List Mgmt. Ross Lyon - Sacked

[Gussman]

Guys I know it may be of a shock, but Ross isn't a bad coach.

Lets have a look at the youth out of the draft in recent years (only looking at national draft and until 2013 because I'm lazy):

2016 drafted:
Logue - We all agree he could spend some more time learning positioning and getting used to the game. Also looks like a replacement for Johnson who has been solid so far this year
Darcy - We all agree he needed to up his fitness and trim some weight. Now that has happened he is seriously pushing for debut.
Cox - Has been pushed around both the forward and back lines and needs to show strength in one of those before he can claim a role at top level. Doubt he'll make a senior appearance this year.
Ryan - Injuries to start the year, but debuted against Collingwood due to consistent form in the WAFL.

2015 drafted:
Tucker - Been in the squad for a good amount of the year. Dropped only once or twice I think, for only a game or two.
Balic - Played a few games this year before having to go on leave for personal reasons.
Collins - Was performing consistently well in the WAFL and the only one most of us agree should of played by now. Chance to play if Johnson is rested against Brisbane.

2014 drafted:
Weller - Played every game so far this year I believe.
Blakely - Same
Langdon - Played most games this season, missed some due to injury
Deluca - Injured most of the season so far, looked good in WAFL so might push for debut

2013 drafted:
Apeness - Bad luck with injures.
A.Pearce - Bad luck with injures. Would definitly be in the squad if not for injuries.
Grey - Played every game after coming in round 3.
Taberner - Played about half the games this season so far.

So with these claims that Ross doesn't play youth, I'm a bit dumbfounded. So far this year he's done a bloody good job. We have a good young base to start with and Ross has the coaching ability to keep them going. As far as I'm concerned Ross has done nothing to make me believe he wasn't the right man for the rebuild. I might be singing a different tune if he had kept the round 2 squad, but as it stands right now I'm happy.

 

[freo1997]

Not sure if you're serious or not? Voss is hopeless.

It doesn't matter who is under Ross. He's the boss. It's his call at the end of the day and rightfully so, he's the one answerable to the media and the board.

Voss isn't bad at all. Fan's were angry when he got sacked and rightfully so. He made one big mistake in his tenure and we all know what that was.

I think we need more than one footy brain in the coaches box.

 

[AAACockburn]

Who wants to see shit backwards footy at our shiny new stadium.
Not for 9 bucks for half a can.

 

[Unique Name]

Who wants to see shit backwards footy at our shiny new stadium.
Not for 9 bucks for half a can.

We're one of the highest users of the corridor this season. It's the turnovers and skill errors that make it all look a mess.

More experience into our developing youth and getting rid of the players that don't look like improving will make us look tonnes better. But that takes time.

 

[Crippa]

Guys I know it may be of a shock, but Ross isn't a bad coach.

Lets have a look at the youth out of the draft in recent years (only looking at national draft and until 2013 because I'm lazy):

2016 drafted:
Logue - We all agree he could spend some more time learning positioning and getting used to the game. Also looks like a replacement for Johnson who has been solid so far this year
Darcy - We all agree he needed to up his fitness and trim some weight. Now that has happened he is seriously pushing for debut.
Cox - Has been pushed around both the forward and back lines and needs to show strength in one of those before he can claim a role at top level. Doubt he'll make a senior appearance this year.
Ryan - Injuries to start the year, but debuted against Collingwood due to consistent form in the WAFL.

2015 drafted:
Tucker - Been in the squad for a good amount of the year. Dropped only once or twice I think, for only a game or two.
Balic - Played a few games this year before having to go on leave for personal reasons.
Collins - Was performing consistently well in the WAFL and the only one most of us agree should of played by now. Chance to play if Johnson is rested against Brisbane.

2014 drafted:
Weller - Played every game so far this year I believe.
Blakely - Same
Langdon - Played most games this season, missed some due to injury
Deluca - Injured most of the season so far, looked good in WAFL so might push for debut

2013 drafted:
Apeness - Bad luck with injures.
A.Pearce - Bad luck with injures. Would definitly be in the squad if not for injuries.
Grey - Played every game after coming in round 3.
Taberner - Played about half the games this season so far.

So with these claims that Ross doesn't play youth, I'm a bit dumbfounded. So far this year he's done a bloody good job. We have a good young base to start with and Ross has the coaching ability to keep them going. As far as I'm concerned Ross has done nothing to make me believe he wasn't the right man for the rebuild. I might be singing a different tune if he had kept the round 2 squad, but as it stands right now I'm happy.

Worth taking the story back a few years to see what Lyon has at his disposal to assist him in the rebuild:

2012 drafted:
Simpson – Never made it
Smith – Never made it
Duffy – Never made it

2011 drafted:
Sheridan – Borderline AFL standard
Crozier – Borderline AFL standard
Forster – Never made it
Neale – STAR
Sutcliffe – Borderline AFL standard

2010 drafted:
Pitt – Never made it
Michie – Never made it
Mellington – Never made it

2009 drafted:
Morabito – Never made it
Fyfe - STAR
Houghton – Never made it
Crighton – Never made it
Roberton – Left for family reasons
Bollenhagen – Never made it

 

[FreoRicci]

Clarkson benefited from having a game plan that started from the back line. The best ball users during his time all played across half back- Guerra, Birchall, Hodge, Sam Mitchell (who played there a fair bit at times), Suckling to a lesser extent. Plus their KPDs were also skilled - Gibson is okay by foot, Lake as well. Burgoyne.

In 2013, our defence did just enough. Spurr was a good user at times, Suttclife and Sheridan probably played their best footy at that time. MJ was fit and red hot. Duffield was our rebounder - ala Birchall. McPharlin and Dawson were perhaps the biggest flaw in that system. It worked, but not as well as Clarkson's throughout that time.

Right now defence is our biggest defiency- limited skills across half back. Perhaps MJ is consistent. Spurr isn't, Suttclife meh, Hughes has brain fades. Sheridan isn't the same player. Ibbotson has fallen big time. Weller plays a high half back/Winger role. It's the area in which we looked shocking over the season. Turnovers and poor decision making really affecting the gameplan. Ross is trying to find that combination and get it working back to an elite level then the team will get stronger for it.

 

[scon]

Never made it

Because Lyon wasn't good enuff right??

 

[Crippa]

Because Lyon wasn't good enuff right??

That's 15 out of a possible 17 players he ground down into a pulverised mess of delist material, in typical Lyon fashion.

 

[Admiral Byng]

Right now defence is our biggest defiency- limited skills across half back. Perhaps MJ is consistent. Spurr isn't, Suttclife meh, Hughes has brain fades. Sheridan isn't the same player. Ibbotson has fallen big time. Weller plays a high half back/Winger role. It's the area in which we looked shocking over the season. Turnovers and poor decision making really affecting the gameplan. Ross is trying to find that combination and get it working back to an elite level then the team will get stronger for it.

This.

Great post,

 

[scon]

That's 15 out of a possible 17 players he ground down into a pulverised mess of delist material, in typical Lyon fashion.

It's demoralising the players,degrading to the club and the game.
He removes all energy,creativity,verve and love of life from their bodies then discards the sucked husk of a talented young player on the scrap heap of his ego driven failure.
He grinds them into the submission of the talentless.

Glad you spotted it,many have over looked the destructive wake he leaves behind.

 

[Crippa]

It's demoralising the players,degrading to the club and the game.
He removes all energy,creativity,verve and love of life from their bodies then discards the sucked husk of a talented young player on the scrap heap of his ego driven failure.
He grinds them into the submission of the talentless.

Glad you spotted it,many have over looked the destructive wake he leaves behind.

If he wasn't so risk-averse and conservative in his selections we'd have a premiership by now. Just look at all that talent he had at his disposal.

