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You forgot the /wishfulthinking.
Our best 3 players this year are 23, 24 and 24. We're going nowhere.
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AFLW 2024 - Round 10 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
The arrogance and balls of one Nathan Buckley
- Thread starter Mark25Jackson
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You forgot the /wishfulthinking.
Our best 3 players this year are 23, 24 and 24. We're going nowhere.
Arrogance would have had him walking straight into the job at North without doing the apprenticeship.
The club chose the appropriate course of action at the time. At the time the deal was struck Malthouse had been at the club 9 years and we were still without a flag. Or a ruckman. Or a clearance midfielder. When a candidate like Buckley appears then you need to do what you can to invest in the future, especially when your coach is nearing 60.
Buckley will be judged on his merits over the course of his term, not on the back of whatever may occur in 2012. Lets not forget Collingwood have 13 first year players at the club, and only one of them has had a taste of senior football, so he has a whole new bunch of players to bring through.
The club chose the appropriate course of action at the time. At the time the deal was struck Malthouse had been at the club 9 years and we were still without a flag. Or a ruckman. Or a clearance midfielder. When a candidate like Buckley appears then you need to do what you can to invest in the future, especially when your coach is nearing 60.
Buckley will be judged on his merits over the course of his term, not on the back of whatever may occur in 2012. Lets not forget Collingwood have 13 first year players at the club, and only one of them has had a taste of senior football, so he has a whole new bunch of players to bring through.
MaddAdam
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Hollow Knight
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Can't help but get the impression that Buckley has a tendency to chase success, rather than create it.
Rather than stick around build something, he left the Bears in order to "play finals footy" and I can't help but suspect his career moves thus far show a similar approach.
Rather than take ownership of a struggling team and building something from scratch, he finds himself in an almost unprecedented position of being handed a ready-to-go premiership side. The "only wanting to coach Collingwood - the club I love" thing is nothing more than a smokescreen IMO.
Call me bitter, and I am sure some will, but I don't like to see this sort of self-serving ambition get rewarded. It absolutely stinks what they are doing to Mick.
Rather than stick around build something, he left the Bears in order to "play finals footy" and I can't help but suspect his career moves thus far show a similar approach.
Rather than take ownership of a struggling team and building something from scratch, he finds himself in an almost unprecedented position of being handed a ready-to-go premiership side. The "only wanting to coach Collingwood - the club I love" thing is nothing more than a smokescreen IMO.
Call me bitter, and I am sure some will, but I don't like to see this sort of self-serving ambition get rewarded. It absolutely stinks what they are doing to Mick.
you're kidding, right?
Don't give me that old wheeze about mick getting shafted. You know its absolute b/s.
He had been at the club for over decade with full control of the footy department and no success to show for it when he was offered this deal to save his reputation and pride. No other sporting body would give a failure of a coach that sort of sweetheart deal.
Collingwood saved Micks reputation and are going to make him a rich man - those are the FACTS.
Sorry, its just bitterness.
He is a Collingwood man and wants to coach Collingwood.
Hird is an Essendon man and wants to coach Essendon.
Voss is a Brisbane man and wants to coach Brisbane.
You are reading way too much into it.
As for "what they are doing to Mick".... I think anybody who had produced no silverware after nine years and then get a five year pension plan thrown at them can hardly consider themselves to be hardly done by.
The proof as they say will be in the pudding!
Had enuf of all the talk + speculation seriously..
No one inc. those involved has any idea if this will work or not!!
We will all have to wait for the next couple of years to pass by to know if this has worked or otherwise.
Had enuf of all the talk + speculation seriously..
No one inc. those involved has any idea if this will work or not!!
We will all have to wait for the next couple of years to pass by to know if this has worked or otherwise.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
IMO it says more about the flogs that start them than anything else. I personally cringe whenever I see a Collingwood supporter start a similar thread to this about another contending club.
However having said that I'll still embrace the concept of this thread despite the fact that it's meant as a pot-shot at both the club and Buckley.
I don't mind in the slightest if Buckley is arrogant with the biggest cajonies of any senior coach currently at the top. All it means is that he'll stop at nothing for my club to be successful. You just have to take a look at MM to realise that those attributes can be extremely positive.
