Coach Justin Longmuir Pt 2

[fnerd]

What's wrong with Horse? Seems like a decent guy. Have I missed something?

Horse would be the closest to what be seen as decent guy granted

But he’s till very prone to losing his shit in the box on the regular.

Another Quick example -was all to content to bench amartey when he had good chance to kick his 10th in a game this year
Fair amount of prickness evident in Longmire

And certainly doesn’t mind a good ol whinge when trying to drum up sympathy for favours from AFL house when it comes to his club either

Finally despite all his “gifts” from AFL house over the years and multiple gf appearances still only has one flag to his name

 

[WilloTree]

The paul Roos who had RTB and horse as his assistants?

Decent coach hardly extraordinary tho

Now compare to Hardwick , clarko, Thompson,Scott , Malthouse and Mathew’s further back all generational coaches and by large, pricks.

As I said previous post, history of the modern game in terms of multiple premiership winners is not great reading to supporters of the “nice guy” coach
Facts.

Mate, Longmire is a very successful coach. He's playing his 27th final next week.

oops. wrong reply. Meh - you know which one I was replying to.

 

[MadMac]

What's wrong with Horse? Seems like a decent guy. Have I missed something?

Nothing. I don’t think he belongs in that company and I would argue C. Scott doesn’t either.
Fnerd makes a valid point though, most successful coaches do tend to have a bit of a campaigner in them. Whether that’s a coincidence or not is debatable

 

[WilloTree]

Nothing. I don’t think he belongs in that company and I would argue C. Scott doesn’t either.
Fnerd makes a valid point though, most successful coaches do tend to have a bit of a campaigner in them. Whether that’s a coincidence or not is debatable

Some do - some don't. It's hardly a prerequisite. I'd probably go with the two aren't linked. A good coach is a good coach because of other things (great cattle, knowledge of the game, people skills, not being such a dick players leave in droves etc)

 

[Stinky Lomax]

Nothing. I don’t think he belongs in that company and I would argue C. Scott doesn’t either.
Fnerd makes a valid point though, most successful coaches do tend to have a bit of a campaigner in them. Whether that’s a coincidence or not is debatable

So if Longmuir punches a hole in a wall in public he’s a great coach all of a sudden? None of you have any idea what he is like behind closed doors.

 

[Dockeroo]

Enough already.

It’s a discussion board. There’s this thing called a mute button you can use on my comments if they bother you that much, please do.

 

[arsesmart]

Some do - some don't. It's hardly a prerequisite. I'd probably go with the two aren't linked. A good coach is a good coach because of other things (great cattle, knowledge of the game, people skills, not being such a dick players leave in droves etc)

If you're approaching from a selection panel pov you'd want to know what is it about partaking in self-indulgent and selfish acts adds to successful coaching. I mean it sounds more like ego than effectiveness to me.

 

[MadMundy]

It's been confirmed time and time again that the Longmuir you see on TV is completely different to the Longmuir who talks to the players in the change rooms, multiple have said they've seen him very angry and emotional before, fired up and all that.

But people seem to believe that "He doesn't show it on TV so he must not do it at all" as if how a coach presents themselves on TV is how they present themselves to the playing group.

 

[MadMac]

So if Longmuir punches a hole in a wall in public he’s a great coach all of a sudden? None of you have any idea what he is like behind closed doors.

Lol, not necessarily. And for the record, I don’t personally rate Clarko as a great coach.

You’re right, we don’t know what Jlo is like behind closed doors but what we do know is that the team comes out flat shortly after his address more often than not so it’s valid to question whether he’s motivating the players enough or not. That’s also part of coaching and as important as tactical nous. Successful coaches tend to be good in all aspects of coaching.
I think the jury is still out on whether Jlo is capable getting the best out of his players on a consistent basis as that’s one area that could either get him sacked or make him a premiership coach.

 

[Fat Nyfe]

It's been confirmed time and time again that the Longmuir you see on TV is completely different to the Longmuir who talks to the players in the change rooms, multiple have said they've seen him very angry and emotional before, fired up and all that.

But people seem to believe that "He doesn't show it on TV so he must not do it at all" as if how a coach presents themselves on TV is how they present themselves to the playing group.

Ah this old chestnut.

The observer effect, known to occur in two real world phenomena: in quantum mechanics, and with Fremantle Dockers coach Justin Longmuir.

Known to exhibit entirely different properties when observed, but switch the lights and cameras off and he will transform into a different person. Remarkable.

 

[chaosball32]

View attachment 2110524

If we extend his contract again after making finals once in 5 years that’s the definition of accepting mediocrity.

At some point this club as a whole needs to face the pressure head on and deal with it and perform, both on and off-field. Both Longmuir and Nicks got unworthy contract extensions this year to “alleviate pressure” and both of them ended up missing finals anyways.

This article mentions Carlton and Essendon continually changing coaches, and while I don’t agree with that approach, our approach of prioritising stability for the sake of stability hasn’t worked either. We’ve made finals 1 time in the past 9 years and have only had 2 head coaches in that time. At some point change is needed.

 

[Dockeroo]

If we extend his contract again after making finals once in 5 years that’s the definition of accepting mediocrity.

