Preview The evolution of our best 22 - 2016

[Dogsman16]

Personally, I want to see him be a bit more mongrel whilst giving away less soft free kicks! it's called 'one eyed, beer logic'

We talking about Redpath here? Think the "mongrel" aspect of his game is already very good. Hits very hard

 

[bobs head soup]

I kind of get the mongrel thing. What he needs is more belief that he is a weapon at AFL level and to throw himself into each play with conviction. At times last year he was that bit tentative for a crucial split second.

The word is that Jack has been doing plenty of sprint work to build up his mobility. I wonder if he will be trialled as more of a conventional CHF type.

His aerobic capacity needs a lot of development, but he could be really good in this role for a few reasons:

- Would be a great presence running off the line at centre bounces and generally getting up into midfield contests.
- Looks more comfortable as a leading into space type than a contested inside 50 pack marker.
- Is a lovely field kick but patchy set shot. Would prefer him bringing the ball into the 50 rather than finishing.

A forward line of:

Dahlhaus/Redpath/Crameri
Stringer/Boyd/Dickson

Would certainly stretch a few defences.

 

[cats2rise]

Thanks for the responses.

Seems there is a big split on the forum! I think a lot will depend on what forward line is deemed best to work with (tall/tall with focal point/small/small with focal point) by the coaching staff.

 

[Pugz89]

I kind of get the mongrel thing. What he needs is more belief that he is a weapon at AFL level and to throw himself into each play with conviction. At times last year he was that bit tentative for a crucial split second.

The word is that Jack has been doing plenty of sprint work to build up his mobility. I wonder if he will be trialled as more of a conventional CHF type.

His aerobic capacity needs a lot of development, but he could be really good in this role for a few reasons:

- Would be a great presence running off the line at centre bounces and generally getting up into midfield contests.
- Looks more comfortable as a leading into space type than a contested inside 50 pack marker.
- Is a lovely field kick but patchy set shot. Would prefer him bringing the ball into the 50 rather than finishing.

A forward line of:

Dahlhaus/Redpath/Crameri
Stringer/Boyd/Dickson

Would certainly stretch a few defences.

I'd nearly swap Stringer and Dahlhaus for two reasons. Stringer has more room to turn his man inside out higher up on the flank, and Dahl roving to Boyd is salivating.

 

[Mattdougie]

Thanks for the responses.

Seems there is a big split on the forum! I think a lot will depend on what forward line is deemed best to work with (tall/tall with focal point/small/small with focal point) by the coaching staff.

Redpath plays every week mate.

We have zero ruckman coming through(no Campbell isn't the answer and never will be) so Red becomes a back up to a ruckman that isn't capable of doing all the work.

I actually think Mino will be back to his best this year and now with 4 back on the bench you need a back up ruck and Boyd isn't the man for the job he is a permanent forward

 

[cats2rise]

Ohhh I forgot about scrapping of the sub rule. Fair point.

 

[bobs head soup]

I'd nearly swap Stringer and Dahlhaus for two reasons. Stringer has more room to turn his man inside out higher up on the flank, and Dahl roving to Boyd is salivating.

Yeah, thinking Dahl is more of a high half/midfielder these days. Maybe move him out altogether onto a wing/rotating with the onballers and make it:

Stringer/Redpath/Crameri
Dickson/Boyd/Maclean

 

[HowBoutThemDoggies]

Quickly, off the top of my head
Morris Hamling Boyd
Wood Roberts Murphy
JJ Wallis Macrae
Dahlhaus Crameri Dickson
Stringer Boyd McLean
Minson Libratore Bontempelli
Int: Suckling Roughead Hunter Picken
Em: Stevens Biggs Redpath

Christ that was hard, which is a good thing. Stevens very stiff, not convinced Rough and Will will both play so Stevens in for one of them.

 

[NthBondiDoggies]

Would love to see Redpath play a Mooney role - this was great for Hawkins when he started out and will be great for Boyd too. He can both crash packs and play in front of packs stopping big key defenders pushing into Boyd from the front - with him coming from CHF back Boyd can come forward to the ball from deep and cause nightmares. He also shepherds really strongly and can give some back to the pain in the &$se defenders that just whack into you. We can't let Boyd cop the double teaming that Jones copped. And we want Stringer playing his own game not a role. If Redpath can do this and do a bit of ruck we should be happy.

