Roast Sack Horse

[Jeffers]

56.5 point average losing margin in 4 losing grand finals.
Unfathomable and non competitive

Also only lost 6 games by 60 or more points and 3 of them have been the grand finals.

Is he’s a Masochist?

 

[crankygeese]

My guess is that Horse retires this week or next.

I'm only guessing, and it's based purely on his post game interview and the look on his face as the game was running down to the inevitable failure in that final quarter and on field during the post game, but he looked broken, he looked like he didn't have it in him to do this anymore.

 

[The King!]

All well and good wanting to bring in a coach to get us that extra step further, but who even is that and what does it look like? The thoughts of what could happen under a different coach scares me more than sticking fat.

After years in the doldrums Man United finally got a coach in Ole who took them back up to 2nd two years running. It wasn't good enough because fans thought he wasn't capable of finishing the job - they basically drove him out of the club and look at the state of them now.

This is horses race until this team can race no more. All it takes is one grand final in a matchup that suits us, and all the pain would be worth it. I'm still convinced we would've smashed Geelong, wanted to avoid brisbane like the plague unlike some here. I think footy is as simple as that at times..

I get it to a degree but what are we risking? we aren't winning flags as it stands now. In this comp rightly or wrongly losing grand finals ends up being a case of well why bother making it may as well miss out and get picks. We are just effectively treading water and trying to act like making finals consistently is success. Which to a degree it is, I get that , don't get me wrong.


But the case against Horse is how many more chances do you want him to have? if we lost two more grand finals or bombed out in a final 2 more times is that enough? let's not forget it's not just 3 grand finals he got flogged in, Blues basically won it half time last year, Cats smashed us in a semi one year, Gws smashed us at home in 2018 etc .


I am just not sure at this stage moving on from Horse is that big of a risk. What's the downside really? we don't win the flag?

I can't see how he gets an extension at least which would mean one
more chance.

I just wonder what a fresh change could do to reinvigorate us. If it doesn't work then you start to move players as well I guess.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

All well and good wanting to bring in a coach to get us that extra step further, but who even is that and what does it look like? The thoughts of what could happen under a different coach scares me more than sticking fat.

After years in the doldrums Man United finally got a coach in Ole who took them back up to 2nd two years running. It wasn't good enough because fans thought he wasn't capable of finishing the job - they basically drove him out of the club and look at the state of them now.

This is horses race until this team can race no more. All it takes is one grand final in a matchup that suits us, and all the pain would be worth it. I'm still convinced we would've smashed Geelong, wanted to avoid brisbane like the plague unlike some here. I think footy is as simple as that at times..

I somehow truly doubt that did you watch the Prelim? it would of been a repeat of 2022 give or take a few goals.

Stengle/Mannagh/Cameron/Henry would of slaughtered us and Danger somehow was free to play.

The only team we would be confident is a bottom 4 side and even then they would fancy themselves against us in a GF.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

My guess is that Horse retires this week or next.

I'm only guessing, and it's based purely on his post game interview and the look on his face as the game was running down to the inevitable failure in that final quarter and on field during the post game, but he looked broken, he looked like he didn't have it in him to do this anymore.

No i think that was more to do with the farcical conditions the presser was being done in.

 

[zyzzbruh]

I get it to a degree but what are we risking? we aren't winning flags as it stands now. In this comp rightly or wrongly losing grand finals ends up being a case of well why bother making it may as well miss out and get picks. We are just effectively treading water and trying to act like making finals consistently is success. Which to a degree it is, I get that , don't get me wrong.


But the case against Horse is how many more chances do you want him to have? if we lost two more grand finals or bombed out in a final 2 more times is that enough? let's not forget it's not just 3 grand finals he got flogged in, Blues basically won it half time last year, Cats smashed us in a semi one year, Gws smashed us at home in 2018 etc .


I am just not sure at this stage moving on from Horse is that big of a risk. What's the downside really? we don't win the flag?

I can't see how he gets an extension at least which would mean one
more chance

It's the great unknown. If we were given two options for next year - make another granny but we will lose, or a first round of finals exit what would you choose?

I know I'd sill be sick enough to choose the first option still.

Like I said my thoughts are, just get there. And when you're there whatever happens on the day happens, as disappointing as what that can be. But I truly believe the luck of the matchup plays a big part. As much as I didn't want to admit it, I wasn't confident v brisbane, the matchup has not suited us for a while now.

 

[The King!]

My guess is that Horse retires this week or next.

I'm only guessing, and it's based purely on his post game interview and the look on his face as the game was running down to the inevitable failure in that final quarter and on field during the post game, but he looked broken, he looked like he didn't have it in him to do this anymore.

0 chance , he won't face any real scrutiny that he can't ignore up in Sydney . He will gradually get a pass in the media.

Best case he says 2025 is his last year.

We can all predict the bs best and fairest speech. He will come back for another swing.

I mean I wouldn't be shocked if they reappoint him if he wants it.

Harley and Pridham love the stability.

I do assume Cox has been informally promised the job though at some stage?

