MEGA THREAD***** Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

[Amber Guzzler]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

I don't have a still frame showing his direct contact above the shoulder, because the only slow-mo angle I have is from behind hodge, but it pretty clear to me that there is only one place Reid's upper arm can be, and that is over Hodge's shoulder. In any case, if you think the tackle was on the bicep the whole time, then you are mistaken, as the replay clearly shows in the first frames of the tackle that his hand is on hodge's lower arm, and slips up to his bicep later. It is not about what Reid's hand is doing, it is about where his upper arm is.

Anyway, this is rather pointless, there are a bunch of other decisions I'm sure we could argue about, like the much easier to see on the replay, hand on the shoulder of Buddy from Tarrant at around the 9:40 mark in the last quarter, or whether Dawes was pushed in the back in front of goals, but it is unlikely we'd agree on those either. It is fair enough that you don't accept the opinions of an opposition supporter, and if you are not going to accept the majority neutral supporter opinions either, we are at an impasse, and further discussion seems somewhat pointless. Congrats on Swan's win last night, that one certainly was well deserved

I think it's quite amusing that 2 of the three incidents where Dawes was hardly done by, you said he took a dive, while ignoring the fact that Hodge was clearly playing for a free kick. BTW, I'm still waiting for you to define what you mean by "neutral supporter", especially as it was you that said it's difficult to find an unbiased opinion when it comes to Collingwood. The various hawthorn supporters in this thread that have said there was nothing wrong with the umpiring, do you think they have biased opinions? Or will you simply continue to ignore that point, like you've done with any other that shows the holes in your arguments?

 

[TheLip]

I would respond to this thread but all I'm reading is mwah, mwah, mwah! Have I accidentally stumbled into the cry baby's board?

 

[Amber Guzzler]

I would respond to this thread but all I'm reading is mwah, mwah, mwah! Have I accidentally stumbled into the cry baby's board?

You're not wrong, this thread should be sponsored by Kleenex and Tampax.

 

[hk89]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

BTW, I'm still waiting for you to define what you mean by "neutral supporter", especially as it was you that said it's difficult to find an unbiased opinion when it comes to Collingwood.

You have reading comprehension problems, which doesn't surprise me given your mis-interpretations of other events, here is what I actually said:

While you can argue that there is no such thing as a neutral where the pies are concerned, many of these people also have very little love for the hawks.

See the difference? I said you could argue it, I didn't say it would be a good argument, and I never said you couldn't find unbiased opinions on Collingwood. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

The various hawthorn supporters in this thread that have said there was nothing wrong with the umpiring, do you think they have biased opinions?

Or will you simply continue to ignore that point, like you've done with any other that shows the holes in your arguments?

I already responded to this in my last reply.

Lots of umpiring mistakes were made, your team won. Those are facts we both seem to agree on. I'm done with the whinging for now. Enjoy grand final week.

 

[TheLip]

You're not wrong, this thread should be sponsored by Kleenex and Tampax.

Seriously, I thought BF had opened up a juniors board for kids who want to argue every decision that goes against them. Maybe they have!

 

[hk89]

You're not wrong, this thread should be sponsored by Kleenex and Tampax.

Very amusing, the Kleenex for the crying non-pies fans, and the Tampax for the rest of you *****?

 

[Hawkforce]

Look, I think we all accept that COllingwood's Preliminary final win is tainted beyond repair, so it's time we all moved on.

 

[Hawkforce]

Lol. Just brought myself to watch the replay.

Lol at Collingwood supporters claiming they were hard done by. Just... Lol.

Great game though.

 

[Elite]

- Dawes in the back should have been paid, zero impact on the game though, as Wellingham got a (legitimate) high free seconds late.
- Dawes not paid in the back in front of goals because he took a dive.
- Blair HTB was a bit rough on the prior opportunity, but it cancelled out the deliberate by Tarrant missed seconds earlier which was going to result on a shot at goal, so likely zero impact. In any case "results in goal" is subjective, there was not a goal directly from that free kick, if you want to look at goals that were kicked from possession chains that started with a free (or missed free, or 50 m penalty), almost all (if not all) of your first half goals were scored like that.
- Not sure on the Burgoyne incident, and I would need to read the rule book, he did handball, when the handball didn't go far enough , he tapped it to help it along. I guess this might be incorrect disposal.
- Mitchell's was not HTB, he had no prior opportunity (around 0.3-0.5 seconds from taking possession to being tackled), so the fact that the ball fell out in the tackle was irrelevant.
- The diving on the ball incident in front of goals I don't recall, you'd have to name the Hawks player for me to check.

