News Lions to wear traditional jumper...now reduced by the club to the 'commemorative hat-trick jumper'

[Viceregal]

Fair point Viceregal. I still don't think it's ideal. The reason:
Let's say that member survey is one factor. Let's say the others are:

• future changeability (because in 50 years time, fans may find the logo old and boring)
• Marketing consultation,
• Future logo development proposals
• A survey of non-member fans (read: future growth in our member base)
• A survey of non-fans (read: future growth in our supporter base)
• A survey of middle- or high-school students in Brisbane (read: where most of our growth will come from, and most of our marketing will target)

Was thinking about that as I typed up the other one ... more along the lines of a two part poll - one part for members only with a one vote per member limit (not one vote per IP as many households have multiple members) and a second part for those who consider themselves supporters (basically anyone who is interested enough in the issue to want to have a say but who are not currently card carrying members) with the voting this time possibly ip limited or whatever else you need to do to doge the spam bots and other vote-rigging options (and an age range radio button if you like)

If it comes down to 60-40 as I would expect, I would suggest that it would be considered a close call. For this example though, it's 51-49. TLR are there, any they are TRIUMPHANT, and demand the old lion back. Never mind that the marketing professionals and the business professionals have declared that the other five factors have varied outcomes... the current members, who've proved that they're with the club no matter what, are 51-49 in favour of the old. Should we change?

Despite the "Bring It Back" references my understanding of TLR is that their main beef is not with the jumper per se but with the *process* through which the jumper came about - and if a transparent process was to take place and there was a sincere pro-current jumper then they would accept (potentially somewhat bemusedly and grudgingly) that decision.

The club, since the time of the 'focus group' have signed a member's charter where they have agreed to consultation about a variety of issues and changing the jumper is one of them - part of the issue at play here is that we are talking about signs and symbols that are dear to the heart of many people ... it might be a positive 'community' or 'engagement' decision to switch out all the crosses in Indonesia for Crescents on the churches there but guarantee it would not go down well with the church members up there (the supporters) - and there have been many analogies made between the supporters of football clubs and members of religions (esp in Victoria!)

 

[adey115]

Either that or a preferential, order them in preference 1-3 type system. Eliminate the least popular option and distribute their second preferences to the other options.

All stuff that can be done very easily online with SurveyMonkey.

Ah, I totally agree. But I await to see as to how it will be set up. The skeptic in me worries that it won't be preferential.... let's see what they come up with.

 

[Hollow Knight]

I don't understand some of you guys. Your message has cut through. This is a big win for the anti paddlepop.

If you haven't been involved at every step of the process I can see how you might have that view, but the way it has played out and some of the interactions with the club (not all of which have been discussed at detail in this thread) make it hard to believe the battle is won and that the board's intentions are completely on-the-level.

Let us wait and see what the board does next before more inflammatory comments are made about how evil our board is

There is some merit to a wait-and-see approach, but a general level of pro activeness is still required. Don't want a Zimbabwe election thrust upon us.

 

[Lionator]

There is some merit to a wait-and-see approach, but a general level of pro activeness is still required. Don't want a Zimbabwe election thrust upon us.

I'm not saying to stop voicing your concerns and writing the letters, But you guys are now shooting the board down for making this announcement??!!
Its a big step forward for the board and for the cause. Lets now see what they do

 

[western royboy]

Attention all Graphic Designers - and apologies if it's already been done. What does BFC look like in the same stule as the old FFC Monogram? I used to love that monogram and I realise we are the Brisbane Lions but I'd be interested to see what it looks like.

 

[Hollow Knight]

I'm not saying to stop voicing your concerns and writing the letters, But you guys are now shooting the board down for making this announcement??!!

Wouldn't say we are shooting them down at all. I would describe my mood as "encouraged with a splash of trepidation".

 

[____]

Attention all Graphic Designers - and apologies if it's already been done. What does BFC look like in the same stule as the old FFC Monogram? I used to love that monogram and I realise we are the Brisbane Lions but I'd be interested to see what it looks like.

Football Pope made this request via PM last year, here's my mockup

Personally I'd prefer if we got our real Lion back

 

[adey115]

Doesn't work.

The traditional Lion works.

 

[BigEasyPeasy]

I'm not saying to stop voicing your concerns and writing the letters, But you guys are now shooting the board down for making this announcement??!!
Its a big step forward for the board and for the cause. Lets now see what they do

I think a large part of the 'trepidation' as TBD describes it is the fact that this kind of a survey would seemingly give closure to the issue, one way or another, but especially if numbers are in favour of the PP. To this end I'd hate to see a final verdict on the jumper (either for or against PP) be based on a flawed survey process. For those who have taken to this fight for a long time it is understandable to question/ challenge the process, purely in the interests of a result that accurately represents the thoughts of the members/supporters as a whole.

Yes, I know the process hasn't been completely unveiled, but we've got to talk about something

 

[Dylan12]

Regardless, I do trust our board more than I trust our members. The reason is - they know what they're doing.

The board knows what they are doing?

Care to provide any positive examples since the club was well and truly profitable in 04?

