might kick the Carringbush bum everytime, but we have to get to the big one first.
We have to beat the Geelongs of this world, right now we can't do it, and haven't for nearly 2 and a 1/2 years. And Adelaide the unknown towelled us up when we should have buried them, we had the pussies by 26 points at one stage, did the boys go for coffees or something, I gotta tell you I,m getting sick and tired of wondering every match whether the apponant is a top side or a bottom side and still having to guess whose gonna win! In Tassie we should have anihilated the Eagles we just scraped in
it was not a confidance building victory hey?

 

[qldbluesman_43]

IMO their loss doesn't really show much. Hawks are the most inconsistent team in the comp and show signs of absolute brilliance followed by utter crap. If they can get some form together at the right time they'll be dangerous. They can beat anyone on their day, although the way they're going I can't imagine them winning 3 or 4 finals in a row. I would be shocked if they pulled 4 good performances in a row together.

Also lol at hawks fans, so insecure.

 

[year of the cat]

If St Kilda and Hawthorn merged, they'd win the flag for sure.

For the best party club...

 

[witsend]

IMO their loss doesn't really show much. Hawks are the most inconsistent team in the comp and show signs of absolute brilliance followed by utter crap. If they can get some form together at the right time they'll be dangerous. They can beat anyone on their day, although the way they're going I can't imagine them winning 3 or 4 finals in a row. I would be shocked if they pulled 4 good performances in a row together.

Also lol at hawks fans, so insecure.

Hawthorn is paying the price for extremely poor top-up recruiting, a self-belief that is narcissistic and unfounded and a game plan that seems to be "We're just that good...I'm sure we'll win because we won in 2008".
Clarkson is an idiot for not playing Roughead at CHB to shore up a defence that is INCAPABLE of being part of a Premiership team, and a ruck division that is adequate at best.
Also he has a track record of playing injured players.
They have tremendous talent at the top of their list but until they make some tough decisions they will not progress.
Also don't underestimate the impact of Crawford's retirement. He was the real heart and soul of that club and I suspect his loss at even a training level is one that they have not yet addressed.

 

[MinerBoy]

IMO their loss doesn't really show much. Hawks are the most inconsistent team in the comp and show signs of absolute brilliance followed by utter crap. If they can get some form together at the right time they'll be dangerous. They can beat anyone on their day, although the way they're going I can't imagine them winning 3 or 4 finals in a row. I would be shocked if they pulled 4 good performances in a row together.

Also lol at hawks fans, so insecure.

All within one quarter unfortunately, let alone week to week.

 

[Byron2008]

Some good points here, especially those raised by Hawk supporters.

I've also thought the true sign of a great team is winning, even when they're not playing at their best..

To be frank, no team can go 90-100% all season.. The Hawks can't seem to get those solid (sometimes scrappy) wins against good competition.

But like everyone else has said, at their best they can beat anyone... but then again nearly any team at its best can knock off the top teams (especially if they're a little off)..

 

[David the Cat]

Hawthorn is paying the price for extremely poor top-up recruiting, a self-belief that is narcissistic and unfounded and a game plan that seems to be "We're just that good...I'm sure we'll win because we won in 2008".
Clarkson is an idiot for not playing Roughead at CHB to shore up a defence that is INCAPABLE of being part of a Premiership team, and a ruck division that is adequate at best.
Also he has a track record of playing injured players.
They have tremendous talent at the top of their list but until they make some tough decisions they will not progress.
Also don't underestimate the impact of Crawford's retirement. He was the real heart and soul of that club and I suspect his loss at even a training level is one that they have not yet addressed.

Good post as usual witsend...especially paragraph 1 and 5. Roughead to CHB may not have helped though.

What I couldn't believe was their total inability to curb the impact of Matthew Scarlett. On another thread, one Hawk poster was waxing lyrical about Scarlett not taking Hale, Buddy or Roughhead, thereby completely missing the point. IT appeared to me that there was a total lack of defensive pressure from the Hawk forward line at times....and thereby allowing Scarlett to rack up 29 possessions. He cut them to pieces while, meanwhile, Hawk fans are criticising him for not picking up a gun forward.

Scarlett has taken on a completely different role under Chris Scott who recognised that Scarlett was getting older, but had the ability to run wild if other players could take gun forwards. Step up Lonergan and Taylor and hey presto, Scarlett runs amok. ITs not the first time Scarlett has done it this year. It is IMO, a reflection of Chris Scott's approach at the Cats this year.

With Enright and Scarlett, Geelong have an attacking flair from the back half that matches any in the competition. IT has made Geelong a better side, and opposition coaches will need to curb it to halt the Geelong run.

 

[The Donners]

You know the funny thing? It's been the media and bookies carrying on about that rubbish, I haven't heard anyone from Hawthorn saying it.

Apart from a one-eyed Hawk fan mate of mine, you're right. I have to say, it's hard for me not to generalise and say that ALL Hawk fans were, in the pre-season at least, expecting to seriously challenge for the premiership.

It's not looking that way at the moment but let's remember, it's only round 5.

Any team who finishes top 4 would think they're a realistic chance of winning the premiership and there's nothing after 5 rounds that suggests Hawthorn can't make the top 4 - ditto probably Sydney, Essendon and Carlton.

 

[The Donners]

Hawthorn is paying the price for extremely poor top-up recruiting, a self-belief that is narcissistic and unfounded and a game plan that seems to be "We're just that good...I'm sure we'll win because we won in 2008".
Clarkson is an idiot for not playing Roughead at CHB to shore up a defence that is INCAPABLE of being part of a Premiership team, and a ruck division that is adequate at best.
Also he has a track record of playing injured players.
They have tremendous talent at the top of their list but until they make some tough decisions they will not progress.
Also don't underestimate the impact of Crawford's retirement. He was the real heart and soul of that club and I suspect his loss at even a training level is one that they have not yet addressed.

Robert Campbell and Paul Dear aren't names that are going to send shivers down your spine, both premiership ruckman for Hawthorn. To that extent, ruckman are extremely overrated - see Mark Blake 2009.

 

[SA HAWK]

Good post as usual witsend...especially paragraph 1 and 5. Roughead to CHB may not have helped though.

What I couldn't believe was their total inability to curb the impact of Matthew Scarlett. On another thread, one Hawk poster was waxing lyrical about Scarlett not taking Hale, Buddy or Roughhead, thereby completely missing the point. IT appeared to me that there was a total lack of defensive pressure from the Hawk forward line at times....and thereby allowing Scarlett to rack up 29 possessions. He cut them to pieces while, meanwhile, Hawk fans are criticising him for not picking up a gun forward.

Scarlett has taken on a completely different role under Chris Scott who recognised that Scarlett was getting older, but had the ability to run wild if other players could take gun forwards. Step up Lonergan and Taylor and hey presto, Scarlett runs amok. ITs not the first time Scarlett has done it this year. It is IMO, a reflection of Chris Scott's approach at the Cats this year.

With Enright and Scarlett, Geelong have an attacking flair from the back half that matches any in the competition. IT has made Geelong a better side, and opposition coaches will need to curb it to halt the Geelong run.

You are right the defensive pressure in our forward line was pretty much non existent on Tuesday. The lack of competitiveness from our tall forwards in the contest compounded this. Geelong just ran the ball out at will. I thought our midfield was far too loose as well.

We lack a crumbing forward with Rioli probably being our best option there playing more in the midfield.

Some of our matchups in particular Hodge on Ling were really poor choices imo.