Review Knightmare's 2010-2013 top 40

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PJ Power said:
Has Wingard broken into the top 3 yet?;)

Unbelievably good second year. Reckon he will be the best non KPP of this lot, possibly with the exception of O'Meara.
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Wingard has certainly worked his way up the rankings very quickly and is looking like Port's best this year. A little like Bennell last year just absolutely dominanting which is impresive for such a yonug player but I'm expecting some ebs and flows to come into it so I'm not expecting such a consistent picture over the course of his career. Has the opportunity to move into the top 10 certainly but my views on Cameron and Daniher firstly are very strong and would still remain my starting two with O'Meara the midfielder I think who will be great but more consistently and over more seasons than Wingard which I suspect will prove the difference and Jack Martin I also expect will become a ripper and another who will benefit from that extra year in the system.
 
Jack Package said:
We need someone who can run and carry, and has some decent hurt factor with his disposal on the outside, seedsman is that. Conca, for all that he can do, isn't. It's really not hard, nor is it a biased comment.
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yes I agree the dons need a HBF with run and carry a great hurt factor and super foot skills....wonder were you can get one ;)

long way to go before we make a call on who will have a better career....conca or seeds
but for me conca in front for now
 
TIGER DAVE said:
yes I agree the dons need a HBF with run and carry a great hurt factor and super foot skills....wonder were you can get one ;)

long way to go before we make a call on who will have a better career....conca or seeds
but for me conca in front for now
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Hibberd and Dempsey not good enough HBF's for you?

I think Jack Package was talking about an outside midfielder with a bit of speed and polish
 

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carnthedons said:
Hibberd and Dempsey not good enough HBF's for you?

I think Jack Package was talking about an outside midfielder with a bit of speed and polish
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yes I think Hibbert and Dempsey are super players....from what I have seen of seeds he has been playing of the HBF hence my post....though the poster was looking for another HBFer

would you also take the seeds before conca?
 
TIGER DAVE said:
yes I think Hibbert and Dempsey are super players....from what I have seen of seeds he has been playing of the HBF hence my post....though the poster was looking for another HBFer

would you also take the seeds before conca?
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If I was looking for outside run and carry, absolutely. If I was looking for another Ben Howlett then Conca (please note, I really rate Howlett so that is a serious compliment)
 
carnthedons said:
Hibberd and Dempsey not good enough HBF's for you?

I think Jack Package was talking about an outside midfielder with a bit of speed and polish
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got it in one.

i'd love him opposite stanton or goddard on a wing, runs hard, but still has that defensive aspect to his game.

different strokes though really, different sorts of players, but I don't see how you can put Conca ahead on the basis that he's played more games in an inferior side.
 
aussierulesrules said:
KM, is there anyone in this year's draft crop who really reminds you of Seedsman, with the good defensive ability, combined with the high hurt-factor, thanks to their speed and good long kicking and ability to hit the scoreboard? Is Bontompelli somewhat similar in that regard?
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Seedsman is an interesting one because he came in as a very outsideish mid. Never played as a defender in his life before Collingwood and we've only starting playing him back last year. He's one who has become as good as he has because he's worked harder than the next guy at his game and has as a result got the best out of himself and really developed into something.

Bontempelli is a heck of an athlete. He's not elite at any one thing but is better than most in most areas of the game and at his height is one who intrigues because he can accumulate and moves freakishly well for a guy at his height. He's similar to Seedsman in so much as he is also a tall outside type with some athleticism though I'd say more again than Seedsman with more tricks than just straightline pace. I'd also back him in as an accumulator with some of his school level games incredibly dominant and if he continues to step up his game he can win well in excess of 20 disposals per game.
He can hit the scoreboard when he pushes forward and does have above average range on his game (so overall as a prospect while it's early I like him more than Seedsman) but defensively not at this stage as advanced as Seedsman is now.

It's pretty rare for juniors to have an already developed two way game or a good combination between ability to find it inside and outside.

If anyone reminds me of Seedsman I'd probably go with Kade Kolodjashnij as a guy who can play a pretty similar role and late 1st - 2nd round could be worth a shot. Again not nearly as advanced defensively and you hope once he gets stronger as with Seedsman he can build it up but he's a big time accumulator on a back flank with real pace and a while perhaps not as penetrating by foot certainly every bit as good a user as Seedsman and probably even a touch better in this regard because he better lowers his eyes and finds the better targets than Seedsman does which is what you want from a back flanker/wingman.
 
aussierulesrules said:
Cheers for that. Really liking the sound of Bontompelli and it will be interesting to see how high he goes, being that really good height for someone who doesn't play key position and given that he may also still be growing.
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The second half of the season when he plays more regular TAC Cup footy will likely determine where he goes and give us a better idea of how good he can get.

