Ross Lyon is synonymous with Ugly football

[Freomaniac]

I pointed that out in the OP. Who on BF rejoiced in 2007 when an all-out attacking Geelong team put an end to the dour, ugly "flood at all cost" style played by the Swans?

At least the Swans 2013 play an exciting brand of football.

My question was whether Lyons has any other tricks, and the resounding response he he has no plan B.

You say he has no plan B. I reckon he does... It just wasn't pulled off against Geelong with a weakened squad, but that's in the past.

Sad thing is People bag out Ross Lyon for Being too defensive. Yet at the start of 2012, freo apparently had one of the worst forward lines in the AFL. By the end of the season Freo had a very exciting forward line With Pav, Mayne, Walters, Ballantyne and Zac Clarke. If in top form, fully fit and can play a minimum of 20 games in a season, Pavlich can kick 60 goals, Mayne and Walters with 40 each, Ballantyne on 35, Zac Clarke can kick 20. Add that all up and thats 195 goals. So thats under 9 goals a game from those 5 guys alone. Then add another 4 goals a game from the mids.

Its not like the old days of the 1980s and 1990s where you heavily rely on a spearhead to kick 100 goals a season.

 

[andrew99]

Ah, the Ross Lyon gameplan - good enough to keep you in the game, not good enough to have you win it.

Good teams can score more than 68 points on GF day.

Ross Lyon has one of the best W/L % in the league.

I also think that his finals record would stack up well.

As for his grand final(s) record:
He lost by 12 points in 2009 to a team considered one of the greatest of all time.
He drew a grand final against a team rated much higher than his.

Do these facts indicate Lyon's game plan is flawed? Get real.

 

[Biggy_Boy]

Ross Lyon has one of the best W/L % in the league.

I also think that his finals record would stack up well.

As for his grand final(s) record:
He lost by 12 points in 2009 to a team considered one of the greatest of all time.
He drew a grand final against a team rated much higher than his.

Do these facts indicate Lyon's game plan is flawed? Get real.

Has a side ever won a grand final with Ross Lyon at the helm?

In their three GF appearances under him, did St. Kilda ever manage to score above 68?

 

[andrew99]

Has a side ever won a grand final with Ross Lyon at the helm?

In their three GF appearances under him, did St. Kilda ever manage to score above 68?

No. But you have to take into account the circumstances. Neither team in those grand finals scored heavily.

Results from the 09 grand final:
St Kilda 9.14 (68)
Geelong 12.8(80)

St Kilda actually had more scoring shots. If you re-played that game 100 times I would back St Kilda to win at least 50 of them.

2010 grand final:
Collingwood 9.14 (68)
St Kilda 10.8 (68)

You have an obsession with scoring heavily , but that it necessarily a relevant metric without acknowledging the circumstances.St Kilda under Lyon did not need to score heavily, nor should the potency of its gameplan be judged on that metric. Nor too does Fremantle need to score heavily.

 

[Freomaniac]

Has a side ever won a grand final with Ross Lyon at the helm?

In their three GF appearances under him, did St. Kilda ever manage to score above 68?

You want to play this game? Ok lets play big man. Do you remember Malcolm Blight? He was your coach form 1989-1994 and lost 3 grand finals in that period. Yet he had 3 years at the crows from 1997-99 and won back to back flags in 1997 and 1998. Do you see what I am trying to say on here?

Now Speaking of your team in those 1992 and 1994 grand finals. Do you know why your mob lost those 2 grand finals? Simple as Good as your forward line is, Go look at your teams back 6 in those 2 grand finals and compare them to west coasts back 6.

 

[krisholio14]

Winning footy always looks attractive to me, and Freo have done plenty of that this year.

They were missing key attacking components on Saturday night, you can only work with what you've got.

 

[andrew99]

You want to play this game? Ok lets play big man. Do you remember Malcolm Blight? He was your coach form 1989-1994 and lost 3 grand finals in that period. Yet he had 3 years at the crows from 1997-99 and won back to back flags in 1997 and 1998. Do you see what I am trying to say on here?

Losing a game can just be part of the normal variance of football performance.

It's like with gambling or any activity that involves probability.

Say for example in the 09 grand final St Kilda had a 50% chance of winning.And in the 2010 grand final St kilda also had a 50% chance of winning.

