SFL – MSJFL proposed merger. Has the VAFA been stiffed?

[Rooster1979]

A well run, strong and sucsessful SFL is good for everyone concerned in the area. Nothing improves performance like genuine competition, and that has sadly been lacking in the inner southern region for the past 15 years. Clubs haven't been able to get into the VAFA fast enough to escape the poorly run & managed SFL

The VAFA is continuing to operate as they always have. It's a well run organisation, but because of it's size, clubs in the lower grades are always going to feel a bit left out when compared with the attention teams in A-C get from both the media and the executive. A D1-D3 side however could seemlessly move into Div 2 of the SFL and instantly become a bigger fish in a smaller pond.

One policy isn't going to suit every club, and it's not surprising, to me at least, that a district club originally from the SFL, which left because the SFL was a basket case and could no longer afford to pay its players and be competitive in that environment, would consider moving back now things have changed substantially.

Add to this the SFL getting tough on rogue negative elements and reputation it's been plagued with in the past by suspending the entire Doveton club and attractive financial inducements to return. The VAFA has done well to only lose one club.

With the SFL actively looking for clubs, hopefully it will drive a better performance by the VAFA toward all it's lower grade clubs. They can no longer be taken for granted

 

[The Enemy Within]

A well run, strong and sucsessful SFL is good for everyone concerned in the area. Nothing improves performance like genuine competition, and that has sadly been lacking in the inner southern region for the past 15 years. Clubs haven't been able to get into the VAFA fast enough to escape the poorly run & managed SFL

The VAFA is continuing to operate as they always have. It's a well run organisation, but because of it's size, clubs in the lower grades are always going to feel a bit left out when compared with the attention teams in A-C get from both the media and the executive. A D1-D3 side however could seemlessly move into Div 2 of the SFL and instantly become a bigger fish in a smaller pond.

One policy isn't going to suit every club, and it's not surprising, to me at least, that a district club originally from the SFL, which left because the SFL was a basket case and could no longer afford to pay its players and be competitive in that environment, would consider moving back now things have changed substantially.

Add to this the SFL getting tough on rogue negative elements and reputation it's been plagued with in the past by suspending the entire Doveton club and attractive financial inducements to return. The VAFA has done well to only lose one club.

With the SFL actively looking for clubs, hopefully it will drive a better performance by the VAFA toward all it's lower grade clubs. They can no longer be taken for granted

Very well said

 

[Rooster1979]

The problem with much of the comment here is that it's mired in the SFL of bygone days. The SFL is a vastly different organisation to that of 4 or 5 years ago.


Presently the MSJFL is fundamentally independent although it gets significant help from the SFL and still, to an extent, also gets help from the VAFA – although much less so nowadays. When the merge is completed and the MSJFL is re-branded the Southern Football League Juniors – as I expect it to be - our junior teams will be playing in their comp. We've already seen how the MSJFL umpire coach became the SFL umpires administrator and the effect that has had on umpires flowing through to the SFL. Equate that to the playing side and the VAFA should have some concerns.


Noone is suggesting that the VAFA won't continue as a force as a football league if only because of its strong old school base. But they should be concerned at how they have been sidelined in this process and the possible implications – part of which have already been witnessed in the umpiring area.


As a football club you always love it when other clubs don't rate you. I reckon the SFL would be more than pleased to read some of the comments here that show some VAFA people still don't rate them. As I've said, look at the SFL today and what it's achieving, not the basket case of 4 or 5 years ago.

1. The MSJFL needs to merge, it can't run itself effectively.

2. The VAFA can't run a junior competition in soutern suburban Melbourne. It makes no sense for them to even attempt it. They have given administrative assistence, but the MSJFL needs to move to a position where it is self sufficient, not relying on other comps.

3. The SFL is the best fit for such a merge, so no, the VAFA has not been left out.

 

[AM]

1. The MSJFL needs to merge, it can't run itself effectively.

2. The VAFA can't run a junior competition in soutern suburban Melbourne. It makes no sense for them to even attempt it. They have given administrative assistence, but the MSJFL needs to move to a position where it is self sufficient, not relying on other comps.

3. The SFL is the best fit for such a merge, so no, the VAFA has not been left out.

I agree with much of what you say. The VAFA has, however, recognised the need for junior feeder teams that's why it put its foot in the water with an U18 comp. Every major comp now has a junior feeder comp associated with it. It's the way of the future.

The report recognises the VAFA is a "stakeholder" in the process but only recommends it "be periodically updated".That sounds like 'left out' to me.

 

[Rooster1979]

I agree with much of what you say. The VAFA has, however, recognised the need for junior feeder teams that's why it put its foot in the water with an U18 comp. Every major comp now has a junior feeder comp associated with it. It's the way of the future.

The report recognises the VAFA is a "stakeholder" in the process but only recommends it "be periodically updated".That sounds like 'left out' to me.

What is the other option though?

 

[majicjman]

The vafa is in big trouble with not enough umpires as far as i know from D3 down each team has to suppply an umpire for the reserves each game as VAFA can not supply any also each club has to supply for seniors and reserves boundry and goal umpires can any advise if this the same for D2 and D1

 

[Fish 20]

The vafa is in big trouble with not enough umpires as far as i know from D3 down each team has to suppply an umpire for the reserves each game as VAFA can not supply any also each club has to supply for seniors and reserves boundry and goal umpires can any advise if this the same for D2 and D1

Was the same for us across the board in D2, with the game of the round getting boundary umps

 

[Jascave]

Noticed with interest that the SFL has the Code report on its website and it can be downloaded, while on the VAFA site, no mention of the report at all, just coaching changes, and even more strangely, a poll on who VAFA website users think might win the Cox Plate. This shows just how far behind the VAFA is right now. The VAFA will be geniunely surprised in a few years time about how far the SFL has come. Benny Goodman and the VAFAUA will be under great strain like never before, when the lack of depth in the VAFA umpiring ranks is tested to the fullest, because the number of umpires that were spotted by the VAFAUA talent scouts and who were in line for senior promotion will instead be doing it in a different comp and also key umpires such as Tim Sutcliffe, Sacha Koffman, and more experienced umpires such as Wayne Hinton and Mark Gibson will be hard to replace in the coming years when they announce their retirements-who's going to step up and fill the gap?

 

[Bentleigh Beard]

Sniper shouldn't we be back on the SFL boards.

My mail is that the SFL are all for it, but the majority of MSJFL clubs (who will be the ones voting for it) are against it, including many teams with SFL senior teams.

 

[Cardio Carl]

Sniper shouldn't we be back on the SFL boards.

My mail is that the SFL are all for it, but the majority of MSJFL clubs (who will be the ones voting for it) are against it, including many teams with SFL senior teams.

I think you mean VAFA senior teams.

Good luck back in SFL BB

Goodness could you imagine if the MSJFL imposed the criteria that all teams must be aligned to an SFL side e.g. St Bedes going to say Mordialloc or Cheltenham, Hampton Rovers to Hampton Hammers etc. Just can't see that happening or unless the VAFA side goes to SFL.

Interesting times ahead.

 

[Fish 20]

Sniper shouldn't we be back on the SFL boards.

My mail is that the SFL are all for it, but the majority of MSJFL clubs (who will be the ones voting for it) are against it, including many teams with SFL senior teams.

This is an interesting thread which involves both the VAFA & SFL which is why I'm sticking my nose in.

 

[superfreak]

Great thread fellas and some really good posts. Obviously from an SFL standpoint this move would be fantastic for the future of our league.

Must agree with all of Ammo Man's posts though, too many people still look at the SFL like they are staring through 5 year old glasses. A lot has changed in that time.

 

[Rooster 24]

Agree. An interesting thread which has created a lot of (generally) balanced discussion. A healthy SFL is good for the VAFA as it should force those at HQ raise the bar and look at their priorities. The re-badging (Premier A, B, C etc) was an absolute nonsense and surely there are more pressing matters. While there is room for improvement the VAFA is still in pretty good shape and I cant see too many clubs bailing out. Might suit some but others will take their place.

Sniper and Co. Good luck in the SFL. I reckon Bentleigh will flourish and providing you maintain most of your playing group you should find yourself in Div 1 very soon. But be careful not to burn too many bridges. You never know when you might need to cross them again.

 

[Jascave]

So, what do you think the VAFA could've done better to meet the challenge of the Southern Football League/MSJFL merger, especially when the SFL/MSJFL 'marriage' could have wide ranging implications for the VAFA in the years to come (ie clubs that have teams affiliated with the MSJFL like Hampton Rovers & Baeumaris, umpiring numbers etc)?

 

[Grum Smuth]

I think to prevent the terrible catastrophic spectre of the proposed Merger the VAFA should have:

1. Stopped the expansion if its competition to include more U18 teams, new sides from key urban growth areas such as Point Cook, Sth Mornington and Beaconsfield (SFX).

2. Decided against running independent umpires in Premier Reserve fior the first time ever.

3. Not bothered consulting clubs on the proposed Division 1 to Division 4 restructure to minimise travel, especially for the numerous suburban based clubs in those sections.

4. Ignored the fact that the vast majority of junior players who graduate to U19 and senior VAFA ranks do so from the very stable and traditional feeder competitions of the APS, AGSV, ACC and EIS schoolboy football competitions.

5. Got Sacha Koffman, Tim Sutcliffe and Wayne Hinton to do a goodwill tour of the MJSFL clubs to show the kids things are done in the VAFA.

Had they followed the above, then maybe the sky wouldn't be about to fall in.

 

[Max Leader]

I think to prevent the terrible catastrophic spectre of the proposed Merger the VAFA should have:


2. Decided against running independent umpires in Premier Reserve for the first time ever.


Had they followed the above, then maybe the sky wouldn't be about to fall in.

Best rule introduced by VAFA in 20 years.

Shite umpire are now no longer called "cheats" they are called shite umpires.

 

[Bentleigh Beard]

[/b]


I think you mean VAFA senior teams.

Good luck back in SFL BB

Goodness could you imagine if the MSJFL imposed the criteria that all teams must be aligned to an SFL side e.g. St Bedes going to say Mordialloc or Cheltenham, Hampton Rovers to Hampton Hammers etc. Just can't see that happening or unless the VAFA side goes to SFL.

Interesting times ahead.

No Cardio, I mean SFL Senior teams, a few of the so called SFL alligned junior clubs are only associated by name. They don't want to be involved in an merger with the SFL and won't be voting for it at the meeting in November.

 

[Rooster 24]

So, what do you think the VAFA could've done better to meet the challenge of the Southern Football League/MSJFL merger, especially when the SFL/MSJFL 'marriage' could have wide ranging implications for the VAFA in the years to come (ie clubs that have teams affiliated with the MSJFL like Hampton Rovers & Baeumaris, umpiring numbers etc)?

Well Jase they could be a bit more pro-active. My junior club was ‘juniors’ only. Most of the players ended up at the Ammo’s – the best ones to their old school teams in A grade (De La & St Bedes primarily), a good numbers of others to Ormond and Oakleigh and to a lesser degree Bentleigh. A much smaller % to the SFL. Despite this the SFL were far more active in trying to sell their league and at least trying to recruit. They approached us to enter a team in the new (as it was then) U18 comp and even tried to encourage consideration of a senior team. Was never going to happen but they had a real crack.

The VAFA need to look at their priorities. Put their energy into what’s important. As a starter – umpire recruitment & development (McCarthy & Goodman do a very good job but need more help), improvement to EP, better council liaison etc. Not re-badging, interstate junkets and worst of all the ridiculous and petty fining system. Serious infractions deserve serious penalties. The petty crap that goes on at the moment is pathetic. I could go on and on….

I still reckon the VAFA is a great comp but they have the scope to do much better. With the looming threat from the SFL now is the time.

 

[Jascave]

And it's not just the proposed SFL/MSJFL merger that the VAFA should be worried about-there is the Eastern Football League wanting to challenge the VAFA as the no.1 football comp in metro Melbourne. Which means the VAFA would have to be pro-active rather than reactive to meet these challenges. Otherwise the VAFA would lose public recognition as the best football comp in metro Melbourne-and we're not talking about the NOW, but in 5-10 years time.

 

[Rooster1979]

And it's not just the proposed SFL/MSJFL merger that the VAFA should be worried about-there is the Eastern Football League wanting to challenge the VAFA as the no.1 football comp in metro Melbourne. Which means the VAFA would have to be pro-active rather than reactive to meet these challenges. Otherwise the VAFA would lose public recognition as the best football comp in metro Melbourne-and we're not talking about the NOW, but in 5-10 years time.

I'd suggest the best EFL teams would beat the best VAFA teams quite comfortably, and it's been that way for at least 10 years.

The VAFA doesn't need to worry, the standard is what the standard is, better or worse than other leagues, it really is irrelevant. Much of the VAFA's strength comes from the financial support of the OB networks toward the clubs, and that's not about to change any time soon

 

[superfreak]

EFL is easily the best comp in Melbourne. VAFA second, EDFL third.

 

[AM]

EFL is easily the best comp in Melbourne. VAFA second, EDFL third.

The thread isn't about which is the "best" comp. It's more to do with which of the two mentioned is currently the more progressive.

There's a puff piece on Russell Barnes brother (as we know him in the VAFA) which provides a feel for how far the SFL has come in the last few years here.

From being within a bees diaphragm of being defunct four years ago the SFL is now administratively and financially sound; has developed a healthy umpiring list; expanded the participating teams; likely to expand to include a significant junior league with a second in prospect down the track; added a competitive U18 comp and is now highly regarded at AFL Victoria.

It’s now a competition the VAFA should take seriously – even learn from.

 

[Jascave]

The thread isn't about which is the "best" comp. It's more to do with which of the two mentioned is currently the more progressive.

There's a puff piece on Russell Barnes brother (as we know him in the VAFA) which provides a feel for how far the SFL has come in the last few years here.

From being within a bees diaphragm of being defunct four years ago the SFL is now administratively and financially sound; has developed a healthy umpiring list; expanded the participating teams; likely to expand to include a significant junior league with a second in prospect down the track; added a competitive U18 comp and is now highly regarded at AFL Victoria.

It’s now a competition the VAFA should take seriously – even learn from.

I agree. On-field the VAFA comp looks as strong as ever; but off-field it is a concern. I've already spoken at length about the looming umpiring crisis that could emerge if the SFL/MSJFL merger goes ahead.

What the VAFA really needs to do is to cut down on sending rep teams overseas to spread the gospel in places like NZ. There are clubs that are finding difficult to be financially sound.

The last thing a club who's in financial trouble needs right now is another VAFA junket sending a rep team overseas, when in reality the VAFA should be spending more time & effort to help the club get out of the financial mire they're in.

Otherwise the club concerned might look at the SFL, which is far better run now compared to what it was 5 years ago, and maybe think about joining that comp.

And the VAFA will have no-one else to blame but themselves.

 

[BrianSpeaking]

Easy Jase, the facts are that the SFL is next to the worst comp in Victoria, and the VAFA is the best, regardless of what some peanuts on here say.
A team of Amateurs beat a team of highly paid Eastern Leaguers last year remember, oh how that must hurt, and our lower grade rep team flogged the finest from the SFL every time they played that the VAFA looked elsewhere.
I know your bro is at the Hampton Hammers, but really, who the hell are they?

 

[Jascave]

I reckon 88.3 Southern FM will be worthwhile listening to on the radio when the two local footy shows-The Southern Football League Show and VAFA Sunday come back in time for the start of the footy season. No doubt it'll be interesting to hear what Darryl Pitman on The Southern Football League Show, Tom Brain & Steve McCarthy on VAFA Sunday say about the Code Report, and the repercussion the Code Report might have on the respective competitions.