At some point this club as a whole needs to face the pressure head on and deal with it and perform, both on and off-field. Both Longmuir and Nicks got unworthy contract extensions this year to “alleviate pressure” and both of them ended up missing finals anyways.

This article mentions Carlton and Essendon continually changing coaches, and while I don’t agree with that approach, our approach of prioritising stability for the sake of stability hasn’t worked either. We’ve made finals 1 time in the past 9 years and have only had 2 head coaches in that time. At some point change is needed.

Another one year extension is not an option. We’d be the laughing stock of the comp.
End of next season he’s either sacked or given a long term extension. Depending on performance next season.

 

[eastfreo75]

If we extend his contract again after making finals once in 5 years that’s the definition of accepting mediocrity.

At some point this club as a whole needs to face the pressure head on and deal with it and perform, both on and off-field. Both Longmuir and Nicks got unworthy contract extensions this year to “alleviate pressure” and both of them ended up missing finals anyways.

This article mentions Carlton and Essendon continually changing coaches, and while I don’t agree with that approach, our approach of prioritising stability for the sake of stability hasn’t worked either. We’ve made finals 1 time in the past 9 years and have only had 2 head coaches in that time. At some point change is needed.

100%

5 years is enough time.

 

[Stinky Lomax]

It’s a discussion board. There’s this thing called a mute button you can use on my comments if they bother you that much, please do.

Absolutely it’s a discussion board, hence my response. If you keep going around in circles with same stuff week after week I’ll respond & call it out.

 

[MadMundy]

Doesn't feel like there's much new content to discuss in regards to Longmuir, it's not too surprising that people are repeating past discussion topics.

 

[WilloTree]

That Fagan fellow seems like a nice chap.

ducks

 

[stax on the mull]

I think successful teams have to play more than one style and be able to change their method during a game if the pressure comes.

 

[Dockeroo]

Absolutely it’s a discussion board, hence my response. If you keep going around in circles with same stuff week after week I’ll respond & call it out.

Lol the entire premise of Big footy is people talking about the same thing over and over.
There’s literally a list management thread on our board right now with hundreds of pages of the same repeated discussion about Shai Bolton, as just one example.
Anyway you keep fighting the good fight, calling out what you don’t agree with if it makes you feel better about yourself

 

[arsesmart]

Lol the entire premise of Big footy is people talking about the same thing over and over.
There’s literally a list management thread on our board right now with hundreds of pages of the same repeated discussion about Shai Bolton, as just one example.
Anyway you keep fighting the good fight, calling out what you don’t agree with if it makes you feel better about yourself

Weren't they too just having an opinion... on your opinion?

 

[wakojako]

Weren't they too just having an opinion... on your opinion?

People need to learn to tolerate and ignore other opinions they disagree with in life. If you respond to everything you disagree with, with your own opinion in a condescend matter you are just spreading unnecessary negativity. I see a lot of stuff I disagree with on here but we are all unique individuals and no one is ever 100% right on anything

 

[blue shark]

I think successful teams have to play more than one style and be able to change their method during a game if the pressure comes.

I think we are doing well defensively in games. It’s our attacking mindset that is
so underwhelming.
We’ve had close to a decade of this style of footy, for one finals appearance.
At the beginning of the year it was finals or bust, that has now gone out the
door.
Instead of fixing the problems we will just try to buy a premiership.
Let’s hope that the talk of Simpson joining Freo are true, we need that type
of experience, and relationship building to forge our coaching development.

 

[Stinky Lomax]

Lol the entire premise of Big footy is people talking about the same thing over and over.
There’s literally a list management thread on our board right now with hundreds of pages of the same repeated discussion about Shai Bolton, as just one example.
Anyway you keep fighting the good fight, calling out what you don’t agree with if it makes you feel better about yourself

People need to learn to tolerate and ignore other opinions they disagree with in life. If you respond to everything you disagree with, with your own opinion in a condescend matter you are just spreading unnecessary negativity. I see a lot of stuff I disagree with on here but we are all unique individuals and no one is ever 100% right on anything

Sorry folks, as you continue to point out this is a discussion board, but if we disagree we shouldn’t make comment?

Dockeroo if you continue to rattle off the same stuff on this thread, I will continue to respond. The point is he coaching next year & you constant digs on here aren’t going get him sacked. Everyone agrees there are certain targets the team should reach for him to continue on next year, but the players have to take some responsibility for that.

You talk about over handball, we had on average 22 more handballs per game than Sydney, thats 5.5 more handballs per quarter, around 1 extra handball every 4 minutes of a game.
Do you know why we protect the ball marginally more than anyone else?
Because the average age of our key forwards is around 21.5 & our contested marks numbers are low, but our marks inside 50 are above average. Additionally we don’t have the small forward arsenal yet to take advantage of the chaos ball.

Our game style is structured to protect the ball & get the most out of a forward half, which is still short of reaching its full potential, ability wise & player wise.
We are well below average on turnovers, which apparently is our issue with our high handball numbers?