Assuming those figures , St Kilda had a 25% chance of winning both of those games. And a 25 %chance of losing both of those games.

Remember the grand final is merely one game. You can't judge the potency of a team based on one game. It is the AFL that gives the grand final its arbitrary title as the deciding weight on a team's performance for the year. The system exists for marketing reasons. If the AFL was truly interested in determining who the best team was , it would equalize the draw and award the premiership to the 1st placed team on the H/A ladder at the end of the year ( as with soccer).

 

[Freomaniac]

I pointed that out in the OP. Who on BF rejoiced in 2007 when an all-out attacking Geelong team put an end to the dour, ugly "flood at all cost" style played by the Swans?

At least the Swans 2013 play an exciting brand of football.

My question was whether Lyons has any other tricks, and the resounding response he he has no plan B.

Im sure Swans posted a very high score against the blues last week. Did you see the Draw they got against Freo? I was jizzing my pants with excitement at that game as that was a very, very High scoring game.

 

[DJ Dupree]

So North were given 2 options

1. Play attractive football and finish 11th-14th

2. play unattractive Football get 5th-8th spot.

If your happy to choose option 1 then you can stay down there.

I don't know how this always comes back to North. It doesn't even come into it.

I'm not actually bothered with what you've mentioned - it isn't a known quantity anyway. You've pretty much admitted that Lyon football wont win flag by saying they'll finish between 5th and 8th by playing it. That's worse than his best years at St. Kilda. Is he losing the knack? Teams outside the top 4 don't win flags; will Freo not even contend for a flag?

 

[nicshata]

I don't know how this always comes back to North. It doesn't even come into it.

I'm not actually bothered with what you've mentioned - it isn't a known quantity anyway. You've pretty much admitted that Lyon football wont win flag by saying they'll finish between 5th and 8th by playing it. That's worse than his best years at St. Kilda. Is he losing the knack? Teams outside the top 4 don't win flags; will Freo not even contend for a flag?

top 4 is looking very likely.

300 pinches

 

[DJ Dupree]

top 4 is looking very likely.

300 pinches

Likely? I think it's entirely possible. The above poster didn't seem to think so, and he goes for Freo. Even I'm more optimistic about Lyon footy than some Freo fans - and I don't think they'll win a flag.

How can someone can me for not particularly rating Lyon footy, and yet predict an even lower finish for Freo than I would?

 

[nicshata]

Likely? I think it's entirely possible. The above poster didn't seem to think so, and he goes for Freo. Even I'm more optimistic about Lyon footy than some Freo fans - and I don't think they'll win a flag.

How can someone can me for not particularly rating Lyon footy, and yet predict an even lower finish for Freo than I would?

Its hard to hang shit on any other coach when you support a team with Brad Scott in charge.

Dont worry is it only another 4 years to go of his bullshit ?

300 pinches

 

[Freomaniac]

I don't know how this always comes back to North. It doesn't even come into it.

I'm not actually bothered with what you've mentioned - it isn't a known quantity anyway. You've pretty much admitted that Lyon football wont win flag by saying they'll finish between 5th and 8th by playing it. That's worse than his best years at St. Kilda. Is he losing the knack? Teams outside the top 4 don't win flags; will Freo not even contend for a flag?

1st off Lets be Brutally honest. Compare Freos finals experience to the likes of Hawks, Swans, Cats and Magpies in the last 10 years. We are inexperienced compared to all 5 sides.

I expect to see freo grab a spot between 5th and 8th as Freos depth has been Tested.

The reason I posted the last post you quoted on is that there are these people out here, which included one of those fellow North fans complaining about Ross Lyons tactics. Freo can't win the Flag just yet as the stars are not aligned yet. When I mean by that is that Freo have not played their full strength squad all season and will not because griffin and Bradley are out for the whole season.

Also the back bone of freo is the players from the 2008 and 2009 drafts. So all those 18 year olds are 22-23. So they are not in their Prime yet.

Again anyone that thinks Freo will have an Ageing squad in 4 years time is sadly mistaken.

 

[DJ Dupree]

Its hard to hang shit on any other coach when you support a team with Brad Scott in charge.

Dont worry is it only another 4 years to go of his bullshit ?

300 pinches

I know, it's pretty annoying. He was given a contract for too long, and for too early.

