SFL – MSJFL proposed merger. Has the VAFA been stiffed?

[AM]

I’ve just had a read a summary of The Code Report which recommends the merger of the SFL with the MSJFL. Code pumps-up the SFL as the league best placed to run a junior competition and recommends the VAFA as a “stakeholder” be “periodically updated on the progress of the merge” – effectively dealing us out of the process. Toss in the recent defection of Bentleigh back to the SFL and it hasn’t been a good few weeks for the VAFA.


In view of the fact that the VAFA has been a significant supporter of the MJSFL over the years it seems - prima facie at least - the VAFA has been treated poorly by Code. The proposed merger will make the SFL a formidable league.

 

[Fish 20]

This was one contributing factor in why we left the VAFA. Our juniors wanted a seamless transition from junior to senior football & the SFL could provide this. I mean it basically makes sense for the merger as the SFL & MSJFL HQ operate out of the same building with the MSJFL umpires already training with their counterparts. I think the SFL have been more proactive in their future planning than the VAFA in securing the symmetry between junior & senior footy.

A good get by the SFL to expand their boutique competition, it will certainly put pressure on the VAFA securing teams this side of the yarra in the future. Then there's the issue of them running out of umpires.

 

[Rooster 24]

Wouldn’t panic too much. A good number of the MSJFL clubs are either “junior only” or already affiliated with VAFA teams. It is really only formalising some existing processes anyway. Until recently the MSJFL admin was a complete basket case and AFL Vic has been looking to off load their operations to a senior body for some years. It makes sense, especially when you take in the geography of both comps.

In regards to Bentleigh – Good club, great facilities and a shame to see them go but in the scheme of the VAFA they are a minnow. D2 (5th Division) club who never threatened to reach of the heights of their neighbouring district clubs Beauy, Ormond & Hampton Rovers. Of more concern is that Parkdale Vultures have committed to an U18 side next year in the SFL, not in the VAFA. The VAFA U19 competition is without peer. A fantastic comp with 5 strong divisions offering a good range of options. However the 18s comp is struggling and IMO may have even gone backwards this year.

 

[Jascave]

So which comp will emerge the stronger-not so much of now, but in 5-10 years time-the SFL or the VAFA?

 

[BrianSpeaking]

Not surprised that Parkdale has decided to go SFL under 18's with Sam Radford as coach. A poorly run club(not Radders) heading nowhere so the SFL may make sense, however their juniors come from Mordi-Brae so it may make for some interesting recruiting problems if they leave the VAFA between them and Mordialloc.
I also dont think it will make any difference what happens with the MSJFL as kids are aligned to either their club or old boys school side, not the league.
Jase, the SFL will continue to be a non-entity until it merges with the MPNFL, the VAFA will not be effected.

 

[Cardio Carl]

Not surprised that Parkdale has decided to go SFL under 18's with Sam Radford as coach. A poorly run club(not Radders) heading nowhere so the SFL may make sense, however their juniors come from Mordi-Brae so it may make for some interesting recruiting problems if they leave the VAFA between them and Mordialloc.
I also dont think it will make any difference what happens with the MSJFL as kids are aligned to either their club or old boys school side, not the league.
Jase, the SFL will continue to be a non-entity until it merges with the MPNFL, the VAFA will not be effected.

BS, without going into the detail to much I did have some input into a couple of areas.

You have to remember that the SFL only wants to own their patch, just like MPNFL, EDFL etc etc. They have no intention of competing with VAFA as it is not their market other than the area they exist.

Therefore I think the Code Report and the SFL strategies will substantially hurt VAFA in the SFL territory in the next 3-5 years if (when) the proposed merger goes ahead.

By enticing active players from U9's to seniors with the key benefit of not having to travel half way around Melbourne and further in some cases ever 2nd week. Ask the guys at Rupo the travel effect

The Old Schools can only 'enforce' players to participate in school football however have no link thereafter. MSJFL are voluntary playing conditions linked to a senior district club - its the playing for 'school mates' vs 'team mates' proposition and i know which one has the greater pulling power post juniors

SFL have been very active in bridging the gap for transitional youth players with their U18 competition. It fills an opportunity gap between MSJFL U17's and VAFA U19's very well in the SFL area.

In reviewing the 'game plans' I think the Parkdale move was to get in before the merger so they have an opportunity to pick up MB players away from Mordy.

If you read the report I think all the current VAFA district clubs in the SFL district would see the merger as very very enticing.

If all goes to plan the biggest benefit to all SFL clubs will be the enforcement to reduce player payments and make the league more family oriented so they can easily transition family groups from MSJFL into their league - this may include their alcohol position.