He is also a good long kick. Having a CHF who can pot them from outside of 50 can really spread a Defence and a couple of goals downtown can lift a team.

The teams we envy just seem to have so many options that we always seem to have some mismatch playing them. I want to see us doing this to others.

Dickson Boyd Crameri
Stringer Redpath Dalhaus

This is very hard to match up on - key tall defenders need to take Boyd and Redpath - the third tall defender needs to play on stringer - but will be too slow. The mid defender needs to play on Crameri - but will be too small - if you go bigger he will run you into the ground. Dickson is a nightmare and like Breust doesn't miss. Leaves Dalhaus - arguably the best player and very hard to match up on - especially as he moves in and out of midfield to burn off small defenders - then when he moves into the midfield - we move Bonti forward and you have a big forward (ala Fyfe) and another mismatch.

Plenty of other moves but these are obvious and hard to address.

 

[Dogsman16]

Would love to see Redpath play a Mooney role - this was great for Hawkins when he started out and will be great for Boyd too. He can both crash packs and play in front of packs stopping big key defenders pushing into Boyd from the front - with him coming from CHF back Boyd can come forward to the ball from deep and cause nightmares. He also shepherds really strongly and can give some back to the pain in the &$se defenders that just whack into you. We can't let Boyd cop the double teaming that Jones copped. And we want Stringer playing his own game not a role. If Redpath can do this and do a bit of ruck we should be happy.

He is also a good long kick. Having a CHF who can pot them from outside of 50 can really spread a Defence and a couple of goals downtown can lift a team.

The teams we envy just seem to have so many options that we always seem to have some mismatch playing them. I want to see us doing this to others.

Dickson Boyd Crameri
Stringer Redpath Dalhaus

This is very hard to match up on - key tall defenders need to take Boyd and Redpath - the third tall defender needs to play on stringer - but will be too slow. The mid defender needs to play on Crameri - but will be too small - if you go bigger he will run you into the ground. Dickson is a nightmare and like Breust doesn't miss. Leaves Dalhaus - arguably the best player and very hard to match up on - especially as he moves in and out of midfield to burn off small defenders - then when he moves into the midfield - we move Bonti forward and you have a big forward (ala Fyfe) and another mismatch.

Plenty of other moves but these are obvious and hard to address.

Great Analysis NBD!!! Agree with all of it. Toby McLean will be sniffing about in there too has major talent and can see him starting round 1.

I think that Redpath could become pretty damn important especially considering the amount of times our main ruck was resting on the bench and then we had our secondary ruckman in the middle yet we were badly struggling taking contested marks in the forward line with Stringer the only 190cm + option in the forward line. That means that we could have Redpath/Boyd sharing the second ruck duties and then still have a big big target in the forward line on all occasions. It also means that Boyd won't be having to march up and down the ground all game and blow his tank out and then yet still have to be the second ruck option.

What it also does is that it allows Bev to go with the more mobile ruck option (like Roughead) over Minson because someone like Redpath can push up the ground and play 3rd man up (like he did so effectively against North Melbourne - great way we neutralised Goldstein) yet still have that really tall option up forward. Make no mistake about it, it was a great move on Bev's behalf but it somewhat cost us in the forward line when Tarrant was taking a huge number of intercept marks. Tom Boyd would be stopping that virtually straight away.

FB: Wood, Roberts, Morris
HB: Boyd, Hamling, Murphy
C: JJ, Bont, Hunter
HF: Crameri*, Redpath, Dickson
FF: Dahlhaus, Boyd, Stringer
R: Roughead#, Liberatore, Wallis
Int: Macrae, Stevens, Picken, Suckling
Emg: McLean*, Biggs, Campbell

* If Crameri is rubbed out then we still have 3 talls and add a small forward/mid rotation which I am happy to do and Mclean comes straight in.
# Roughead should only start in my view if he has decent ruck support, if we only go with Boyd and no other real big tall in the forward half, meaning that Boyd has to be the 2nd ruckman for 20 - 30% game time, we are better off picking minson as it keeps Boyd in the forward line for longer

 

[Dazb86]

B: Wood Roberts Boyd
HB: JJ Hamling Murphy
C: Hunter Libba Suckling
HF: Stringer Redpath Dahlhaus
F: Dickson Boyd Crameri
R: Minson Bont Wallis

Int: Macrae, Picken, Morris, Stevens

Our weakest area is still the tall backs.

