If Scully was discovered to have signed with GWS...

[Beth]

Im hoping Scully stays with you and Im hoping you guys and gals don't have to spend a season putting up with pompous twats from other teams who will come over to your board and presume to tell you how you should and should not be feeling/reacting ("grow up" is my particular favourite...not). Good luck to you all!

 

[cannons]

Whilst I hope Caro's assessment is correct, her 'he just doesn't seem the type' argument isn't overly convincing.

 

[demons64]

might be interesting to watch the body language of his team mates towards him tomorrow (if he plays).

 

[Dr Awkward]

We have such double standards in football. It is okay for clubs to trade and dump players, but how dare a player set himself up for life. If I was Melbourne, I would be very upset if he left, but sometimes these things happen.

I've read a few comments about booing Scully, putting him back to the VFL... Not sure this shows good form.

I'm sure that if your boss offered you $400,000 and then another company came along and offered you $3,000,000 in the first year...you would wave goodbye to your old company.

So what? Fans are definately allowed to boo a player. The game has always existed for the fans, you cheer if you like and you boo if you dislike, its sporting entertainment. Overstepping the line with abuse would definately be frowned upon, but otherwise boo away.

The way I see it, if it looks like he is definately going then there is no way I would be playing him in AFL or VFL. Why aid his development when he is leaving?

I would be seething if this was D. Martin, or J.Riewoldt, or T. Cotchin. At least you should get another No. 1 pick for him but it really can rip a bit of soul out of your club. I don't think they should be able to sign 1st, 2nd or 3rd year players. They already have access to young talent via the draft they only need some experienced older players from other clubs.

 

[RedLegs#5]

So what? Fans are definately allowed to boo a player. The game has always existed for the fans, you cheer if you like and you boo if you dislike, its sporting entertainment. Overstepping the line with abuse would definately be frowned upon, but otherwise boo away.

The way I see it, if it looks like he is definately going then there is no way I would be playing him in AFL or VFL. Why aid his development when he is leaving?

I would be seething if this was D. Martin, or J.Riewoldt, or T. Cotchin. At least you should get another No. 1 pick for him but it really can rip a bit of soul out of your club. I don't think they should be able to sign 1st, 2nd or 3rd year players. They already have access to young talent via the draft they only need some experienced older players from other clubs.

I'll be doing much more than booing if he leaves. I know a lot of people who will join me. Scully will never forget.

 

[Mijhaa]

To those saying things along the lines of 'We must play him all season because he brings in revenue'.

If Scully hasn't signed by July, I'm not sure I want to see him playing on the football field.




As long as I am paid enough to keep me happy, all I need is a good place to spend my time and I am golden. Cash while nice, doesn't replace a friendly and supportive environment.

Money can buy you things, but it can't buy you everything (think premierships).

It all comes down to what Tom Scully values.

I don't care how much you want to 'look' after yourself by getting the best money, if he valued his team mates he would be open and honest and not be afraid of any repercussions.

If he wants the cash thats fine, but be honest about it, don't screw a club that has placed faith, effort and value into you.

Be a man and accept the position you want, don't hide behind your management as a way of dodging out of any pressure you might deserve in 2011.

You do realise Jack Watts did the exact same thing and put off contract negotiations until the end of last season? So yeah good idea lets alienate Tom when there's still every chance he is staying with us.

 

[Dr Awkward]

The second point is that he has made the wrong call, or at least he has been badly advised, in waiting to sign a new deal. There seems little upside in putting off negotiations until the end of the season because he will have to wear all season the speculation that he has behaved like a traitor and secretly signed with a new club.

I disagree with this point made by Caro.

If he backs his own ability and believes he will have a good year then surely his stocks will rise by the end of the year thus having more negotiating power.

 

[cannons]

I disagree with this point made by Caro.

If he backs his own ability and believes he will have a good year then surely his stocks will rise by the end of the year thus having more negotiating power.

I'm with you in this regard.

If he has a great year with us, coupled with the interest from GC, then there's really no way known that he wouldn't increase the value of his next deal.

I also disagree with those saying if he isn't signed by mid-season, he's gone. That, in itself, doesn't necessarily mean a thing, as his agent has said all along that they are planning on stalling talks until season's end.

