Review Knightmare's 2010-2013 top 40

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MightyTiger said:
Disagree, your bias clouds your judgement, in no way is or will Seedsman end up the better player then Conca.
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You are calling Knightmare bias... Your arguement is just screaming bias.

Conca looks like a handy player, but until he strings together games and performs consistently throughout them, without fading in and out of them, then maybe he shall be rated higher but as of right now I think Knightmare's ranking is fair.

Seedsman has been ultra impressive this year. Everytime I see this kid play, the way he runs, his attack on the ball, his excellent disposal and booming kick, just makes me think of Brendan Goddard. His ball use is first class and his kicking action is almost a mirror image to Goddard's which just makes him look even more impressive. Silky smooth that kid and will have a Goddardesque career in my opinion. Collingwood are very lucky to have him Knighta, you did well!
 
How you you rate Tom McDonald so far, Knightmare? Also interested in your thoughts re Troy Davis and Rory Taggert, who haven't played yet.
 
JR95 said:
You are calling Knightmare bias... Your arguement is just screaming bias.

Conca looks like a handy player, but until he strings together games and performs consistently throughout them, without fading in and out of them, then maybe he shall be rated higher but as of right now I think Knightmare's ranking is fair.

Seedsman has been ultra impressive this year. Everytime I see this kid play, the way he runs, his attack on the ball, his excellent disposal and booming kick, just makes me think of Brendan Goddard. His ball use is first class and his kicking action is almost a mirror image to Goddard's which just makes him look even more impressive. Silky smooth that kid and will have a Goddardesque career in my opinion. Collingwood are very lucky to have him Knighta, you did well!
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You obviously haven't watched enough of him, he would have been leading or close to it our BnF before his injury.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/...1=3515&tid2=15&pid2=3452&type=A&fid1=S&fid2=S

Conca has him covered in pretty much every important category, Knightmares bias is clearly clouding his judgement.
 

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Knightmare said:
He's not being correctly utilised.

He's an excellent inside midfielder but Gold Coast seem to want to give others midfield minutes ahead of him and instead are electing to play him down back. Is this for his development? It's not where he's going to play his best footy in any case.
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You have no idea how crazy this sends me lol. They are giving him a bit more time in the midfield but they just need to put him in their and let him develop. Surely putting a pure mid on HB isn't the solution to our backline drive.
 
JackAttack7 said:
How you you rate Tom McDonald so far, Knightmare? Also interested in your thoughts re Troy Davis and Rory Taggert, who haven't played yet.
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Tom McDonald has done some good jobs down back these past few seasons and has the opportunity to become a regular. Some hitches with his kicking he needs to iron out but hopefully he will be ok.

Troy Davis and Rory Taggert both still have some way to go before they earn time in the seniors and at this point both look more like VFL players until they elevate their games.
 
MightyTiger said:
You obviously haven't watched enough of him, he would have been leading or close to it our BnF before his injury.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/...1=3515&tid2=15&pid2=3452&type=A&fid1=S&fid2=S

Conca has him covered in pretty much every important category, Knightmares bias is clearly clouding his judgement.
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Statistics are a major part in assessing players.

Conca has done more having debuted earlier so it's very easy to make a strong case for him.

I like Seedsman for the damage he does. His game as is the case with many, it goes beyond the stats with his 1v1 play sound allowing him to effectively get stops, then add linebreaking pace with all those running bounces he provides as well as his damaging long kicking he does and he's a clear top 10 player on Collingwood's list and only trending upward.

Seedsman is a speculative call but with it being so early in his career every pick at this stage largely is.
 
Ethicz said:
You have no idea how crazy this sends me lol. They are giving him a bit more time in the midfield but they just need to put him in their and let him develop. Surely putting a pure mid on HB isn't the solution to our backline drive.
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You need to remember he did play a lot of his junior career off half back. Give him time, he will make the transition back.

How do you squeeze Prestia, Ablett, O Meara etc out the midfield when they all perform their better than he did at the start of the year? I have a feeling he is still carrying niggles though. At least he is being super solid off half back, kicks Broughton out the team.
 
Knightmare said:
Statistics are a major part in assessing players.

Conca has done more having debuted earlier so it's very easy to make a strong case for him.

I like Seedsman for the damage he does. His game as is the case with many, it goes beyond the stats with his 1v1 play sound allowing him to effectively get stops, then add linebreaking pace with all those running bounces he provides as well as his damaging long kicking he does and he's a clear top 10 player on Collingwood's list and only trending upward.

