Traded Jordan Clark and F4 traded to Fremantle for #22 and F3 (Carl)

[CatToTheFuture]

Will either turn out to be better than Cerra or a total bust.

What if Cerra turns into a bust?

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Would think a pick the 40s gets this done. Drafted way too early in the first place and hasn't really done much since drafted.

Yeah, Nah

 

[HFF]

I think there's a bit more to it than that. If the line coach that was keeping him out is gone then is it the same scenario next year? Have a look how easily the cats were pinned in the backline after Stewart went down. A new backline coach would be very likely to be reassessing the whole defensive system, and when he does I'd be extremely surprised if Clark isn't in that backline.

Do you believe the narrative that a line coach didn’t want him and had more pull than thr senior coach about where a player will be selected to play?

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Do you believe the narrative that a line coach didn’t want him and had more pull than thr senior coach about where a player will be selected to play?

Yes. It absolutely happened.

 

[foxdog50]

I think at best Freo offer pick 27 and if Geelong don't agree to trade, they have a disgruntled player on their list for another year.

Tim Kelly says Hi.....

 

[BigCat1]

The valuation of players is starting to get out of control by Clubs.
Clark here for example...obviously not rated to be a regular in the team and obviously not rated enough to be played in his preferred position yet he is somehow still “highly rated” by the club and want premium compo return?

Makes no sense to me.

But it’s a ridiculous statement. He looked like one of the players of the draft in year one. Bad injury in year 2. Flat start to this year in new position and then injured again with the shoulder. He’s played a grand total of 5 VFL games in his life.

Freo rate him so highly that they try and get him every year and yet again are offering a 4 year contract whilst already in contract.

If value equaled games then trading would be easy. He’s a player both teams really want but thanks for your insight into “value”.

Ollie Henry only played 10 games in a team absolutely gifting kids games like a GP gives out lollipops. By that logic we should be able to snaffle him for a mid 20s pick. He gets injured next season and it’s pick 40 even when we offer him 5 years to come and join big bro.

 

[cats_09]

The valuation of players is starting to get out of control by Clubs.
Clark here for example...obviously not rated to be a regular in the team and obviously not rated enough to be played in his preferred position yet he is somehow still “highly rated” by the club and want premium compo return?

Makes no sense to me.

What about how much Fremantle rate him - they've reportedly put a 4-year deal to a contracted player which would suggest they rate Clark highly, and as such Geelong is surely within their rights to request value from the trade

It's not like Clark is out of contract with a 1-year life line offer on the table - if Fremantle rate him highly enough to offer him a 4 year deal, let's see how much they're willing to stump up at the trade table

 

[rgauci]

Tim Kelly

11

Tim Kelly

Age

30

Ht

184cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.6

5star

K

13.5

5star

HB

10.1

5star

M

3.4

3star

T

4.0

5star

CL

4.9

5star

D

19.9

5star

K

12.3

5star

HB

7.6

4star

M

3.1

3star

T

4.7

5star

CL

3.6

4star

D

21.6

5star

K

10.4

4star

HB

11.2

5star

M

2.8

3star

T

3.8

5star

CL

3.8

5star

is totally different, he was happy but his family wasn’t. He had to perform to guarantee the paycheck and ensure the clubs in WA actually wanted him.

I’m not really sure why Clark has gone backwards in the last 2 years. Some injuries, returning from Covid lockdown unfit, and perhaps not favored by a line coach.

End of 2019 he’s valued quite highly, 2 years later not so much.

Personally I think it’s slight overs for pick 27.

 

[Joose]

Quite happy to let Geelong keep Clark if they are being too unreasonable.

Putting aside all bias you cannot expect to ask a high price for a player you deem not good enough for the firsts.

His original draft pick is largely irrelevant and is not Freo's problem. I really hope the club politely decline Geelongs demand for a high 2nd rounder/low first.

 

[Art Vandelay_]

Putting aside all bias you cannot expect to ask a high price for a player you deem not good enough for the firsts.

Educate yo'self.

But it’s a ridiculous statement. He looked like one of the players of the draft in year one. Bad injury in year 2. Flat start to this year in new position and then injured again with the shoulder. He’s played a grand total of 5 VFL games in his life.

 

[HumanMeatball]

26 gets it done

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Do you believe the narrative that a line coach didn’t want him and had more pull than thr senior coach about where a player will be selected to play?

When that line coach is Scarlett yes i do.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Do you believe the narrative that a line coach didn’t want him and had more pull than thr senior coach about where a player will be selected to play?

The line coach is accountable for defensive outcomes so yes. It's not the 1980s. The senior coach will publicly back the on field coaching decisions because it's their job to do so but you have to give the line coach the independence to make their own decisions, otherwise you don't drive accountability. Undermine your line coach and you make their entire analysis and input pointless. You have to back them or sack them. It's that binary.

Specific to Clark: The fact that since his 6th game he has been played away from the backline indicates that the rest of the coaching group was fine with him.

