South Africa - Where to now?

[Pure_Ownage]

ch-ch-ch-changes

Lol so they drop their most promising young player verreyne for of all people klaasen? (While basically admitting they are doing it to keep klaasen away from the outfield due to injury. If hes injured dont play him FFS).

And bringing markram back when hes done nothing.

You could make a sitcom out of this stuff.

 

[PhatBoy]

No problem with them bringing markram back as he has proven at least that he can handle international cricket. No problem with four of the axings either. Dropping Verreyne is unfathomable though

 

[Blue1980]

That retirement of Theunis de Bruyn will hurt…

It’s like a Daniel Gorringe

Daniel Gorringe

Age

32

Ht

200cm

Wt

97kg

Pos.

F/R

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.6

3star

K

4.7

2star

HB

5.9

4star

M

2.3

2star

T

1.6

4star

G

0.4

3star

No current season stats available

D

8.2

2star

K

3.8

2star

HB

4.4

4star

M

1.6

2star

T

1.0

3star

G

0.4

3star

style retirement

 

[ioppolo]

I hope the burden of captaincy releases Elgar. He's a better player than his average suggests imo. I just hope Tiny Temba doesn't hit a form slump.

 

[Around the Wicket]

Bavuma has 1 Test hundred in 54 Tests as a batsmen.. I don't even think he should be in the side imo.

 

[Trojan90]

Bavuma averages 44 since beginning of 2021. Only Elgar (33) and Petersen (32) average over 30. He’s the closest thing to a lock out of the batsman.

 

[ioppolo]

Bavuma has 1 Test hundred in 54 Tests as a batsmen.. I don't even think he should be in the side imo.

Find someone to put in ahead of him.
Even better, find someone black to put in ahead of him.
They don't exist, especially with quotas.

 

[to1994]

Bavuma averages 44 since beginning of 2021. Only Elgar (33) and Petersen (32) average over 30. He’s the closest thing to a lock out of the batsman.

This is the cycle of looking into South African Cricket. You question Bavuma's place in the side, look at his ordinary record, then you see that the rest of the side are even worse and realise that this is the state of their cricket team.

 

[PhatBoy]

Bavuma has 1 Test hundred in 54 Tests as a batsmen.. I don't even think he should be in the side imo.

Well if he shouldn’t, no one else aside from Keegan Pietersen should because he’s been comfortably their best batsman for 18 months.

He’s averaged 45 across their last 6 series and generally has done it with the top order contributing very little. Of course you’d like to see a specialist batsman making hundreds no denying that but in such a poorly functioning batting line up you can’t cut all the guys that are failing and then throw away not only Verreyne who is actually doing ok but Bavuma as well

 

[Joose]

South Africa is in a very dodgy condition economically and politically. Crime rate is one of the worst in the world. Not long before it is in the failed state category.

We may have seen the best of South African cricket for a while.

 

[Trojan90]

South Africa is in a very dodgy condition economically and politically. Crime rate is one of the worst in the world. Not long before it is in the failed state category.

We may have seen the best of South African cricket for a while.

Sad if this happens. So many of my all time favourite players were South African.

 

[western royboy]

South Africa is in a very dodgy condition economically and politically. Crime rate is one of the worst in the world. Not long before it is in the failed state category.

We may have seen the best of South African cricket for a while.

Sad but spot on - the systems that produced the greats of the past no longer exist for a variety of reasons. Their cricket will never ever comeback unfortunately.

 

[Gough]

Sad but spot on - the systems that produced the greats of the past no longer exist for a variety of reasons. Their cricket will never ever comeback unfortunately.

The systems that produced the greats of the past could have produced even more incredible cricketers but for the structural flaws at every level. If a weaker cricket team is the price to pay for democracy I suspect the vast majority of South Africans will cop that.

 

[MisterMarcus]

Im not across teh quota system as much as others, nor players who may be missing out. Have enjoyed the posts here, and feel like ive learned something today. Can see the benefits and pitfalls of the system per se.

chatting to some fellow patrons at the bar yesterday, who bemoaned the system. "they should pick players on merit". They couldnt name anyone who could take the place of a quotaed player. Neither could I.

