News Media Thread, 2023: Insightful, Inciteful and Incomptent

[WCErevival]

Yeah cant take Suma seriously. Comes across as an angry man.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Those average age and games stats are pretty damning. Hard to fathom how you get thrashed in contested possessions when, on average, each of your players was two years older and 30 games more experienced than his opponent.

 

[Ghossein]

Adam Simpson declared the Eagles were “fitter” than they have been for at least two years. All that indicates is that they’ve caught up to where they should have been 24 months ago, while the rest of an unforgiving AFL competition is well advanced.

They were running PBs on the time trial and got through pre-season relatively injury free, so unsure what this means.

Unless Simpson and his football support staff can dramatically turn things around in the space of a week and knock over Greater Western Sydney at home on Sunday afternoon, a disaster is brewing.

Dramatically = 1 from 2

Any new era should have been launched two to three years ago and be bearing fruit.

Bro thinks we should've lauched the rebuild 1 year after winning the GF

 

[Byron_Clanger]

Suma is perpetually salty that he didn't get the gig

While that's true, we have won 2 games out of what was it? 25?...so it's not like he's potting them without any validity.

His whole 'we should've started a rebuild' after we won the Granny while getting Tim Kelly a year after that is a weird take from him as well.

 

[The wily weagle]

Per foxsports

Eagles’ burning question: Where is the fight?

West Coast endured a season from hell in 2022 and were expected to come out firing this year in Round 1. Instead, the Eagles were belted in contested ball by a team that had won just nine games across three seasons. In the last five years, statistics show the Eagles have been ranked 17th in the competition for contested disposal differential. Against the Roos last week, they finished -37 in contested ball. “This is a West Coast Eagles brand that is being damaged right now,” Fox Footy’s Garry Lyon warned. While Jonathan Brown has accused senior players of simply “resting on their laurels”.

If there were ever 2 statements that encapsulate where its breaking down, its the above

 

[Farang83150]

"-37 in contested ball"
Ouch...that's about as bad as it gets

 

[The wily weagle]

"-37 in contested ball"
Ouch...that's about as bad as it gets

I think ranking 17th over the past 5 years for contested ball differential is far worse

Thing is, its not like its invisible

We notice it, the commentators notice it, the media notice it. Its stood out for a while

The real question is, what are we actually doing to remedy it?

 

[Ghossein]

While that's true, we have won 2 games out of what was it? 25?...so it's not like he's potting them without any validity.

His whole 'we should've started a rebuild' after we won the Granny while getting Tim Kelly a year after that is a weird take from him as well.

The team is obviously deserving of criticism, but a lot of his points are strange:

• Nisbett likes Simmo better than me (sad)
• Waterman should've played instead of Kelly and Gaff (what?)
• Darling and Ryan had low disposal counts at half-time (4 goals between them, hardly our worst players on the pitch)

 

[plays tall 1]

Some of what Suma says in that article was ill conceived, but there’s plenty of home truths too.

It’s good to see that type of critical content getting printed in The West because the local journos are often too anxious about getting the Eagles off-side to ask the hard questions or state a few home truths. By giving Suma a column the message is delivered without the journos themselves being ostracised by the club. Ideally Suma would get it all correct but we can’t have everything.

 

[Farang83150]

AFL.com
As reported in Inside Trading last week, Swans midfielder Angus Sheldrick, another first-round pick from the 2021 draft crop, is bound for a two-year extension with the club.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

The team is obviously deserving of criticism, but a lot of his points are strange:

• Nisbett likes Simmo better than me (sad)
• Waterman should've played instead of Kelly and Gaff (what?)
• Darling and Ryan had low disposal counts at half-time (4 goals between them, hardly our worst players on the pitch)

I thought he said Waterman should have played instead of Darling

 

[RookiePick]

Suma hitting nails on head IMO. Salty posters with truth aversion syndrome making some quality deflections.

Simpson and the coaches appear to have largely got a mulligan for 2022 disaster...let's see if they can conjure up anything showing as much promise as 2011's bounce.

How good is it having the footy back?

 

[Farang83150]

I thought he said Waterman should have played instead of Darling

Yeah that's how I read it

 

[Farang83150]

He sprouted some crap but also a few truths, I don't actually mind a former player having a crack at us, keeps people on their toes, throws a bit of a spotlight on those that probably deserve it.

 

[kempy]

The West don’t have sub-editors it seems otherwise Sumich’s piece would be less of a dog’s breakfast in the way his arguments and points are organised.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[thebutterflyeffect]

Final line in that article

“Any new era should have been launched two to three years ago and be bearing fruit.”

Three years ago was the start of the 2020 season. We had just added Tim Kelly in the 2019 draft period to a side that had won a premiership a year earlier

And Sumich is saying we should have been launching a new era back then??

We went to the draft in 2021 and brought Chesser, Hough and Bazzo to the club that’s went the list transition started for anyone paying attention

That's a fair observation but Suma also made a fair observation when he pointed out Simmo mentioned us being young and inexperienced when we were older and more experienced than the team we lost to. I don't have a particular issue with Simmo and maybe he can turn it around but signs are not great when you compare our performance since 2021 to list profile

 

[Ghossein]

I thought he said Waterman should have played instead of Darling

I see what you're saying now, but the argument is a bit incoherent.