So most of your "even upperers" either didn't happen the way you thought they did, or had low impact on the game. You list the impact of several, as robbing you of an inside 50, you only scored goals from 25% of inside 50s, so even if these were all legitimate (which they are not), they are also low impact compared to a frees missed directly in front of goal (like the hodge high, or the tarrant over the shoulder on buddy), or goals incorrectly rewarded (like happened with the illegal shepherd on Gibson).

Yes, the umpire made mistakes in both directions, they hurt us more than they hurt you. You won, we lost. I can see why hawks fans might find it hard to move on. I'm not sure why pies fans have trouble accepting the majority neutral fan verdict, and move on to enjoying GF week.



I can make up imaginary friends too. Several non-imaginary pies supporters I've spoken to admit the pies didn't deserve to win (Like swann last night), and that their team got help from the umpires in the last quarter. As you say, when you take away the keyboard, people seem to get a lot more reasonable.

Yes, shock horror, I have real life human friends who support the hawks, and they actually enter my home, where the TV is........and I didn't invite them via social media, hard for you to believe, I know, but it does happen out here, away from internet land

And yes, when humans are presented with evidence, in real time, it's hard for adults to act like children and deny it, because it makes them look like idiots, in real life...I'm sure you understand though

If you cant accept they were free kicks, then dont expect anyone to accept a few "we were robbed" frees that you seem to think lost you the game were incorrect.......

And I'm not gonna name the hawk player that dived on the ball, I mentioned when it occurred and were, if you really watched the replay with dry eyes, you would see it.


But if a true neutral watched the last quarter, and counted the frees I mentioned, they would all be paid. You can have your frees that you think the umpire got wrong, but if the umpire also correctly awarded the collingwood missed frees, we would have won by a few goals, because the Pies out played, out performed and out scored the hawks. It really is that simple.

Most people realise this, except anyone who can't stand the pies getting through to another GF.

 

[Amber Guzzler]

Lol. Just brought myself to watch the replay.

Lol at Collingwood supporters claiming they were hard done by. Just... Lol.

Great game though.

Which Collingwood supporters are you talking about? Most of them say the umpiring was fair. You know, mistakes on both sides. It's those that make claims like your tainted claim above that are only seeing it from one side and crying about it.

 

[PieNSauce]

Look, I think we all accept that COllingwood's Preliminary final win is tainted beyond repair, so it's time we all moved on.

lol. Yep, just sounds like more mwah, mwah, mwah to me. I'm sure if you ask nicely mummy will buy you a new dummy. That one you threw out is all dirty now!

 

[TheLip]

Lol. Just brought myself to watch the replay.

Lol at Collingwood supporters claiming they were hard done by. Just... Lol.

Great game though.

You have to love reading stuff like this. I was in awe of some of the Hawks supporters who just moved on and saw it for what it was but it warms the cockles of your heart to know that bad sports get offended this bad!

 

[Rustin Cohle]

Is it really any surprise that BigFooty once again over-analyses something to the point of ridiculousness? I watched the last quarter with two Carlton supporters and a St. Kilda supporter. They all hate Collingwood, but none of them mentioned the umpiring as being anything other than standard.

Only on BigFooty can people talk for 28 pages about umpiring decisions that really had no effect on the end result of a football match.

Honestly, if the roles were reversed here nearly every one of the people bitching in this thread would be telling Collingwood supporters to shut up and get over it - and rightfully so.

 

[Chief]

No effect on the game?

I disagree completely. Reasons given earlier in the thread.

Hawks fell apart but Pies were gifted at least two goals, more like three, in really obvious, clear and uncomplicated situations. We're not talking borderline calls which could go either way based on simple positioning or human perception, but obvious calls.

This rubbish with umps evening up the frees to cover over their rubbish calls has to end. Ignoring some rules - like holding the man in the goal square - based on some idealised form of the game is just as crap.

The game deserves better umpiring - at least in a tight finals match if nowhere else.

Should be a Cats v Hawks Grand Final.

But it isn't so I'll leave it there.

 

[Nardz]

No effect on the game?

I disagree completely. Reasons given earlier in the thread.

