Society/Culture Horse racing is cruel

[Bomberboyokay]

 

[Bunk Moreland]

What does Senator Faruqi get out of visiting Charlie Fellowes and his best looking, stage-managed employees? Any information that isn't publicly available? Or invalidates what is publicly available?

Yep, good call.

If you’re an outsider who’s clearly “passionate” about something, what could you possibly get from meeting with an expert professional in that field.

I’d say absolutely nothing at all. Carry on. Has anybody got a placard I can hold?

 

[Bomberboyokay]

 

[SSwans2011]

Melbourne University research found that over 50% of horses had blood in their windpipes.

Why the Melbourne Cup is actually one of the cruellest days on Australia's calendar

Countless horses have sustained catastrophic injuries on the racetrack after being whipped and pushed past their limits.

www.smh.com.au

85-95% of horses show signs of gastric ulceration (ulcers that erode stomach lining).

Gastric Ulcers - Everything You Need to Know | Ranvet

Gastric Ulcers in Horses

www.ranvet.com.au

The industry sees a wastage rate of 40%.

From prizewinners to pet meat: the harsh realities of horse breeding

The daughter of a former thoroughbred breeder confronts the brutal reality faced by racehorses who've outlived their usefulness.

www.smh.com.au

122 horses were killed on the track in the last race year.

Australian Racehorse Deathwatch

A report on fatalities in the last racing year.

horseracingkills.com

Before anyone asks a patronising question, yes, I have visited a stable. Members of my family are involved in the industry. That doesn't change the fact that the statistics and evidence are clear. It is a cruel and reprehensible industry. Not to mention, given the amount of drugs that are pumped into racehorses, visiting a stable at the invitation of a breeder or trainer is a frivolous activity that will prove very little.

There's a powerful video included in the last link. There is so much evidence that is plain to see. It has become nauseating reading people trying to convince everyone that in spite of all this clear evidence that the cruelty only represents a fraction of the industry. How can the cruelty represent only a fraction of the industry when 40% of horses bred for racing are sent to abattoirs for not being fast enough?

 

[SSwans2011]

By the way, the comparisons to domesticated pets are a false equivalence. If footage was released of a domesticated pet being whipped, the inevitable social media outrage would rightfully result in an RSPCA investigation.

On Melbourne Cup Day the same thing, but with racehorses, is broadcast to millions, and those within the industry try to convince us that the horses are treated no differently to household cats and dogs. Remarkably, I think they genuinely believe their own bullshit.

 

[Craven Morehead]

Melbourne University research found that over 50% of horses had blood in their windpipes.

Why the Melbourne Cup is actually one of the cruellest days on Australia's calendar

Countless horses have sustained catastrophic injuries on the racetrack after being whipped and pushed past their limits.

www.smh.com.au

85-95% of horses show signs of gastric ulceration (ulcers that erode stomach lining).

Gastric Ulcers - Everything You Need to Know | Ranvet

Gastric Ulcers in Horses

www.ranvet.com.au

The industry sees a wastage rate of 40%.

From prizewinners to pet meat: the harsh realities of horse breeding

The daughter of a former thoroughbred breeder confronts the brutal reality faced by racehorses who've outlived their usefulness.

www.smh.com.au

122 horses were killed on the track in the last race year.

Australian Racehorse Deathwatch

A report on fatalities in the last racing year.

horseracingkills.com

Before anyone asks a patronising question, yes, I have visited a stable. Members of my family are involved in the industry. That doesn't change the fact that the statistics and evidence are clear. It is a cruel and reprehensible industry. Not to mention, given the amount of drugs that are pumped into racehorses, visiting a stable at the invitation of a breeder or trainer is a frivolous activity that will prove very little.

There's a powerful video included in the last link. There is so much evidence that is plain to see. It has become nauseating reading people trying to convince everyone that in spite of all this clear evidence that the cruelty only represents a fraction of the industry. How can the cruelty represent only a fraction of the industry when 40% of horses bred for racing are sent to abattoirs for not being fast enough?

Another professional protesting muppet.

You're the guy who was all upset about the Biloela Sri Lankan's and claiming that the entire town was outraged etc. Which was not even close to being the case.