The sheer arrogance and stubbornness that he portrays to the media are testament to how he's operated since day dot and I gotta say that it hasn't exactly had a negative effect on his coaching career! Mark Thompson is another poster boy for the most arrogant men in football group, yet it didn't seem to have any adverse effects for Geelong, once they got their list in order.
yep, agree. Hird, too, is not short of a little arrogance. I don't mind that one bit.
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Both these posts are spot on.
When the deal was struck, Malthouse saved face and the club restored his reputation and pride. At ANY other club, he would have been released ala Kevin Sheedy after a decade with no silverware to show for it.
The club did what was in the best interests of all parties involved. Malthouse was looked after and given the hoorah he has deserved, Bucks was given the time to learn under the guidance of the master and the club won a premiership and is on track for a second. There is no denying that this deal has been very successful for everyone involved at Collingwood.
OP you do realize MM will still be at Collingwood in 2012 guiding Buckley and the team right?
When the deal was done every other club supporter considered MM a failure at Collingwood, now he is suddenly the greatest coach of all time and an immortal of the game.
The only delusion in this thread is supporters under estimating Buckleys knowledge of the game, how much he has learned from MM in the past few years and how beneficial it will be to the club having him as the coach with MM guidance in 2012.
Malthouse agreed to the deal. He thought it was a good decision at the time. That's not stabbing someone in the back. The fact he may turn around later and change his mind is irrelevant.
Cousin of Daicos
HEY MAGPIE ARMY!
While your post actually makes a lot of sense, I call bullshit only because the REASON this all 'stinks' is because of the flag we won.
Which is not the right reason for this deal not to go ahead.
The deal was put in place knowing full well, (and more than likely hoping) a flag or 2 would come in those 2 years.
Malthouse sat like a fat cat, for 10 years, with unprecedented control over the football department, with blank cheques being written to fly to Arizona, travel around the world studying other codes, spending big bucks on Assistants, sports science etc, with no flag.
NO other club would have given a coach, even an experienced one, that long.
Hell, look at Carlton. Pagan is an amazing coach, who had NO budget, NO draft picks, NO control over the footy department and how long did they give him?
Please, Mick had his chance, and was even granted ANOTHER 2 years to get soemthing done.
This deal was the kick up the arse he needed to get the job he should have done years ago, done.
Guess, what, it worked.
Revisionist history can kiss my ass.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
TBH that's thing that shits me most about your coaching panel
They've all bloody got it except maybe McCartney who always seems to take a back seat! Doesn't auger well for your mob being out of the 8 for too long as those blokes certainly won't accept mediocrity.....
The only concern I have re the arrogance is if they're prone to brain farts like Voss succumb to. It was through his arrogance and stubbornness that he felt he could become successful with those cast off's and aside from Staker they've all pretty much been failures.
You can't make guarantees, however with the current list Buckley has to work with and how the Bombers are shaping up under Hird I can't see them following the Voss path, so that bravado can only be a positive IMO.
I can't see Buckley winning out of this situation. If in his first year as coach they win another flag then it will be viewed as Mick laying the foundations and Bucks reaping the rewards. If he doesn't win a flag then the view will be that Mick was a better coach as we all suspected and Buckley (Like Voss) being slapped about in the media.
Without being able to see into the future, I can't see Voss or Buckley coaching another team in the AFL. They have been guided to coach their beloved team and if this fails where to from there. Voss at least has a few years to progress and realistically unless he really is a dud coach Brisbane will progress, but what about Collingwood, Unfortunately they can only go down hill. So unless he can keep Collingwood as premiership contenders for the duration of his career he will be out of a job.
Without being able to see into the future, I can't see Voss or Buckley coaching another team in the AFL. They have been guided to coach their beloved team and if this fails where to from there. Voss at least has a few years to progress and realistically unless he really is a dud coach Brisbane will progress, but what about Collingwood, Unfortunately they can only go down hill. So unless he can keep Collingwood as premiership contenders for the duration of his career he will be out of a job.
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The interest from non-Collingwood supporters was strong long before McGuire came out and said that. There's been a main board thread or two about the Collingwood coaching situation and/or "what's Mick doing next year?" seemingly every week this year. Why do people care so much? I'm not asking in a "Mind your own business!"/"Don't dare talk about Collingwood!" kind of way, just genuinely curious as to why it's of such constant importance to supporters of other clubs.