To me, it just makes sense to wait until the end of the year from a purely financial point of view. There is some risk involved in doing so, but for a player of Tom's ability, it's highly likely that he'll end up having a good year and increasing his value as a result.

 

[LemmingMaster]

Just on a few points.

If Carlton losses a player to GWS, I will be pissed off.
If Scully has agreed in principle to sign with the GWS, he will do what Ablett did and announce the deal at the end of the season.
I still remember Mundy and Pavlich last year, they did not sign until very late in the season, imagine if the Dockers decided to drop them to the VFL for not signing before the season ended. I can tell you now that the Dockers would not have those two players this season.

GWS and GC are going to cause short to medium term pain to the AFL and certain teams, but if it all works out, the WHOLE AFL will benefit from their expansion.

Obviously you don't want to be the team that gets your players poached.

Carlton basically moved a player that wanted to stay with the Blues to obtain Judd. The Demons basically forced their captain into retirement so they could play their youth, yet supporters are fine with the club doing these things.

Yet when a player decides to set himself up in a career that I think on average only lasts 4 years, everyone wants to blast that player.
I HOPE this does not happen but if Scully had a major knee injury in his 4th year and that ended his football career, then where is his earning potential then? GONE.

McLean donated money to your club to help it survive and you traded him away, yet that is also fine? I think it is strange that players MUST show loyality, but clubs are allowed to do what they want.

 

[Hannabal]

You are delusional. So if you are a professional tennis player or golfer, I gather that you would only play in the local events rather than chasing the money overseas?

That's a very poor and ill thought analogy.

Footballers belong to a club. They thrive in a team environment. They have allegiances to teammates and want to share success with those teammates.

Golf and tennis are individual sports with no such allegiances, or sense of belonging.

I doubt there'd be many AFL players that said their no.1 focus was their remuneration. Of course it's a significant consideration, but I doubt it would top the list of priorities.

 

[DaveyTrainxpress]

Just on a few points.

If Carlton losses a player to GWS, I will be pissed off.
If Scully has agreed in principle to sign with the GWS, he will do what Ablett did and announce the deal at the end of the season.
I still remember Mundy and Pavlich last year, they did not sign until very late in the season, imagine if the Dockers decided to drop them to the VFL for not signing before the season ended. I can tell you now that the Dockers would not have those two players this season.

GWS and GC are going to cause short to medium term pain to the AFL and certain teams, but if it all works out, the WHOLE AFL will benefit from their expansion.

Obviously you don't want to be the team that gets your players poached.

Carlton basically moved a player that wanted to stay with the Blues to obtain Judd. The Demons basically forced their captain into retirement so they could play their youth, yet supporters are fine with the club doing these things.

Yet when a player decides to set himself up in a career that I think on average only lasts 4 years, everyone wants to blast that player.
I HOPE this does not happen but if Scully had a major knee injury in his 4th year and that ended his football career, then where is his earning potential then? GONE.

McLean donated money to your club to help it survive and you traded him away, yet that is also fine? I think it is strange that players MUST show loyality, but clubs are allowed to do what they want.

I don't know what you're tripping on mate but not all Melbourne supporters were happy to get rid of McDonald, I think he should have went one more tbh.

As for McLean he asked to be traded and we tried to convince him to stay so clearly McLean did not show loyality.

 

[w00dy]

I still remember Mundy and Pavlich last year, they did not sign until very late in the season, imagine if the Dockers decided to drop them to the VFL for not signing before the season ended. I can tell you now that the Dockers would not have those two players this season.

McLean donated money to your club to help it survive and you traded him away, yet that is also fine? I think it is strange that players MUST show loyality, but clubs are allowed to do what they want.

A couple of differences here though... Firstly, Pavlich, Mundy and McLean had all given their clubs between good and unbelievable service... They had made major contributions to their club, very much like Ablett...

The thing with Scully is that his contribution is yet to come, he's played one season with us, we've invested the number one draft selection in him, and to only get 2 years of service... Freo even got more out of Clive Waterhouse...

If this were the likes of Colin Sylvia or Aaron Davey, I would still be very disappointed, but I wouldn't have that sick feeling sitting in my stomach that I have right now, that I've been (or am going to be) completely ripped off...

