Is Buckley A Good Coach?

[jathanas]

The senior coach is an important club figure and a legitimate topic of discussion. It's fair to do so and everyone has a right to express their view.

The mod team observed that the thread was dominated by a few protagonists and their points were repeated i.e. 8 years of regression vs marked improvement in 17,18 etc Pretty much everyone with a strong opinion has already expressed it here.

What further degraded discussion was the simplistic "sack FIGJAM" or "he's a legend" type posts.

This thread will remain open. If your view has slightly shifted or you have new thoughts please share. In an effort to encourage quality discussion repetitive statements and circular arguments will from now on be deleted as will silly posts suggesting that we sack a coach on match-day.

FYI Gone Critical Anzacday Maggie5

 

[HeadInTheSand]

We have a below standard team at the moment. We’d be getting the same results with any coach.

Any team that contains Pendlebury, Moore, Degoey, Grundy, Sidearse, Maynard, Mihocek, Crisp and Daicos is not a below standard team.

It's a helluva lot better than one containing Fox, McInerny, Rowbottom, Blakely, Wicks, Mclean, Dawson and Warner, who have all played less than 50 games - 5 of them have played less than 20 - and Hickey, who has played 105 games in ten years at four different clubs.


It is quite clearly a coaching issue.

 

[neilk]

One of the most common game outcomes in the last couple of years is one where Collingwood come out on fire and kick 4 or 5 goals in the first quarter and have a handy lead. The opposition work out what needs to be done and pass on those instructions at quarter-time and we struggle to score for the next 3 quarters. The opposition starts scoring and either get up and win or, on a couple of occasions, just fall short. We don't seem to be able to change the game plan on-the-fly to react to the opposition's new tactics. For me, that seems to indicate poor match-day coaching, but just IMO.

 

[Doc1763]

Fact 1 - is irrelevant because in one year we climbed from 13 th to 2nd and stayed in the 8.
So by offering this evidence you are simply saying a slower climb up the ladder (that would have improved your metric ) is the sign of a better Coach - no ones buying that argument.

Fact 2 - so what?
How does that prove Buckley can’t Coach, or capable of winning a flag, given his excellent record in that last 3 season and Coach of the Year award.

Doc - as I told you last night I can walk and chew gum at the same time.

ie - I can see the need for change but will not fall for the BS offered, that Buckley can’t Coach, based on irrelevant data like that offered above.

If you offered that to a potential Coaching selection panel - they would laugh you out of the room.

You haven't proved that at all, in fact, your inane arguments would strongly suggest otherwise.

I don't need to offer anything to a potential coaching panel - they can see the irrefutable, undeniable, un-spinnable facts for themselves.

Keep spinning (and maybe spit out the gum before you trip over again).

 

[slugger01]

You haven’t debunked anything, not even close. You really do have a severely overinflated opinion of your own self-importance.

Here are the irrefutable, undeniable, un-spinnable facts:

Fact #1

After Home & Away Games

2012 – 4th & 16 wins, down from 1st & 20 wins the previous season

2013 – 6th & 14 wins, down from 4th & 16 wins the previous season

2014 – 11th & 11 wins, down from 6th & 14 wins the previous season

2015 – 12th & 10 wins, down from 11th & 11 wins the previous season

2016 – 12th & 9 wins, down from 12th & 10 wins the previous season

2017 – 13th & 9 wins, down from 12th & 9 wins the previous season

2018 – 3rd & 15 wins, up from 13th & 9 wins the previous season (finally!!)

2019 – 4th & 15 wins, down from 3rd & 15 wins the previous season

2020 – 8th & 9 wins, down from 4th & 15 wins the previous season (Covid affected)

2021 – well, we all know where that is going to end.

Fact #2

Buckley has now coached 214 games for 0 Flags – That is the 11th most games coached in VFL/AFL history without ever winning a flag. If he somehow survives until the end of the season, he will be 8th on that illustrious list – he will be 2nd for most games coached at one club without ever winning a flag.

I imagine after he is gone, and we have all been put out of our misery, you’ll still be forlornly trying to spin the irrefutable, undeniable, un-spinnable facts in an attempt to change history, and failing miserably again like you have so far.

But by all means keep trying, this is fun.

I want Buckley to break more records.. sign him up for as many years as it takes to be no.1 on all your measures...
A 5 year extension should cover it, shouldn’t it? By that time, we might start talking about salary cap room for free agents, since the $7m contract might be coming to an end???

 

[Doc1763]

One of the most common game outcomes in the last couple of years is one where Collingwood come out on fire and kick 4 or 5 goals in the first quarter and have a handy lead. The opposition work out what needs to be done and pass on those instructions at quarter-time and we struggle to score for the next 3 quarters. The opposition starts scoring and either get up and win or, on a couple of occasions, just fall short. We don't seem to be able to change the game plan on-the-fly to react to the opposition's new tactics. For me, that seems to indicate poor match-day coaching, but just IMO.

Buckley just sits there looking stunned, wondering how the opposition coach worked out his brilliant game plan so quickly.

 

[NMBB]

One of the most common game outcomes in the last couple of years is one where Collingwood come out on fire and kick 4 or 5 goals in the first quarter and have a handy lead. The opposition work out what needs to be done and pass on those instructions at quarter-time and we struggle to score for the next 3 quarters. The opposition starts scoring and either get up and win or, on a couple of occasions, just fall short. We don't seem to be able to change the game plan on-the-fly to react to the opposition's new tactics. For me, that seems to indicate poor match-day coaching, but just IMO.

this

 

[Doc1763]

I want Buckley to break more records.. sign him up for as many years as it takes to be no.1 on all your measures...
A 5 year extension should cover it, shouldn’t it? By that time, we might start talking about salary cap room for free agents, since the $7m contract might be coming to an end???