"Inevitably ageing"? "Likely to be out of the top four" after 2013? I don't think people realise just how young the Collingwood list is. The only clubs with a younger list than Collingwood in 2011 are Gold Coast, Melbourne, Richmond, North Melbourne, West Coast and Adelaide, and the Pies just won the Premiership last year. I think these young/up-and-coming clubs (plus everyone else) will still have a powerful Collingwood side to deal with for a fair number of years yet.
Based on the current Collingwood playing list, here's what the Magpies might look like in 2016, excluding anyone who'll be over 30 by then:
B: Alan Toovey - Nathan J. Brown - Tyson Goldsack
HB: Harry O'Brien - Ben Reid - Simon Buckley
C: Steele Sidebottom - Sharrod Wellingham - Dayne Beams
HF: Brent Macaffer - Travis Cloke - Alexander Fasolo
F: Daniel Farmer - Chris Dawes - Jarryd Blair
R: John Ceglar - Scott Pendlebury - Dale Thomas
I: John McCarthy - Luke Rounds - Tom Young - Jarrod Witts
14 Premiership players there
West Coast could have done the exact same thing in 2005.
Exit Judd , Cousins , Kerr Injured and a few retirements and we know how that turned out.
Most collingwood supporters struggle to figure out a TV remote let alone predicting the future.
I prefer to look someone in the eye when talking to them...
Buckley has been assistant coach for several years, I'm not sure Voss or Hird have. I don't care enough to check.
Cousin of Daicos
HEY MAGPIE ARMY!
West Coast could have done the exact same thing in 2005.
Exit Judd , Cousins , Kerr Injured and a few retirements and we know how that turned out.
Most collingwood supporters struggle to figure out a TV remote let alone predicting the future.
Surprising an Essendon supporter would doubt Collingwood's ability to remain a threat for many years.
Baby Bombers ring a bell? Didn't you then go on to play in a prelim 6 years later, and play in 2 grand finals in the 2 years after that?
Collingwood 2010 was a younger team than Bombers 93.
Think about that for a second.
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Funny thing about this thread, both Collingwood supporters and non-Collingwood supporters are looking forward to next year when Buckley takes over. I recognise that some Pie supporters have expressed their desire not to carry out Eddie's plan. However, the majority of Pie fans trust and support Eddie.
Of course, non-Pie supporters are looking forward to it because they think it will fail. Fair enough. I can understand your desperation.
As for calling Bucks arrogant, it's really like water off a Buck's back. Until his supposed arrogance has an effect similar to the one that resulted from King Voss's arrogance, then I will continue to support him.
As for the rest of you hoping and praying that Bucks stuffs it up next year.....well you can always hope that your team beats us....lol.... like I said, I understand your desperation..
Of course, non-Pie supporters are looking forward to it because they think it will fail. Fair enough. I can understand your desperation.
As for calling Bucks arrogant, it's really like water off a Buck's back. Until his supposed arrogance has an effect similar to the one that resulted from King Voss's arrogance, then I will continue to support him.
As for the rest of you hoping and praying that Bucks stuffs it up next year.....well you can always hope that your team beats us....lol.... like I said, I understand your desperation..
Ego is not a dirty word, and the late great Shirl once sang.
You're forgetting this is Collingwood you are talking about, we ignore foolish and ignorant opinions - who cares what other supporters think when the have NFI what is going on at the club. Opinions are just that - opinions and uniformed ignorant opinions at that.
A lot of water to flow yet but if Collingwood win in 2011 and then Buckley coaches Collingwood to the 2012 flag it will be one of the very rare instances of a hat trick in the history of the competition. IMO it will have been in no small part to the urgency Malthouse discovered when his tenure had a finite end and the refresh of a new coach - see Geelong for an example.
If Collingwood don't win in 2011 then I can't see any issue either way unless Collingwood fall in a heap in 2012.
Honestly, all the hypotheticals are so over dramatised it's not funny.
Right now both Malthouse and Buckley are working their backsides off for a second successive flag. The following year the club may be chasing history. If some people discount the achievement of Buckley if he happns to caoch a flag Collingwood will still be deleriously happy and Buckley will only be more driven.
This is a deal that has already worked. All we are arguing about now is how spectacularly successful this will all turn out to be.
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