 

[scon]

When we were screaming for decent talls look what he and his medicos did to Zaarke,Apeness and Moose!
Unforgivable levels of self-centred incompetence!
He's only there for the money.
As Gerard Whateley observed with such insight 'Ask Lyon to coach Fremantle for nothing and you'll see what his integrity amounts to!'

 

[Square Peg]

Worth taking the story back a few years to see what Lyon has at his disposal to assist him in the rebuild:

2012 drafted:
Simpson – Never made it
Smith – Never made it
Duffy – Never made it

2011 drafted:
Sheridan – Borderline AFL standard
Crozier – Borderline AFL standard
Forster – Never made it
Neale – STAR
Sutcliffe – Borderline AFL standard

2010 drafted:
Pitt – Never made it
Michie – Never made it
Mellington – Never made it

2009 drafted:
Morabito – Never made it
Fyfe - STAR
Houghton – Never made it
Crighton – Never made it
Roberton – Left for family reasons
Bollenhagen – Never made it

Jesus that is a horror story

 

[meima]

Worth taking the story back a few years to see what Lyon has at his disposal to assist him in the rebuild:

2012 drafted:
Simpson – Never made it
Smith – Never made it
Duffy – Never made it

2011 drafted:
Sheridan – Borderline AFL standard
Crozier – Borderline AFL standard
Forster – Never made it
Neale – STAR
Sutcliffe – Borderline AFL standard

2010 drafted:
Pitt – Never made it
Michie – Never made it
Mellington – Never made it

2009 drafted:
Morabito – Never made it
Fyfe - STAR
Houghton – Never made it
Crighton – Never made it
Roberton – Left for family reasons
Bollenhagen – Never made it

Interesting list , I wonder freo will delist hamling if drafted him at 18 years old

 

[M_rash]

When we were screaming for decent talls look what he and his medicos did to Zaarke,Apeness and Moose!
Unforgivable levels of self-centred incompetence!
He's only there for the money.
As Gerard Whateley observed with such insight 'Ask Lyon to coach Fremantle for nothing and you'll see what his integrity amounts to!'

He also can't develop assistant coaches. Nobody ever goes on to senior jobs.

 

[Banker]

I don't agree with that. There's a lot of myth surrounding Clarkson, and I still believe we blew our chance in 2013 with a team comprised of lesser-quality players than he had at his disposal on the day.

I'm not saying he's not a good coach, and I'm not even necessarily disagreeing with someone who says might be a great one - but I don't think he's all he's made out to be.

You have to look at Clarksons strategy in which was a game changer.

The biggest issue with Ross is that his game plans are one dimensional. I agree with him in that you should treat each game as a grand final, problem is that come finals time you need to have a plan that can adapt.

 

[Crippa]

He also can't develop assistant coaches. Nobody ever goes on to senior jobs.

Never had a Chris Fagan to develop them for him like Clarkson did.

 

[scon]

He also can't develop assistant coaches. Nobody ever goes on to senior jobs.

Teleported Cap'n Kirk too.

 

[Banker]

How many $$$ would that be?

Clarkson is contracted until the end of 2019 at $1.2m per year.

Then you would have to pay out RTB. He's contracted for another 3 1/2 years at $1-1.1m per year.

Can you put a price on winning the first flag?

I'm thinking more the lines end of 2018 as Ross has earned another season.

 

[scon]

Come clean Banker you're a broke teenager aren't you??

