Coach Men's Senior Coach: Brad Scott

[MattyB3150]

So apparently AFL clarified with Scott that the Clarke, Draper and Menzie decisions were mistakes. But Ridley and Stewart ones were ticked off.

I thought the Ridley one was Ok - it was a perfect tackle and sometimes that has to be rewarded. He had an arm free but the tackle was too good and he couldn’t dispose.

Apparently Stewart had no prior so incorrect disposal not a factor. (1) He absolutely did have prior and (2) since when does not having prior mean you can just drop the footy in a tackle and not get penalised? A bewildering explanation.

From what I heard they said he did have prior but aslong as you “attempt” to dispose of it then it’s play on.

 

[Vander18]

From what I heard they said he did have prior but aslong as you “attempt” to dispose of it then it’s play on.

The Stewart one you mean?

Maybe I misheard. Still raises the same question…..you can’t just drop the footy in a tackle right? Is incorrect disposal not a thing anymore?

 

[P Money]

Jesus we are talking about sacking the coach now? The one guy that has managed to finally finally finally turn the dial on our organisational professionalism and playing culture after 20 absolutely shite years of mediocrity, because why exactly? We're not looking like winning the premiership in his second year with a bog average list? Christ almighty.

 

[MattyB3150]

The Stewart one you mean?

Maybe I misheard. Still raises the same question…..you can’t just drop the footy in a tackle right? Is incorrect disposal not a thing anymore?

Yep the Stewart one when he was running out of defensive 50.
No wonder everyone cracks the shits when their stupid rules don’t make any sense.

 

[MiguelM]

Jesus we are talking about sacking the coach now? The one guy that has managed to finally finally finally turn the dial on our organisational professionalism and playing culture after 20 absolutely shite years of mediocrity, because why exactly? We're not looking like winning the premiership in his second year with a bog average list? Christ almighty.

People expect miracles. We are miles ahead of what even the most optomistic supporter could hope for. Problem is now some expect to win every week and compete for a flag now, totally unrealistic. There is a very good reason Scott came out and said 8 year plan and continually states how far we have to go.

He is effectively in his first season with total control of list/preseason training. For me he has totally transformed the whole club. Haven't had everyone onboard like this since the early in Sheedy's tenure. He has been a catalyst of monumental change whilst holding onto competing interests within the club. Even Sheedy (who agitated for Hird's return) completely onboard. Would have been so easy for Scott to get rid of Sheeds, Heppell, etc. But he got them to come with him.

No way the club would be sacking him anytime soon. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if he becomes a long term coach

 

[ant555]

I agree with most of what you said. It’s a tricky balance to maintain for sure.

As far as my “sports coaching” experience. It’s Zero. I’m not enough of a people person, and for whatever reason really struggle to connect with people who have an “athlete” personality. I have had other leadership roles in the past in unrelated fields and one of my talents is that I’m great at analysing and optimising systems/workflows.

That’s why personally I’m more interested in process and development and optimisation vs Did natural variance lead to a win/loss

Anyway back to footy talk.

I actually have probably a more positive view of Hepp/Kelly than you do. They have been good fringe AFL players this season and I’m glad that they are on the list.

I agree that you want vets to maintain structure and then float in a few learning players who bring energy/enthusiasm.

Where I bristle is the idea that a “Warrior” has more value than a rookie just because they are popular with the group, try hard and make less glaring mistakes.
After the deep cuts last offseason I expect every player (aside from Sheil) has a good attitude, and could deserve opportunity based on effort.

As far as how many young players can be fit in. I think it depends on the players and roles. Some roles are easier than others and are a better fit for developing players. Some roles are more Load Bearing than others.

See KPD2/3, HB, Wing, 3rd tall forward, tagger, Pressure forward being more forgiving

This is part of my issue with this current side. It’s that quite a few of the vets are skating by being largely unimpactful in non loadbearing roles.

