NO TROLLS Should AFL players bend the knee before each match in 2021?

[Ricketz]

What are you talking about mate? I quoted a communist interviewing the founder who says on tape 'we are trained Marxists' hahahaha

BLM and the social politics of today argue the inverse of that, and that also is indisputable.

You are selectively ignoring your own logic. The founder of Christianity was anti-capitalist, therefore all Christians are Marxists, therefore Scott Morrison is a Marxist. The majority of people support Scott Morrison, therefore the majority of people support Marxism. See? If simple arguments like that work for BLM, they must also work for everything else, right?

Like I said, tell me how the BLM "organisation" is Marxist.

 

[HaroLad]

You are selectively ignoring your own logic. The founder of Christianity was anti-capitalist, therefore all Christians are Marxists, therefore Scott Morrison is a Marxist. The majority of people support Scott Morrison, therefore the majority of people support Marxism. See? If simple arguments like that work for BLM, they must also work for everything else, right?

Like I said, tell me how the BLM "organisation" is Marxist.

I don't want to be demeaning, but if you think being anti-capitalist equates with being a Marxist there isn't much point arguing with you.

The founder and head of the organisation explicitly said it is Marxist. The doctrines are Marxist. The adherents are Marxists.

How does the lived experience that comes with being a different colour form a person?

I wouldn't know, and don't want to pretend to know. In theory it shouldn't matter. But groups like BLM continue to pronounce these differences and turn us against one another - it is incomprehensibly bad for a multi-racial society to think that each racial group has opposing interests. We are headed for disaster, or at least the US is.

 

[Kram]

I absolutely love how the title includes 'No trolls' yet the whole thread itself was intended as a troll.

 

[JZ_Skitzo]

Ah right, so if i dont bend the knee I'm all for racism? What a crock.

That's the same mentality as saying "white lives matter" or "All lives matter".

Just because of one action or statement, doesn't mean that the inverse is also true.

 

[Chief]

I wouldn't know, and don't want to pretend to know. In theory it shouldn't matter. But

You don’t want to pretend to know. but you have an opinion anyway.

 

[Ricketz]

I don't want to be demeaning, but if you think being anti-capitalist equates with being a Marxist there isn't much point arguing with you.

The founder and head of the organisation explicitly said it is Marxist. The doctrines are Marxist. The adherents are Marxists.

I wouldn't know, and don't want to pretend to know. In theory it shouldn't matter. But groups like BLM continue to pronounce these differences and turn us against one another - it is incomprehensibly bad for a multi-racial society to think that each racial group has opposing interests. We are headed for disaster, or at least the US is.

Well that's really my point, Marxist ideology is not describable by a few one liners - but just so you know:

"Supporting Marxism's historical premises are its economic theories. Of central importance are the labor theory of value and the idea of surplus value. Marxism supposes that the value of a commodity is determined by the amount of labor required for its manufacture. The value of the commodities purchasable by the worker's wages is less than the value of the commodities he produces; the difference, called surplus value, represents the profit of the capitalist. Thus the bourgeois class has flourished through exploitation of the proletariat."

I don't think anti-capitalism describes Marxism. I was just pointing out your foolishness in using instagrammers and youtubers as your source of knowledge on this issue and how you can apply their very same logic to suggest the majority of Australians are Marxists to the same level of proof you required to say taking a knee at a football game is a Marxist ideology.

You are right though - there isn't much point discussing this with you any further.

 

[Gough]

I'd like to know where BLM advocates for the nationalisation of all resources and transferring the means of production to the workers. There are some very strange definitions of Marxism thrown round these days.

 

[HaroLad]

You don’t want to pretend to know. but you have an opinion anyway.

An opinion regarding what it is like being another race? No, I don't have one, and never held myself out as having one.

Well that's really my point, Marxist ideology is not describable by a few one liners - but just so you know:

"Supporting Marxism's historical premises are its economic theories. Of central importance are the labor theory of value and the idea of surplus value. Marxism supposes that the value of a commodity is determined by the amount of labor required for its manufacture. The value of the commodities purchasable by the worker's wages is less than the value of the commodities he produces; the difference, called surplus value, represents the profit of the capitalist. Thus the bourgeois class has flourished through exploitation of the proletariat."

I don't think anti-capitalism describes Marxism. I was just pointing out your foolishness in using instagrammers and youtubers as your source of knowledge on this issue and how you can apply their very same logic to suggest the majority of Australians are Marxists to the same level of proof you required to say taking a knee at a football game is a Marxist ideology.

You are right though - there isn't much point discussing this with you any further.

Please, for my sanity, give examples of the following:
a. Where I have cited 'instagrammers' or 'youtubers'
b. Where I have suggested the majority of Australians are Marxists (I have consistently argued it is contrary to our collective normative morality)
c. Where I have said the act of taking a knee is of itself 'Marxist'

 

[Ricketz]

An opinion regarding what it is like being another race? No, I don't have one, and never held myself out as having one.