 

[CaptainMurphy]

Would love to see Redpath play a Mooney role - this was great for Hawkins when he started out and will be great for Boyd too. He can both crash packs and play in front of packs stopping big key defenders pushing into Boyd from the front - with him coming from CHF back Boyd can come forward to the ball from deep and cause nightmares. He also shepherds really strongly and can give some back to the pain in the &$se defenders that just whack into you. We can't let Boyd cop the double teaming that Jones copped. And we want Stringer playing his own game not a role. If Redpath can do this and do a bit of ruck we should be happy.

He is also a good long kick. Having a CHF who can pot them from outside of 50 can really spread a Defence and a couple of goals downtown can lift a team.

The teams we envy just seem to have so many options that we always seem to have some mismatch playing them. I want to see us doing this to others.

Dickson Boyd Crameri
Stringer Redpath Dalhaus

This is very hard to match up on - key tall defenders need to take Boyd and Redpath - the third tall defender needs to play on stringer - but will be too slow. The mid defender needs to play on Crameri - but will be too small - if you go bigger he will run you into the ground. Dickson is a nightmare and like Breust doesn't miss. Leaves Dalhaus - arguably the best player and very hard to match up on - especially as he moves in and out of midfield to burn off small defenders - then when he moves into the midfield - we move Bonti forward and you have a big forward (ala Fyfe) and another mismatch.

Plenty of other moves but these are obvious and hard to address.

You have gone a long way towards convincing me to put Redpath in, I'll be honest.

 

[TempletonTheRat]

FB: Morris, Roberts, Wood
HB: Boyd, Hamling, Murphy
C: Macrae, Wallis, Hunter
HF: Crameri, Redpath, Dickson
FF: Dahlhaus, Boyd, Stringer
R: Roughead, Bontempelli, Liberatore
Int: Picken, Johannisen, Mclean, Suckling

Emerg:
Stevens, Biggs, Honeychurch

Depth:
Webb, Daniel, Dale
Prudden, Jong, Hrovat
Minson, Campbell, Adcock

Cover:
C Smith, Cordy, R Smith
Hamilton, Adams, Collins
Dunkley, Williams, Lynch
Goetz

 

[Super Hans]

I'd nearly swap Stringer and Dahlhaus for two reasons. Stringer has more room to turn his man inside out higher up on the flank, and Dahl roving to Boyd is salivating.

I reckon people are missing the mark a bit on Dahl. I think he will still spend a lot of time in the midfield this year. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bontempelli/Wallis/Dahl as our starting centre bounce guys at the start of the year while Libba finds his feet.

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

I reckon people are missing the mark a bit on Dahl. I think he will still spend a lot of time in the midfield this year. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bontempelli/Wallis/Dahl as our starting centre bounce guys at the start of the year while Libba finds his feet.

I'm interested to see what happens with Macrae. He developed his inside game tremendously and became one of those starting centre bounce guys; I'm interested to see whether he's pushed back onto the wings or whether he continues his development as an on-baller.

Personally? I favour Macrae at the centre bounce as Dahl has a greater level of versatility - he's a superb forward as well as a superb midfielder, and can play the wing role with aplomb also. Macrae, in my opinion, is much more dangerous starting inside the contest than anywhere else, particularly as he continues to develop his inside game/strength.

 

[Super Hans]

I'm interested to see what happens with Macrae. He developed his inside game tremendously and became one of those starting centre bounce guys; I'm interested to see whether he's pushed back onto the wings or whether he continues his development as an on-baller.

Personally? I favour Macrae at the centre bounce as Dahl has a greater level of versatility - he's a superb forward as well as a superb midfielder, and can play the wing role with aplomb also. Macrae, in my opinion, is much more dangerous starting inside the contest than anywhere else, particularly as he continues to develop his inside game/strength.

It's not a bad problem to have. My preferred starting three until Libba is 100% back is Bontempelli, Macrae and Dahlhaus with Wallis and Picken next in.

I think all those players are versatile, especially Dahl, Picken and Bontempelli. Macrae's elusiveness around the contest is unique, I don't think it gets the credit it deserves. People still view him as an 'outside seagull'.

His game in the final was very good around the contest. Certainly come a long way compared to the win at the SCG.

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

It's not a bad problem to have. My preferred starting three until Libba is 100% back is Bontempelli, Macrae and Dahlhaus with Wallis and Picken next in.