Cheers

I remember Kevin Pietersen talking about this back in the day. He made mention of promising white juniors and younger lower-level players who found their path upwards blocked or made much more difficult by the quota system. He claimed a lot of those players either fell by the wayside, had their development severely impeded by playing at too low a level for too long, or (as he did) just left the country and found opportunities to play elsewhere.

I would imagine in the era of the 20-20 Mercenary, the latter option is becoming even more attractive now for young players who don't want to have to fight through the system (although admittedly that's not exclusively a SA problem)

So from what he was saying, I think it's less that there are bucketloads of 'deserving' white players around who are blatantly missing out. It's that a whole potential talent pool is just being lost at an early stage, and never even getting to the point of being considered for bigger things.

 

[PhatBoy]

I remember Kevin Pietersen talking about this back in the day. He made mention of promising white juniors and younger lower-level players who found their path upwards blocked or made much more difficult by the quota system. He claimed a lot of those players either fell by the wayside, had their development severely impeded by playing at too low a level for too long, or (as he did) just left the country and found opportunities to play elsewhere.

I would imagine in the era of the 20-20 Mercenary, the latter option is becoming even more attractive now for young players who don't want to have to fight through the system (although admittedly that's not exclusively a SA problem)

So from what he was saying, I think it's less that there are bucketloads of 'deserving' white players around who are blatantly missing out. It's that a whole potential talent pool is just being lost at an early stage, and never even getting to the point of being considered for bigger things.

It is hard to know how to alleviate that problem. I haven’t followed their new franchise comp but ideally it would pump a lot of money into their cricket system.
At the very least you would hope that maybe going forward they could establish some extra domestic sides which would open up an extra 20-30 spots, ie. if you are going to reduce the percentage of spots available to white players, at least enhance the gross number of spots available.

I support the quota system in basic principle and if done right it suddenly opens up this incredibly big pool of talent to enhance their cricket but that ONLY happens if the development and the coaching and the structure is good, and if the players of any colour still know that if they are obviously good enough, they can make it.

Right at the moment they haven’t got that structure and development right and it’s not working the way it should

 

[Beutbrute]

South Africa to relieve their u19 captain of his position because of his ethnicity. Not a good way to build culture.

 

[big_e]

South Africa to relieve their u19 captain of his position because of his ethnicity. Not a good way to build culture.

Given Piers is one of the "keep politics and sport separate" folks, I wonder what he thought of these comments...

 

[Santana]

South Africa to relieve their u19 captain of his position because of his ethnicity. Not a good way to build culture.

Yes, he clearly has been dropped because he is a Jew....

Do these people ever get tired of lying?

 

[eth-dog]

South Africa to relieve their u19 captain of his position because of his ethnicity. Not a good way to build culture.

No, he was relieved because he was advocating genocide

 

[Black Diamond]

Says a lot about their own people that they think Teeger would in danger as captain.

SA is a failure of a nation.

 

[Santana]

The whole in "danger" thing is probably just cover. They probably just feel very uncomfortable having a war crime supporting bigot lead one of the national teams while the actual nation leads the way in the UN to stop said war crimes. The embarrassing part is not doing this when he said it.

 

[PhatBoy]

Says a lot about their own people that they think Teeger would in danger as captain.

SA is a failure of a nation.

TBH I think that sort of broad generalisation is exactly the sort of generalisation that gets people in trouble in the first place. There’s no switch that a ‘nation’ can flick that fixes these problems. It’s the people that make up those nations that fix the problems.

 

[Gough]

South Africa also faces a set of circumstances that are unique to any other country on the planet.

 

[mouncey2franklin]

If a weaker cricket team is the price to pay for democracy

What are you talking about?

Apartheid ended 30 years ago. There have been plenty of good SA players and teams in the meantime.

The current lot isn't it.

 

[western royboy]

This is far more complex than removing him as Captain because he is Jewish - as many have pointed out. I witnessed some of the most obscene racism that I have ever seen first hand by a lad of the same background against a cape coloured kid in the very same team that we played in. This was in Sydney mid 90’s. Shameful.