Non Lions Discussion 2024

[Grasshopper17]

https://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/jacqui-lambie-lashes-out-over-dud-deal-for-tasmanian-afl-stadium/news-story/dfb4604e505949383ec1db8aeb75a79c

Senator Lambie called for the government to “tell AFL Australia that quite frankly the deal is a dud, and that’s it”.
..........................

He found the projected cost for the stadium would balloon to more than $1bn, “significantly” more than the government’s $775m estimate.

In response, Tasmanian minister Eric Abetz thanked Dr Gruen for his work and told the ABC that the government would be moving ahead with the project.

Yep, the stadium is cooked. Therefore so is the team.

Tasmania, yet again raising the benchmark for shooting oneself in the foot.

So pleased I left

 

[Nunez]

Yep, the stadium is cooked. Therefore so is the team.

Tasmania, yet again raising the benchmark for shooting oneself in the foot.

So pleased I left

You can take the boy out of Tasmania...

 

[Section 5]

I am not really a fan of an extending the competition to 19 teams let alone going to 20 to eliminate a bye.
If the Tasmania team fails to eventuate i won't lose any sleep over that.
Happy for a relocation of a Melbourne team to Tassie but that is unlikely.
Tasmania population is around 576K with 272k in Hobart.
Thats going to be very hard to get regular sponsorship dollars to keep the club afloat.
Canberra population is around 477k

An ACT/Canberra team makes more sense to me but that encroaches on the Giants territory.
However, i believe the Giants playing in Canberra is just stopping any growth where they are located.
dlanod would have a more enlightened view on that subject.
It does keep an AFL interest in Canberra though

ACT/Canberra has been playing AFL at state level for a long time and part of the then 2nd tier interstate competition.

Queensland, ACT (Canberra), NSW, Australian Amateurs regularly played off in the 50's & 60's
Then Tasmania joined in the 70's, 80's 90's.
Fitzroy travelled to Carrara in 1985 to play Queensland. Fitzroy 23-9-147 to Qld 5-13-43

 

[Grasshopper17]

Tasmania population is around 576K with 272k in Hobart.
Thats going to be very hard to get regular sponsorship dollars to keep the club afloat.

But Geelong manage just fine. As do the Newcastle Knights with a comparable population. Not to mention the North Queensland Cowboys.

I used to agree with you but there are some pretty clear examples here of so called "backwater" clubs achieving considerable success, both on and off field, the latter two from scratch within the last 30 years.

Financially it stacks up. Unfortunately not enough Tasmanians are able to embrace the concept of having to spend money to make money. And too many of the ones who are, leave.

 

[Elixuh]

Yep, the stadium is cooked. Therefore so is the team.

Tasmania, yet again raising the benchmark for shooting oneself in the foot.

So pleased I left

I did wonder why you had 8 fingers on one of your hands

 

[Grasshopper17]

I did wonder why you had 8 fingers on one of your hands

And that's one of my better traits.

 

[Dalions]

And that's one of my better traits.

I don’t think we should go any further on a Public forum.

 

[Section 5]

But Geelong manage just fine. As do the Newcastle Knights with a comparable population. Not to mention the North Queensland Cowboys.

I used to agree with you but there are some pretty clear examples here of so called "backwater" clubs achieving considerable success, both on and off field, the latter two from scratch within the last 30 years.

Financially it stacks up. Unfortunately not enough Tasmanians are able to embrace the concept of having to spend money to make money. And too many of the ones who are, leave.

The thing is Newcastle (465k) and The Cowboys (201k) are in NRL heartland so easy enough to get establish, that's why they do okay.
A better example would be the Redcliffe Dolphins but it is early days (10k). Once again in NRL heartland
Dolphins Average attendance for 2024 from AFL tables:
Home: 21,626
Away: 21,795
The same applies to Geelong (around 290k) being in AFL heartland.

From what i have read in the last 12 months about AFL in Tasmania is that it was in freefall in the number of teams that actually played in all Tasmania and attended the games.
In my opinion Tassie is not a heartland state of AFL but neither is it for any other football code.
The Hobart team and stadium most likely go ahead but i bet it will be a drain on the state government purses for a long time. Be that direct or indirect sponsorship. At least they only have the JackJumpers to fight for sponsorship dollars.
The AFL may have planned for more money in the next media deal by including Tasmania but with the recent Fox decision that deal could in fact be less.

When you start teams in the opposition sports heartland it is much harder

Brisbane & Sydney took ages to get a foothold in NRL territory. At least those two were in the largest & 3rd largest cities.
AFL is still considered a very minor sport to NRL in Brisbane and Sydney at least in all the main media outlets.
The Storm was the exception when they went to Melbourne but again it was the 2nd largest city so was always a good chance to be competitive and get enough sponsorship. The same with them being a very minor sport in Victoria.

GWS and the Suns are struggling big time to get recognition in NRL heartland. GWS are a very completive team.
The Suns look likely to improve each year, but it has not happened yet.
It may take these two teams longer than Brisbane and Sydney to establish themselves but at least they are located in arears of much bigger populations than Hobart so more opportunities for sponsorship.

 

[Grasshopper17]

The thing is Newcastle (465k) and The Cowboys (201k) are in NRL heartland so easy enough to get establish, that's why they do okay.