I think all those players are versatile, especially Dahl, Picken and Bontempelli. Macrae's elusiveness around the contest is unique, I don't think it gets the credit it deserves. People still view him as an 'outside seagull'.

His game in the final was very good around the contest. Certainly come a long way compared to the win at the SCG.

I do really like that starting three. There's a good mix there of extraction, spread, skill and vision. Of course Libba is an automatic in if/when he's right to shoulder the load in the middle but for me a mix of any three of Bontempelli/Macrae/Dahlhaus/Wallis/Picken/Stevens still makes for a bloody good midfield, even if Libba does need a few rounds to work his way into it. Chuck two of JJ/Suckling/Biggs/Hunter alongside them and we're not going to have much issue getting opportunities forward of the ball provided everything clicks. Exciting. We've gotta work on capitalising more and also conceding less marks/over the top goals, but the midfield isn't a concern for me, Libba or no Libba.

Agree on Macrae, too. I've seen him referred to as an outside seagull way too many times. He needed to move into the contest to reach his full potential and he's well on his way to doing so. As he continues to develop that offensive running from the centre bounce is going to be absolutely deadly.

 

[bobs head soup]

If Libba's not 100%, I can't see Wallis not being in our starting clearance combo. He won over 6 clearances a game last year, not too far away from Libba's 8 per game and amongst our all time best. I do like the idea of Wallis/Bont/Macrae as a big bodied clearance unit to start quarters (until Libba's ready).

 

[Doggies7]

I really think Bev and the coaching staff will do to Libba what they did with Wallis and force him to play more FWD or other un-natural positions to help develop his all round game. I remember when people here though Wallis was expendable because he was too on-dimensional, slow and could only play inside mid. Definitely proved us wrong with how good he looked going forward and became a dangerous goal-kicker. Maybe they will give Libba a run in the backline? His hardness, tackling and ball winning ability there could be valuable and would help him learn about what it's like to play as a defender and be accountable for a FWD. Obviously long term he is a star inside mid, but like I was saying, to help develop him as an all round footballer.

 

[Roddy]

G'day Dogs, just finished watching a replay of our game against you in Tassie last year. We accounted for you pretty easily in the end that day, but there was great promise shown by your team. I'm fascinated to see how your forward line structures up this year, with Boyd, Crameri, Dickson and Stringer (all of whom I think played that day). How tall are all those blokes? I know Boyd is ruckman size. Will you be a little top-heavy with all those guys down there?
I sincerely hope the Dogs can get up and be a really good side this year, and play finals.

 

[Dogsman16]

G'day Dogs, just finished watching a replay of our game against you in Tassie last year. We accounted for you pretty easily in the end that day, but there was great promise shown by your team. I'm fascinated to see how your forward line structures up this year, with Boyd, Crameri, Dickson and Stringer (all of whom I think played that day). How tall are all those blokes? I know Boyd is ruckman size. Will you be a little top-heavy with all those guys down there?
I sincerely hope the Dogs can get up and be a really good side this year, and play finals.

We got slaughtered in that last quarter of that game and were missing Bontempelli, Wood, M.Boyd and both Wallis and Morris didn't come back on in the first quarter. Certainly wouldn't have changed that result but with those guys we might have been within 6 or less goals.

But with our forward line I think our board is split 50/50 as to how tall we play. It seems as though Stringer, Dickson and Crameri are the absolute mainstays of our forward line but the board is divided as to whether both Redpath and Boyd play in the same side. If they both play we probably have the advantage of an extra tall that is always is in the forward line whilst the other can give the chop out ruck option. The downside is that they both prefer to play deep and its probably a bit taller than we have gone in the past. Stringer also loves being one out as the deep option.

Whatever happens Stringer will generally take the best key defender which is an absolute lifesaver for Boyd and Redpath as they can develop without the pressures of taking the best defender. Seemed to be a trend in the latter part of season 2015, teams bailed out on playing mediums on Stringer but instead would line up D.Talia, T.Mcdonald etc those type of number 1 shutdown defenders.

I'd say we should pick both Boyd and Redpath because I think that means Roughead gets more help in the ruck as both can give a chop out and when we need to we can always have Boyd deep who even early in his career nearly always brings it to ground.

