Player Watch Kayle Kirby (Delisted 2018)

[WakeUpPies]

He's an adult now whose been handed a once in a life time opportunity and appears to be pissing it down the drain at this (no doubt) early stage.

Needs a kick up the bum if he wants to have a chance at an AFL career, he isn't a baby and we don't need to sugarcoat things... Being so fat at the end of a long preseason is unacceptable.

Exactly this. If you want to be a pro athlete, be a damn pro athlete. Millions of kids would gladly live in the gym to trade spots with him in an instant. He needs to sack up. Let's drop the PC nonsense.

Edit. Before someone eventually brings up Swanny - even he couldn't get a game before he started taking things more seriously. He was never this out of shape in recent years too. He is also the exception, not the norm.

 

[THATSGOLD]

I can't help but feel that we've taken the wrong approach with him. From training reports it sounds like he's just been running laps to get his fitness up rather than being a part of match simulation. Pretty dispiriting and demotivating for a guy who was recruited with probable commitment issues. Let him play, have fun slowly getting fitter through match play and accept building his work ethic and fitness is going to take a couple of years.

If he's been running laps to get his fitness up I'd hate to see what he looks like doing no laps.

 

[THATSGOLD]

Hopefully Kayle has some mentors to guide him. Be there when he's wavering in commitment. Give him support with diet. Keep him on track with exercise.

Sounds like he needs some extra effort from the club. They should be set up to do this.

Who is the player welfare guru? Is it the Caff?

First of all he's got to want to help himself.

 

[THATSGOLD]

Some of the comments in this thread are ugly. AFL is a hard adjustment; and for some it's harder than others. Support the kid FFS.

He needs to support himself. Kappa is right he's an adult earning an adult wage. If he was in the work force he wouldn't last two seconds doing a 38 hour week with the sounds of it.

 

[35Daicos]

He needs to support himself. Kappa is right he's an adult earning an adult wage. If he was in the work force he wouldn't last two seconds doing a 38 hour week with the sounds of it.

TG, the generosity you've shown to Henry Schade in his thread is almost unprecedented, given that he's a 23-year-old who's now in his sixth year in the AFL, and so far has done bugger all! How about you afford this 18-year-old some of the same kind thoughts. Schade is no doubt doing the right thing in terms of his preparation, giving himself the best possible chance of making it at Collingwood. But he would probably know that if he doesn't make it with us, he'll spend the rest of his career in the VFL, or have to head back to Tasmania. I didn't know sh** from clay when I was an 18-year-old, how about you?!

PS You might even be right about your man Schade, I hope you are. It doesn't change the fact that you could be a bit more generous in your attitude towards this fellow.

 

[ClaytonM]

TG, I didn't know sh** from clay when I was an 18-year-old, how about you?!

Agree. Just cause he is eighteen doesn't make him an adult in any way except legally.

It is way too early for the club to cut this kid unless he has really fallen off the rails Garlett style.

Whether he needs tough love or cuddles I dont know and neither may the club at this point in time.

 

[Pedro]

Same but if Kirby chucks in the towel what else can you do? That's his choice and if he can't or doesn't want to be apart of an AFL environment then so be it. If he wants to still pursue and AFL career and the club is giving up him then I have an issue with that.

If that happens there probably is not much you can do. Other than perhaps encourage him to take a bit of time, step back and sleep on it. He'll only make the decision once, so he'd want to be certain about it.

 

[Apex36]

I can't help but feel that we've taken the wrong approach with him. From training reports it sounds like he's just been running laps to get his fitness up rather than being a part of match simulation. Pretty dispiriting and demotivating for a guy who was recruited with probable commitment issues. Let him play, have fun slowly getting fitter through match play and accept building his work ethic and fitness is going to take a couple of years.

That's incorrect. There are several reports I've seen where he's been involved in match sim. He does laps during drills.

 

[doodles98]

I can't help but feel that we've taken the wrong approach with him. From training reports it sounds like he's just been running laps to get his fitness up rather than being a part of match simulation. Pretty dispiriting and demotivating for a guy who was recruited with probable commitment issues. Let him play, have fun slowly getting fitter through match play and accept building his work ethic and fitness is going to take a couple of years.

Totally agree with this. For everyone.. chasing a ball, playing and doing drills is the fun way to get fit. The ball motivates us to run after it just like with my kelpie. We will run harder faster, longer and get fit faster if we are motivated by some spherical bouncing object. Clearly the club was sending a message to Kirby early days that he wasn't fit enough to do drills. The management of him here has clearly backfired.
Being excluded to run laps is just terrible training methodology both from a mental and physical outcome point of view. This is what our fitness experts come up with.. slow jogging laps ffs!! Slowly jogging laps to get fit.. I believe this technique is still popular at Waubra too. Biggest most well funded sports club in the country. Do they know it's 2017 and sports science has evolved much more effective techniques than running laps?. Do they know the psychology behind it is the biggest key? This is a failure by both parties, Kirby and the clubs management of him; make no mistake about that.

Sorry for the rant. But fat joke material aside I am very disappointed with this.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

If you send an unfit player out do do training drills and he gets injured because of it you will crucified for poor player management.

I dont know what the answer is but its pretty simple. If youre not fit enough you work solo until you are. Exactly what that solo program looks like is a case by case situation.

 

[loki04]

I would be very disappointed if the club gives up on him 4 months into his AFL career. Work with him. Give him some belief that if he puts the work in he can be a good footballer.

Parting ways by 'mutual agreement' would be hard to take, If he refuses then there is only so much you can do. But Collingwood needs to leave no stone unturned in trying to get Kayle right.

