Oppo Camp Non-Essendon Football Thread XVI

[fishardansin]

Some random put it on Twitter:

It's all good under the Hood!

 

[ant555]

Melbourne were a basket case 10 years ago. We are not quite a basket case, but things can turn around quickly.

We have hit our rock bottom this year. We have found out that “we are Essendon” doesn’t work anymore. We have lost that arrogance because we haven’t been a good football club for a number of years.

I have no doubt in my mind that we will look at this time, in five years time and pinpoint it to when the club starting turning s**t around.

I am not doubting we are at rock bottom but as you mentioned Melbourne it took them over 5 seasons under Roos / Goodwin to turn it around. Even then the fell back down for a couple of seasons before winning a flag.
There still has to be a massive culture shift. Brasher and Truck pointed it out but could not get it moving. It is not an easy fix.

 

[Lore]

Alastair Clarkson, Chris Fagan and Mark Evans were accused by a fellow Hawthorn coach of running the football department like the “Russian Mafia’’, the club’s review of its handling of Indigenous players reveals.
Two pregnant partners of players lost their unborn children during the “traumatic events’’, the explosive Hawthorn-commissioned report also noted.

The report further concluded that between 2010 and 2016, coaches Clarkson, Fagan and Jason Burt used “bullying and intimidation’’ against Indigenous players and their partners, with the incidents so serious as to “amount to human rights abuses’’.

The Herald Sun has exclusively obtained the full report titled Cultural Safety Review: Of Past and Present Indigenous Players and Staff of the Hawthorn Football Club.

Clarkson, who was appointed North Melbourne coach in August, has categorically denied any wrongdoing.

On Tuesday, Brisbane coach Fagan said: “I confirm, as I said in my earlier statement, that I deny, categorically, the allegations of wrongdoing by me in relation to First Nations players at the Hawthorn Football Club, and that I intend to defend myself.’’

It is not possible for the Herald Sun to independently verify the claims or assertions made in the report and the paper does not suggest they are completely true and accurate, only that they have been made and are being investigated by various bodies.

The report asserted that the alleged treatment at the club of First Nations players involved “bullying and intimidation tactics … to be used to isolate First Nations players from their families and communities”.

These “aggressive intimidatory actions were undertaken by the most senior of the coaching and management hierarchy’’, wrote the review’s authors, led by project manager Phil Egan.

A Hawks coach, who the Herald Sun has chosen not to name, told the reviewers: “If you dare question their methods, you were frozen out.”

“I knew this day would come,’’ the insider told the authors, according to the report.

The whistleblower coach, who is not Indigenous, “reached out’’ to the authors of the report who up to that point had only interviewed Indigenous people in order to corroborate parts of the testimonies from players and their partners.

“He went on to say Evans, Clarkson, Fagan and Burt operated the football department like The Russian Mafia,” the report said.

The review includes several pages of harrowing testimony from three partners of players and another player.

As was revealed last week, one testimony claimed Clarkson told a player he should terminate their unborn child.

The report asserts that “partners of players who have tabled the serious allegations were in the early stages of pregnancy, with two mothers losing their unborn child during these traumatic events’’.

The testimony of one partner said: “For three grown men (Clarkson, Fagan and Burt) to have walked into my house with no warning, and intimidate, trap and bully me full well knowing I’m carrying a child is just by no means acceptable.

“I was in complete agony after they left, I felt like my world had just come crashing down.

“If anything was to happen to this baby I would have no choice but to hold the Hawthorn Football Club and those three as individuals responsible and it is the last thing on earth I’d ever want to do.’’

A player told the authors: “My partner and daughter were then not allowed to fly over to Melbourne to come and see me until my daughter was four months old, as the club had told my partner and myself that they would be a distraction to my football career.

“When I was delisted, all my past trauma resurfaced, and I have been extremely unwell since. I am now deemed disabled, and I am on disability support pension, and I am also awaiting NDIS funding for a full time support worker to work with me 7 days a week.

“I have had multiple suicide attempts, multiple stays in the mental health unit at the hospital … the trauma that I deal with every day is because of the way the Club treated myself and my family.’’

Another testimony described a Clarkson visit to their home. “Alister (sic) Clarkson came over to visit us one night. I remember his comments as soon as he entered the house because I was so shocked. Clarko – “Oh (player’s name) this house is nice, you have the kids artwork up and it’s nice and clean. You should invite your teammates over for dinner and things. For all they know you’re living in a shack in the desert somewhere”.

‘’I was insulted straight away. It was clear that this Hawthorn official had a view on how Aboriginal people live and he wasn’t shy in voicing it.’’

Burt and Evans were contacted for comment, but did not respond before publication.

