Jacinta Allan - Leading a zombie government

[Saint]

All these things indicate the anticipated population increase can be accommodated in a similar metro area footprint

There will be teething issues. But the things you say absolutely have to go better than 90% optimal

Yes, the population could be accommodated in a metro area by condensing people into these new urban centres. But does anyone actually want to move there in the numbers they're suggesting?

Considering how Docklands is going, I'm not sure.

People have been talking about reducing urban sprawl since the 60's. The Freeway plans of the 70's were also predicated on creating a multi-centric city, and it didn't happen. What makes anyone think this $30bn investment will make it happen?

 

[peetoo]

Yes, the population could be accommodated in a metro area by condensing people into these new urban centres. But does anyone actually want to move there in the numbers they're suggesting?

Considering how Docklands is going, I'm not sure.

People have been talking about reducing urban sprawl since the 60's. The Freeway plans of the 70's were also predicated on creating a multi-centric city, and it didn't happen. What makes anyone think this $30bn investment will make it happen?

There is a credibility gap for sure. But those opposed to it seem certain the stations will be surrounded by box hill type hi rise

It’s one of the scare tactics used

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Considering how Docklands is going, I'm not sure.

Docklands is badly designed. That's its flaw.

 

[Nuggs Bunny]

Yes, the population could be accommodated in a metro area by condensing people into these new urban centres. But does anyone actually want to move there in the numbers they're suggesting?

Considering how Docklands is going, I'm not sure.

People have been talking about reducing urban sprawl since the 60's. The Freeway plans of the 70's were also predicated on creating a multi-centric city, and it didn't happen. What makes anyone think this $30bn investment will make it happen?

You could ask the same thing about Clyde North or Kalkallo or any other pop-up suburb in Melbourne and most people would tell you they've got no intentions of living that far out of town in a 400m2 block, but people do live there because it's the only thing in their price range.

Will be the same story with Box Hill apartment buildings - nobody would live there if money was no object but given the land releases on Melbourne's fringes will end up being a fraction of what they used to be, people will buy them because they don't have anything else in their price range.

The biggest driver of urban sprawl in Melbourne are the 3-4 bedroom single family houses less than 10km from the city on 800m2 blocks. Everyone agrees that these are the nicest, most desirable places to live and yet if every house was built like these Melbourne would stretch from Warrragul to Ballarat. Something has got to give, can't keep offering up "character" as a reason to keep places like this when we're spending billions in infrastructure to connect the newer, denser suburbs 30kms out of Melbourne to the CBD.

 

[peetoo]

Docklands is badly designed. That's its flaw.

Capitalist market principles

 

[Saint]

You could ask the same thing about Clyde North or Kalkallo or any other pop-up suburb in Melbourne and most people would tell you they've got no intentions of living that far out of town in a 400m2 block, but people do live there because it's the only thing in their price range.

Will be the same story with Box Hill apartment buildings - nobody would live there if money was no object but given the land releases on Melbourne's fringes will end up being a fraction of what they used to be, people will buy them because they don't have anything else in their price range.

The biggest driver of urban sprawl in Melbourne are the 3-4 bedroom single family houses less than 10km from the city on 800m2 blocks. Everyone agrees that these are the nicest, most desirable places to live and yet if every house was built like these Melbourne would stretch from Warrragul to Ballarat. Something has got to give, can't keep offering up "character" as a reason to keep places like this when we're spending billions in infrastructure to connect the newer, denser suburbs 30kms out of Melbourne to the CBD.

The problem is that there's never been a shortage of apartments in Box Hill, Clayton or Burwood. And if you're buying an apartment, the price in Box Hill isn't going to sky-rocket because all of a sudden they can get a train to Clayton. Why wouldn't they have just bought in Clayton?

Time will tell, but, like the 70's freeway plan and favourable zoning in Clayton and Burwood and Box Hill, none of them have been able to spur demand for apartments. And I'm not sure this will either.

There are currently 590 apartments and units in Box Hill for sale. (might include surrounding suburbs, I just based it in)

https://www.realestate.com.au/buy/property-unit+apartment-in-box+hill,+vic+3128/list-1?activeSort=list-date

The point is, there's not a shortage, so enabling more to be built and greater transport links isn't going to move the needle much on anything, I don't think.

 

[Saint]

Docklands is badly designed. That's its flaw.

Have you seen where they planned the Monash station? It's on the opposite side of the Uni from the current bus interchange and where all the Uni is oriented.

I used to park in the first streets outside Monash where it was free parking and too far for most paying parkers to walk and that was closer than this station is.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Have you seen where they planned the Monash station? It's on the opposite side of the Uni from the current bus interchange and where all the Uni is oriented.

I used to park in the first streets outside Monash where it was free parking and too far for most paying parkers to walk and that was closer than this station is.

I would have put the station under the bus interchange myself.

If they played it right they could very easily broaden the catchment and use that bus interchange a lot more than they currently do.

You could do the same with Glen Waverley, Deakin Uni and Box Hill.

 

[peetoo]

I would have put the station under the bus interchange myself.

If they played it right they could very easily broaden the catchment and use that bus interchange a lot more than they currently do.

You could do the same with Glen Waverley, Deakin Uni and Box Hill.

Build in active transport infrastructure. Have the SRL rolling stock active transport friendly

I think active transport for the last mile or so is more the future than buses. Think future generations

 

[Saint]

I would have put the station under the bus interchange myself.

If they played it right they could very easily broaden the catchment and use that bus interchange a lot more than they currently do.

You could do the same with Glen Waverley, Deakin Uni and Box Hill.

Have you ever switched between the existing train and bus stations at Box Hill? You have to go through half the shopping centre, including the food court. Neither are near the tram terminus

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Have you ever switched between the existing train and bus stations at Box Hill? You have to go through half the shopping centre, including the food court. Neither are near the tram terminus

I have and it's awful.

Vicinity Centres do have a redevelopment plan for the shopping centre. There is an opportunity there to fix it.

 

[Saint]

I have and it's awful.

Vicinity Centres do have a redevelopment plan for the shopping centre. There is an opportunity there to fix it.

That's the ironic bit. They had plans for towers already. But SRL will be trying to claim credit for the increased density which was happening anyway.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

That's the ironic bit. They had plans for towers already. But SRL will be trying to claim credit for the increased density which was happening anyway.

They've made some adjustments with the SRL announcement.

They're not complaining either way

 

[peetoo]

Have you ever switched between the existing train and bus stations at Box Hill? You have to go through half the shopping centre, including the food court. Neither are near the tram terminus

The devil is most definitely in the detail.

 

[peetoo]

I have and it's awful.

Vicinity Centres do have a redevelopment plan for the shopping centre. There is an opportunity there to fix it.

Hopefully include a cycle underpass too