West Coast had 10 players from the 2018 premiership team, as well as recruits Tim Kelly and Jayden Hunt, plus veteran Andrew Gaff.

First reference to three older midfielders and defenders.

Continuing to play some of these older players is wasting valuable development time for younger and emerging Eagles, such as Jake Waterman who was left out because he was apparently underdone.

Continuation of first point, where he then references Waterman off the back of "these older players" (meaning Kelly Hunt and Gaff)?

Even argues against himself noting that Waterman was underdone.

But then the match committee picks Jack Darling, with no pre-season games and limited training over the past month. And Waterman misses out on an extra game to improve his AFL career.

Then circles back to point the finger at the decision to select Darling, who shouldn't have been played because he is underdone, despite him previously noting Waterman was also underdone?

 

[bzparkes]

Suma hitting nails on head IMO. Salty posters with truth aversion syndrome making some quality deflections.

Simpson and the coaches appear to have largely got a mulligan for 2022 disaster...let's see if they can conjure up anything showing as much promise as 2011's bounce.

How good is it having the footy back?

Hard to take anyone seriously when they come off as salty as Sumich. Then there's the fact that this year there's a sample size of one whole game to go off.

If the next 6 weeks are bad, by all means pile in.

There's also the fact that we lost by 5 points. The way people are reacting on the media, as well as this forum, would make someone reading it believe we got smashed by 50+.

-37 in contested ball isn't great but the fact that we lost by less than a goal would give it some form of indication that perhaps this stat isn't as important as people like to make out.

I'm much more interested in missed tackles, fumbles, handballs missing easy targets and kicking efficiency.

What you do with the ball is arguably more important than what you do without it.

 

[ConcreteWaters]

Suma has gone to the toilet with a big diarrhea- a little bit hit the mark in the bowl but there's an awful lot of crap sprayed everywhere else

 

[Ghossein]

OUT: Darling, Kelly, Gaff, Ryan
IN: McKinley, McGinnity, Ebert, Weedon

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

I see what you're saying now, but the argument is a bit incoherent.


First reference to three older midfielders and defenders.

Continuation of first point, where he then references Waterman off the back of "these older players" (meaning Kelly Hunt and Gaff)?

Even argues against himself noting that Waterman was underdone.

Then circles back to point the finger at the decision to select Darling, who shouldn't have been played because he is underdone, despite him previously noting Waterman was also underdone?

Yeah it takes some following. But the reference to Kelly, Gaff and Hunt was just to fill out the number of senior players that were in the side - 10 premiership players plus three experienced guys who weren’t in the premiership side for various reasons.

Then referring solely to Waterman didn’t help - what about Hough?

 

[squashface]

I can’t go anywhere without Eagles fans venting their anger and disgust at how far West Coast have tumbled in such a short time.

Enough is enough.

Let’s not take a lame approach in assessing what is going wrong at the Eagles.

There’s been enough of the comfort zone and virtually unquestioned existence that the West Coast coach, assistant coaches and administration have enjoyed for at least two years now.

Too many old Eagles players are too slow and playing self-survival footy. The game has become so brutally quick moving that more soft tissue injuries are likely as West Coast lumber through what looms as another horrific season.

The club’s members, fans and corporate faithful deserve a lot better.

Adam Simpson declared the Eagles were “fitter” than they have been for at least two years. All that indicates is that they’ve caught up to where they should have been 24 months ago, while the rest of an unforgiving AFL competition is well advanced.

Unless Simpson and his football support staff can dramatically turn things around in the space of a week and knock over Greater Western Sydney at home on Sunday afternoon, a disaster is brewing.

West Coast have now lost 28 of their past 32 games, since June 27, 2021, when they were sitting seventh on the ladder during the round 14 bye.

That’s a win ratio of 12.5 per cent since then.

Simpson’s Eagles confront a hell of a difficult schedule through April and May, putting a proud club on a path to another totally unacceptable bottom-of-the-table finish.

They have Fremantle in round three, then Melbourne here, Geelong and Port Adelaide in successive outings at Adelaide Oval, followed by Carlton and Richmond.

They’re all serious finals contenders for 2023. It’s a depressing outlook trying to find a win somewhere there. That has Simpson, right, pleading for patience from members and fans, while at the same time making promises of some wins on their home turf.

The Eagles have won just two of their past 17 home games — against St Kilda who sat in 12th in June 2021 and then 16th-placed Essendon in late June last year.

Back in 2010, I was an assistant coach when the Eagles had finished last for the first time in 24 years. We had missed finals for three consecutive seasons — another unacceptable first.

Chief executive Trevor Nisbett brought John Worsfold, who was coach at the time, and myself into his office.

Nisbett was brutal in his message that Worsfold and I should be sacked, despite each of us having a year to run on our contracts.

If it had not been for our service as decorated players and coaches at West Coast, we would have been sitting in exit meetings, Nisbett told us.

We had won just 16 games of a possible 66 at a terrible 24.2 per cent.