‘Human rights abuse’: Hawks’ ‘Russian Mafia’ tactics exposed

Alastair Clarkson, Chris Fagan and Mark Evans were accused by a fellow Hawthorn coach of running the football department like the “Russian Mafia’’, the club’s review of its handling of Indigenous players reveals.

www.codesports.com.au

 

[The Prosecutor]

The Hawthorn board banning any discussion on this investigation over the past few days is bizarre.

Imagine if this board locked any threads on ASADA back in the day.

 

[Eleven 38]

It honestly makes me sick that Clarkson and Fagan seriously think that saying those things to the indigenous players isn't wrong.

Hopefully the investigation finishes up quickly.

 

[Old Campaigner]

It honestly makes me sick that Clarkson and Fagan seriously think that saying those things to the indigenous players isn't wrong.

Hopefully the investigation finishes up quickly.

It shouldn't take long, I think the biggest delay is the AFL trying to find a big enough broom to sweep all of this under the rug.

 

[TheGrizz]

The Hawthorn board banning any discussion on this investigation over the past few days is bizarre.

Imagine if this board locked any threads on ASADA back in the day.

Their board, their rules.
If they want to stick their head in the sand they are free to do so.

Not gonna mitigate the pain when the freight train arrives for them, it would seem.

 

[ant555]

I think that the report of an assistant saying the club was run like the Russian mafia rules out the likes of Yze being involved in any of the meetings.

 

[The Devils Advocate]

The Hawthorn board banning any discussion on this investigation over the past few days is bizarre.

Imagine if this board locked any threads on ASADA back in the day.

Always been pea-hearted, fair weather fans. They'll be back to 20 members soon with this going on, and no Tassie dollars.

 

[Corleone]

Growing up in country NSW in a town with a large Koori population I've heard a million little comments like the one Clarkson allegedly made;

"Alister (sic) Clarkson came over to visit us one night. I remember his comments as soon as he entered the house because I was so shocked. Clarko – “Oh (player’s name) this house is nice, you have the kids artwork up and it’s nice and clean. You should invite your teammates over for dinner and things. For all they know you’re living in a shack in the desert somewhere""

There will be people who will tell you this is a harmless comment, no designed to offend or have any racist overtones at all. Those people are wrong. It's little comments like this that really hurt.

The AFL will be scrambling to cover all this up and at worst Clarkson will have to undergo some "cultural sensitivity training" or some nonsense non-punishment.

The AFL do not care about indigenous people, they only want to monetize them and their culture and feel good about themselves while doing it.

Shameful

 

[Beerfish]

I think they're going to have a hard time covering up the incoming class action..

 

[Lore]

 

[Lore]

 

[mike14]

I can't access the full article (because I'm too lazy to sign up!), is this a player aware or an administrator/coach/support staff award?
How would they recognise a players 'combined achievements across the men's and women's national leagues' when players can't play in both so can only achieve in one?

 

[Maddogm]

I can't access the full article (because I'm too lazy to sign up!), is this a player aware or an administrator/coach/support staff award?
How would they recognise a players 'combined achievements across the men's and women's national leagues' when players can't play in both so can only achieve in one?

my interpretation (purely from the headline) was club based. Ie. something like finishing 2nd in both comps puts you ahead of a club winning a premiership and a wooden spoon

 

[citizen-erased]

should be a game a week there.

 

[Runk]

I think they're going to have a hard time covering up the incoming class action..

The dildo of great consequence rarely arrives lubed

 

[mike14]

my interpretation (purely from the headline) was club based. Ie. something like finishing 2nd in both comps puts you ahead of a club winning a premiership and a wooden spoon

Ah that makes much more sense. I thought they were talking about an individual award

 

[eth-dog]

my interpretation (purely from the headline) was club based. Ie. something like finishing 2nd in both comps puts you ahead of a club winning a premiership and a wooden spoon

Done in the VAFA. SKOB or Xavs win every year

 

[Lore]

I can't access the full article (because I'm too lazy to sign up!), is this a player aware or an administrator/coach/support staff award?
How would they recognise a players 'combined achievements across the men's and women's national leagues' when players can't play in both so can only achieve in one?

The AFL has privately floated the idea of an official club championship award which would recognise combined achievements across the men’s and women’s national leagues.
While the concept is yet to be formalised, industry sources confirmed the idea was tabled earlier this year at a competition committee meeting and had received some initial support.

Part of the rationale behind such a move would be to encourage clubs to invest more time and resources into their AFLW programs, while also fostering greater senses of inclusiveness and reciprocal interest across the men’s and women’s competitions.

The prospect of prize money to accompany a title has also generated enthusiasm at club level.