Have you ever thought that if we play like everyone else & hack it forward under pressure we might actually be worse off? This puts massive pressure on our back half & without McDonald, Cox & Pearce for lots of the year would have had us in serious trouble. Draper was serviceable because he was protected.

There’s a lot of science & statistics that go into the way teams play, a lot of man hours going through tape to work out the best way to play for OUR list, not what works for others. There’s a shit load to improve on, but a lot of that is on the players & their intent & experience, not just the coaches.

wakojako coaching is a difficult gig, a lot think they have magical powers & control everything the players do. Believe it or not sometimes it’s the players fault, not the coach. The coach isn’t here to defend himself, so I will.
As has been pointed out, if you don’t like it there are measures you can take.

 

[arsesmart]

People need to learn to tolerate and ignore other opinions they disagree with in life. If you respond to everything you disagree with, with your own opinion in a condescend matter you are just spreading unnecessary negativity. I see a lot of stuff I disagree with on here but we are all unique individuals and no one is ever 100% right on anything

Sure ignoring it is one option. Not particularly robust as a catch-all, but sometimes can soothingly reduce the energy/feelings invested.

Another more satisfying/rational option is dwelling in the evidencesphere that supports your opinion or challenges someone else's (maybe even your own).

 

[WilloTree]

Sorry folks, as you continue to point out this is a discussion board, but if we disagree we shouldn’t make comment?

Dockeroo if you continue to rattle off the same stuff on this thread, I will continue to respond. The point is he coaching next year & you constant digs on here aren’t going get him sacked. Everyone agrees there are certain targets the team should reach for him to continue on next year, but the players have to take some responsibility for that.

You talk about over handball, we had on average 22 more handballs per game than Sydney, thats 5.5 more handballs per quarter, around 1 extra handball every 4 minutes of a game.
Do you know why we protect the ball marginally more than anyone else?
Because the average age of our key forwards is around 21.5 & our contested marks numbers are low, but our marks inside 50 are above average. Additionally we don’t have the small forward arsenal yet to take advantage of the chaos ball.

Our game style is structured to protect the ball & get the most out of a forward half, which is still short of reaching its full potential, ability wise & player wise.
We are well below average on turnovers, which apparently is our issue with our high handball numbers?

Have you ever thought that if we play like everyone else & hack it forward under pressure we might actually be worse off? This puts massive pressure on our back half & without McDonald, Cox & Pearce for lots of the year would have had us in serious trouble. Draper was serviceable because he was protected.

There’s a lot of science & statistics that go into the way teams play, a lot of man hours going through tape to work out the best way to play for OUR list, not what works for others. There’s a shit load to improve on, but a lot of that is on the players & their intent & experience, not just the coaches.

wakojako coaching is a difficult gig, a lot think they have magical powers & control everything the players do. Believe it or not sometimes it’s the players fault, not the coach. The coach isn’t here to defend himself, so I will.
As has been pointed out, if you don’t like it there are measures you can take.

Stop with all this well thought-out analysis. You make us all look bad.

 

[Rob]

Sorry folks, as you continue to point out this is a discussion board, but if we disagree we shouldn’t make comment?

Dockeroo if you continue to rattle off the same stuff on this thread, I will continue to respond. The point is he coaching next year & you constant digs on here aren’t going get him sacked. Everyone agrees there are certain targets the team should reach for him to continue on next year, but the players have to take some responsibility for that.

You talk about over handball, we had on average 22 more handballs per game than Sydney, thats 5.5 more handballs per quarter, around 1 extra handball every 4 minutes of a game.
Do you know why we protect the ball marginally more than anyone else?
Because the average age of our key forwards is around 21.5 & our contested marks numbers are low, but our marks inside 50 are above average. Additionally we don’t have the small forward arsenal yet to take advantage of the chaos ball.

Our game style is structured to protect the ball & get the most out of a forward half, which is still short of reaching its full potential, ability wise & player wise.
We are well below average on turnovers, which apparently is our issue with our high handball numbers?

Have you ever thought that if we play like everyone else & hack it forward under pressure we might actually be worse off? This puts massive pressure on our back half & without McDonald, Cox & Pearce for lots of the year would have had us in serious trouble. Draper was serviceable because he was protected.

There’s a lot of science & statistics that go into the way teams play, a lot of man hours going through tape to work out the best way to play for OUR list, not what works for others. There’s a shit load to improve on, but a lot of that is on the players & their intent & experience, not just the coaches.

wakojako coaching is a difficult gig, a lot think they have magical powers & control everything the players do. Believe it or not sometimes it’s the players fault, not the coach. The coach isn’t here to defend himself, so I will.
As has been pointed out, if you don’t like it there are measures you can take.

If we were winning games your analysis would be fine. But we're not. We're a bog average middling team with a rolls royce list.

Your argument in defence of the Longmuir game plan seems to be that we'd be worse if it was adjusted. So the absolute best we could have hoped for this year - with any game plan - was 10th. With another one we'd have finished lower. Sorry dude, I just can't agree with that.

It does seem 95% likely that JL will coach in round 1 next season, but he'd better ****ing work it out quickly. If we're 3 and 5 or even 4 and 4 after 8 rounds he's probably going to be a dead man walking.