The year after, we finished fourth and made it to a preliminary final — the biggest rise for a wooden spoon team in AFL history.

There’s clearly a greater tolerance from Nisbett towards Simpson.

The current board has also endorsed Simpson with an absence of any apparent development strategies over the past two to three seasons.

The lack of development for younger players on their list has drastically exposed a lack of talent to cover the decline of ageing stars who, granted, took West Coast to the 2018 premiership.

Simpson is securely contracted through until the end of 2025.

All too often there’s a distinct lack of intensity. There’s a languid nature about the Eagles.

Last Saturday, to open the new season, West Coast lacked effort from the first bounce.

Some of the powerbrokers should be very angry about what is going on and, unfortunately, there are no signs on the horizon of any great improvement.

The Eagles turned in an inept first-half performance to lay the foundation for a season-opening loss to North Melbourne.

The coach had laid claim to being “underdogs” leading into the clash of last year’s two bottom sides and then declared post-match that they’d “gone there to win.”

West Coast lacked aggression, fight and hunger right through the first half.

The players turned up to the game with a soft attitude and a lack of urgency and effort was evident from the outset.

There’s no excuse for such a lame start to a season when the coach has made public his intentions for improvement, especially as he gets his better players back into the side.

Yet still, they lost a game they should have won.

West Coast took a vastly more experienced unit into that game, despite Simpson claiming his side was “young” and learning.

North, who had won just nine games in the past three seasons, had more urgency for the contest and gave their faithful something to look forward to with their effort.

West Coast had 10 players from the 2018 premiership team, as well as recruits Tim Kelly and Jayden Hunt, plus veteran Andrew Gaff.

Continuing to play some of these older players is wasting valuable development time for younger and emerging Eagles, such as Jake Waterman who was left out because he was apparently underdone.

But then the match committee picks Jack Darling, with no pre-season games and limited training over the past month. And Waterman misses out on an extra game to improve his AFL career.

West Coast had an average age of 25.7 years and experience of 111.5 games for each player on Sunday. North averaged 23.8 years and 80.2 games among their 23.

Darling, at 30 with 257 games behind him, had just five disposals at half-time, with fellow premiership forward Liam Ryan having just four touches as the Kangaroos dominated a more experienced West Coast outfit.

There was an alarming contested possession differential, with North having 27 more to half-time, when they led clearances 24-11, exposing a lack of effort to contest from the Eagles.

It will be argued that West Coast forwards were starved of scoring chances.

But surely capitalising on limited chances necessitates Darling, on $1 million this season, not muffing set shots.

Instead he kicked three behinds and another out on the full in three terms.

West Coast and Simpson need to be accountable for poor development when it comes to the imminent loss of ruckman Nic Naitanui. This was never more evident than during heir-apparent Bailey Williams’ shabby performance.It was Williams’ chance to lead the ruck after the Roos lost Tristan Xerri to injury — against a third-tier ruckman in 20-year-old Charlie Comben, who was playing just his third game.

Williams was lamentable.

But the 22-year-old probably should have played more than his 27 games in the past two seasons in preparation for Naitanui’s ongoing injury absences and approaching retirement.

There’s so much uncertainty at West Coast that rests on the program run by Simpson, in what he has described at different times as “transition” and now a “new era” with little to no evidence of strategy to prepare for these claims.

Any new era should have been launched two to three years ago and be bearing fruit.

That’s a lot of words to say “I’m a little salty whiny campaigner”

Great player for us but gee he talks some shit.

 

[Keys]

It’s only my opinion, but 2022 should be set aside in any discussion around Simpson. There was so much going on that wins/losses are borderline irrelevant. If anything, Simpson getting the playing group through that year without any signs of a rift is an achievement in itself

He needs to be judged on this year and how he navigates a transition from old to new

The North game wasn’t a great start predominantly due to our inability to be remotely competitive in contested ball/clearance work

That said, adjustments were made and we were able to get ourselves back in the game and have a legitimate shot at winning it

Plenty of people were tipping us to be bottom 4 again, then act surprised/outraged when we play like one

In terms of round 1, ours wasn’t the worst performance by a team on the weekend either

 

[ZergMinion]

How good is it having the blowtorch on the squad all week coming into a winnable game at home.

Should make for good in-person viewing on Sunday. Or we can fire up the Harley Reid threads

 

[Goldfish]

Per foxsports

Eagles’ burning question: Where is the fight?

West Coast endured a season from hell in 2022 and were expected to come out firing this year in Round 1. Instead, the Eagles were belted in contested ball by a team that had won just nine games across three seasons. In the last five years, statistics show the Eagles have been ranked 17th in the competition for contested disposal differential. Against the Roos last week, they finished -37 in contested ball. “This is a West Coast Eagles brand that is being damaged right now,” Fox Footy’s Garry Lyon warned. While Jonathan Brown has accused senior players of simply “resting on their laurels”.

If there were ever 2 statements that encapsulate where its breaking down, its the above

Nice that they pull out a stat for the last 5 years, one of which we won a flag...

Don't get me wrong, there's some big issues at the club. Just found the above stat amusing.