Port tell league: we'll go broke without assistance

[PAFC_1870]

Oh well, this is Port's way of getting out of the SANFL's back pocket, so be it.

First step of many I hope.

 

[krusden]

press conference at 11am this morning should tell everyone a bit more

 

[greennick]

There was even talk not too long ago in darker times over in the west about the WAFL been required to step in to support "the parlous state of AFL football in Western Australia". I can't recall if the clubs over there received any handouts though? They have always seemed to have good membership numbers.

How long ago was that??? Not since we first collapsed under the debt we had to take to start up as a result of the $4m fee we paid to enter the competition have we had any financial issues.

No, but then many of those same clubs scrimped, scrounged and worked their arses off for over a 100 years to build this competition.

I think SLF said it best earlier. There are 3 clubs outside of Victoria that could be considered safe. That is not a great indication of the success of the AFL's plan for the competition.

LOL, yeah, that competition that was financially bankrupt until you admitted 2 teams from interstate whose fees propped it up (saving it from calling in the administrators), allowed the television rights to skyrocket and providing a huge boost in the value of sponsorships.

Would you have preferred we didn't join? We could always have let this bankrupt competition run itself into the ground and then start up a new league, with far fewer teams from Vic. The good thing about the way it is now though, it allows WC to dominate financially, which certainly helps on the field.

On ground rationilisation it's fair to say the policy hasn't been a success. Probably a combination of factors including the fact that clubs simply couldn't afford to maintain the grounds they had at the times. There's probably a big lesson here for the clubs and the AFL that in future they need to maintain control of as much of there home revenues as possible. Teams need to have control of the stadium in which they play games as much as possible.

If the AFL didn't rationalise the grounds all the lower supported Vic teams would have been playing in sub-standard facilities until they managed to get their shit together. That probably would have been a long time coming if it would have even happened at all yet.

I dont understand the comment that Port are the first Non-Vic club to ask for a handout/assitance from AFL.

WCE went broke in first few years, is a superclub now though
Brisbane have had salary cap assistance.
The AFL basically owns Sydney
Freo had some troubles, not sure the AFL helped them at all though.

WC went broke from its start-up costs. It got no support, more at that time the competition was so bankrupt we were the ones supporting it. Brisbane had salary cap assistance to convince people to live in Brisbane. Not really a financial assistance/handout. The AFL does own Sydney, after that Eddleston bloke drove them into the ground with his flamboyance. AFL never helped Freo, the WAFL did a little, effectively through WC's profits.

What revenue streams do clubs truly have control over?

1. Membership
2. Sponsorship
3. Pubs or clubs (if they have them)

Look at what the AFL controls

1. TV rights, internet, radio
2. Merchandise (all royalty income goes to the AFL, the clubs recieve a equal distribution and the margin on sale if they goods are purchased directly from the club.
3. Catering
4. Fixturing
5. Finals tickets sales

Areas I am not sure on include signage (I believe the stadium takes a chunk of this) and others I can't think off (feel free to add).

POINT BEING AFL CLUBS HAVE VERY LITTLE CONTROL OVER THEIR FINANCES DUE TO THE CENTRALIST POLICIES OF THE AFL.

This is not the case for all clubs. Some have more control than others.

Anyway, would you prefer we all take control of our revenue. I think this would only help clubs like WC and destroy lowly supported teams. The socialist structure of the AFL with many key revenues being shared means there is not that control (I think this is good though). If you took that away, it would only be to the detriment of crap clubs. WC, Collingwood, Essendon, Adelaide, etc could sell our TV rights for a lot more than what many other clubs could. Also, we would get a lot more money from merchandise, finals tickets, catering, etc if we fully controlled it. The clubs don't have the control so that the crappier ones can be on more of a level playing field. Even with the small control the powerful clubs have, we still dominate financially.

On the merchandise, I thought there was a portion that went to the AFL for their "AFL" branding and a portion that went to the club for their particular rights (even though they are effectively owned by the AFL).

 

[greennick]

This is going to be unpopular but I am going to say it..........


There are too many clubs in the AFL. The Global Financial Crisis should lead to a cull of the ones that cant perform financially at the top level. The problem with the AFL propping up the Melbourne clubs is that these clubs are wasting sponsorship dollars that Port Adelaide should be able to take advantage of. Melbourne should have 6 clubs maximum. This would allow the entire league to co-exist. We need two clubs in our state. Victoria does not need ten.