A similar concept has already been initiated in the A-League, with men’s and women’s points being combined to produce an A-League club championship winner. Melbourne City was earlier this year awarded the inaugural A-League club championship.

An official club championship would be designed to encourage more resources towards a team’s AFLW program. Picture: Darrian Traynor/Getty Images
The idea also has parallels with the previous incarnation of the McClelland Trophy, which used to be awarded to the club that performed the best across the men’s senior, reserve and under 19 grades.

When the under 19 competition was dissolved in the early 1990s to make way for the TAC Cup, the AFL moved to award the McClelland Trophy to the team that finished atop the AFL senior ladder at the end of the home and away season, this year given to Geelong, who also claimed the much more coveted men’s premiership.

The proposal comes against a backdrop of uncertainty around the next phases of player movement within the national women’s league.

The AFL’s decision to expedite the start of season seven from early 2023 to August 2022 threw the conventional draft and player movement timeline off kilter. The league allowed some 17 year olds to be drafted and play this season after the competition was brought forward but when the next draft will be held, and which players will be eligible to be drafted, remains up in the air.

One school of thought within AFLW circles is the league could introduce a mini-draft at the end of the year for players who have previously been bypassed and then wait until late next year for the next conventional under 18 draft.

Players and clubs are also eager for greater clarity around whether the traditional sign and trade period will be held in this calendar year – after the late-November grand final – or if the league will defer the player movement period until early next year given season eight isn’t due to begin until August, 2023.

The upcoming draft period will be crucial for new sides like Sydney who have struggled in their first season. Picture: Phil Hillyard
CODE Sports has spoken to several sources who are hopeful that the sign and trade period is held before the Christmas break, allowing clubs and in particular part-time players to better prepare for 2023 and to decrease lingering uncertainty into the new year.

However planning is complicated by the fact that negotiations over a new collective bargaining agreement remain ongoing. The AFL’s recent clinching of a new television rights deal has paved the way for greater certainty in CBA talks between the league and AFL Players Association. A joint CBA involving both male and female players is being considered.

Female players received a 94 per cent pay increase in a one-year CBA signed four months ago.

Another issue for the league is competitive balance within AFLW. While Richmond recorded an upset win over the Brisbane Lions last weekend, there is considerable predictability of results in the women’s league. A series of blowouts – most notably Adelaide’s 15. 7 (97) to 0.1 (1) victory over Greater Western Sydney on Sunday – has raised concerns at some clubs.

The AFL weighted its AFLW fixture in an attempt to reduce mismatches but some have been unavoidable. Expansion sides Hawthorn and Sydney had been largely non-competitive until they clashed at Punt Road on Friday night, while the form of the Giants is a particular concern given they are competing for talent in NSW with fellow lightweights the Swans.

The Crows kept the Giants to just one point in their round five AFLW encounter. Picture: Mark Brake/Getty Images
The same six clubs made the finals in both seasons five and six, and five of that group appear on track to make this year’s finals, with only injury-hit Fremantle likely to fall out.

The lack of a national draft, a concession to the part-time nature of the league, is an impediment to the spread of talent. One suggestion raised at club level is for first-round draft picks to be forced into a national pool, helping lower sides obtain the best youngsters in the country.

While most of these issues are likely to eventually be overcome with full-time professionalism, there are mixed views within the industry as to the best way to mitigate against massive blowouts in the interim. The topic of equalisation was raised with coaches at a pre-season meeting.

A new CBA potentially affords the league the chance to introduce dramatic changes to player movement mechanisms but this would likely be balanced against concerns from fans around list stability given the already disruptive nature of three expansion waves in four years.

Perennial contenders Melbourne, Brisbane and Adelaide remain the three premiership favourites having retained the bulk of their nuclei across the 2022 expansion window. Relatively weaker sides like Carlton, the Bulldogs and Gold Coast were hit harder, although the Dogs have started the season strongly and look on their way to a first finals appearance since their 2018 premiership.

There is also a push from clubs for more games to be played at AFL men’s venues, with Lions premiership coach Craig Starcevich telling the ABC earlier this week that the league should “grab the game of the round every week and put it on Marvel.”

 

[doug85]

Selwood times his retirement perfectly. Goes out playing decently and captaining a flag.

 

[Hamez]

Selwood times his retirement perfectly. Goes out playing decently and captaining a flag.

They’d be a few clubs wanting his services in a off-field capacity.

 

[Pweter]

They’d be a few clubs wanting his services in a off-field capacity.

Have we interviewed him for CEO and/or head coach yet?

 

[Doss]

Insane

 

[The Devils Advocate]

They’d be a few clubs wanting his services in a off-field capacity.

Before the CTE kicks in.