 

[Chasing the Dream]

Am a fan.

Split personality Jorgo??

Some days you are not a fan, some days you are a fan.......

 

[Jorgo]

Split personality Jorgo??

Some days you are not a fan, some days you are a fan.......

Just like to keep you all on your toes...

 

[dlanod]

Just like to keep you all on your toes...

Some might say you face whichever way the wind is going...

 

[Skoob]

Split personality Jorgo??

Some days you are not a fan, some days you are a fan.......

The act of being a fan, or 'fanning' only exists when turned on. Jorgo 's status of fandom is dependant on his level of turned on-ness.

 

[adey115]

Sometimes Jorgo is not a fan...
Then other times, Jorgo is not a fan.

 

[mattesideburns]

I would not be at all surprised if the survey included the current and 2 NEW designs thus not giving us who want it an option of the desired Guernsey.

We've seen this in the past with voting for Heritage Round guernseys. Options are presented that aren't really heritage at all, just roughly based on past guernseys with a few changes made to try and sell more today. That's understandable in that context but totally inappropriate in the matter here. I wouldn't be surprised if the real question we're asking (paddlepop v original Brisbane Lions guernsey) gets bastardized with some other options/modifications that nobody is asking for.
It should be a straight choice - were the club right to change to the paddlepop or was it a mistake that should be undone? Once that's decided, then we can move forward. The problem for the Paddlepop is that a vote for the Paddlepop is also a vote for instability on the guernsey, giving the board a mandate to make these choices on our behalf whenever fashion/marketing strategy dictates.

 

[Football Pope]

Football Pope made this request via PM last year, here's my mockup

Personally I'd prefer if we got our real Lion back

Doesn't work.

The traditional Lion works.

That doesn't ...For it to work the font needs to be changed...the 'B' just doesn't marry up to the 'F' or 'C'

 

[Dylan12]

Whilst we have had a small victory of sorts with the club at least asking the question in its recent survey, which even then, pretty much means shit, it still staggers me how transparent and proactive every other club seems to be with its members on major issues, particularly the jumper it wears (even if it is only its reserves side).

Here's the latest example:

ADELAIDE'S reserves will wear a traditional 'V' guernsey next season, with almost 5000 club members voting for it after being asked to choose from six designs.

The jumper claimed 36.59 per cent of the total vote. All six designs had a white base to avoid clashing with existing SANFL jumpers.

Crows chief operating officer Nigel Smart said the fans' choice echoed his own. “The more I looked at [design] C, the more I thought it suited what we need for the SANFL competition, and that’s what a clear majority of the fans [thought]," Smart said.

“It was good to involve the fans in submitting the initial ideas and designs and creating some debate around the guernsey and our SANFL team. “We didn’t want to need to create another clash strip and the SANFL was also keen for us to have a different look to the other teams, so the white base worked in that sense. “We also think that combined with blue shorts and socks it will look great.“

 

[Hollow Knight]

Whilst we have had a small victory of sorts with the club at least asking the question in its recent survey, which even then, pretty much means shit,

You realise the club is having a vote on the jumper at the AGM right?

 

[Skoob]

You realise the club is having a vote on the jumper at the AGM right?

Do we yet know exactly what members are voting on?
Voting for a change just in principle or voting for a return to the previous design or voting to reinstate the original Lion in some way, yet to be determined?

 

[Hollow Knight]

Do we yet know exactly what members are voting on?
Voting for a change just in principle or voting for a return to the previous design or voting to reinstate the original Lion in some way, yet to be determined?

The middle one I think. But we won't know for sure until the AGM papers go out.

 

[lionbear]

I actually believe the vote is not concrete, from what I have read, the vote at the AGM is simply to gauge members opinions on the jumper change in a more direct way, to be used by the board when deciding what to do with the uniform in 2015.

I hope I am wrong, but I do believe the board can ignore the vote results if they want to.

 

[Elixuh]

I actually believe the vote is not concrete, from what I have read, the vote at the AGM is simply to gauge members opinions on the jumper change in a more direct way, to be used by the board when deciding what to do with the uniform in 2015.

I hope I am wrong, but I do believe the board can ignore the vote results if they want to.

I think you're right. There is no requirement that the board be bound by the results of the survey.

 

[Fatcat08]

I think you're right. There is no requirement that the board be bound by the results of the survey.

Correct, was stated in the EGM papers that were sent out. Guessing the AGM will be the same. Personally I think its almost a fait acompli that we'll be getting the new one in 2015. I'd imagine that next seasons is pretty much done and dusted, although given Kooga are changing to BLK I wonder whether they would have been able to hold the new guernseys off for this season and sneak the change in?

 

[Hollow Knight]

I think you're right. There is no requirement that the board be bound by the results of the survey.

From what I've heard, the new board, including one Leigh Matthews, know that the majority want the old jumper back and that it is absolutely inevitable it will happen.

If dickheads like whatboutbob didn't go forcing the club to put "forced consultation on the jumper" in the member's charter, it would probably have happened already and we wouldn't need to vote on the bleeding obvious in December.