If Kayle leaves Collingwood before the season starts that reflects badly on us and our ability to develop indigenous footballers.

Chris Tarrant comes to mind, Big Ed had to go convince him to come back as all he wanted to do was smoke bongs on the river and fish with his mates.

 

[loki04]

Hopefully Kayle has some mentors to guide him. Be there when he's wavering in commitment. Give him support with diet. Keep him on track with exercise.

Sounds like he needs some extra effort from the club. They should be set up to do this.

Who is the player welfare guru? Is it the Caff?

I'd actually love to see the club bring Leon Davis back in a role for indigenous welfare for the young ones we draft. Give them a sounding board to help bridge any gaps or help keep them on the right motivational track and someone they can feel relates to them.

 

[Ned_Flanders]

A quick post to pass on some of the stuff I heard about him prior to the draft at rfc.

Discipline and tank were always the issues. He did a lot of work to try and get afl ready in the last season. Mid year there was talk of him being borderline because of these issues - rookie or low draft prospect. Talk was absolute raw talent, but the risk was could he get and maintain the conditioning needed for afl. His end of the season changed a lot of that however, underlined by how high he was drafted by you guys.

This isn't an indigenous issue either. He has come late to the world of hard work ethic and training. He is the type of kid who will make it or not based upon how much he's personally willing to sacrifice to make it.

Fwiw I wanted him at rfc as a late nd pick

 

[Vicky Park]

That's incorrect. There are several reports I've seen where he's been involved in match sim. He does laps during drills.

Pretty sure Kirby was involved in some match sim at training 5 or so weeks ago. I was there, although I missed seeing him kick a goal, which he apparently did! After that he was running laps.

 

[loki04]

If you send an unfit player out do do training drills and he gets injured because of it you will crucified for poor player management.

I dont know what the answer is but its pretty simple. If youre not fit enough you work solo until you are. Exactly what that solo program looks like is a case by case situation.

Way to militant, the reason MM (and other great coaches even Clarko) was such a great coach is due to him treating individuals differently and not a 1 mould fits all. Sure there maybe some non negotiable's but I wouldn't of thought having tailored programs for certain individuals would fall under that banner.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Wasnt being militant at all. I was agreeing with you. Case by case situation how to bring players up to base fitness.But you cant train with the main group without that base fitness. You will get injured.

Its far too early to be calling the club out for doing the wrong thing or making ridiculous implicit comparisons between Buckley and Malthouse

 

[Schraderbrau]

Some fairly hysterical responses to a young bloke coming back from the Christmas break carrying a few kegs. It's not as if he's coming back from a drug ban or a few knee reconstructions.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

I don't really understand the idea behind getting a guy to run laps at training. If you need to be running laps for fitness, you can jog around a park any old time of the week. If you can't participate in match sims then you'd think your time would be better spent on skills work with a staff member.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

A quick post to pass on some of the stuff I heard about him prior to the draft at rfc.

Discipline and tank were always the issues. He did a lot of work to try and get afl ready in the last season. Mid year there was talk of him being borderline because of these issues - rookie or low draft prospect. Talk was absolute raw talent, but the risk was could he get and maintain the conditioning needed for afl. His end of the season changed a lot of that however, underlined by how high he was drafted by you guys.

This isn't an indigenous issue either. He has come late to the world of hard work ethic and training. He is the type of kid who will make it or not based upon how much he's personally willing to sacrifice to make it.

Fwiw I wanted him at rfc as a late nd pick

There's no doubt Collingwood took him in the nd because they knew Richmond were keen.

In all reality he should be a rookie list player with slightly less pressure to make an instant impact but that's the competitive environment of football for you. As soon as another team gets a sniff the price goes up.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I don't really understand the idea behind getting a guy to run laps at training. If you need to be running laps for fitness, you can jog around a park any old time of the week. If you can't participate in match sims then you'd think your time would be better spent on skills work with a staff member.

Keeping warm I guess if he's participating in some but not all drills...as apex alluded to?

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Fair enough, I guess.

 

[Rusty Beam]

There's no doubt Collingwood took him in the nd because they knew Richmond were keen.

In all reality he should be a rookie list player with slightly less pressure to make an instant impact but that's the competitive environment of football for you. As soon as another team gets a sniff the price goes up.

Richmond were only ever going to rookie list him as Cat B via next gen.

Potentially might have been some third party interest that meant we took him where we did in the ND.

 

[loki04]

Richmond were only ever going to rookie list him as Cat B via next gen.

Potentially might have been some third party interest that meant we took him where we did in the ND.

I'm glad we took him ND, personally i just hope he in time builds the base he needs and that we allow for teething problems/guide him in the right direction. Rather then the "shape up or ship out" line of thought that appears to be rumoured, there is no doubt on his talent we just need to get him to buy into the work ethic side as well .

 

[Lockyer24]

If he lived with Levi Greenwood I am not sure it is a good idea to put him with maniac trainers, instead he should be housed with the Ben Johnson/Dane Swan types at the club (if we have any left) that maintain the balance between having a social life but also getting down and dirty. He will never be an ultra professional.

I also agree that making him run laps forever is pointless and gives him zero inspiration to get out on the park. I'd rather see him involved in the intraclub, not get a kick and wake up that way that he needs to get better conditioned.

Either way I don't expect him to last long and never did. But it will be fantastic if I am wrong and we can get him to AFL standard as he has more talent than many on our list.

 

[Kilmo]

Does anyone know if these reports are even true?