Opinion Is this rock bottom?

[ferball]

Waiting for Ferb's and Greezy to remind me I'm wrong in slamming our list management.

You're wrong.

 

[Themanbun]

It's a ****ing abomination.

Let's add another mid at pick 1/2 anyway. Its the Norf way.

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Unfortunately we might have to because our midfield is still shit. How, I don't know. But it is.

 

[ferball]

Scotty, since we drafted LDU name me two seasons in a row where we've had something like stability in the footy side's coaching staff.

 

[DANMAN]

We are rock bottom . Make no mistake about it . 10 players today are not AFL standard

 

[Spud11]

Drafting and development - equally poor.
You come to Norf to have zero success, zero development, zero realisation of potential.
But hey, they’ll all see each other’s smiling faces at the 20 year reunion of almost beating Collingwood.

 

[ToxicMegaPunts]

 

[archereleven]

Unfortunately we might have to because our midfield is still shit. How, I don't know. But it is.

Our midfield is shit because we have a 100 gamer surrounded by 30 gamers.
Adding a 0 gamer will do nothing.

We need a 200 gamer to organise and coach. We need kpfs to kick to. We need small fwds that can lock the ball inside f50. We need depth.

Our mids are on a hiding to nothing. They win the clearance, it trampolines out of our f50, and they are chasing tail. Rinse and repeat.

Our list composition is totally ****ed.

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[scottywiper]

Scotty, since we drafted LDU name me two seasons in a row where we've had something like stability in the footy side's coaching staff.

Keep finding excuses. We appointed Shaw, we appointed Noble. Clarko last year not of our doing.
But we have for the most part made our own bed.

 

[ferball]

Our midfield is shit because we have a 100 gamer surrounded by 30 gamers.
Adding a 0 gamer will do nothing.

We need a 200 gamer to organise and coach. We need kpfs to kick to. We need small fwds that can lock the ball inside f50. We need depth.

Our mids are on a hiding to nothing. They win the clearance, it trampolines out of our f50, and they are chasing tail. Rinse and repeat.

Our list composition is totally ****ed.

On SM-G991B using BigFooty.com mobile app

We had four players 27 or over. They were Tucker, McDonald, Corr and Shiels who just retired. One of them has been there more than five years. Two of them more than three years.

Hawthorn had Hardwick, Amon, Impey, Sicily, Frost, Gunstan and Breust. With the exception of Amon all of those players have been there playing together since we drafted LDU. Two of them won flags and the rest spent time with players who played in those same flag sides for their entire early careers. Except Impey who was 23 when he got there.

That's actual experience and leadership. We have none of that.

They've also had two coaches in 20 years.

We had two last year and a different two the year before.

So on top of that leadership and experience they have relatively stable processes and systems they can fall back on when they don't know how to react to a situation.

We have none of that either.

Our list composition is totally ****ed.

This is true, but not the way you think it is. Its the demographics (ie the age) of the players on the list. Even Hawthorn, who are one of the other youngest, least experienced sides in the comp had nearly twice as many older experienced players who had been at the club for years and understood how to react and respond.

And despite what scottywiper thinks this isn't Rawlings' fault because even if he'd fixed that demographic hole with his list building since he got here those players would have had no exposure to a consistent system.

We've had six coaching changes in that time and three separate coaching regimes. Whereas Hawthorn's current coach was assistant to their old coach for three years then coached their VFL side for a couple before becoming senior coach three seasons ago.

I know no one wants to hear this cos there's no simple solutions, obvious scapegoats or quick ways to fix it.

But that is where we are at and why situations like today happen.

The only way to fix it is to keep as many of these players together for as long as we can while we work on the same systems and slowly turn over the worst of our players. That's it.

I went to the game today, was late and I'm pretty sure I got done by a speed camera on the way. I sat in the rain and watched that shit surrounded by fu<kwit Hawthorn supporters and on the way out some stupid copper looked at me funny. If my kid wasn't with me I'd have punched the campaigner repeatedly if I wasn't already locked up for going one of the fu<kwit Hawthorn supporters. That's how ****en angry I was. Its the worst game I've been to since r16 1982.

But now that i've calmed down its alot easier to see where we are at and why.

 

[ferball]

Keep finding excuses. We appointed Shaw, we appointed Noble. Clarko last year not of our doing.
But we have for the most part made our own bed.

They're not excuses. Its the reality of the situation. And yes this is the bed we made.

But the only thing that will fix it is time and stability. Not one or the other. Blaming Rawlings for the list is missing the point.

Brad Scott nearly made a GF with some talented players, some hard working role players and FA coaching ability. Because he had five years of stability and a consistent system they worked with.

 

[archereleven]

We had four players 27 or over. They were Tucker, McDonald, Corr and Shiels who just retired. One of them has been there more than five years. Two of them more than three years.

Hawthorn had Hardwick, Amon, Impey, Sicily, Frost, Gunstan and Breust. With the exception of Amon all of those players have been there playing together since we drafted LDU. Two of them won flags and the rest spent time with players who played in those same flag sides for their entire early careers. Except Impey who was 23 when he got there.