From what i have read in the last 12 months about AFL in Tasmania is that it was in freefall in the number of teams that actually played in all Tasmania and attended the games.
In my opinion Tassie is not a heartland state of AFL but neither is it for any other football code.

Oh dear. As the main premise for your argument this truly is a terrible take unfortunately.

Teams are declining all over Australia's "footy heartland", and that doesn't seem to be affecting AFL attendances and ratings in those other states.

On the flipside, you can look at it the opposite way and say that Tassie absolutely needs an AFL team to try to reverse that trend and give young people something to aspire to.

I'd also point out that basketball was certainly not a popular sport in Tasmania 10 years ago, but that hasn't stopped people getting behind the Jackjumpers at all. The same would absolutely apply with the AFL team, once they got over all the irrational melts regarding the stadium etc.

Finally, you only have to look at Hawthorn's attendances at York Park, which have stayed pretty consistent from their premiership era up to now, despite the fact that a relatively small proportion of Tasmanians actually follow Hawthorn, and that the games are played in Launceston, with a population of only 70,000. And even then it's chalk and cheese compared with the support a Tasmanian team would enjoy once it got off the ground.

Comparing putting an AFL team in Tassie with the challenges faced by the Giants and the Suns is absolutely laughable I'm afraid.

 

[Section 5]

Oh dear. As the main premise for your argument this truly is a terrible take unfortunately.

Teams are declining all over Australia's "footy heartland", and that doesn't seem to be affecting AFL attendances and ratings in those other states.

On the flipside, you can look at it the opposite way and say that Tassie absolutely needs an AFL team to try to reverse that trend and give young people something to aspire to.

I'd also point out that basketball was certainly not a popular sport in Tasmania 10 years ago, but that hasn't stopped people getting behind the Jackjumpers at all. The same would absolutely apply with the AFL team, once they got over all the irrational melts regarding the stadium etc.

Finally, you only have to look at Hawthorn's attendances at York Park, which have stayed pretty consistent from their premiership era up to now, despite the fact that a relatively small proportion of Tasmanians actually follow Hawthorn, and that the games are played in Launceston, with a population of only 70,000. And even then it's chalk and cheese compared with the support a Tasmanian team would enjoy once it got off the ground.

Comparing putting an AFL team in Tassie with the challenges faced by the Giants and the Suns is absolutely laughable I'm afraid.

Obviously, we are miles apart in our comparison of thought process which is fine with me.

Let's see how Tassie go when/if they get off the ground.
The AFL will probably make it happen to save face no matter what the politicians decide to do on a stadium.

I know they signed up 150k members in a week at one stage paying $10 for the privilege.
In August 2024 they were close to 200k making it the 6th largest sporting club on the planet according to an AFL article.
Thats a cool $2 million in the bank which is a fantastic marketing achievement so hats off to them for that.
How could they not succeed, well let's wait and see

 

[martinson]

What's forgotten is the rapid population increases in all the main cities in Aus over the last decade or so together with advancements in technology and instant access to involvement either directly or via media or SM.

It's a lot easier to get people interested and involved despite a wider range of choices.

Money will keep pouring into Sports whilst the product is able to be sold to networks and the demographics mean that's not slowing down. We have an ever increasing proportion of viewers/supporters to actual participants and the beneficiaries are the major sports. Often to the detriment of the numbers who play at grassroots level.

 

[irel]

And that's one of my better traits.

Do they still measure in inches or centimetres these days?

 

[Grasshopper17]

Do they still measure in inches or centimetres these days?

It's miles from anywhere that's all I know

 

[qlderlions]

Brisbane & Sydney took ages to get a foothold in NRL territory. At least those two were in the largest & 3rd largest cities.
AFL is still considered a very minor sport to NRL in Brisbane and Sydney at least in all the main media outlets.
The Storm was the exception when they went to Melbourne but again it was the 2nd largest city so was always a good chance to be competitive and get enough sponsorship. The same with them being a very minor sport in Victoria.

Some good points Section 5.

As a supporter group I think we have role to play here in helping the Suns (and wider AFL in Queensland). That is in the annual Q Clash (both legs). As a supporter group we need to turn out in force for the game at the Gabba (I know some members give it a miss), create a cauldron like atmosphere for when the Suns visit us (it was great in 2024 to see so many Suns supporters at the Gabba). This game is prime time Sunday night to the whole of Australia with the opportunity to engage the casual sports fan on the gold coast and Brisbane for the game to draw them in. The Victorian media treat the Q Clash as a bit of joke, it is time to change that perception by injecting real passion into the game to create wider media interest across the AFL world and in Queensland.

I know its a pain as a supporter group to get to PF Stadium at Carrara but I encourage all members to get down there and pack the stadium out to create a heated atmosphere for their home game. Nothing like being out-numbered in your own stadium to bring out the loathing from the Suns Supporters (remember what it was like for us in the early 2000s at the Gabba against Collingwood and Carlton?).

I have done the last three years down there at PFS (as a family we treat it as our 12th home game for the year), first two years were GA seats and last year I upgraded to covered grandstand for minimal incremental cost. Every year it has been bigger and the crowd louder but I reckon it would need only 3000-4000 more of us members to go down to really get the place rocking and the standing room packed. Yes it was a pain they cancelled the trains last year, hopefully that isn't an issue this year.

Also we need to wrac our brains to come up with a better name than "Q Clash" to engage the non-AFL public, thoughts?