The AFL seems to think they are bigger than they are. It is a regional sport that is popular with about 15 million people. It is nothing. The A League gets more global exposure than the AFL. Time for some real belt buckling to take place across the league. I doubt soccer will be more popular here in the short term, but it can be a more appealing sponsorship vehicle if you have to decide between the two. A choice that Bianco seems to have to make.

No shit they don't need 10 clubs, but they have them and we are propping them up. How are you going to get rid of them though? I just don't think it is possible anymore. Too much time has passed, people are too passionate and this whole competition was set up wrong from the beginning, with a few teams just rushed in to save their league.

At least we all still get to watch good footy, even if the competition is ****ed.

 

[arzach]

Re: Port tell league: we'll go broke without handout

Wait, they seem to be going up, or they are going up?
Don't make up statistics, back it up.

SANFL Crowds 2005-2008

2005 Total: 303,354 (2,974 ave.)
2006 Total: 309,874 (3,228 ave.)
2007 Total: 322,935 (3,165 ave.)
2008 Total: 362,209 (3,773 ave.)

"Seem" to be going up, base on a relatively small sample size...

 

[rooboy]

Well if the shoe was on the other foot ( Crows in the sh1t ) I'd be pretty sure there would be much hilarity down at Alberton.

However, us Crows supporters are above such behaviour, and I for one hope that Port fight their way through this, as they are an integral part of footy in Australia. And I hope once they have fought their way through this, the Crows will continue to smash the bastards at every turn.

 

[FOOOOTY]

No shit they don't need 10 clubs, but they have them and we are propping them up. How are you going to get rid of them though? I just don't think it is possible anymore. Too much time has passed, people are too passionate and this whole competition was set up wrong from the beginning, with a few teams just rushed in to save their league.

At least we all still get to watch good footy, even if the competition is ****ed.

I love how you guys think that when you joined it was the 'beginning'

 

[Geoffa32]

Re: Port tell league: we'll go broke without handout

SANFL Crowds 2005-2008

2005 Total: 303,354 (2,974 ave.)
2006 Total: 309,874 (3,228 ave.)
2007 Total: 322,935 (3,165 ave.)
2008 Total: 362,209 (3,773 ave.)

"Seem" to be going up, base on a relatively small sample size...

How does that correlate with Glenelg's rise upt the ladder??

 

[Genesis67]

How are you going to get rid of them though? I just don't think it is possible anymore.

I've often wondered just what straw it will take to break the camel's back, and for WC, Adelaide, Collingwood & Essendon to say amongst themselves "**** this, lets go start our own Superleague", and invite who they want.

Because it's a fair bet that it wouldn't be a 16 team league.

 

[1jasonoz]

Re: Port tell league: we'll go broke without handout

Great marketing saved Freo IMO. GREAT marketing.

I beleive they also got one of their long term sponsors; CUB to pay out their entire planned sponsorship (10 years) in one hit upfront as well.

 

[FOOOOTY]

I've often wondered just what straw it will take to break the camel's back, and for WC, Adelaide, Collingwood & Essendon to say amongst themselves "**** this, lets go start our own Superleague", and invite who they want.

Because it's a fair bet that it wouldn't be a 16 team league.

There would be no Collingwood, Essendon, Adelaide Crows or West Coast Eagles in any breakaway league seeing the AFL owns those monikors.

Maybe you franchise supporters would change clubs again, but no Victorians would leave their clubs and support brand new teams, and without Victorians it will go broke about 20mins after it starts.

 

[Geoffa32]

I've often wondered just what straw it will take to break the camel's back, and for WC, Adelaide, Collingwood & Essendon to say amongst themselves "**** this, lets go start our own Superleague", and invite who they want.

Because it's a fair bet that it wouldn't be a 16 team league.

Untill the AFL itself is affected by the downturn, they will keep propping up the failing clubs.

Surely GC is off now??

10 Superleague team comp would be perfect
Adelaide Sharks
Perth Pirates
Fremantle Clippers
Collingwood Zebras
Carlton (cant think of Blues alternative)
Essendon Jets
Sydney Storm
Brisbane Cyclone
Port Adelaide Thunder
Melbourne Tigers (Richmond, Melb) Although Melb not a rich club they are in to allow use of MCG.

 

[arzach]

Re: Port tell league: we'll go broke without handout

How does that correlate with Glenelg's rise upt the ladder??