That's actual experience and leadership. We have none of that.

They've also had two coaches in 20 years.

We had two last year and a different two the year before.

So on top of that leadership and experience they have relatively stable processes and systems they can fall back on when they don't know how to react to a situation.

We have none of that either.

Our list composition is totally ****ed.

This is true, but not the way you think it is. Its the demographics (ie the age) of the players on the list. Even Hawthorn, who are one of the other youngest, least experienced sides in the comp had nearly twice as many older experienced players who had been at the club for years and understood how to react and respond.

And despite what scottywiper thinks this isn't Rawlings' fault because even if he'd fixed that demographic hole with his list building since he got here those players would have had no exposure to a consistent system.

We've had six coaching changes in that time and three separate coaching regimes. Whereas Hawthorn's current coach was assistant to their old coach for three years then coached their VFL side for a couple before becoming senior coach three seasons ago.

I know no one wants to hear this cos there's no simple solutions, obvious scapegoats or quick ways to fix it.

But that is where we are at and why situations like today happen.

The only way to fix it is to keep as many of these players together for as long as we can while we work on the same systems and slowly turn over the worst of our players. That's it.

I went to the game today, was late and I'm pretty sure I got done by a speed camera on the way. I sat in the rain and watched that shit surrounded by fu
But now that i've calmed down its alot easier to see where we are at and why.

The list composition isn't ****ed on demographics alone mate. We have trash and treasure kpps we found on the hard rubbish pile all over the field and 1 small fwd. Most teams have 4+ smalls pressuring i50.

You cannot have a kpf, a ruck/kpf, and 4 mediums in your f50, and expect ball retention.

I've been saying it for a while now, we need to lift our age profile for at least a couple of seasons to aid development. 2 kpp and a mid would be a start.

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[Zondor]

Simpkin, Larkey, Zurhaar, Pink, Dawson, Fisher all 26 years old. LDU and Xerri 25. The truth is staring you in the face. :stern look

 

[Ball Dont Lie]

Are we 100% certain the AFL isn’t intervening because this is the best outcome for relocating? No sporting organisation in the world is this bad. certainly not one with a salary cap and draft system. We are making it very easy to move us given the apathy in the supporter base atm.

 

[Gasometer]

Are we 100% certain the AFL isn’t intervening because this is the best outcome for relocating? No sporting organisation in the world is this bad. certainly not one with a salary cap and draft system. We are making it very easy to move us given the apathy in the supporter base atm.

AFL supporters in general or Nmfc supporters?

 

[HTPunter]

Simpkin, Larkey, Zurhaar, Pink, Dawson, Fisher all 26 years old. LDU and Xerri 25. The truth is staring you in the face. :stern look

Yeah but they’re not 27! Which is the magic age when you want to make an argument to suit yourself ferball

 

[4cunningTonneTruck]

There is nothing, and I mean nothing, to justify the putrid effort the players put in, and how bad we have been for how long. Light a match and burn the place to the ground. The club will not be able to attract any talent that could help improve, and will downward spiral until they fold. Good riddance.

 

[hilly]

Scotty, since we drafted LDU name me two seasons in a row where we've had something like stability in the footy side's coaching staff.

Let me tell you something Ferbs. We could delist half the list and be no worse off.

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[ferball]

Let me tell you something Ferbs. We could delist half the list and be no worse off.

On SM-S901E using BigFooty.com mobile app

Maybe but if the same list stayed together for the next two preseasons they'd be an unrecognisably better side as well.

 

[hilly]

We had four players 27 or over. They were Tucker, McDonald, Corr and Shiels who just retired. One of them has been there more than five years. Two of them more than three years.

Hawthorn had Hardwick, Amon, Impey, Sicily, Frost, Gunstan and Breust. With the exception of Amon all of those players have been there playing together since we drafted LDU. Two of them won flags and the rest spent time with players who played in those same flag sides for their entire early careers. Except Impey who was 23 when he got there.

That's actual experience and leadership. We have none of that.

They've also had two coaches in 20 years.

We had two last year and a different two the year before.

So on top of that leadership and experience they have relatively stable processes and systems they can fall back on when they don't know how to react to a situation.

We have none of that either.

Our list composition is totally ****ed.

This is true, but not the way you think it is. Its the demographics (ie the age) of the players on the list. Even Hawthorn, who are one of the other youngest, least experienced sides in the comp had nearly twice as many older experienced players who had been at the club for years and understood how to react and respond.

And despite what scottywiper thinks this isn't Rawlings' fault because even if he'd fixed that demographic hole with his list building since he got here those players would have had no exposure to a consistent system.

We've had six coaching changes in that time and three separate coaching regimes. Whereas Hawthorn's current coach was assistant to their old coach for three years then coached their VFL side for a couple before becoming senior coach three seasons ago.

I know no one wants to hear this cos there's no simple solutions, obvious scapegoats or quick ways to fix it.

But that is where we are at and why situations like today happen.

The only way to fix it is to keep as many of these players together for as long as we can while we work on the same systems and slowly turn over the worst of our players. That's it.