Seedsman is a speculative call but with it being so early in his career every pick at this stage largely is.
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Top10 on Collingwoods list?

Beams
Shaw
O'Brien
Sidebottom
Swan
Pendlebury
Thomas
Cloke
Toovey
Krakeour
Blair
Brown
Jolly
Reid

And then you have players such as

Elliot
Fasolo
Goldsack
Maxwell
Didak

the list goes on and on.

Conca has done more, and it's not because he's debuted a year earlier, Conca has probably missed a full season since 2010 due to injuries, Conca has done more because hes simply the better player, Seedsman is your dime a dozen player, someone who can get a few disposals and can run.
 
MightyTiger said:
Top10 on Collingwoods list?

Beams
Shaw
O'Brien
Sidebottom
Swan
Pendlebury
Thomas
Cloke
Toovey
Krakeour
Blair
Brown
Jolly
Reid

And then you have players such as

Elliot
Fasolo
Goldsack
Maxwell
Didak

the list goes on and on.

Conca has done more, and it's not because he's debuted a year earlier, Conca has probably missed a full season since 2010 due to injuries, Conca has done more because hes simply the better player, Seedsman is your dime a dozen player, someone who can get a few disposals and can run.
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I think your bias is clouding your judgement
 
MightyTiger said:
He's the one who claimed Seedsman to be top10 on Collingwoods list, he clearly isn't.

Do you also agree that Seedsman is the better player of Conca or that Conca is clearly the better player?
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Personally I would take conca. But it's not as black and white as you think

Seedsman is quicker and has more penetration whereas conca is a more all rounded mid. Jury is still well and truly out on who will be better. You could mount a case for both

Chad wingard on the other hand, is light years ahead of both :D
 

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TheJaegerBomb said:
You need to remember he did play a lot of his junior career off half back. Give him time, he will make the transition back.

How do you squeeze Prestia, Ablett, O Meara etc out the midfield when they all perform their better than he did at the start of the year? I have a feeling he is still carrying niggles though. At least he is being super solid off half back, kicks Broughton out the team.
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Prestia, Ablett, O'Meara - that's only 3 players, plenty of room to put him in their. 6th most contested possessions at the start of the year, I thought he was doing ok. Probably blinded because if my man crush on him though. ;)
 
MightyTiger said:
Top10 on Collingwoods list?

Beams
Shaw
O'Brien
Sidebottom
Swan
Pendlebury
Thomas
Cloke
Toovey
Krakeour
Blair
Brown
Jolly
Reid

And then you have players such as

Elliot
Fasolo
Goldsack
Maxwell
Didak

the list goes on and on.

Conca has done more, and it's not because he's debuted a year earlier, Conca has probably missed a full season since 2010 due to injuries, Conca has done more because hes simply the better player, Seedsman is your dime a dozen player, someone who can get a few disposals and can run.
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Pendlebury
Beams - yet to play so probably shouldn't be in the rankings for this year
Cloke
Swan
Reid - only in there because he had the AA 2011 season but this season has not outperformed Seedsman.
Shaw
Toovey - Out with ACL so probably shouldn't be ranked but if healthy would be ahead.
Ball
O'Brien
Seedsman
----
D.Thomas has not performed since 2011 and has since played like a depth player to be frank. Has lost his pace and is no longer that freak pressure act player who used to be able to give those 2nd and 3rd efforts and no longer a linebreaking threat either making him vanilla.
Sidebottom good but not this year outperforming Seedsman.
Krakouer is fringe best 22 but probably not in my best side.
Blair I don't regard as a best 22 player with other younger players going even better (named K.Martin and J.Thomas)
N.Brown is a good shutdown defender but doesn't provide regular rebound so Seedsman as a two way player rates ahead of him.
Jolly is not who he was in past seasons and shouldn't make the list on reputation when he's only player up ok football.
Elliott up there and in my best 15 but I class Seedsman a touch higher being a year more advanced and productive more often.
Fasolo is out for the season. A top 20 player but until he's healthy it's hard to make an arguement he's even inside the top 15.
Goldsack is only just inside out best 22.
Maxwell is a defender who can't hold his position 1v1. Is a below average kick and doesn't break the lines. Best captain Collingwood has had in some time but I don't have him close to my top 10 let alone top 15.
Didak is depth. He's not who he was in 2010 and shouldn't be playing seniors with younger players having passed him by.
 