How much do they pay you people?

Is it a cause by cause cheque, or just an overall package?

 

[SSwans2011]

Another professional protesting muppet.

You're the guy who was all upset about the Biloela Sri Lankan's and claiming that the entire town was outraged etc. Which was not even close to being the case.

How much do they pay you people?

Is it a cause by cause cheque, or just an overall package?

Way to deflect. Who would be paying me? Soros, I bet?

Please try to engage with the issue. You seem to consistently struggle with that and resort to name-calling when you have your worldview challenged. If you want to actually talk about cruelty in the racing industry, I'm happy to. Otherwise, I have no interest in stinking up the thread, and will simply put you on ignore.

 

[Craven Morehead]

Way to deflect. Who would be paying me? Soros, I bet?

Please try to engage with the issue. You seem to consistently struggle with that and resort to name-calling when you have your worldview challenged. If you want to actually talk about cruelty in the racing industry, I'm happy to. Otherwise, I have no interest in stinking up the thread, and will simply put you on ignore.

Well you would put me on ignore because you have all your little talking points and links laid out for you and you must follow the narrative that you've been instructed to follow.

Funny how you went all quiet about the Sri Lankans, even though they are still a little newsworthy, huh?

The organisers found a more worthy 'cause'?

You people are like rice paper. Transparent as f***.

 

[SSwans2011]

Well you would put me on ignore because you have all your little talking points and links laid out for you and you must follow the narrative that you've been instructed to follow.

Funny how you went all quiet about the Sri Lankans, even though they are still a little newsworthy, huh?

The organisers found a more worthy 'cause'?

You people are like rice paper. Transparent as f***.

Yes, Craven, it is completely impossible to care about two things at one.

Yes, Craven. anybody who doesn't agree with everything you believe must be mentally programmed to think that way.

Yes, Craven, the best way to argue is to refuse to engage with the actual topic and instead deflect to a bunch of other issues.

Good job, Craven. Really insightful posts, as always.

 

[Craven Morehead]

Yes, Craven, it is completely impossible to care about two things at one.

Yes, Craven. anybody who doesn't agree with everything you believe must be mentally programmed to think that way.

Yes, Craven, the best way to argue is to refuse to engage with the actual topic and instead deflect to a bunch of other issues.

Good job, Craven. Really insightful posts, as always.

What about the Sri lankans locked up on Christmas island pal?

Why so silent?

Why suddenly enter a thread with more political and media traction?

 

[SSwans2011]

What about the Sri lankans locked up on Christmas island pal?

Why so silent?

Why suddenly enter a thread with more political and media traction?

It's a disgrace and cruel. If you want to engage with that issue, I'd be happy to do so in that thread.

This thread is for animal cruelty in the horse racing industry. I posted here because I saw people engaging with a topical issue that I've developed pretty strong feelings about after doing my own research and reading plenty of debate on social media.

 

[Craven Morehead]

It's a disgrace and cruel. If you want to engage with that issue, I'd be happy to do so in that thread.

This thread is for animal cruelty in the horse racing industry. I posted here because I saw people engaging with a topical issue that I've developed pretty strong feelings about after doing my own research and reading plenty of debate on social media.

LOL.

Transparent as f***.

So which one are you aligned to?

Socialist Alliance?

Or one of their associated minions?

LOL.

jesus, you people and your saving the planet one issue, as it is popular, at a time.

 

[SSwans2011]

Sorry for clogging up the thread, all. I've put Craven on ignore, seeing as he clearly has no interest in engaging with the issue, and would rather just peddle out conspiracy theories. I'll leave it be now. I'm always happy to engage in healthy debate, but if someone doesn't even want to discuss the issue, and instead just makes unsubstantiated accusations about me, there just isn't any point. Understand if any of my posts are deleted.

Back on topic, I thought The Juice Media, as per usual, did a wonderful job of summing up the issue:

 

[Craven Morehead]

and the pre-scripted propaganda spiel begins.

 

[Lethality]

Lowest Oaks Day attendance since 1994.

 

[skilts]

It ceases to amaze me that people are prepared to spend money on a gambling venture which has, as one of its underlying assumptions, that there is such a thing as 'inside information'.