Knights played him on the wing until he did his shoulder. Enright even played him forward. But Scarlett never saw him again post round 6 2019 iirc.

In any case, how the previous backline coach rated him is a moot point. The previous backline coach isn't there.

 

[Cobbler]

Scott won’t want him to play next year. He won’t want to finish bottom 4.
His words are inspiring for the youth trying to get a game.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Quite happy to let Geelong keep Clark if they are being too unreasonable.

Putting aside all bias you cannot expect to ask a high price for a player you deem not good enough for the firsts.

His original draft pick is largely irrelevant and is not Freo's problem. I really hope the club politely decline Geelongs demand for a high 2nd rounder/low first.

I honestly think they're just trying to get freo to go away until next year

 

[BigCat1]

Quite happy to let Geelong keep Clark if they are being too unreasonable.

Putting aside all bias you cannot expect to ask a high price for a player you deem not good enough for the firsts.

His original draft pick is largely irrelevant and is not Freo's problem. I really hope the club politely decline Geelongs demand for a high 2nd rounder/low first.

Why are you offering players 4 year deals putting all bias aside? Is Peter Bell completely incompetent? Geelong have said 27 (really 30) won’t be accepted. We accept your polite decline. Hope the price doesn’t go up like it did with Tim Kelly

As has been said at over and over. There have been reasons a 21 year old wasn’t in a complete lock in a team 2 seconds away from finishing on top. I get why it suits to make out like he’s a VFL scrubber but the actual clubs seem all over it.

I mean there’s Freo supporters comparing Clark to the SPS or Crowden.

 

[Joose]

I honestly think they're just trying to get freo to go away until next year

Smart move. They need to keep their young talent.

 

[Yeti]

Geelong should 100% hold him to his contract. Players requesting trades while in contract is getting out of hand.

 

[ubiquitous226]

I honestly think they're just trying to get freo to go away until next year

If the HS article has come from Geelong, it certainly seems so.

Hope this one breaks down if that's actually what Geelong are asking.

 

[Polo342]

27 will get it done. Geelong will want a pick around 20 but we won't have it unless we trade. Jordan Dawson

12

Jordan Dawson

Age

27

Ht

191cm

Wt

91kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.0

4star

K

11.4

4star

HB

5.7

4star

M

4.8

5star

T

2.8

4star

CL

0.6

3star

D

15.7

4star

K

10.9

4star

HB

4.9

3star

M

2.9

3star

T

2.0

3star

CL

0.4

3star

D

11.8

3star

K

7.8

3star

HB

4.0

3star

M

5.0

5star

T

3.0

5star

CL

0.6

3star

is valued at the back end of the first round or early second and he is a better player than Clark.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Do you believe the narrative that a line coach didn’t want him and had more pull than thr senior coach about where a player will be selected to play?

Anther way to put this actually. Let's imagine a completely different club.

Imagine you're Ken Hinkley going into the prelim against the Dogs. You look at your backline and you strongly feel that you're going to need Tom Clurey in the side for some reason. Also imagine your line coach is adamant that Clurey isn't up to it.

In our imaginary scenario you over rule the line coach and Clurey plays. We get the same outcome and the Dogs smash Port.

Now post match review with the coaching group. "What failed in the backline?" What do you think the line coach will say? Regardless of the actual reason the side lost, the narrative that will be pushed by your line coach is that Clurey upset the defensive mix. Given the number of independent variables in a game, you could never pin down the answer 100% even if this seems like an excuse.

So by over ruling the line coach you've now:

1. Given him an excuse for failure. He won't own his own failure
2. Undermined your own authority by pushing for a change that, on review, was seriously discussed as the reason for the loss regardless of whether its true

This is what modern organisations refer to as "pushing decision making down" and is a key part of leadership training.

 

[Moo]

Won’t get a game in Geelong’s senior team for at least another decade, I can see why he is exploring his options.

The upside is in a decades time ....he'll be in the starting 22 until his in his late 30's

 

[Pure_Ownage]

I honestly think they're just trying to get freo to go away until next year

I tend to think the same and thats what i expect to happen. It makes sense from geelongs end.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

27 will get it done. Geelong will want a pick around 20 but we won't have it unless we trade. Jordan Dawson is valued at the back end of the first round or early second and he is a better player than Clark.

Jordan dawson is uncontracted though Clark isnt and that counts for a lot. If Clark wasnt contracted youdbe right but he is.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

If the HS article has come from Geelong, it certainly seems so.

Hope this one breaks down if that's actually what Geelong are asking.

Jay Clark has very good Geelong contacts (one of the few journos i trust re geelong mail) so i doubt the club actually asked him to run the story but its 99 % likely an accurate reflection of their position on the issue.

 

[BigCat1]

The upside is in a decades time ....he'll be in the starting 22 until his in his late 30's

It’s like standing on the tee and deciding between driver, 3 wood or an iron on a 275 metre par 4 when thinking of a come-back to a Freo fan whose trying to troll your club. Using anything will do the job.