 

[Kickett Punches Read]

i tend to disagree with the "he will be sacrificing premierships for money" argument..... look at the concessions both GC17 and GWS are getting, those two teams should share 6 premierships between them as of 2015 onwards

 

[Hannabal]

The Demons basically forced their captain into retirement so they could play their youth, yet supporters are fine with the club doing these things.

Yet when a player decides to set himself up in a career that I think on average only lasts 4 years, everyone wants to blast that player.
I HOPE this does not happen but if Scully had a major knee injury in his 4th year and that ended his football career, then where is his earning potential then? GONE.

MacDonald was 34, so of course supporters understood the club's position. The club's best interests should always be put before any individual.

Young players can chase money, but they'll be remembered for those actions. If they're prepared to cast aside allegiances with their club, supporters, and their own teammates they'll pay a price for chasing that pot of gold. It's up to them if they think it's worth it.

As for a career ending injury in year 4 ? One doesn't tend to make important life decisions based on the liklihood that grave and unforeseen circumstances are but moments away. Do you ?

 

[bulli]

Just on a few points.

McLean donated money to your club to help it survive and you traded him away, yet that is also fine?

I thought that it was pretty much McLeans's decision to leave the club at the time??

 

[jimmyclean]

You do realise Jack Watts did the exact same thing and put off contract negotiations until the end of last season?

Yep, except Watts wasn't touted as the best youngster in the AFL at the time (He played half the season at Casey). Just look at all the conjecture about his performance on this board.

GWS has stated that they aren't intending to being peaking for a few years after they enter the competition, which is why the young recruits are the ones clubs are most worried about.

GC was stealing the present through poaching players and gifted the future through the draft.

GWS is stealing the future through poaching players and is being gifted the future through the draft.

 

[jimmyclean]

I still remember Mundy and Pavlich last year, they did not sign until very late in the season, imagine if the Dockers decided to drop them to the VFL for not signing before the season ended. I can tell you now that the Dockers would not have those two players this season.

Yeah but because you found a few players who didn't sign and didn't go to the GC that doesn't mean the majority followed suit.

The difference between now and then is clubs/supporters felt screwed over by the players who signed and said nothing last year. People can now see the writing on the wall and won't accept it twice.

Fool me once, shame on me, fool me twice, shame on you.

 

[LemmingMaster]

As for a career ending injury in year 4 ? One doesn't tend to make important life decisions based on the liklihood that grave and unforeseen circumstances are but moments away. Do you ?

If we're talking about the difference between $400,000 and $600,000, I would understand that you would not make decisions based on a worst case scenario.

We're talking about potentially a vast gulf in the ability of GWS to pay Scully insane amounts of money. Scully is looking at earning potentially 6-8 years worth of income in his first year. That would be seriously tough for the young kid.

I think the main problems should be "potentially" directed at the AFL.

Maybe there should be an adjustment to the rules, if a player is selected within X years of being drafted an identical selection will be given to the club affected.

This would potentially allow Melbourne to obtain a first round pick. Personally at the end of the day, Melbourne would prefer to keep Scully as he is a gun. They would be at least compensated for their loss with a pick at the same level, only two years of development lost. (not much you can really do about this)

I just think it is not Scully that you should be angry at, it is the AFL and their potential handling of the introduction of the two new teams.

As for my McLean statement, if it is actually true that he requested a trade and was not given a push out the door due to whatever reasons, then I am sorry for my statement.

 

[whelan=legend]

As for my McLean statement, if it is actually true that he requested a trade and was not given a push out the door due to whatever reasons, then I am sorry for my statement.

Weird that you would be making such statements clearly with out knowing the full story...

http://www.afl.com.au/tabid/208/default.aspx?newsid=85230
"McLean met with Melbourne officials on Monday and informed them of his request to be traded from the club."

Seems like the rest of your argument TBH. Scully won't be going anywhere, it will be fun to bump these threads and laugh at all you people that have blatantly over reacted

 

[MightyHawks]

do you even know sheedy???? mckenna has some class, he would never stir up trouble

sheedy on the other hand thrives for it, my statement was specific to sheedy

also gws can't 'sign' anyone untill the end of the season, so that's a lie

and i can't recall him saying that, ever??

maybe i'm wrong, or selective memory or blah blah

No they can't "sign" anyone, but they can do a heads of agreement with them.