I once had an unfortunate encounter with a horse trainer who was vigorously touting the integrity of his beloved industry. When asked if he had ever encountered a race which was rigged in his many years as a trainer, he replied, "Of course I have, but it doesn't happen often." I then asked him what action he had taken to assure the continued integrity of racing in those circumstances. How many times had he reported the fraud being perpetrated to the stewards or police? None was the number. Just another crook in a bent, so-called sport. An ugly pursuit, run by urgers, touts and spivs - I give you Lloyd Williams.

It will be justifiable to call it a sport when the horses are given equal opportunity to whip the jockeys.

 

[Bollox]

It ceases to amaze me that people are prepared to spend money on a gambling venture which has, as one of its underlying assumptions, that there is such a thing as 'inside information'.

I once had an unfortunate encounter with a horse trainer who was vigorously touting the integrity of his beloved industry. When asked if he had ever encountered a race which was rigged in his many years as a trainer, he replied, "Of course I have, but it doesn't happen often." I then asked him what action he had taken to assure the continued integrity of racing in those circumstances. How many times had he reported the fraud being perpetrated to the stewards or police? None was the number. Just another crook in a bent, so-called sport. An ugly pursuit, run by urgers, touts and spivs - I give you Lloyd Williams.

It will be justifiable to call it a sport when the horses are given equal opportunity to whip the jockeys.

If they ever get organised and start with that shit, we'll just shoot the lot of them and race camels instead.

We have the technology to do all sorts of cruel things to animals if we truly wanted to. Even the so called "cruelty" involved in the racing game is relatively minor compared to the cruelty nature inflicts on such a species in the wild. Certainly far less cruel than the way indigenous peoples treated them on other continents over the last twenty thousand years.
We now offer them protection, we pamper them, keep them warm over winter, and in most cases feed them the equine equivalent of lobster with truffle and caviar.
If they could talk I'm sure they say "hell yeah give me that whip once a month anytime over being constantly stalked and slowly eaten alive by those bastard cruel carnivores"
We have had a symbiotic relationship with the horse for thousands of years. If we could ride cheetah's without getting scratched we would. You could argue horse numbers have exploded due to humans. You could also argue that as humans have evolved socially we have also markedly improved their lot in life. They were once a convenience to us, but now treated as the king of land animals by the great majority. In most countries including Australia they are treated better than many humans.

Even if we simply leave them alone we can be labelled cruel, because they eat themselves out of house and home very fast then move on. They aren't native to Australia for very good reason. They can consider themselves lucky that after the advent of the internal combustion engine they are still useful for at least something, other than one of natures rich sources of protein for other animals.
They can be bad tempered buggers as well...but we tolerate that in general. They can be extremely high maintenance. We know they are one of the smarter animals going around and are respected.

So when you see the whip come out in the last furlong, try to understand that those particular select few horses have been brought into the world at our discretion, spoilt, pampered, bathed, fed caviar, and allowed to do what they do best, and are in fact LUCKY.....and if they could speak would probably say....

"... ouch, thanks for the reminder and bit of a hurry up. Now you can bath me and give me my lobster and caviar "

Afterall we COULD shove a cruise missile up their arse and light them up...but we don't. How about some perspective is all I say.

 

[RobbieK]

If they ever get organised and start with that shit, we'll just shoot the lot of them and race camels instead.

We have the technology to do all sorts of cruel things to animals if we truly wanted to. Even the so called "cruelty" involved in the racing game is relatively minor compared to the cruelty nature inflicts on such a species in the wild. Certainly far less cruel than the way indigenous peoples treated them on other continents over the last twenty thousand years.
We now offer them protection, we pamper them, keep them warm over winter, and in most cases feed them the equine equivalent of lobster with truffle and caviar.
If they could talk I'm sure they say "hell yeah give me a hurry up with that whip once a month anytime over being constantly stalked and slowly eaten alive by those bastard cruel carnivores"
We have had a symbiotic relationship with the horse for thousands of years. If we could ride cheetah's without getting scratched we would. You could argue horse numbers have exploded due to humans. You could also argue that as humans have evolved socially we have also markedly improved their lot in life. They were once a convenience to us, but now treated as the king of land animals by the great majority. In most countries including Australia they are treated better than many humans.