The ongoing motivation to play for your club of 9 years will allow SFL clubs to build their playing groups based on loyalty not mercenaries and salary caps will certainly be enforced.

So don't give it the old VAFA 'heave-ho', this report, potential merger between SFL & MSJFL will have very serious consequences for VAFA in the SFL areas.

 

[Fish 20]

So which comp will emerge the stronger-not so much of now, but in 5-10 years time-the SFL or the VAFA?

Not surprised that Parkdale has decided to go SFL under 18's with Sam Radford as coach. A poorly run club(not Radders) heading nowhere so the SFL may make sense.
I also dont think it will make any difference what happens with the MSJFL as kids are aligned to either their club or old boys school side, not the league.
Jase, the SFL will continue to be a non-entity until it merges with the MPNFL, the VAFA will not be effected.

Typical arrogant comments from typical arrogant B Section people. This kind of self righteous attitude will eventually/hopefully be the undoing of the private school boys club that is the VAFA. I mean after all it's only the Old Boys clubs that the VAFA want in the association anyway, they've made that perfectly clear. The idea that the VAFA will only ever be the 'Big Cheese' in town no matter will bring them undone, not caring about improving the future of their junior structure.

 

[AM]

I think too many people are mired in old thinking and don’t have a grip on how the SFL has progressed in recent years. While the VAFA has been naval gazing and concerning itself with matters like altering ‘Section’ to ‘Premier’, the SFL has:

1. Become a profitable operation;
2. Worked on merging with the highly successful MSJFL;
3. Through their Director of Umpiring forged a relationship with the MSJFL Umpires so that junior umpires are now channelled through it (SFL). At one time around 80% of MSJFL umpires came to the VAFA;
4. Developed a relationship with the Riddell League;
5. Developed a successful and expanding under 18 competition;
6. Developed a very close relationship with AFL Victoria.

The merge will make the SFL a much stronger entity. To me it’s concerning that with such an important suburban merge likely to occur the VAFA has been effectively sidelined to just ”be periodically updated”. And there exists a prospect of the SFL developing a close working relationship with the Dandenong and District Junior Football League as well.

People who still don’t rate the SFL haven’t been keeping abreast with the how it’s changed for the better in recent years. And to suggest it will ever amalgamate with the MPNFL is nonsense.

 

[Jascave]

The VAFA would probably be feeling a little nervous considering how strong the SFL might be in the coming years. And the VAFA would also be upset about the MSJFL deserting them for the SFL,especially considering in the mid 90's when there was a large number of VAFA umpires going into retirement, it was the MSJFL umpires who filled the gaps and a number of these umpires went on to the VAFA senior umpires panel. I think it's fair to say we might have underestimated the SFL.

 

[bedford]

Maybe the VAFA has dropped the ball, but apart from Division 1 the SFL is a very ordinary standard of footy. The new CEO has done a great job of getting some respect back for the SFL, but it should not be allowed to take over the MSJFL. It is a fact that in the MSJFL there are more clubs afiliated with the VAFA than the SFL.

 

[muesli]

Ammo Man, where did you get a copy of the Code Report from?




Nevermind, i found it, it's on the SFL website.

 

[bedford]

And don't worry there is a lot of conficts of interest in the whole thing.

 

[BrianSpeaking]

Typical arrogant comments from typical arrogant B Section people. This kind of self righteous attitude will eventually/hopefully be the undoing of the private school boys club that is the VAFA. I mean after all it's only the Old Boys clubs that the VAFA want in the association anyway, they've made that perfectly clear. The idea that the VAFA will only ever be the 'Big Cheese' in town no matter will bring them undone, not caring about improving the future of their junior structure.

Sniper, take your crap agenda to the SFL boards with your club. It's well known that you offered 'things' to Mark Graham and Dimmatina in true SFL style and you still couldn't climb up the grades, so you took the easy way out and headed back to the SFL. All of the Old Boys clubs are just that, old boys, which means that their juniors have been more than looked after through their football development. I reckon Stewie Loewe at Haileybury, Robert Shaw at Brighton, Barry Rawlings at Caulfield and Steve Wallis at St Kevin's just to name a few would know more on their little finger than most coaches in the MSJFL and SFL put together.
The APS, AGS and ACC football programmes are SECOND TO NONE, so get over the fact that we have Private schools because they are needed to produce Men and Women to keep people like you out of jail.

In regards to the report, I disagree with Cardio and Ammo, the VAFA will remain the premier non AFL/VFL competition in suburban Melbourne because it has 72 clubs as well as 20 more knocking the door down to get in, not to mention its 14,000 registered players. The fact that they have also introduced the Under 18's comp, and that they took them overseas for a series of rep games tells me that they are serious about bridging the gap between juniors, Under 19s and the TAC U18 for those not good enough to get on a list.