Don't you think it's strange that Scully's management have said they haven't spoken to GWS? Now I don't believe that for a second.

Surely there's only four alternatives here.

1. GWS have contacted Scully's manager, and Scully's manager has told GWS that Scully is concentrating on playing for Melbourne this year and has no interest in playing for GWS.

2. GWS have contacted Scully's manager, and Scully's manager have told GWS that Scully is concentrating on playing for Melbourne this year and will look at contracts at the end of the year.

3. GWS have contacted Scully's manager, and a heads of agreement has been signed with Scully. Maybe Scully's manager has signed a deal with a 3rd party who in turn has signed one with GWS to ensure complete deniability.

4. GWS have NOT contacted Scully's manager at all.

Option 1 is pretty unlikely, can't see why Scully's manager would knock back interest from GWS point blank.

Option 2 seems quite plausible, but if it's the case then the Statement released yesterday is completely false.

Option 3 is completely plausible.

Option 4 is completely unbelievable. Does anyone think GWS haven't tried to talk to Scully's manager?

Which option seems the most likely to you?

 

[LemmingMaster]

Weird that you would be making such statements clearly with out knowing the full story...

http://www.afl.com.au/tabid/208/default.aspx?newsid=85230
"McLean met with Melbourne officials on Monday and informed them of his request to be traded from the club."

Seems like the rest of your argument TBH. Scully won't be going anywhere, it will be fun to bump these threads and laugh at all you people that have blatantly over reacted

Maybe something like this potentially occurred?

Melbourne offer McLean a $200,000 per year contract, McLean asks to be traded.

Maybe Scully is doing this?

Scully asks for $3,000,000 from Melbourne, Melbourne offers $400,000, Scully basically gets traded away without asking because the GWS are allowed to take players without the need for a trade...

Unless you know the full reasons why McLean left the club, how can you say you know the FULL STORY?

Anyway, like you stated, I hope you can bump this thread and tell other Melbourne supporters that they overacted.

 

[dee64]

That's a very poor and ill thought analogy.

Footballers belong to a club. They thrive in a team environment. They have allegiances to teammates and want to share success with those teammates.

Golf and tennis are individual sports with no such allegiances, or sense of belonging.

I doubt there'd be many AFL players that said their no.1 focus was their remuneration. Of course it's a significant consideration, but I doubt it would top the list of priorities.

You've taken my comment out of context. My comment was in response to this suggestion that Scully would have "no connection to real life" if he set up his home in Sydney and plays for West Sydney.

And players have an allegiance to their teammates at the time, not for their whole career.

If you heard Joel MacDonald on SEN this morning, without specifically talking about Scully, teammates would not begrudge anyone leaving the club for a better deal, because they understand the feeble nature of loyalty of AFL clubs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ando727
There is plenty of doubt. I would much rather stay in Melbourne on an already VERY comfortable income and with my friends and family than move to Western Sydney and play with people I don't even know for twice the money. It's not worth it to set up a home with no connection to your real life, just because a financial opportunity exists.

 

[cannons]

I don't find it strange that a player agent is concealing the truth, they tend to do that in order to protect the interests of their client and prevent a media blow-up surrounding certain issues.

That statement is most likely as truthful as all of the rumour and speculation surrounding Scully's potential move to GWS.

 

[Crimson Azure]

I wonder if they will use Scully to call up members from 2010 wh haven't renewed their memberships for 2011 yet? Might not be the best idea.

Heres how I see the convo:

Tom: "Hi its Tom Scully from the MFC calling you about your membership, we have noticed you haven't renewed for 2011."

Member: "Well i've noticed you haven't committed to the club either, give me a call back when you do or pass the phone to Brad Green."

Tom: "Ummmm........... can I....... will you............ Brad, someone wants to talk to you!"

 

[Rojik of the Arctic]

Which option seems the most likely to you?

That the manager has at least fished the waters to see what is on offer around the traps. I'd sack my manager on the spot if he didn't do that even if I had no interest in leaving.