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

It's the great unknown. If we were given two options for next year - make another granny but we will lose, or a first round of finals exit what would you choose?

I know I'd sill be sick enough to choose the first option still.

Like I said my thoughts are, just get there. And when you're there whatever happens on the day happens, as disappointing as what that can be. But I truly believe the luck of the matchup plays a big part. As much as I didn't want to admit it, I wasn't confident v brisbane, the matchup has not suited us for a while now.

Are you serious thats pretty wild thinking but each to their own i would not like for all of those spending thousands and attending to sit through yet another GF capitulation.

First round finals exit is much preferred

 

[The King!]

It's the great unknown. If we were given two options for next year - make another granny but we will lose, or a first round of finals exit what would you choose?

I know I'd sill be sick enough to choose the first option still.

Like I said my thoughts are, just get there. And when you're there whatever happens on the day happens, as disappointing as what that can be. But I truly believe the luck of the matchup plays a big part. As much as I didn't want to admit it, I wasn't confident v brisbane, the matchup has not suited us for a while now.

I do agree I always want to make it and have a shot , absolutely, winning is always better .

But I don't think Horse going means we can't do it.

Cox gives us some continuity but also a fresh voice it might be that extra % we need. Whatever tweaks he brings, a bit like Horse in 11/12 taking over from Roos, there were a few who were reinvigorated seemingly like Okeefe for instance.

I agree with your conclusion , I want to get there , because eventually it will work surely .

Yep and in all honesty , I wanted the dogs out and Lions and maybe even the Hawks because both the dogs and lions worried me. I think bulldogs would have bullied us again.

I was hoping we would get the Power Cats or GWS

 

[TheMase]

56.5 point average losing margin in 4 losing grand finals.
Unfathomable and non competitive

Also only lost 6 games by 60 or more points and 3 of them have been the grand finals.

Is he’s a Masochist?

Interestingly, also the average margin over the last 6 grand finals… grand finals are often blow outs….

2019 - 89
2020 - 31
2021 - 74
2022 - 81
2023 - 4
2024 - 60

Average 56.5

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

I do agree I always want to make it and have a shot , absolutely, winning is always better .

But I don't think Horse going means we can't do it.

Cox gives us some continuity but also a fresh voice it might be that extra % we need. Whatever tweaks he brings, a bit like Horse in 11/12 taking over from Roos, there were a few who were reinvigorated seemingly like Okeefe for instance.

I agree with your conclusion , I want to get there , because eventually it will work surely .

Yep and in all honesty , I wanted the dogs out and Lions and maybe even the Hawks because both the dogs and lions worried me. I think bulldogs would have bullied us again.

I was hoping we would get the Power Cats or GWS

A non Victorian side was always preferred as the best option for our chances well we got that.

But it doesnt matter playing like that we lose against any of the top 8 sides

 

[The King!]

A non Victorian side was always preferred as the best option for our chances well we got that.

But it doesnt matter playing like that we lose against any of the top 8 sides

My fear is we help Fremantle get their first, blues break their drought, maybe we can help the Suns get one etc etc

 

[zyzzbruh]

I do agree I always want to make it and have a shot , absolutely, winning is always better .

But I don't think Horse going means we can't do it.

Cox gives us some continuity but also a fresh voice it might be that extra % we need. Whatever tweaks he brings, a bit like Horse in 11/12 taking over from Roos, there were a few who were reinvigorated seemingly like Okeefe for instance.

I agree with your conclusion , I want to get there , because eventually it will work surely .

Yep and in all honesty , I wanted the dogs out and Lions and maybe even the Hawks because both the dogs and lions worried me. I think bulldogs would have bullied us again.

I was hoping we would get the Power Cats or GWS

If we made the call and went with Cox I'd accept it, and I'd be just as much optimistic as I'd be worried. I'd just roll with it and hope for the best. I just hope this group has the fortitude deep within them to have what it takes, because as much as what they've upset us it's hard to not love this group.

 

[The King!]

If we made the call and went with Cox I'd accept it, and I'd be just as much optimistic as I'd be worried. I'd just roll with it and hope for the best. I just hope this group has the fortitude deep within them to have what it takes, because as much as what they've upset us it's hard to not love this group.

Yep i so wanted to see the guys , including the coach to be honest , avenge 2022 and shove it up everyone . It's a loveable group overall

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

My fear is we help Fremantle get their first, blues break their drought, maybe we can help the Suns get one etc etc

You just dont win against decent opposition putting in 40 odd tackles and pressure ratings of 140 in a GF.

Any of those teams would fancy their chances against us make it against Sydney you are 80% there.

 

[The King!]

You just dont win against decent opposition putting in 40 odd tackles and pressure ratings of 140 in a GF.

Any of those teams would fancy their chances against us make it against Sydney you are 80% there.

It will linger over the club until we win one even as the group of players changes.


But when we break it I hope I am there and not dead in the ground

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

It will linger over the club until we win one even as the group of players changes.