Rockford said:
Just noticed your last edit, you've removed Whitfield from your top 30 calculations. Is there something you've seen that makes you think he won't be as prolific? Or is it just that he hasn't really opened up a game or shown as much as O'Meara, Wines, Macrae and the young GWS mids etc...?
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I see Whitfield as a pure outside player really pretty similar to Gaff but maybe a touch better. I think he'll end up in that top 20-40 group but it's really open to interpretation as to just where in that order he should be rated.

I wouldn't be surprised if Greene, Treloar and Shiel become GWS' best midfielders but another year into them and it will start to become more clear as it is with those Gold Coast boys coming through with McKenzie and Prestia really breaking into their own along with Dixon and Thompson as the bigs, GWS likely next year will also experience similar breakout seasons with 3-4 likely to do the same.
 
Knightmare why would they pick Lachie Whitfield at number one if he was purely an outside player and wouldn't be in the top 30 players from the combined three drafts? I think you are underselling him here. He has looked fantastic in the games I've watched, in a side void of maturity, his decision making, cool head, class and elite disposal really stand out to me
 
Watson_my_mind said:
Knightmare why would they pick Lachie Whitfield at number one if he was purely an outside player and wouldn't be in the top 30 players from the combined three drafts? I think you are underselling him here. He has looked fantastic in the games I've watched, in a side void of maturity, his decision making, cool head, class and elite disposal really stand out to me
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I may be.

But Tom Scully wouldn't be on this list either.

Really looking back at the 8 most recent drafts: Whitfield, Patton, Swallow, Scully, Watts, Kreuzer, Gibbs you're not a star because you go at no.1 overall. They're all guys who can play to varying levels but they're not stars of the competition and none are nearly the best at their respective positions.

It's all speculative. I think Whitfield is clearly better than O'Rourke and Plowman, neither of whom I'd even have in my top 50 but we'll all vary in our views this early into their careers.
 

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Knightmare said:
The second half of the season when he plays more regular TAC Cup footy will likely determine where he goes and give us a better idea of how good he can get.
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I liked what I saw of him yesterday and he still looks very raw and doesn't turn 18 until late November, so I think there's potentially significant upside to him. David Myers went at no.7 or so, so I look forward to seeing where Bontompelli ends up going. A club may take a punt on him based more on his potential upside rather than purely on his output so far.
 
KM, Toumpas is starting to show why he was rated so highly. How would you compare him to Whitfield?

Everyone has said Toumpas is quite small, but seeing him on the ground he has AFL size, and seems to love tot ake the game on with his kicking. I'm hesitant to make any prediction mostly because its only been in spurts - but the kid looks like he can really kick a footy.
 
aussierulesrules said:
I liked what I saw of him yesterday and he still looks very raw and doesn't turn 18 until late November, so I think there's potentially significant upside to him. David Myers went at no.7 or so, so I look forward to seeing where Bontompelli ends up going. A club may take a punt on him based more on his potential upside rather than purely on his output so far.
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I see things the same with Bontempelli. He's largely projected as a guy who won't be special in season one but with 2-3 years in the system has the opportunity to become something and if you buy him you're buying him on what he'll become and not who he is today so he could well go higher than his form suggests he should, but that may/may not be a bad thing.

LouisCK said:
KM, Toumpas is starting to show why he was rated so highly. How would you compare him to Whitfield?

Everyone has said Toumpas is quite small, but seeing him on the ground he has AFL size, and seems to love tot ake the game on with his kicking. I'm hesitant to make any prediction mostly because its only been in spurts - but the kid looks like he can really kick a footy.
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Whitfield is the more immediate player because as a linkup type you don't really need much size - as Gaff and others have shown in the past. I think Whitfield will still be the better player because he'll find more of it but Toumpas with his explosiveness and kick is a good one who has the opportunity to become a very good player for Melbourne and still potentially a top 10 player from last years draft if Melbourne improve their player development.
 
aussierulesrules said:
I liked what I saw of him yesterday and he still looks very raw and doesn't turn 18 until late November, so I think there's potentially significant upside to him. David Myers went at no.7 or so, so I look forward to seeing where Bontompelli ends up going. A club may take a punt on him based more on his potential upside rather than purely on his output so far.
Click to expand...

I see things the same with Bontempelli. He's largely projected as a guy who won't be special in season one but with 2-3 years in the system has the opportunity to become something and if you buy him you're buying him on what he'll become and not who he is today so he could well go higher than his form suggests he should, but that may/may not be a bad thing.

LouisCK said:
KM, Toumpas is starting to show why he was rated so highly. How would you compare him to Whitfield?

Everyone has said Toumpas is quite small, but seeing him on the ground he has AFL size, and seems to love tot ake the game on with his kicking. I'm hesitant to make any prediction mostly because its only been in spurts - but the kid looks like he can really kick a footy.
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Whitfield is the more immediate player because as a linkup type you don't really need much size - as Gaff and others have shown in the past. I think Whitfield will still be the better player because he'll find more of it but Toumpas with his explosiveness and kick is a good one who has the opportunity to become a very good player for Melbourne and still potentially a top 10 player from last years draft if Melbourne improve their player development.
 
hey mate, i've been pretty happy with Taylor Hine's start his North Melbourne career. He was taken as an underage player by Gold Coast so didnt hear much about him during the draft time. Just wondering if you saw much of him as a junior and what level can you see him developing too? cheers mate
 
Spitter9 said:
hey mate, i've been pretty happy with Taylor Hine's start his North Melbourne career. He was taken as an underage player by Gold Coast so didnt hear much about him during the draft time. Just wondering if you saw much of him as a junior and what level can you see him developing too? cheers mate
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Taylor Hine was indeed prelisted.

I mostly watch the 18 year olds unless I specifically have in mind to watch a particular 17 year old or one really dominates and really demands I take note of their games.

With Hine I saw bits and pieces but he was never a focus. Was generally rated as a 2nd rounder or thereabouts.

I see Hine as a role player. He can play in the seniors and is going ok down back at the moment but he's not likely to change too many games with his play. He can still improve further on what he's doing now but he's more a component of a successful back half if he continues developing as opposed to a key piece you build around.
 
Knightmare said:
Taylor Hine was indeed prelisted.

I mostly watch the 18 year olds unless I specifically have in mind to watch a particular 17 year old or one really dominates and really demands I take note of their games.

With Hine I saw bits and pieces but he was never a focus. Was generally rated as a 2nd rounder or thereabouts.

I see Hine as a role player. He can play in the seniors and is going ok down back at the moment but he's not likely to change too many games with his play. He can still improve further on what he's doing now but he's more a component of a successful back half if he continues developing as opposed to a key piece you build around.
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Cheers mate, certainly been doing a good tagging role when required. Something we've lacked since Brady Rawlings retired. Destroyed deledio yesterday
 
KM, possibly a bit of a silly one, but if you were to expand this to include the 2013 draft, how many kids would you include and who would they be?

Not necessarily worried about placing them on the list, just trying to gauge the comparative strengths of the last 3 drafts, and how the prospects compare.
 
Jack Package said:
KM, possibly a bit of a silly one, but if you were to expand this to include the 2013 draft, how many kids would you include and who would they be?

Not necessarily worried about placing them on the list, just trying to gauge the comparative strengths of the last 3 drafts, and how the prospects compare.
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I'm hoping by the end of the week to add three rounds along with complete bios.


It's a strong midfielders draft certainly and some key forwards are starting to push their way up the draft order as options. 80 guys could go in the national draft with probably another 40 rookies.

It's not 2008 strong but the strongest draft we've had since then with the draft consessions making a mess of the recent drafts.
 
Knightmare said:
I'm hoping by the end of the week to add three rounds along with complete bios.


It's a strong midfielders draft certainly and some key forwards are starting to push their way up the draft order as options. 80 guys could go in the national draft with probably another 40 rookies.

It's not 2008 strong but the strongest draft we've had since then with the draft consessions making a mess of the recent drafts.
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Looking forward to it, it's always a great read.

But in the context of this list, how many from this draft would make their way into this top 30, don't fuss on numbering them, but would Boyd, Aish and Scharenberg (at least) push into the 30 and drop out some towards the bottom end?
 
Jack Package said:
Looking forward to it, it's always a great read.

But in the context of this list, how many from this draft would make their way into this top 30, don't fuss on numbering them, but would Boyd, Aish and Scharenberg (at least) push into the 30 and drop out some towards the bottom end?
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Apologies. I thought this was my phantom draft thread.

I may perhaps over the offseason expand this. Perhaps I'll do rankings over the 2010-2013 drafts. Perhaps an All AFL ranking system with who you'd start a team with first.

eg.
1. Nic Naitanui
2. Jeremy Cameron
3. Joe Daniher
etc.
 

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Review Knightmare's 2010-2013 top 40

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