Boyd (201cm) Stringer (192) and Crameri (190cm) is very similar to the Hawks structure (in terms of size) in 2014 with Roughead (193), Gunston (193) and that resting ruck McEvoy/Hale. Hawthorn's forward line is similar to ours in that do you play that extra tall like you did with Schoenmakers or do you play the mobile setup. Both structures have its merits.

Dickson is like 183cm so he's more a small forward but has good marking ability and set shots are obviously very good.

 

[Roddy]

We got slaughtered in that last quarter of that game and were missing Bontempelli, Wood, M.Boyd and both Wallis and Morris didn't come back on in the first quarter. Certainly wouldn't have changed that result but with those guys we might have been within 6 or less goals.

But with our forward line I think our board is split 50/50 as to how tall we play. It seems as though Stringer, Dickson and Crameri are the absolute mainstays of our forward line but the board is divided as to whether both Redpath and Boyd play in the same side. If they both play we probably have the advantage of an extra tall that is always is in the forward line whilst the other can give the chop out ruck option. The downside is that they both prefer to play deep and its probably a bit taller than we have gone in the past. Stringer also loves being one out as the deep option.

Whatever happens Stringer will generally take the best key defender which is an absolute lifesaver for Boyd and Redpath as they can develop without the pressures of taking the best defender. Seemed to be a trend in the latter part of season 2015, teams bailed out on playing mediums on Stringer but instead would line up D.Talia, T.Mcdonald etc those type of number 1 shutdown defenders.

I'd say we should pick both Boyd and Redpath because I think that means Roughead gets more help in the ruck as both can give a chop out and when we need to we can always have Boyd deep who even early in his career nearly always brings it to ground.

Boyd (201cm) Stringer (192) and Crameri (190cm) is very similar to the Hawks structure (in terms of size) in 2014 with Roughead (193), Gunston (193) and that resting ruck McEvoy/Hale. Hawthorn's forward line is similar to ours in that do you play that extra tall like you did with Schoenmakers or do you play the mobile setup. Both structures have its merits.

Dickson is like 183cm so he's more a small forward but has good marking ability and set shots are obviously very good.

Wow, I even forgot Redpath, he obviously wasn't playing that day.

Man you guys have got some serious forward depth. Exciting times.

 

[JJHunter]

I reckon people are missing the mark a bit on Dahl. I think he will still spend a lot of time in the midfield this year. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bontempelli/Wallis/Dahl as our starting centre bounce guys at the start of the year while Libba finds his feet.

Libba is an interesting one.... will need to learn a forward game to fit into Beveridges plans.
All our centre square mids last year spent sent significant time forward and all did well at different times.
Just off the top of my all our mids outside of macrae can play a fwd role.

 

[JJHunter]

I do really like that starting three. There's a good mix there of extraction, spread, skill and vision. Of course Libba is an automatic in if/when he's right to shoulder the load in the middle but for me a mix of any three of Bontempelli/Macrae/Dahlhaus/Wallis/Picken/Stevens still makes for a bloody good midfield, even if Libba does need a few rounds to work his way into it. Chuck two of JJ/Suckling/Biggs/Hunter alongside them and we're not going to have much issue getting opportunities forward of the ball provided everything clicks. Exciting. We've gotta work on capitalising more and also conceding less marks/over the top goals, but the midfield isn't a concern for me, Libba or no Libba.

Agree on Macrae, too. I've seen him referred to as an outside seagull way too many times. He needed to move into the contest to reach his full potential and he's well on his way to doing so. As he continues to develop that offensive running from the centre bounce is going to be absolutely deadly.

Macrae has been told to work on forward craft - all the players you mention above were effective forward bar him last year. No sub rule means he will spend more time there.

 

[Dogsman16]

Wow, I even forgot Redpath, he obviously wasn't playing that day.

Man you guys have got some serious forward depth. Exciting times.

Hmm after that though we don't have any KPF's at VFL level. Just blokes who ruck that can pinch hit forward.

I'd say we might look to trade in a young CHF who might not have got the opportunities at his present club but might crack our best 22 as that Nick Riewoldt push up the ground type style of CHF. Deep options we have plenty.

Although If Crameri is rubbed out we only have 3 players who can man those KPF positions. Our top line quality is good (Stringer is fantastic) and those other 2 will get better and better but I'd like another depth option as cover if either Redpath doesn't make it or injury.

But there is a very good chance we could see all four of Stringer, Boyd, Crameri and Redpath in the starting line up particularly due to Crameri and Stringers well above average mobility.