I went to the game today, was late and I'm pretty sure I got done by a speed camera on the way. I sat in the rain and watched that shit surrounded by fu
But now that i've calmed down its alot easier to see where we are at and why.

If the current list manager is unable to add talent outside of the very early picks we get for being sh1thouse then he should ship off.

On SM-S901E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[HTPunter]

I’m ****ing sick of being shit. Even before we were bottom 2 for 5 years shit we weren’t great. And then we are spectacularly shit.

And those of us who see the results staring us in the face as proof that the club is shit from top to bottom and ran by shit people have to listen to one eyed floggers who get into fights at the footy over some hAwkS mUpPetS cheering on their own sides saying no, it’s not Brady’s fault, he’s good at his job!!

Yeah maybe if the problem is lack of 27 year olds (even though we have plenty of 26 year olds) you don’t go get Dylan Stephens

15

Dylan Stephens

Age

23

Ht

184cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.3

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

3.3

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.7

4star

CL

0.0

1star

D

10.3

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

3.3

2star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.7

3star

CL

0.0

1star

D

10.3

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

3.3

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

1.7

4star

CL

0.0

1star

who is a soft outside wing type with your priority gift. I’d rather have let it go by the wayside so no one benefited rather than pissing it against the wall on that kind of softness. And to double up on that, we played McKercher our top pick in a similar role that Stephens might be suited to, AND we spent our other gift pick on Fisher, to also play an unaccountable outside soft flanker role. Why on earth did we put so much into the LEAST effective role in footy in terms of winning games? PLUS it took Half a season to move Harry ****ing Sheezel out of that same ****ing role. **** **** ****. Not 1 of McKercher, Fisher, Stephens were going to be difference makers in that half back role if Sheezel wasn’t. We were copping hefty losses with Sheezel playing that role! So we went and got 3 more!! I get the McKercher is wading into senior footy rather than being Thrown in the deep end aspect - ok cool, but why Fisher AND Stephens? Oh and we trialled Stephenson back there! Everyone is a ****ing half back flanker! Tucker & Scott can do it too! ****.

Stupid list management. Stupid coaching. Indefensible. Yet it is defended. Because wE aRe iNeXpErieNcED and yOuF. **** off. We’ve been inexperienced and young for 5 years now. Next year it’ll be Goater, Bergman, Duursma, W.Dawson into the side, and 4 others will be out and so again we will be inexperienced and come round 24 2025 it’ll be “wait for 2026, we are coming good, it takes time” as we will have Hardeman, the 2024 top draft pick & George to come in or some shit. ****. It never ends. Rock bottom never ends. And we have people lecturing us that actually we will be quite good; just wait and see.

League low percentage in the end because Richmond cared enough to show up in rounds 23 & 24. We didn’t. No respect. No pride. What’s another 220 points in losses over 2 rounds when you’re 15-100 over the past 5 years.

 

[ferball]

Simpkin, Larkey, Zurhaar, Pink, Dawson, Fisher all 26 years old. LDU and Xerri 25. The truth is staring you in the face. :stern look

Yeah exactly.

At any side with reasonable levels of experience they wouldn't be considered senior players yet. They'd be in the middle age group and still learning from the senior players. Instead they're sposed to lead the way when none of them have any experience of how to do that in a settled side where everything isn't lurching from one crisis to another.

Pink and Dawson are basically rookies considering how little AFL footy they've played as well.

 

[HTPunter]

this could genuinely kill the club. How long can members keep signing up for? How long can members turn up for? The Tassie money is shortly drying up. I don’t even know if we will have a bandwagon available if we eventually get good - rusted on supporters won’t just drift away to come back when we’re good, they’ll be gone.

Clarkson is currently in my eyes Malthouse at the Blues and I haven’t seen anything to change that.

 

[HTPunter]

Yeah exactly.

At any side with reasonable levels of experience they wouldn't be considered senior players yet. They'd be in the middle age group and still learning from the senior players. Instead they're sposed to lead the way when none of them have any experience of how to do that in a settled side where everything isn't lurching from one crisis to another.

Pink and Dawson are basically rookies considering how little AFL footy they've played as well.

Simpkin 151 games

Yep not a senior player

**** sake

 

[Zondor]

Yeah exactly.

At any side with reasonable levels of experience they wouldn't be considered senior players yet. They'd be in the middle age group and still learning from the senior players. Instead they're sposed to lead the way when none of them have any experience of how to do that in a settled side where everything isn't lurching from one crisis to another.

Pink and Dawson are basically rookies considering how little AFL footy they've played as well.

Yah love an excuse. Stop it with the excuses. We lost by 124 points today. The truth is staring you in the face. The list is a shambles and it’s the canvas that Rawling has painted. Bottom Line. :stern look

 

[smauge]

I thought we were at rock bottom a couple of years ago, but here we are. It’s frustrating watching a team that can't seem to get the basics right or gel together. I’ve seen teams turn it around before when they finally click, but it can take a while and sometimes gets worse before it gets better. Just hoping we see some positive changes soon and that things start to come together.