Please, for my sanity, give examples of the following:
a. Where I have cited 'instagrammers' or 'youtubers'
b. Where I have suggested the majority of Australians are Marxists (I have consistently argued it is contrary to our collective normative morality)
c. Where I have said the act of taking a knee is of itself 'Marxist'

Sheesh.

 

[JackOutback]

I don't want to be demeaning, but if you think being anti-capitalist equates with being a Marxist there isn't much point arguing with you.

The founder and head of the organisation explicitly said it is Marxist. The doctrines are Marxist. The adherents are Marxists.

I wouldn't know, and don't want to pretend to know. In theory it shouldn't matter. But groups like BLM continue to pronounce these differences and turn us against one another - it is incomprehensibly bad for a multi-racial society to think that each racial group has opposing interests. We are headed for disaster, or at least the US is.

Do you even understand what Marxism is or is it just the insult of choice you’ve heard bandied about lately?

 

[HaroLad]

Do you even understand what Marxism is or is it just the insult of choice you’ve heard bandied about lately?

Marxists, or 'neo' Marxists, in my understanding, view the sphere of human relations as a history of repression and exploitation, of conflict between groups. These 'neo' Marxists, distinct from the usual, orthodox Marxists, disregard the class conflict and focus instead on race, sexual orientation, gender, nationality, culture etc. These people think only in terms of race (or, alternatively, gender etc.). They view history and society exclusively through the lens of race. They have a sickening obsession with race. The consequences of this is a hyper-focus and promotion of a 'victim hierarchy' whereby a person is elevated on account of the number of 'victim' classes they belong to (race, gender, sexual orientation). It is blatantly obvious in their values (https://blacklivesmatter.com/about/) that they promote completely unrelated 'victim' classes (such as transgenders) that they view everything completely through this victim class lens, just as a Marxist would traditional economic class.

 

[JackOutback]

So the answer is no, then?

 

[mtooler]

Lol, hell no.

 

[HaroLad]

So the answer is no, then?

I clearly said they are Marxists in that they embody a new strain of Marxism which simply put, replaces the concept of 'class' with 'classes of victims' such as according to race or sexual orientation. They then analyse history and society almost purely through the purview of racial conflict or oppression.

 

[Gough]

I clearly said they are Marxists in that they embody a new strain of Marxism which simply put, replaces the concept of 'class' with 'classes of victims' such as according to race or sexual orientation. They then analyse history and society almost purely through the purview of racial conflict or oppression.

This new strain of Marxism that you've made up yourself, well done.

 

[jwikked]

Players should absolutely kneel before each game, right when we're playing the American national anthem and a few fighter jets fly over the stadium. If we're going to continue to import worthless US culture into our sport, might as well include some of the fun stuff as well. $2 watered down beer, hotdog night (Pasta at the 'G for Melbourne supporters), t-shirt guns and hot female cheerleaders on the sidelines.

 

[HaroLad]

This new strain of Marxism that you've made up yourself, well done.

Not really:

Neo-Marxism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

In essence they are incorporating broader perceived inequities into the orthodox Marxist doctrine. They themselves admit this, so at the very least you could credit the founders and head of BLM, not me.

 

[Ricketz]

Not really:

Neo-Marxism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

In essence they are incorporating broader perceived inequities into the orthodox Marxist doctrine. They themselves admit this, so at the very least you could credit the founders and head of BLM, not me.

That Wikipedia link doesn't support your premise.

 

[JackOutback]

If we're going to continue to import worthless US culture into our sport, might as well include some of the fun stuff as well. $2 watered down beer, hotdog night, t-shirt guns and hot female cheerleaders on the sidelines.

 

[HaroLad]

That Wikipedia link doesn't support your premise.

What is my premise?

 

[Ricketz]

What is my premise?

If you don't know your own argument what are you doing posting? You are the one posting links about your made up definition about neo-Marxism.

It really is becoming ridiculous now. None of this garbage has anything to do with players showing support for racial equality.

 

[HaroLad]

If you don't know your own argument what are you doing posting?

I do, I just doubt you do.

You are the one posting links about your made up definition about neo-Marxism.

It isn't made up - critical theory, of which 'race' is a key subfield, is undeniably a neo-Marxist doctrine. Critical race theory is undeniably intrinsically bound up with BLM.

It really is becoming ridiculous now. None of this garbage has anything to do with players showing support for racial equality.

It absolutely does - the AFLPA said specifically that they were kneeling for the purpose of supporting the Black Lives Matter organisation (which is not about racial 'equality', anyway).

 

[Forward Press]

View attachment 1098742

Too soon.

 

[Engimal v3]

Only the white players should have to kneel imo

 

[Ricketz]

I do, I just doubt you do.

It isn't made up - critical theory, of which 'race' is a key subfield, is undeniably a neo-Marxist doctrine. Critical race theory is undeniably intrinsically bound up with BLM.

It absolutely does - the AFLPA said specifically that they were kneeling for the purpose of supporting the Black Lives Matter organisation (which is not about racial 'equality', anyway).

Look you have at your one man war against people having opinions. I'm not going to stop you, but dressing up cliff notes from Sky News culture wars as reasoned analysis doesn't fool anybody.

I'm confident you are already on the wrong side of history on this one.