But when we break it I hope I am there and not dead in the ground

Watch Kirk in the 2nd half in the 06 GF the way he willed the team back in the game cant remember we were 5-6 goals down.

This group has none of that in a GF they cant or wont aspire to reach that level.

 

[The King!]

Watch Kirk in the 2nd half in the 06 GF the way he willed the team back in the game cant remember we were 5-6 goals down.

This group has none of that in a GF they cant or wont aspire to reach that level.

Do they have none of that? if we can pretend the grand final didn't happen.

Bar the Port and Dogs game , even in our shittier games don't you feel like this group showed a bit of ticker and fought back quite. a bit?

 

[zyzzbruh]

Are you serious thats pretty wild thinking but each to their own i would not like for all of those spending thousands and attending to sit through yet another GF capitulation.

First round finals exit is much preferred

I'm probably a bit sick in the mind, I'd even take the next 5 grand finals appearances without a win rather than be in the state many other clubs supporters are at.

Just keep going and eventually one will stick.

Looking at it in context, we all agree 22 was way too early (I see it as equivalent to had the Hawks made it this year), and when you look at it in perspective 24 could even be early still. I think the 2 heavy losses have impaired our perspective. Take the lions - they were a genuine contender for the last 6 years, and realistically could've and should've made more GF's in that time (they even fluffed the brisbane covid year oppertunity). They underachieved, then finally made one 6 years later and then won the 7th. Realistically we are probably around their 3rd year mark if taking into perspective how long it took brisbane to reach ultimate success.

I still think we're every chance to win 1 or 2 with this group. What we have probably left on the table tho is a dynasty team.

 

[The King!]

I'm probably a bit sick in the mind, I'd even take the next 5 grand finals appearances without a win rather than be in the state many other clubs supporters are at.

Just keep going and eventually one will stick.

Looking at it in context, we all agree 22 was way too early (I see it as equivalent to had the Hawks made it this year), and when you look at it in perspective 24 could even be early still. I think the 2 heavy losses have impaired our perspective. Take the lions - they were a genuine contender for the last 6 years, and realistically could've and should've made more GF's in that time. They underachieved, then finally made one 6 years later and then won the 7th. Realistically we are probably around their year 3rd year mark if taking into perspective how long it took brisbane to reach ultimate success.

I still think we're every chance to win 1 or 2 with this group. What we have probably left on the table tho is a dynasty team.

I guess you did word it as you lose the grand final though I agree this core can win a flag because if they cant then blow it up

 

[Bloods86]

Based on prior mentions etc, I assume our coaching structure is currently as follows, and I'd be happy enough for the following changes within the next year (though assistants have to change now). Allows for change and the club/Horse to save a bit of face.

Current:
Director of Football - Cameron
Senior Coach - Horse
Senior Assistant/Strategy - Cox
Fwd Coach - J McVeigh
Mids Coach - M McVeigh?
Def Coach - Mathews

New:
Director of Football - Horse
Senior Coach - Cox
Senior Assistant/Strategy - <someone new>
Fwd Coach - <someone new>
Mids Coach - <someone new>
Def Coach - Mathews

Maybe M McVeigh

Player not found

stays if he's largely been overridden by Horse. I think our defence has done alright given what our midfield and lack of forward pressure has done to them. We've certainly been very good at rebound/turnover game for the most part. One of Kennelly (at GWS), Shaw (at GC) might be interested in returning, but would like a couple of new faces among the senior assistant and line coaches. Marty Mattner has got Sturt to a few flags in the SANFL (16-17), is consistently competing (runner up last year, his team kicked 8.14), had a stint at the Crows in between when they were awful (cut due to Covid restrictions).

Some will want entirely fresh faces, but it's difficult to bring in non locals or those without connections to Sydney.

Horse gets to stay on, if he wants, in a more weekday role, still gets to do some man management with players if needed, but is removed from an active gameday coaching role, and can be overridden at selection/strategy meetings.

 

[RUNVS]

My guess is that Horse retires this week or next.

I'm only guessing, and it's based purely on his post game interview and the look on his face as the game was running down to the inevitable failure in that final quarter and on field during the post game, but he looked broken, he looked like he didn't have it in him to do this anymore.

I doubt it. I think he is too stubborn to accept anything could be wrong with how he coaches.

 

[sataris]

Interestingly, also the average margin over the last 6 grand finals… grand finals are often blow outs….

2019 - 89
2020 - 31
2021 - 74
2022 - 81
2023 - 4
2024 - 60

Average 56.5

The average in the AFL era (1990) is 48pts.

 

[Adnico26Parker]

My understanding is Amon Buchanan

Amon Buchanan

Age

42

Ht

179cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.6

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

8.0

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

3.2

5star

G

0.5

3star

No current season stats available

D

6.6

2star

K

2.8

1star

HB

3.8

3star

M

2.2

3star

T

0.6

3star

G

0.2

3star

is forwards coach, and Jarrad M is defence coach

Now the season is over, Mark Mc will be working with KB and JG on the draft.

 

[sataris]

I said it before and I'll say it again.

Next Head Coach should be: