Coach Sack Horse

[Caj]

It has bred so much complacency that Horse led a team to another Grand Final appearance? People are making out that this is a simple outcome.

Met pretty much every standard BUT the final hurdle.

People are emotional, I get it, but some of this commentary is silly. Sacking or asking several levels of management to leave is what the shit clubs do, let’s not knee jerk and throw out our stable management that has created the most successful period of competitiveness the club has seen in its history.

A bit of perspective needed.

If that’s the attitude the club has, no wonder we are so mediocre

We a

It's a lot of responsibility for one person and even blokes like Horse have a limit.

Has started talking about his sleep

Odds on a handover commences imo

He deserved better but one last tilt next year

If he’s happy to be paid $20k a week he has to take responsibility

If it’s too much there’s an easy solution, step down and go and coach in the country

 

[Voice of the G]

Wasn’t Dew the midfield coach during 2014?

Not sure and if he was how did he go.My understanding Dew was being groomed to take over from Horse but Gold Coast grabbed him as coach.

 

[S120]

I’ve not posted yet to manage my disappointment and I think I’ve done it sufficiently now. I have a lot of thoughts about everything that everyone is talking about but one thing I can’t help thinking about

The really good teams of the last few years have doubled down on players having fun and being themselves and going into games with almost a carefree air about them. Being themselves and not getting too down on themselves. Richmond started it and Geelong and the Pies have done it. Even Brisbane I’d say in the back half of the year had a lightness about them despite the pressure they were under.

It doesn’t seem that way at our club. It seems the players have wilted under the pressure rather than stared it down and laughed at it. I wonder if that’s a part of the Longmire recipe here or maybe even the Bloods culture stuff - he’s an older coach who doesn’t have that abandon in him as much as the “do the basics well” type of stuff and the Bloods are about stern accountability and responsibility. And that serves well to play finals and go deep into September. Not to say he hasn’t adapted over time because he has but this club gets to the last day and the pressure seems like it overpowers the whole club despite winning through prelim finals consistently which are also all about pressure. The players seem to love Horse and always have but I do wonder if he engenders some fretting and angst rather than having the confidence to almost laugh at or welcome the pressure.

 

[SM]

I’ve not posted yet to manage my disappointment and I think I’ve done it sufficiently now. I have a lot of thoughts about everything that everyone is talking about but one thing I can’t help thinking about

The really good teams of the last few years have doubled down on players having fun and being themselves and going into games with almost a carefree air about them. Richmond started it and the Pies have done it. Even Brisbane I’d say in the back half of the year had a lightness about them despite the pressure they were under.

It doesn’t seem that way at our club. It seems the players have wilted under the pressure rather than stared it down and laughed at it. I wonder if that’s a part of the Longmire recipe here - he’s an older coach who doesn’t have that abandon in him as much as the “do the basics well” type of stuff. And that serves well to play finals and go deep into September. Not to say he hasn’t adapted over time because he has but this club gets to the last day and the pressure seems like it overpowers the whole club despite winning through prelim finals consistently which are also all about pressure. The players seem to love Horse and always have but I do wonder if he engenders some fretting and angst rather than having the confidence to almost laugh at or welcome the pressure.

Hm not sure about that. Grundy has brought a lightness in social media posts and even horse this year has been getting in on jokes on social media etc. I don't think lightness or enjoying the footy is the issue. Think of Chad laughing as he ran away from a Blues kid or Paps getting into Greene and Rioli.

If we really want to zero in on the constant it's Horses "just another game" mentality that means we don't take it up a level when we need to.

 

[S120]

Hm not sure about that. Grundy has brought a lightness in social media posts and even horse this year has been getting in on jokes on social media etc. I don't think lightness or enjoying the footy is the issue. Think of Chad laughing as he ran away from a Blues kid or Paps getting into Greene and Rioli.

If we really want to zero in on the constant it's Horses "just another game" mentality that means we don't take it up a level when we need to.

Yeh I agree with your second paragraph. The idea that it’s just another game and you prepare the same way seems folly. It’s not just another game; pretending it is is just lying to yourself. Instead accept it’s a huge game with consequences but that you can stare it down and handle the pressure and hit back at it rather than be suffocated by it.

 

[wilsonmatic]

When Rampe was jogging over to the coin toss he looked back to the group, looked like someone was telling him something.. I figured there was confusion about which way to kick if we won the toss. Hope I'm wrong, you'd think horse and co would have that figured out well in advance. Thought it was a bad sign of things to come.

 

[grimlock]

Yeh I agree with your second paragraph. The idea that it’s just another game and you prepare the same way seems folly. It’s not just another game; pretending it is is just lying to yourself. Instead accept it’s a huge game with consequences but that you can stare it down and handle the pressure and hit back at it rather than be suffocated by it.

I felt that that just another game attitude was the 22 preparation. A few players interviewed before the weekend said they had changed and embraced the GF festivities and lead up

 

[TasSixer]

It's hard to know whether or not Cox would be the right replacement being set up to be the next coach or if he's part of the problem without being there internally.

 

[The King!]

I felt that that just another game attitude was the 22 preparation. A few players interviewed before the weekend said they had changed and embraced the GF festivities and lead up

Maybe someone external should review the weeks prep? Instead of the club declaring it was great

 

[JackHiscoxWasFast]

What they needed was the Glengarry Glenross speech by Alec Baldwin. Then straight into the Tommy Raudonikis face slapping pre match routine.

 

[Superstar swan]

It's hard to know whether or not Cox would be the right replacement being set up to be the next coach or if he's part of the problem without being there internally.

I was all for cox taking over but the only coaching he has known is under John.

I’d be much more comfortable raiding an assistant from a successful program like Geelong . At least get a fresh perception . I just feel like cox will be an extension of John’s coaching style

 

[Chaisa]

It's not even that it's 4 losses in a row, it's that it's 3 losses out of 4 that we didn't even show up, and 3 of 4 losses where we were the higher ranked seed coming in.

You could in theory compare it to Chris Scott

Chris Scott

Age

48

Ht

182cm

Wt

89kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.6

4star

K

11.2

4star

HB

5.4

4star

M

5.1

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

0.4

3star

No current season stats available

D

13.2

4star

K

10.2

4star

HB

3.0

3star

M

2.2

3star

T

2.8

5star

G

0.4

3star

prior to 2022, or even early Chris Fagan, but I think Geelong were at least competitive in their losses in from 2012-2021, they just generally lost to better teams and also perhaps had the wrong gameplan for finals. As for Fagan, I think Brisbane were just a bit inexperienced in their first couple of years and also lost a couple of razor tight elimination finals.

What is frustrating is that it seems that we go away from what works in other games in the GF and just don't raise a whimper. The pressure is off, the ability to win the ball is off, the desire is off. That can happen from time to time but it's usually not a huge problem. Why is it such a problem here?

He absolutely needs to find a way to adapt. If he can't, then he needs to hand over to Dean Cox

Dean Cox

Age

43

Ht

203cm

Wt

107kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.9

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

6.9

4star

M

5.3

5star

T

1.5

3star

G

0.6

4star

No current season stats available

D

13.0

4star

K

5.8

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

1.4

4star

G

0.0

1star

.

 

[Neverwas]

I’ve not posted yet to manage my disappointment and I think I’ve done it sufficiently now. I have a lot of thoughts about everything that everyone is talking about but one thing I can’t help thinking about

The really good teams of the last few years have doubled down on players having fun and being themselves and going into games with almost a carefree air about them. Being themselves and not getting too down on themselves. Richmond started it and Geelong and the Pies have done it. Even Brisbane I’d say in the back half of the year had a lightness about them despite the pressure they were under.

It doesn’t seem that way at our club. It seems the players have wilted under the pressure rather than stared it down and laughed at it. I wonder if that’s a part of the Longmire recipe here or maybe even the Bloods culture stuff - he’s an older coach who doesn’t have that abandon in him as much as the “do the basics well” type of stuff and the Bloods are about stern accountability and responsibility. And that serves well to play finals and go deep into September. Not to say he hasn’t adapted over time because he has but this club gets to the last day and the pressure seems like it overpowers the whole club despite winning through prelim finals consistently which are also all about pressure. The players seem to love Horse and always have but I do wonder if he engenders some fretting and angst rather than having the confidence to almost laugh at or welcome the pressure.

I have similar thoughts S120. Before the game at the Grand Final parade press conference, I was worried when I saw Rampes absolutely grim demeanor and comments about people not caring about each others stories. It seemed as though there were already negative vibes in the camp.

I felt after the 22 loss to Geelong that Horse was getting so emotional that it was upsetting the players and this had a negative impact on them. It also seemed to get in the way of him doing his job , such as making correct calls during, and probably before the match as well. He has toned it down considerably since then and I think that the issue must have come up in the club and he was given some advice. Its hard for a player to do their thing if the coach is losing it. Just my honest impressions from afar but feel it is definitely an issue.

 

[Olian]

Logan playing wasn't the difference in the result.

We can cling to reasons why we lost but all factors were in our favour other than mental.

Playing unfit player's doesn’t help our chances of winning. It’s rinse and repeat of ‘22. Longmire hasn’t learnt anything. Fair enough those defending him.

 

[SM]

Playing unfit player's doesn’t help our chances of winning. It’s rinse and repeat of ‘22. Longmire hasn’t learnt anything. Fair enough those defending him.

A fully fit Logan doesn't have any impact on our midfield clearances.

 

[Olian]

A fully fit Logan doesn't have any impact on our midfield clearances.

No it was just a poor selection.
As for the midfield, it was just another masterclass in them underperforming.

 

[The King!]

Logan probably just needed a jab to keep going or something. they knew it was done and he was going shit so gave it up perhaps

 

[RedBloodBlackSwan]

I recall Horse saying during the Covid season that an unusual learning he had was that the preparation for each game did not need to be perfect.

It was interesting that the players all noted that the prep was perfect for the GF. Did it have to be? Was that helpful?

Horse is one of the hardest working coaches in the league, and I wonder if he actually wants it too much. He puts in 110% but all that might do is create pressure for the team to perform. Then their mindset switches from expressing themselves to not wanting to fail. Then some of them start to fail, then others over compensate, then it all starts to implode.

I think they tried to correct this year by treating the process just the same as other weeks (2022 they switched things up). But if the talk was all about perfect prep, then I still think they were worrying too much.

It might be the rugby league fan in me, but maybe they just need to find an arbitrary reason to hate the other team, or the AFL, or the Melbourne media - then come out with a point to prove. We really struggle with front runner status and I think some angry siege mentality might do us the world of good.

You don’t think about failing when you are trying to right a wrong, in your mind the world is already f***ed and you are just trying to make it right again.

It worked for Hawthorn in 2014 (they had the arrogant Sydney swans quite of 100 tackles through their change rooms apparently). Heck, it worked for Port against the Hawks in 2024 with a stupid social media post by an idiot.

And f*** off with the extra media interviews. It’s not the time to grow the game, it’s time to win. Be angry, be silent, do the minimum media you can get away with (not the minimum the AFL requests, less than that). Watch the media get upset, and then lap it up. Be hated and love it. Winners don’t give a sh*t and we have been trying to be liked for too long.

 

[mcs095]

The Bloods are about stern accountability and responsibility.

If only we'd see that in response to horror shows in grand finals!

The bloods culture is dead in my opinion. And that's not necessarily a bad thing - culture changes over time at a club. There is no mentality monsters at the club anymore that would run through fire if there was even a scent of hope that we could win a game. We have to find a way to get some resemblance of that back. Rowy tries so hard, but he isn't a leader in that sense, and can't do all the hard work himself.

But it has to start at the coal face - I actually think the coaches are lax on accountability and responsibility, reflected by too much of a 'almost there is good enough' feel that has shone through in the last week, yet again. I'll be very interested to see the narrative leading into next season and whether anything changes.... I want to see some ruthlessness and a commitment that what happened on Saturday will never happen again. From everyone.

It might be the rugby league fan in me, but maybe they just need to find an arbitrary reason to hate the other team, or the AFL, or the Melbourne media - then come out with a point to prove. We really struggle with front runner status and I think some angry siege mentality might do us the world of good.

You don’t think about failing when you are trying to right a wrong, in your mind the world is already f***ed and you are just trying to make it right again.

Agree with a lot of this. We will have to experience another summer of torment as fans from every dick wad out there, and the players I'm sure in their circles will get plenty of it too.

Get angry and use it as motivation to right the wrong. Its why I want to hear us talking about 'the only redemption is winning the flag', not wishy washy shite like 'we'll work hard to be there again'. **** that. We aren't even lovable losers anymore - fans of other teams will openly mock us, laugh at us for our continued failings on the biggest day.

Yet the likely response we will see will be minimal, if at all.

If we are going to be hated - lets give others a true reason to hate us, not ample opportunity to mock us.

Lets see if this group can grow up and take responsibility and accountability for making up for the pain, or whether they are happy to just join a lost list of South Melbourne/Sydney history as 'almost men' - capable on their day, but impotent when it matters.

 

[Maddo11]

Get Stewwy Dew back, then maybe the boys will Show a bit of ****in fight

 

[GremioPower]

 

[KingV23]

Waiting for the resignation announcement..

 

[Kapers]

Yep, I'm still pissed

 

[Superstar swan]

Yep, I'm still pissed

I’m getting worse the longer it goes on.

We were 3 ****ing games clear on top.

All for nothing

The season was a complete and utter waste of time

 

[MR0808]

I’m getting worse the longer it goes on.

We were 3 ****ing games clear on top.

All for nothing

The season was a complete and utter waste of time

Exactly how I feel. Given everything we did, things we've done over the last few years in terms of drafting and trading, this year was a failure.