 

[E Shed]

Any coach that gets mediocre players to buy in and punch above their weight are gold. Sides have a majority of mediocre players and getting them to perform beyond their abilities is how premierships are won. I don't follow your logic .

its not difficult. By adopting a gameplan based on effort over skill i.e. having forwards who prioritise tackling over scoring he gets amazing results and the players buy into this gameplan. When it stops working because the players are tired i.e after losing the 2013 GF the team effort drops off and we are left with a boring mediocre footy team.
For a few rounds after we brought the new players in this year they looked like they were running above the ground. All of a sudden players were running in waves through the corridor and creating exciting changes of play.
For whatever reason last week looked like the old style and suddenly we had no one to kick to and no one who looked like they wanted the ball again.
I know Lyon is a very good coach. I know he can only coach the players he has and are drafting has been average and we've had some terrible luck with high picks.
I know what I'm saying is simplistic and isn't the full picture.
I also know what I saw last week was alarmingly reminiscent of the awful boring crap we've been dishing up since 13. I accept they were trying to attack through the corridor and there were skill errors and they were tired but what I saw at the MCG against Melbourne was some of the best footy our lot have played and last week was nothing like it. Where were the players queuing up to receive and create?
McCarthy and Kersten who looked like match winners against Melbourne were completely missing and void of confidence. Hughes looked shellshocked. Mundy and Hill look nothing like they did earlier in the year.
Something changed & it worries me, thats all. I hope I'm wrong. You guys all queued up to tell I was being alarmist when I saw the writing on the wall half way through 2015.
For the record I fully support Ross Lyon being in charge of this rebuild. I just didn't like what I saw last week. Would like to see Logue and Balic back as soon as possible. They seemed to bring some energy beyond what their basic contributions would account for.

 

[Square Peg]

I'm surprised anyone actually expected anything different from what we got the last two weeks. Sandi is out and Lyon is always going to structure everything defensively to try and limit the damage, play rope a dope and try to pinch a win. It's just the way he coaches. He's a smart guy but naturally it doesn't always pay off and when it doesn't it is butt ugly to watch. But it doesn't mean it is wrong, or that he has lost the players or some such over-reaction

 

[malpaso]

its not difficult. By adopting a gameplan based on effort over skill i.e. having forwards who prioritise tackling over scoring he gets amazing results and the players buy into this gameplan. When it stops working because the players are tired i.e after losing the 2013 GF the team effort drops off and we are left with a boring mediocre footy team.
For a few rounds after we brought the new players in this year they looked like they were running above the ground. All of a sudden players were running in waves through the corridor and creating exciting changes of play.
For whatever reason last week looked like the old style and suddenly we had no one to kick to and no one who looked like they wanted the ball again.
I know Lyon is a very good coach. I know he can only coach the players he has and are drafting has been average and we've had some terrible luck with high picks.
I know what I'm saying is simplistic and isn't the full picture.
I also know what I saw last week was alarmingly reminiscent of the awful boring crap we've been dishing up since 13. I accept they were trying to attack through the corridor and there were skill errors and they were tired but what I saw at the MCG against Melbourne was some of the best footy our lot have played and last week was nothing like it. Where were the players queuing up to receive and create?
McCarthy and Kersten who looked like match winners against Melbourne were completely missing and void of confidence. Hughes looked shellshocked. Mundy and Hill look nothing like they did earlier in the year.
Something changed & it worries me, thats all. I hope I'm wrong. You guys all queued up to tell I was being alarmist when I saw the writing on the wall half way through 2015.
For the record I fully support Ross Lyon being in charge of this rebuild. I just didn't like what I saw last week. Would like to see Logue and Balic back as soon as possible. They seemed to bring some energy beyond what their basic contributions would account for.

I don't think anything changed except the opposition. The Pies played extra numbers in the midfield/back, they played 4 forwards. Granted we had awful turnovers, fumbling, missed tackles and a lack of run but honestly I think the Pies tactics won the game for them. After playing so poorly at times we were actually a chance to win the game!
You can't say 'something changed' without saying what it is. You watched the game right? A young side like we have is going to have ups and downs in form while we have some tired older players who are doing a load of work to prop up the young guns.
Oh and we had Sandilands against Melbourne.

 

[Allikat]

I wonder if we could get Kirky back as an assistant if we just threw bags of money at him?

 

[freo1997]

I wonder if we could get Kirky back as an assistant if we just threw bags of money at him?

Could you seriously work under ross lyon?...for a second time!