St Kilda President Andrew Bassat tees off on the AFL draft system, specifically father/son and the Northern Academies

[BurnUp]

Question....

If Father-Sons are so inconsequential and irrelevant to a teams success - why do clubs want them?

Is it just for the joy of it?

And if it is, why do they just want the good Father-Sons, and not the hopeless ones?

Surely the joy would be the same?

Lol sooky sooky sook sook still getting all worked up about this.

Father Sons add to the spectacle of the game, sook. It's exciting to see the son of a past footballer continue the family legacy. You can cry all you want about muh fairness all you like, you just don't get it. You're the type looking to get mad about anything

 

[Teflon]

Shows how much you understand about being an AFL club in NRL land. There is no grassroot level AFL establishment to create opportunities or jobs like coaching, training etc. Gold Coast is starting to change but in Brisbane and far north QLD there are private school boards who have blocked playing AFL as a sport in their school system. Until you see broader changes in the way AFL has penetrated into the state, the inequality will continue to exist and there will be a reliance for QLD based clubs to source talent from Victoria.

I'd say our academy - even though it's not doing a stellar job so far in terms of identifying good talent early like Gold Coast have done so far - has been helping us to level the playing field slowly and build our list out with more QLD focused talent like Andrews (pick 61), Hipwood (14), Coleman (undrafted 18 yo, anyone could've taken him in that draft), Reville (drafted as 22 yo), Payne (pick 54) and so on.

Gold Coast this year and possibly in the next 2 years have talent coming through their ranks where they can't draft all of them. That's how you change the system rather than having a mindless go at academy and rambling about "stand up on your own".

We’ve been in Sydney funding it for how long …at what point does that model work or is deemed unable to stand on its own?
Academia can still exist - open them up allow the AFL management of them
Lions are a hit ticket right now or are you saying it’s only the benefits keep you afloat ??
Doesn’t sound sustainable…..in. “Fitzroy” kind of way (who ironically had backers and at the time were more solvent than Carlton….) but the VFL / AFL didn’t want that ….manufactured

 

[Verdun]

Interesting read this thread. Most posters choose to ignore the points raised by Bassat and take the opportunity to lay the boot into the Saints....whatever floats your boat I spose.

I supported Brisbane in the GF mainly due to the Tasmanian connection with Fagan, reading some of their supporters on here not showing a great deal of humility.

Maybe just enjoy the win and stop bringing your club down.

The Saints are now in a solid position with a good list and admin, personally pleased the President is proactive and not just accepting of the status quo.

 

[mpal6]

We’ve been in Sydney funding it for how long …at what point does that model work or is deemed unable to stand on its own?
Academia can still exist - open them up allow the AFL management of them
Lions are a hit ticket right now or are you saying it’s only the benefits keep you afloat ??
Doesn’t sound sustainable…..in. “Fitzroy” kind of way (who ironically had backers and at the time were more solvent than Carlton….) but the VFL / AFL didn’t want that ….manufactured

Model needs to be maintained or continued for AFL as it directly correlates to their media contracts. You need the clubs across all states for 7/fox to cough up $4.5 Billion in TV rights.

To be fair, Sydney was happy to withdraw from national draft and get their players exclusively from NSW as far back as 2009/10. Their model is starting to sustain now and they had so much faith in finding talent via academy pathway that they said happy to draft exclusively from NSW. AFL blocked it.

Swans had plan to pull out of draft

Sydney would have completely withdrawn from the national draft and started recruiting exclusively from New South Wales under a radical proposal put to the AFL.

www.theage.com.au

Lions had a combination of mismanagement and poor planning post three-peat in the last 20 years. Our training facility / gym used to be the dump under Gabba or the open ground at Giffin park - https://www.austadiums.com/stadiums/giffin-park.

We've come a long way since then and able to cash in far more shrewdly in our current window starting from 2019. Built our $80m springfield training base in 2022 - thanks to Ipswich council, state and federal funding. It helps us provide comparable facilities on par with other clubs and able to attract talent in a more even playing field. I believe we'll make a good dent on our $3 mil deficit in the next few years and move towards being solvent on our own.

 

[Elixuh]

Interesting read this thread. Most posters choose to ignore the points raised by Bassat and take the opportunity to lay the boot into the Saints....whatever floats your boat I spose.

I supported Brisbane in the GF mainly due to the Tasmanian connection with Fagan, reading some of their supporters on here not showing a great deal of humility.

Maybe just enjoy the win and stop bringing your club down.

The Saints are now in a solid position with a good list and admin, personally pleased the President is proactive and not just accepting of the status quo.

Most non-vfl teams are just sick of the same tired routine. We sit back and watch over decades as the VFL clubs are advantaged by these rules far and above any non-vfl team.

As soon as a non-vfl team gets a lick of the ice cream a club like St Kilda comes out and is critical of it. It’s a tired routine. Where were these criticisms when teams like the Pies and Doggies were getting F/S year on year?

What Bassat is upset about is St Kilda being a small club doesn’t get the same advantages as the big VFL clubs and wants a lick of that ice cream. But he can’t outright say that so just a waits until a non-vfl club is advantaged by a rule and tees off. It’s pathetic.

 

[Lavender Bushranger]

Correct
It ain’t hard pay full price
For anyone whingeing about St Kilda stuff ups - the prez stated we’ve been our own worst enemy
Doesn’t change the fact the system is cooked

Even if you pay full price - why should a club get to jump the queue to be able to get that player?

It defeats the whole purpose of the Draft.


The other issue I have with the Father-Son rule is, who is it trying to make happy?

Is it the player? The player's family? If so, that's just outrageous. No kid gets to choose which club they go to. It defeats the entire point of the Draft.

Is to make the fans happy? Which fans???
Peter Moore played his last game for Collingwood in 1982 FFS!

No fan under the age of 32 when Darcy Moore was drafted was even born when Peter last played for Collingwood!!

You're basically completely rooting the integrity of the Draft and the comp to make a bunch of 50 year old tragic fans happy.

It's just so bizarre.

Honestly, the most bizarre thing about it is that some people think it's a great idea. I just can't wrap my head around it.

 

[mpal6]

Interesting read this thread. Most posters choose to ignore the points raised by Bassat and take the opportunity to lay the boot into the Saints....whatever floats your boat I spose.

I supported Brisbane in the GF mainly due to the Tasmanian connection with Fagan, reading some of their supporters on here not showing a great deal of humility.

Maybe just enjoy the win and stop bringing your club down.

The Saints are now in a solid position with a good list and admin, personally pleased the President is proactive and not just accepting of the status quo.

I would have a lot more respect for him if he came out guns blazing about Daicos after Pies won the premiership last year.

He's picking and choosing when to channel his moral outrage too. Brisbane is a much easier target compared to taking on Collingwood.

 

[SeaOfFire]

He actually addressed that.
You like so many clearly didn't listen to his entire speech and not the small grab.

Then I'll wait for the stories of him tugging on the coats of AFL commissioners at the GF to advise of taking corporate responsibility to improve and grow their success through internal mechanisms.

He used a public forum to take a populist cheap shot at a perceived injustice, thus perpetuating the cycle of woe the envelops the football club. I cannot fathom how anyone would feel that is anything other than inflammatory and petulant. If he wished to air such a grievance, do so privately, not publicly.

Praise in public, punish in private is the usual approach from capable management, which, irrespective of his business acumen, your president appears to have overlooked in his rush to deflect from the situation of St Kilda.

The apologists ITT are missing the point being made by the critics....whether it is fair or not isn't the point. The point is that even IF the Lions had to compile sufficient points to match a bid for Levi Ashcroft at Pick 1 this year.....that would have ZERO bearing on improving the organisation at St Kilda, one that has spent years fumbling and failing....because they'd seemingly rather bleat and complain about unfairness than get their house in order, take responsibility, make changes and control what they can control.

Yes, I heard him reference this briefly in his speech. But given the time spent (both on the night and at the GF) on the Lions' and Levi Ashcroft, it appears there is less focus internally and more focus externally on creating a public discussion point and agitating on the benefits enjoyed by everyone else, which in his mind somehow consign St Kilda to irrelevance.

Here's a thought - Madonna once said that any publicity is good publicity. Which might be true if you're a pop star. If you are trying to sell a vision of hope and future success for an organisation and to a marketplace, complaining about the unfairness of life probably won't achieve the outcomes you want.

 

[Rabish Binney]

Pretty sure Adelaide did the same thing with Gunston.

I always disliked Taylor Walker for that (though the racism doesn't help either). Treated any Adelaide player who wanted to leave the club like they were traitors and worse than scum.

Interesting….considering Gunston got on a plane back to Melbourne on his own accord the day of the club B & F and advised club officials of this once he landed.

Walker had nothing to do with it.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

Then I'll wait for the stories of him tugging on the coats of AFL commissioners at the GF to advise of taking corporate responsibility to improve and grow their success through internal mechanisms.

He used a public forum to take a populist cheap shot at a perceived injustice, thus perpetuating the cycle of woe the envelops the football club. I cannot fathom how anyone would feel that is anything other than inflammatory and petulant. If he wished to air such a grievance, do so privately, not publicly.

Praise in public, punish in private is the usual approach from capable management, which, irrespective of his business acumen, your president appears to have overlooked in his rush to deflect from the situation of St Kilda.

The apologists ITT are missing the point being made by the critics....whether it is fair or not isn't the point. The point is that even IF the Lions had to compile sufficient points to match a bid for Levi Ashcroft at Pick 1 this year.....that would have ZERO bearing on improving the organisation at St Kilda, one that has spent years fumbling and failing....because they'd seemingly rather bleat and complain about unfairness than get their house in order, take responsibility, make changes and control what they can control.

Yes, I heard him reference this briefly in his speech. But given the time spent (both on the night and at the GF) on the Lions' and Levi Ashcroft, it appears there is less focus internally and more focus externally on creating a public discussion point and agitating on the benefits enjoyed by everyone else, which in his mind somehow consign St Kilda to irrelevance.