MightyTiger said:
He's the one who claimed Seedsman to be top10 on Collingwoods list, he clearly isn't.

Do you also agree that Seedsman is the better player of Conca or that Conca is clearly the better player?
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I'd take the seed. More damaging by foot
 
Seedsman reminds me of clinton young, not rated as highly as esteemed teammates given space and time and just continues to hurt sides. Has a great kick, but I'd be pretty confident if you put a tag on him he'd be a non factor
 
Grockadoc said:
Hey Knightmare, given he isn't in the top 30, i was just wondering where you ranked Brandon Ellis?
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He's in my top 40 and a case could easily be made on recent form that he could be in the 30.

Ellis since round 5 has played excellent footy just finding it so easily and has come into his own.

tigerT said:
Seedsman reminds me of clinton young, not rated as highly as esteemed teammates given space and time and just continues to hurt sides. Has a great kick, but I'd be pretty confident if you put a tag on him he'd be a non factor
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I tend agree with your comment. As a young player who only this year has become an AFL quality talent Seedsman likely would at this point struggle if a club gave him the respect of a tag.

I'd liken his game more to Harry O'Brien though with a better defensive game with his 1v1 ability and ability to go with the quicker and move evasive forwards better. But in essence as with O'Brien he is that linebreaker (quicker than Harry) who loves kicking long and sneaking forward for the long goal. It's who he is and you can tell by his game who has taken him under his wing.
 
Knightmare said:
Pendlebury
Beams - yet to play so probably shouldn't be in the rankings for this year
Cloke
Swan
Reid - only in there because he had the AA 2011 season but this season has not outperformed Seedsman.
Shaw
Toovey - Out with ACL so probably shouldn't be ranked but if healthy would be ahead.
Ball
O'Brien
Seedsman
----
D.Thomas has not performed since 2011 and has since played like a depth player to be frank. Has lost his pace and is no longer that freak pressure act player who used to be able to give those 2nd and 3rd efforts and no longer a linebreaking threat either making him vanilla.
Sidebottom good but not this year outperforming Seedsman.
Krakouer is fringe best 22 but probably not in my best side.
Blair I don't regard as a best 22 player with other younger players going even better (named K.Martin and J.Thomas)
N.Brown is a good shutdown defender but doesn't provide regular rebound so Seedsman as a two way player rates ahead of him.
Jolly is not who he was in past seasons and shouldn't make the list on reputation when he's only player up ok football.
Elliott up there and in my best 15 but I class Seedsman a touch higher being a year more advanced and productive more often.
Fasolo is out for the season. A top 20 player but until he's healthy it's hard to make an arguement he's even inside the top 15.
Goldsack is only just inside out best 22.
Maxwell is a defender who can't hold his position 1v1. Is a below average kick and doesn't break the lines. Best captain Collingwood has had in some time but I don't have him close to my top 10 let alone top 15.
Didak is depth. He's not who he was in 2010 and shouldn't be playing seniors with younger players having passed him by.
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Your bias is clearly clouding your judgement, even towards players of your own team, Seedsman is barely a midfielder, his role as a bit part player on the outside is one that can be covered by pretty much any player.

Seedsman is clearly the best 16 possession player ever.
 
MightyTiger said:
Of course you would. :rolleyes:
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We need someone who can run and carry, and has some decent hurt factor with his disposal on the outside, seedsman is that. Conca, for all that he can do, isn't. It's really not hard, nor is it a biased comment.
 
MightyTiger said:
Your bias is clearly clouding your judgement, even towards players of your own team, Seedsman is barely a midfielder, his role as a bit part player on the outside is one that can be covered by pretty much any player.

Seedsman is clearly the best 16 possession player ever.
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Collingwood have better depth than at any time previous but no longer have a quality top end as we had in previous seasons which has led to Collingwood's recent decline into the bottom portion of the top 8 and out of contention.

Collingwood's situation is that the entire top end has since 2011 declined (both veterans and middle age players *stars included) - with Harry and Caff being the only exceptions this year with their role changes. The improvers have been those relatively new players 1st-4th year players who mostly before this year have been untried.

And yes indeed I would take a back flanker who plays two way footy and has averaged a 20 disposals per game in his past 6 games with many of those damaging with not only the long kicking but also his linebreaking on display.
 

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Review Knightmare's 2010-2013 top 40

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