By the end of 2016, Ross might take a sneaky sideways glance in our direction and think to himself 'Hey yeah, the groundwork is done there, I'm gonna slide on over there without anyone knowing because.. I have no flags here at Freo, and they're all onto me'. I hope this isn't the case. But history doesn't lie - I think the threat of Lyon sneaking to North is very real. By then he will be cheap.

 

[Sttew]

Its hard to hang shit on any other coach when you support a team with Brad Scott in charge.

Dont worry is it only another 4 years to go of his bullshit ?

300 pinches

Let's bookmark this post and revisit in 12 months

 

[DJ Dupree]

I think Brad could do worse than spend an hour or two in the box with Lyon, and after that he might realise 'Ohhhhhh, when you get a lead, you need to defend it. I get it! I was a defender when I played, but for some reason this was a foreign concept to me. Thanks Ross'.

I'd then want him to get the hell out of there quick smart, before his coolness got tarnished. If he spent too long in there, I fear his hoodie would smell like mothballs and sherry.

 

[Freomaniac]

I know, it's pretty annoying. He was given a contract for too long, and for too early.

By the end of 2016, Ross might take a sneaky sideways glance in our direction and think to himself 'Hey yeah, the groundwork is done there, I'm gonna slide on over there without anyone knowing because.. I have no flags here at Freo, and they're all onto me'. I hope this isn't the case. But history doesn't lie - I think the threat of Lyon sneaking to North is very real. By then he will be cheap.

So you think Ryan Crowley pinching is bad? Eagles fans hate Josh and Matt Carr with a passion and rightfully so. Pity you didnt see their tactics. Jeff Farmer at Freo was a thug... he got a 6 week suspension for eye gouging as well.

 

[Freomaniac]

I know, it's pretty annoying. He was given a contract for too long, and for too early.

By the end of 2016, Ross might take a sneaky sideways glance in our direction and think to himself 'Hey yeah, the groundwork is done there, I'm gonna slide on over there without anyone knowing because.. I have no flags here at Freo, and they're all onto me'. I hope this isn't the case. But history doesn't lie - I think the threat of Lyon sneaking to North is very real. By then he will be cheap.

oh and his contract runs out at 2015. I wont be surprised if he walked out, At least I know he guided us to finals in each season he had with us.

 

[DJ Dupree]

So you think Ryan Crowley pinching is bad? Eagles fans hate Josh and Matt Carr with a passion and rightfully so. Pity you didnt see their tactics. Jeff Farmer at Freo was a thug... he got a 6 week suspension for eye gouging as well.

Hey? Nah, I don't care if he pinches. It's not to most masculine thing to do on a footy field, but I guess while effeminate walks down the race to give the half time address are all the rage, one would feel inspired to pinch and/or tie ones' hair in pigtails.

 

[ep2018]

I don't know how this always comes back to North. It doesn't even come into it.

I'm not actually bothered with what you've mentioned - it isn't a known quantity anyway. You've pretty much admitted that Lyon football wont win flag by saying they'll finish between 5th and 8th by playing it. That's worse than his best years at St. Kilda. Is he losing the knack? Teams outside the top 4 don't win flags; will Freo not even contend for a flag?

They probably are the only team who can do it IMO

 

[BananaOnTheRun]

oh and his contract runs out at 2015. I wont be surprised if he walked out, At least I know he guided us to finals in each season he had with us.

i would be. he says his wife loves it over in WA. happy wife...

 

[DJ Dupree]

oh and his contract runs out at 2015. I wont be surprised if he walked out, At least I know he guided us to finals in each season he had with us.

One state, two stories.

Meanwhile across town, Worsfold faces intense scrutiny because his team is only making the finals, and not winning flags.

Success is relative.

 

[nicshata]

One state, two stories.

Meanwhile across town, Worsfold faces intense scrutiny because his team is only making the finals, and not winning flags.

Success is relative.

They arent gonna make the finals.

300 pinches

 

[DJ Dupree]

They arent gonna make the finals.

300 pinches

You don't think? I still reckon they will for sure - they might just sneak in there, but they'll make it all the same.

 

[nicshata]

You don't think? I still reckon they will for sure - they might just sneak in there, but they'll make it all the same.

I knew you were dumb but wow