Here's a thought - Madonna once said that any publicity is good publicity. Which might be true if you're a pop star. If you are trying to sell a vision of hope and future success for an organisation and to a marketplace, complaining about the unfairness of life probably won't achieve the outcomes you want.

That's a lot of words to say "I didn't listen to it"

 

[Sttew]

Good on him.

F/S entitlements are a rort. Not only do you skip the draft which is meant to equalise the comp, you don't even have to pay the full price (in points). Bundling up junk picks for a Top 3 player is ridiculous.

The advantages they give clubs are excessive.

The irony of course is that the league first introduced the father son rule to help Melbourne get Ron Barrassi.

 

[SeaOfFire]

That's a lot of words to say "I didn't listen to it"

ROFL.

This is exactly the point being made, repeatedly - YOU require ME to be involved in YOUR solution.

 

[Pakenhamsaint]

ROFL.

This is exactly the point being made, repeatedly - YOU require ME to be involved in YOUR solution.

If you bothered to listen you would have heard him say St Kilda has been thier own worst enemy at times. He acknowledged that we needed improvement and have been doing so

This is where he acknowledged the current system makes it harder. That's where the clip about him talking about F/S and academies comes from.

 

[The Nostradamus]

First thing that needs to change is Scrap top 30 academy matching of bids for all clubs

They can always request a trade home after their initial contract

 

[Mofra]

Every club bar Gold Coast has had a grand final appearance in the last 25 years. So you're right we need more equalisation for us!!

You joke but but you have the academy which is more about funneling kids into AFL and away from NRL, and nothing
Lions have the academy and a raft of FS picks. Suns are behind the 8 ball compared to their Queensland neighbour.

 

[mpal6]

First thing that needs to change is Scrap top 30 academy matching of bids for all clubs

They can always request a trade hope after their initial contract

And father son, NGA, everything. then we'll have a fair system.

In spite of benefiting more from Father Son than academy recently, I can get behind this change.

 

[Supersuns]

You joke but but you have the academy which is more about funneling kids into AFL and away from NRL, and nothing
Lions have the academy and a raft of FS picks. Suns are behind the 8 ball compared to their Queensland neighbour.

Our academy will pay off, the club has invested significantly into it. Having someone like Rhyce Shaw overseeing is making a huge difference. Football is the main sport played at schools on the GC, we are going to have a lot of young kids being introduced to elite pathways that up until 6 years ago didn't exist on the Coast.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Im surprised also people arnt smart enough to read between the lines

Bassat teeing off trying to get pick 8 in for Battle. The conversation is back and forth on it id say at this stage so Bassat gone nuclear to let the AFL know that unless he gets pick 8, he is going to begin a crusade

Its smart posturing

 

[The Nostradamus]

And father son, NGA, everything. then we'll have a fair system.

In spite of benefiting more from Father Son than academy recently, I can get behind this change.

I don’t mind this

No top 30 matching of any players (academy/father sons etc)

Anything after that is fair game but bids inside that can’t match and you just have to wait for a trade

 

[PenAndPaper]

I don’t mind this

No top 30 matching of any players (academy/father sons etc)

Anything after that is fair game but bids inside that can’t match and you just have to wait for a trade

That essentials makes the academies useless. Why would a club invest any time or resources into a player that would clearly go top 30?
They just need to make it that if an academy player is bid on in the first round, the team matching has to use a pick from that same round, none of this using 4 picks in the 30s to match a top 10 pick.

 

[The Nostradamus]

That essentials makes the academies useless. Why would a club invest any time or resources into a player that would clearly go top 30?
They just need to make it that if an academy player is bid on in the first round, the team matching has to use a pick from that same round, none of this using 4 picks in the 30s to match a top 10 pick.

Afl to run the academies

 

[Elixuh]

First thing that needs to change is Scrap top 30 academy matching of bids for all clubs

They can always request a trade home after their initial contract

So we should fund and run our academy but not receive the intended benefit?

 

[Elixuh]

Afl to run the academies

The AFL doesn’t want to run the academies and when they did it was a disaster.

 

[Sector 7G]

Im surprised also people arnt smart enough to read between the lines

Bassat teeing off trying to get pick 8 in for Battle. The conversation is back and forth on it id say at this stage so Bassat gone nuclear to let the AFL know that unless he gets pick 8, he is going to begin a crusade

Its smart posturing

I think it is a diversion from how poor the Saints season was after making finals last year, rather than admit to the members the club has been poor at list management over the last decade.

 

[nineteen eighty]

Afl to run the academies

The AFL doesn’t want to run the academies and when they did it was a disaster.

And that's the thing...the only fair approach is for the AFL to run the academies and yet if they are given them, it will be a fleck up.

If a club is developing and running the academies, then absolutely they need to be rewarded. They need to pay a little more than a bag of chips though for what are top 5 (if not #1) draft picks. And yet the AFL is asleep at the wheel.

Same goes for father / son picks.