If you look at some of the biggest junior clubs in the MSJFL: Ajax, St Bede's Mentone, Hampton, Beaumaris, Ormond, Prahran, they are all VAFA clubs and most likely always will be. Clubs like East Brighton, Cheltenham, St Kilda City, Waverley, Clayton etc are all aligned with the SFL anyway, so really the report is a wankathon.

IMO, the SFL at best, will be similar to the Federal District Cricket Association, where they have their place locally and may attract the players Carl says don't want to travel, but generally, most from all clubs will end wherever their senior club is aligned.

The VAFA will always be the power by pure numbers, unless as I have said previously the SFL gets serious and merges with the MNPFL.

Will be interesting to see how it all plays out, from what I have seen the non private school kids like those from Parkdale High may benefit more.

 

[AM]

Brian,

Noone is suggesting the VAFA won't always be a powerful force. The mere fact of the old school system will ensure that. But it does too much naval gazing and isn't nearly as progressive as it once was. Nor is it as close to AFL Victoria as it once was and the affect on our umpire numbers due to the MSJFL/SFL tie-up could be seen last year when on many occasions even Premier C weren't provided with boundary or goal umpires. If you'd read the report you'd see how the VAFA isn't viewed as the pre-eminent association it once was.

The SFL will never join forces with the MPNFL. If ever that was to happen it would have been when it was on its knees years back. It now has 250K in the bank according to the report. Not bad for an organisation that was near to bankrupt a few years ago. I have the advantage of knowing a little about the way the SFL operates these days and some of their plans for the future and it's a way different cat to the one of only three or four years ago.

 

[muesli]

The VAFA will always be the power by pure numbers, unless as I have said previously the SFL gets serious and merges with the MNPFL.

Would be a good merger i'd reckon, but probably will not happen. Always thought there was too many leagues in Melbourne. But thats a different topic for another time.

The merger between MSJFL & SFL is a good move by the SFL. One of the best things the Eastern FL has done was merge with the Knox Junior FA back in the late 90's.

 

[Fish 20]

Yes Brian, how dare I speak to someone higher than thee, the man they call The Imposter in your parts?

The VAFA will be the most "powerful" league in metro footy...........that will be umpired by club officials

It's going to be panic stations down at VAFA HQ

 

[THE BEACON]

Yes Brian, how dare I speak to someone higher than thee, the man they call The Imposter in your parts?

The VAFA will be the most "powerful" league in metro footy...........that will be umpired by club officials

It's going to be panic stations down at VAFA HQ

Go back to the SFL boards, your comments are now filled with bias.

 

[Fish 20]

Go back to the SFL boards, your comments are now filled with bias.

Maybe the VAFA should back down from their "high & mighty" opinion of themselves & not except everything & everyone to come the way of their league. If the VAFA keep thinking that just because they have this "exclusive private school football brand" then smaller leagues outside the association are going to pull the rug from underneath them.

Just saying

 

[AM]

Would be a good merger i'd reckon, but probably will not happen. Always thought there was too many leagues in Melbourne. But thats a different topic for another time.

The merger between MSJFL & SFL is a good move by the SFL. One of the best things the Eastern FL has done was merge with the Knox Junior FA back in the late 90's.

Mate, the MPNFL is a member of the Victorian Country Football League. It has no intention or wish to become a metropolitan comp. It made that clear years back when the SFL was in deep do-dos. The SFL is presently functioning well as a stand alone comp with expansion plans.

 

[Jascave]

So, what would happen if some of the VAFA umpires decide to give it (umpiring) away due to injury/work commitments etc-where will the VAFA go to find younger umpires to help fill the breach left by the retirements of the umpires I mentioned above, seeing that the MSJFL would merge with the SFL, and that most of the MSJFL umpires would eventually be on the SFL senior umpires panel?

 

[Fish 20]

So, what would happen if some of the VAFA umpires decide to give it (umpiring) away due to injury/work commitments etc-where will the VAFA go to find younger umpires to help fill the breach left by the retirements of the umpires I mentioned above, seeing that the MSJFL would merge with the SFL, and that most of the MSJFL umpires would eventually be on the SFL senior umpires panel?

The VAFA will have to put an action into place & fast. They will have to put a recruiting campaign into place to entice young umpires to come on board. The only way I see them poaching MSJFL umpires to the VAFA is to offer them more money per game, at great expense the the league & all clubs under the VAFA banner.

We all know how hard it is to get good umpires, with the percentage of retirees quite high every year as some crowds/clubs etc makes it hard for some umps. I expect Benny Goodman will be working overtime next year to educate clubs on umpire appreciation in a bid to retain the umpires that they have.