Even if we simply leave them alone we can be labelled cruel, because they eat themselves out of house and home very fast then move on. They aren't native to Australia for very good reason. They can consider themselves lucky that after the advent of the internal combustion engine they are still useful for at least something, other than one of natures rich sources of protein for other animals.
They can be bad tempered buggers as well...but we tolerate that in general. They can be extremely high maintenance. We know they are one of the smarter animals going around and are respected.

So when you see the whip come out in the last furlong, try to understand that those particular select few horses have been brought into the world at our discretion, spoilt, pampered, bathed, fed caviar, and allowed to do what they do best, and are in fact LUCKY.....and if they could speak would probably say....

"... ouch, thanks for the reminder and bit of a hurry up. Can I have some my lobster and caviar now please"

Afterall we COULD shove a cruise missile up their arse and light them up...but we don't. How about some perspective is all I say.

Well, now I know why you chose that user name.

 

[Craven Morehead]

Well, now I know why you chose that user name.

Stunning rebuttal.

He's dead right.

 

[RobbieK]

Stunning rebuttal.

He's dead right.

No he's not.

The argument that we could be more cruel to horses so they should be happy that we are only as cruel to them as we currently are is a stinking pile of BS.

 

[Demontim275]

No he's not.

The argument that we could be more cruel to horses so they should be happy that we are only as cruel to them as we currently are is a stinking pile of BS.

I don’t want horse racing banned. But that argument is the definition of relative privation fallacy.

 

[Craven Morehead]

No he's not.

The argument that we could be more cruel to horses so they should be happy that we are only as cruel to them as we currently are is a stinking pile of BS.

Have you ever held a crop, (jockey whip to you) in your hand??

There's this entire fallacy that horses are being flogged to within an inch of their life with life long scarring etc etc et bloody cetera.

People equate horse skin to their own, where a simple smack leaves a mark and actually stings, whereas a horses skin is WAAAAY thicker.

Because of the way a horse is broken in, (something of which I'm certain you also know zero about), it is more the sound of the crop and even the sight of it which gets a horse back to concentrating and giving its best.

They are a highly intelligent animal and flogging them in a manner which activists keep banging on about only leaves you with an animal which WON"T gallop at all. They just pack it in and say up yours pal.

Dinkum, I am so over activists like you spouting emotive crap when you wouldn't know a horse if you fell over one.

 

[RobbieK]

Have you ever held a crop, (jockey whip to you) in your hand??

There's this entire fallacy that horses are being flogged to within an inch of their life with life long scarring etc etc et bloody cetera.

People equate horse skin to their own, where a simple smack leaves a mark and actually stings, whereas a horses skin is WAAAAY thicker.

Because of the way a horse is broken in, (something of which I'm certain you also know zero about), it is more the sound of the crop and even the sight of it which gets a horse back to concentrating and giving its best.

They are a highly intelligent animal and flogging them in a manner which activists keep banging on about only leaves you with an animal which WON"T gallop at all. They just pack it in and say up yours pal.

Dinkum, I am so over activists like you spouting emotive crap when you wouldn't know a horse if you fell over one.

When did I say that the use of the whip was the biggest issue of animal cruelty in racing?

 

[Craven Morehead]

When did I say that the use of the whip was the biggest issue of animal cruelty in racing?

When you called out Bollox's post as bullshit.
That was his entire point.
Apart from the use of the whip once every 2-3 weeks for about 5 seconds, they are treated like absolute Gods.

Where is the cruelty in treating an animal way better than we treat a lot of people?

 

[RobbieK]

When you called out Bollox's post as bullshit.
That was his entire point.
Apart from the use of the whip once every 2-3 weeks for about 5 seconds, they are treated like absolute Gods.

Where is the cruelty in treating an animal way better than we treat a lot of people?

Thousands killed a year for being too slow. High rates of injury (you did read the articles about blood in the windpipes and gastric ulcers on this page, yeah?). They are not treated like gods, they are treated as objects, pushed to beyond their limits in races and then discarded when they offer no further possibility for profit.