Hawks fell apart but Pies were gifted at least two goals, more like three, in really obvious, clear and uncomplicated situations. We're not talking borderline calls which could go either way based on simple positioning or human perception, but obvious calls.

This rubbish with umps evening up the frees to cover over their rubbish calls has to end. Ignoring some rules - like holding the man in the goal square - based on some idealised form of the game is just as crap.

The game deserves better umpiring - at least in a tight finals match if nowhere else.

Should be a Cats v Hawks Grand Final.

But it isn't so I'll leave it there.

lol you're still going with this issue? if the game had have been won by hawthorn and collingwood supporters started a thread about being robbed by umpires, I bet you or one of your mods would have closed it 200 posts in. the double standards here are bewildering.

FWIW, why don't you comment on the goals that hawthorn got from umpiring decisions? they had 3-4 chances directly from free kicks in the first 3 quarters, that they just didnt convert (but hey, the decisions till went their way!), and they had one in the last quarter that resulted in a goal. one of the worst holding the balls ever against jarryd blair when he clearly had no prior opportunity.

face it, your judgement is clearly impeded by your anti-collingwood bias. as others have mentioned in this thread, there is no such thing as a neutral fan when collingwood is involved. we were torn a new one for 3 quarters, and everyone whinges about 2 decisions in the last when the rest of the quarter was fairly even. perhaps you'd be happier if the umpires started kicking goals against us?

 

[TheLip]

Oh my god... The baby cry-fest continues. You wouldn't have thought there were this many poor sports in the country let alone on one forum!

 

[hawkman]

Just a general comment but it would have been good to see the Geish try to justify some of the decisions for both sides on his weekly video instead of talk about the umpires are selected for the GF. (Does anyone really care how umpires are selected?)

 

[MinerBoy]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

way to show that you don't know the rules

deliberate rushed behind is only deemed deliberate if he was not under any pressure.

From 25m away that is a fair cop out to rush 'under pressure'. Regardless, knocking it accidentally oob when trying to rush a behind is also meant to be called deliberate.

 

[MinerBoy]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

twas shit both ways for most of the night.

54 free kicks paid, which is far too many for a high pressure prelim. By comparison last years prelims & GFs averaged 30/game.

Put the whistle away you maggots.

Yeah, it was tiggy touch wood stuff all night. A lot of 'technically there' frees were paid to both sides that most people would be happy to see let go. Then in the last Q they refuse to pay some of the most blatant decisions of the night that have a massive scoreboard impact.

 

[TheLip]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

Yeah, it was tiggy touch wood stuff all night. A lot of 'technically there' frees were paid to both sides that most people would be happy to see let go. Then in the last Q they refuse to pay some of the most blatant decisions of the night that have a massive scoreboard impact.

...as they did all night!

57 pages of bad sportsmanship and counting!

 

[MinerBoy]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

...as they did all night!

57 pages of bad sportsmanship and counting!

Never mind, we understand. You follow Collingwood.

 

[TheLip]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

Never mind, we understand. You follow Collingwood.

Never mind we understand your a bad sport!

You can sugar coat it however you like but we all know you can't polish a terd and blaming umpires for your own failures is pure unadulterated bad sportsmanship. But hey, please feel free to continue embarrasing yourself and your fellow supporters.

 

[MinerBoy]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

Never mind we understand your a bad sport!

You can sugar coat it however you like but we all know you can't polish a terd and blaming umpires for your own failures is pure unadulterated bad sportsmanship. But hey, please feel free to continue embarrasing yourself and your fellow supporters.

How hard it must be to just say we were lucky.

I'm not embarrassed and nor did I fail. I, and many other people, have simply commented on the poor umpiring display in a game we were only spectators to.

You can continue your moral posturing all you like. I'm sure it will make you and your Pie chums feel better but the majority can't all be wrong.

 

[Amber Guzzler]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

How hard it must be to just say we were lucky.

How hard is it to show a little sportsmanship, and say "we were outplayed in the last qtr", rather than "the umpires won it for them"? With the number of bad decisions that either gave you scoring opportunities or denied them from us, you'd have to be seriously one-eyed to say the latter.

 

[Rustin Cohle]

Re: Hawthorn vs Collingwood + umpires

Just on the last quarter, was Guerra reported for his high hit on Wellingham? Surely that is worth at least a week based on previous incidents and force of the hit. I think it was accidental, but I don't think that matters with the MRP.

I'm not looking to start an argument over it, just genuinely interested.