 

[the ox1]

I highly doubt the VAFA will be getting nervous over this proposition. After the top 4 teams in Division 1 SFL the competition after that is very weak. I could see maybe St.Kilda and maybe doggies and chelsea being moderatly competitive in C or B. TO think that a D2 club bentleigh will go back and be competitive in that comp shows the lack of depth and quality oppositions....this is not a stab at bentleigh as they are trying to secure the future of there club and not a stab at the league itself but it is weak in comparison to the VAFA.
As a kid coming through the MSJFL i never once was tempted to go the SFL as i dont agree paying blokes who dont give a sh!t about the result and i always thought as a young going down to Mikkinon reserve watching St.Pauls and Hailbury play that the VAFA standard was streaks ahead of the SFL. Small things like crowd behaviour Also made the decision between an SFL and VAFA club easy as a young kid i saw many a drunken fight at the SFL between feral supporters but never seemed to see much of this behaviour during VAFA games.

 

[The Enemy Within]

I highly doubt the VAFA will be getting nervous over this proposition. After the top 4 teams in Division 1 SFL the competition after that is very weak. I could see maybe St.Kilda and maybe doggies and chelsea being moderatly competitive in C or B. TO think that a D2 club bentleigh will go back and be competitive in that comp shows the lack of depth and quality oppositions....this is not a stab at bentleigh as they are trying to secure the future of there club and not a stab at the league itself but it is weak in comparison to the VAFA.
As a kid coming through the MSJFL i never once was tempted to go the SFL as i dont agree paying blokes who dont give a sh!t about the result and i always thought as a young going down to Mikkinon reserve watching St.Pauls and Hailbury play that the VAFA standard was streaks ahead of the SFL. Small things like crowd behaviour Also made the decision between an SFL and VAFA club easy as a young kid i saw many a drunken fight at the SFL between feral supporters but never seemed to see much of this behaviour during VAFA games.

What a load of contrived cr@p

 

[AM]

The problem with much of the comment here is that it's mired in the SFL of bygone days. The SFL is a vastly different organisation to that of 4 or 5 years ago.


Presently the MSJFL is fundamentally independent although it gets significant help from the SFL and still, to an extent, also gets help from the VAFA – although much less so nowadays. When the merge is completed and the MSJFL is re-branded the Southern Football League Juniors – as I expect it to be - our junior teams will be playing in their comp. We've already seen how the MSJFL umpire coach became the SFL umpires administrator and the effect that has had on umpires flowing through to the SFL. Equate that to the playing side and the VAFA should have some concerns.


Noone is suggesting that the VAFA won't continue as a force as a football league if only because of its strong old school base. But they should be concerned at how they have been sidelined in this process and the possible implications – part of which have already been witnessed in the umpiring area.


As a football club you always love it when other clubs don't rate you. I reckon the SFL would be more than pleased to read some of the comments here that show some VAFA people still don't rate them. As I've said, look at the SFL today and what it's achieving, not the basket case of 4 or 5 years ago.

 

[Fish 20]

I highly doubt the VAFA will be getting nervous over this proposition. After the top 4 teams in Division 1 SFL the competition after that is very weak. I could see maybe St.Kilda and maybe doggies and chelsea being moderatly competitive in C or B. TO think that a D2 club bentleigh will go back and be competitive in that comp shows the lack of depth and quality oppositions....this is not a stab at bentleigh as they are trying to secure the future of there club and not a stab at the league itself but it is weak in comparison to the VAFA.
As a kid coming through the MSJFL i never once was tempted to go the SFL as i dont agree paying blokes who dont give a sh!t about the result and i always thought as a young going down to Mikkinon reserve watching St.Pauls and Hailbury play that the VAFA standard was streaks ahead of the SFL. Small things like crowd behaviour Also made the decision between an SFL and VAFA club easy as a young kid i saw many a drunken fight at the SFL between feral supporters but never seemed to see much of this behaviour during VAFA games.

Yes the SFL is weak in comparison to the top 2 or 3 sections of the VAFA, but I think you're missing the point, but it's not about the strength of both leagues. The VAFA aren't worried about if they lose a Bentleigh or a Parkdale, only small collateral damage in their minds. What will hurt the VAFA is the availabilty of umpires. You can have the strongest competition in Australia, but if you have no one to umpire you then what's the point of running a highly proffessional organisation.

C Grade should have 2 umpires, 2 goal umpires & 2 boundaries supplied every week without question, this is already not happening. They've just had a junior feeder supply competition taken away from them.

Not pi55ing in AmmoMan's pocket, but every one of his posts in this thread has been 100% spot on, those in the VAFA who dismiss how the SFL is run now, do so at the own peril.