Like I said above. This is based on what we see on the weekend. They are selecting the team not just based on the weekend but also understanding of the system in match sim and preparation and performance at training. The base of all of this is building the professional system again so it is a start from scratch.
I will not argue that there are some selections that would be borderline as far as football output v putting the systems in place and they will not get everything right. No club does.

 

[Beerfish]

The Stewart one you mean?

Maybe I misheard. Still raises the same question…..you can’t just drop the footy in a tackle right? Is incorrect disposal not a thing anymore?

You can if the umpire feels you've made an attempt to drop it on your foot or fist.

 

[joey_jo_jo]

You can if the umpire feels you've made an attempt to drop it on your foot or fist.

I know thats technically the interpretation now but it just doesnt pass the sniff test to me. Its rules making by people based on data analysis and no feel for the actual game.
Theyre obsessed with avoiding stoppages/speeding up ball movement but to me this example goes against the essence of the rule.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Jesus we are talking about sacking the coach now? The one guy that has managed to finally finally finally turn the dial on our organisational professionalism and playing culture after 20 absolutely shite years of mediocrity, because why exactly? We're not looking like winning the premiership in his second year with a bog average list? Christ almighty.

It’s hard to have a crack at the supporters for speculating, when the club itself sacks every coach after a couple of years.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I think one thing we need from Scott is to lose his attachment to Goldstein.

He has been awesome already for us and still has it, clearly… he was a great pickup.

But the guy can’t be any more than depth. He is 36yo and is not going to be in our next premiership.

Draper has still only played 65 games and Bryan 15. They need to play ahead of him.

Unless Scott has had some major epiphany and now believes we’re going to win the flag this year, that’s the way it has to be.

 

[Beerfish]

I know thats technically the interpretation now but it just doesnt pass the sniff test to me. Its rules making by people based on data analysis and no feel for the actual game.
Theyre obsessed with avoiding stoppages/speeding up ball movement but to me this example goes against the essence of the rule.

AFL:

 

[Vander18]

You can if the umpire feels you've made an attempt to drop it on your foot or fist.

Right…..but you missed, so incorrect disposal….no?

I mean incorrect disposal can only occur if there is an attempt to dispose.

 

[Beerfish]

Right…..but you missed, so incorrect disposal….no?

I mean incorrect disposal can only occur if there is an attempt to dispose.

Incorrect disposal occurs when the umpire deems you haven't made a convincing attempt to kick or handball and the ball also hasn't 'spilled out in the tackle' I think is the technical term.

 

[Vander18]

Incorrect disposal occurs when the umpire deems you haven't made a convincing attempt to kick or handball

So if there is intent, then the outcome of whether you disposed of the footy correctly or not doesn’t actually matter? That’s absurd.

If you have prior but caught in tackle so good you can’t dispose of the ball correctly….that has to HTB. The AFL are idiots.

 

[Beerfish]

So if there is intent, then the outcome of whether you disposed of the footy correctly or not doesn’t actually matter? That’s absurd.

If you have prior but caught in tackle so good you can’t dispose of the ball correctly….that has to HTB. The AFL are idiots.

AFL:

 

[boncer34]

Jesus we are talking about sacking the coach now? The one guy that has managed to finally finally finally turn the dial on our organisational professionalism and playing culture after 20 absolutely shite years of mediocrity, because why exactly? We're not looking like winning the premiership in his second year with a bog average list? Christ almighty.

I am fully with you that sacking him is absurd talk.

But I don't think you can say this yet. We've seen this story before, get halfway through a season in reasonable shape and then fall in a hole.

Saturday was classic Essendon, all gets a little bit hard and we give up. The response from here on will be what tells us if he's changed anything, do we breathe fire and keep the season alive? Or do we do what we've done for 20 years and when the pressures on fall away?

 

[faible]

Saturday was classic Essendon, all gets a little bit hard and we give up. The response from here on will be what tells us if he's changed anything, do we breathe fire and keep the season alive? Or do we do what we've done for 20 years and when the pressures on fall away?