2005 Total: 303,354 (2,974 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 8
2006 Total: 309,874 (3,228 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 6
2007 Total: 322,935 (3,165 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 4
2008 Total: 362,209 (3,773 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 2

Pretty strongly
But remember, correlation != causation

 

[hawker11]

Untill the AFL itself is affected by the downturn, they will keep propping up the failing clubs.

Surely GC is off now??

12 team comp would be perfect
Adelaide
West Coast
Fremantle
Collingwood
Carlton
Essendon
Sydney
Brisbane
Port Adelaide
Melbourne Tigers (Richmond, Melb)
South West Saints (Bulldogs St Kilda)
North East Melbourne Hawks (North, Hawthorn)

Wow, just wow.

Why would Hawthorn merge? And what happened to Geelong?!

Do some research into which clubs are stable prior to listing your 'ideal league'

 

[Belnakor]

GC will start up. whether they go belly up within a couple of years is another question.

The 2nd Sydney team would have to be gone though.

 

[Belnakor]

I'd merge North Melbourne and Melbourne, and the Saints and Bulldogs

 

[Ingall]

Re: Port tell league: we'll go broke without handout

2005 Total: 303,354 (2,974 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 8
2006 Total: 309,874 (3,228 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 6
2007 Total: 322,935 (3,165 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 4
2008 Total: 362,209 (3,773 ave.) Glenelg Placing: 2

Pretty strongly
But remember, correlation != causation

Crowds should top 4,000 when we win the GF this year then.

 

[silverfingers]

I happen to think Port's situation financially is even more dire than what's been reported, if that's possible.

If ever we needed Port supporters on board, or back on board, it's now.

Before it's too late.

 

[Geoffa32]

Wow, just wow.

Why would Hawthorn merge? And what happened to Geelong?!

Do some research into which clubs are stable prior to listing your 'ideal league'

I did an edit and made it a Superleague basis........ie clubs leaving the AFL.

Hawthorn and Geelong can stay in the AFL. Swap premierships each year.

Although you could swap Hawthorn for Carlton, as my Vic clubs were based on top four members.

 

[FOOOOTY]

I happen to think Port's situation financially is even more dire than what's been reported, if that's possible.

If ever we needed Port supporters on board, or back on board, it's now.

Before it's too late.

I think your right, whats really worrying is how are things going to be if you go through an extended period without success?

I am certain if Melbourne had won a flag as recently as 04, we would not need any assistance.

 

[Lach72]

This is going to be unpopular but I am going to say it..........


There are too many clubs in the AFL.

That's just common sense

 

[Lach72]

I've often wondered just what straw it will take to break the camel's back, and for WC, Adelaide, Collingwood & Essendon to say amongst themselves "**** this, lets go start our own Superleague", and invite who they want.

Because it's a fair bet that it wouldn't be a 16 team league.

That's not as far fetched as it sounds

 

[Demonheart]

Untill the AFL itself is affected by the downturn, they will keep propping up the failing clubs.

Surely GC is off now??

10 Superleague team comp would be perfect
Adelaide Sharks
Perth Pirates
Fremantle Clippers
Collingwood Zebras
Carlton (cant think of Blues alternative)
Essendon Jets
Sydney Storm
Brisbane Cyclone
Port Adelaide Thunder
Melbourne Tigers (Richmond, Melb) Although Melb not a rich club they are in to allow use of MCG.

Only having 10 teams would serverely affect the agreement between the AFL and the broadcasting networks and hence the income generated, it seems that thought was not used when creating this post.

 

[Lach72]

Re: Port tell league: we'll go broke without handout

I beleive they also got one of their long term sponsors; CUB to pay out their entire planned sponsorship (10 years) in one hit upfront as well.

I think it was only two or 3, but it saved us a shirtload in interest

 

[Genesis67]

There would be no Collingwood, Essendon, Adelaide Crows or West Coast Eagles in any breakaway league seeing the AFL owns those monikors.

Maybe you franchise supporters would change clubs again, but no Victorians would leave their clubs and support brand new teams, and without Victorians it will go broke about 20mins after it starts.

1) Is that supposed to sting? To be insulting? I cant say that I know too many 'franchise' club supporters that it affords anything other than a laugh to. It simply makes you look small minded.

2) The viability of such a comp would come down to TV rights. If WC, Adelaide, Essendon and Collingwood left to form their own competition, took Brisbane and Sydney with them, there would be enough interest for the TV rights to not be insignificant.