Unfortunately, it will take about another 7 seasons for him to get past Eade, you know, the genius we got in to mentor Flagless Nathan.

 

[Carringbush2010]

I place the blame firmly and squarely on the list management and recruitment (specifically trading more than drafting) departments, it's their responsibility. They made the wrong call constantly topping up to win that flag, every salary cap blunder came from that! and the dearth of players at the moment is because instead of letting Hine find value at the draft we threw those picks and gobs of dollars at aging injury riddled players in the hope they'd tip 2018/19 our way. It was the wrong call on so many levels, Hine is a master of picking up quality with later picks so we were robbed of youth coming through and his odd instant hit that may have actually tipped 2018/19 our way (WA umpires not paying a block they pay every week notwithstanding)

Yep, and whose fault was it allowing all that to happen? The footy boss? And why did the board oversee it all and just let it happen?

To add there is no known universe we are as bad as we are currently showing, we are a much better team than bottom 4 - even with what we've got. That is not fault of list management and recruitment.

 

[slugger01]

Unfortunately, it will take about another 7 seasons for him to get past Eade, you know, the genius we got in to mentor Flagless Nathan.

Great. Sign him up...

 

[No SPIN]

You haven't proved that at all, in fact, your inane arguments would strongly suggest otherwise.

I don't need to offer anything to a potential coaching panel - they can see the irrefutable, undeniable, un-spinnable facts for themselves.

Keep spinning (and maybe spit out the gum before you trip over again).

what inane arguments are you referring to?

 

[NMBB]

You haven't proved that at all, in fact, your inane arguments would strongly suggest otherwise.

I don't need to offer anything to a potential coaching panel - they can see the irrefutable, undeniable, un-spinnable facts for themselves.

Keep spinning (and maybe spit out the gum before you trip over again).

lots of things get called inane (or similar) here - welcome to the Melbourne Comedy Festival part 2.

.... with or without that terrible trend line..., allow me to introduce ...................... THE FACTS - updated!!

 

[Doc1763]

what inane arguments are you referring to?

Pretty much any of you posts on this subject.

Unlike you, I've got better things to do that quote a post number at someone.

Keep spinning, you'll be pretty dizzy soon.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Doesn't matter who is coaching us atm. We are a team of very very average players. Buckley is trying to cut Jarrah with a Butter Knife.

After 10 years as coach, Buckley is as much to blame for the list problems, the type of players we have recruited and the type which we haven't recruited as anyone else at the club. I don't understand why people separate coach and player list as though Buckley can just wash his hands of the recruiting errors that have plagued this club for 10 years.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

Childish

Why childish? Seemed a perfectly reasonable suggestion to me.

 

[TheGreatGrundy]

The euphoria of defeat is well and truly back!

Get used to it. It will be with us for a long time.

 

[Doc1763]

lots of things get called inane (or similar) here - welcome to the Melbourne Comedy Festival part 2.

.... with or without that terrible trend line..., allow me to introduce ...................... THE FACTS - updated!!

View attachment 1129029

irrefutable, undeniable, un-spinnable

 

[jmac70]

ok - does today's ladder make Buckley look better than Clarkson...??

does today's ladder reflect where Cwood sit? - Yes - because what other measure is there?

has Clarkson racked up more success than Buckley? - the stats will tell you.

Yep, you missed the point.

 

[jmac70]

Get used to it. It will be with us for a long time.

This, I agree with.

 

[jmac70]

Any team that contains Pendlebury, Moore, Degoey, Grundy, Sidearse, Maynard, Mihocek, Crisp and Daicos is not a below standard team.

It's a helluva lot better than one containing Fox, McInerny, Rowbottom, Blakely, Wicks, Mclean, Dawson and Warner, who have all played less than 50 games - 5 of them have played less than 20 - and Hickey, who has played 105 games in ten years at four different clubs.


It is quite clearly a coaching issue.

Nine out of the 22 is not going to be enough to win many games.

 

[Doc1763]

This, I agree with.

So, you finally agree that we are going to be putrid for a long time?

 

[NMBB]

irrefutable, undeniable, un-spinnable

absolutely proved by 234 posts as all reasonable, logical, sound people (who agree with me) have already acknowledged

 

[jmac70]

So, you finally agree that we are going to be putrid for a long time?

That’s what normally happens when a club rebuilds. Hopefully not too long in the cellar.

 

[No SPIN]

Pretty much any of you posts on this subject.

Unlike you, I've got better things to do that quote a post number at someone.

Keep spinning, you'll be pretty dizzy soon.

As I thought just unfounded accusations - but that’s cool.
You’re here for quips and witticisms, and there’s nothing wrong with that preference for levity, over substance.

 

[Carringbush2010]

That’s what normally happens when a club rebuilds. Hopefully not too long in the cellar.

And we shouldn't need to be rebuilding in the first place. Now we gotta hope and pray the blose, bombouts and tigs don't succeed in the meantime.

 

[Doc1763]

That’s what normally happens when a club rebuilds. Hopefully not too long in the cellar.

You just agreed we'll be there for a long time.