We probably need 5 more wins for finals, so I expect:

'Honourable' loss to Collingwood where we're competitive to HT then slowly fade away, smash Melbourne, win against Adelaide and St Kilda for 3 in a row, get ahead of ourselves, lose to Freo at home, beat GCS at home, think our finals chances are ALIVE, lose by 140 to Sydney at Marvel, somehow beat Brisbane at the GABBA by 2 points to limp in to finals where we play the Bulldogs and chalk up a 10 goal loss.

 

[Vander18]

Saturday was classic Essendon, all gets a little bit hard and we give up

Equally classic Essendon to be in game where there is an opportunity to show we are “for real” ……and then shit the bed.

Every time there is expectation we go
missing. Watch us come out firing against Collingwood now that the narrative is “will they make the 8” and not “they are top 4 locks.”

Been happening for years and years now.

 

[Darealrath]

Incorrect disposal occurs when the umpire deems you haven't made a convincing attempt to kick or handball and the ball also hasn't 'spilled out in the tackle' I think is the technical term.

I've long thought the 'spilled out in tackle' element they've tacked on in recent years to keep the game moving is cause for a lot of the angst.

It should be relatively simple:

• If you had prior opportunity, are tackled, and don't dispose of the ball (correctly), then HTB.
  • If the ball spills or is knocked out in the tackle that's still HTB, whether you are trying to dispose if it or not.
• If you didn't have prior opportunity, are tackled, then it's only HTB if you are making no attempt to dispose of the ball in a legal way.
• If you dive on the footy you lose the right to prior opportunity and must dispose of the ball (correctly).
• If you are not tackled but the ball is hit out of your hands then that's not a tackle so not HTB, even if you had prior.

The issue seems to be that the ball spilling or being knocked out in a tackle can be called play on even if you had prior opportunity. But it appears to be a lottery as to whether the umpire deems it being knocked out or incorrect disposal, which leaves everyone confused.

 

[Beerfish]

I've long thought the 'spilled out in tackle' element they've tacked on in recent years to keep the game moving is cause for a lot of the angst.

It should be relatively simple:

• If you had prior opportunity, are tackled, and don't dispose of the ball (correctly), then HTB.
  • If the ball spills or is knocked out in the tackle that's still HTB, whether you are trying to dispose if it or not.
• If you didn't have prior opportunity, are tackled, then it's only HTB if you are making no attempt to dispose of the ball in a legal way.
• If you dive on the footy you lose the right to prior opportunity and must dispose of the ball (correctly).
• If you are not tackled but the ball is hit out of your hands then that's not a tackle so not HTB, even if you had prior.

The issue seems to be that the ball spilling or being knocked out in a tackle can be called play on even if you had prior opportunity. But it appears to be a lottery as to whether the umpire deems it being knocked out or incorrect disposal, which leaves everyone confused.

The AFL need the grey areas because that's where they live.

 

[joey_jo_jo]

The AFL need the grey areas because that's where they live.

Yeah fair point, it creates content!

 

[yodellinhank]

Every time there is expectation we go
missing. Watch us come out firing against Collingwood now that the narrative is “will they make the 8” and not “they are too 4 locks.”

Been happening for years and years now.

That would actually be nice though. Sucks to be last week.

 

[Vander18]

That would actually be nice though. Sucks to be last week.

It sucks to be every week when you know it’s all just building up to another last week….

 

[MiguelM]

Predictably measured and diplomatic takes on 360 tonight. He is a very impressive speaker.

 

[ghostdog]

Jesus we are talking about sacking the coach now? The one guy that has managed to finally finally finally turn the dial on our organisational professionalism and playing culture after 20 absolutely shite years of mediocrity, because why exactly? We're not looking like winning the premiership in his second year with a bog average list? Christ almighty.

Who's talking about sacking anyone?