The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast *MB thread*

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

I don't know what toilet paper you write your scoops on but IF you are any sort of journalist, you would have access to media releases and associated press stories. The media in Perth, the WCE football club and past players openly admit to a drug problem at the Eagles. Radio in Perth are even suggesting Cousins was counselled to undergo rehabilitation.

Show me the evidence.

I'm not going to take your word for it - your credibility was shot 20 pages back.

Cousins has been reported to have been abusing illicit and prescription drugs, and has escalated this use over the last three weeks due to relationship and personal problems.

Evidence?

I haven't read any of those reports. Where did you see them?

Gunner you have been so stoik in your support and steadfast refusal to accept anything that you don't deem to be acceptable.

It's not about what I deem acceptable.

Cousins has messed up, but I'm not going to immediately assume it's drugs-related.

But my poor pompous fool, time to catch up with the news, the problem is real, is documented and very unfortunate for the eagles.

Can you point me towards some of the documentation that you say exists?

How utterly courageous of you to drop off the site for a day and come back towing the party line you supplied for the last week. Didn't have the strength of character to log on yesterday....

You think it takes "strength of character" to go online?

I guess you need to keep the battles small to begin with.

Now run along surely there must be something to contibute to the school newsletter like an upcoming fete or cake stall.

But I'm still waiting for you to make a real argument or present some of the glaring evidence you claim exists.

Not only are you woefully inadequate your grandstanding and attempts to portray a superior intellect are crumbling like the happy facade the eagles portayed for the last five years.

Who are you trying to fool?

You haven't made an argument. Your condescending tone isn't going to conceal the fact that everything you've posted is completely hollow.

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Like I said Gunnar, the word is "bordering". And that implies that there is a problem.

I'm cutting and pasting from the Australian's website.

I thought it looked a bit clunky, but I'm not going to edit it without having heard the quote myself.

You can replace the word if you want - I think the meaning is still pretty clear: Worsfold believes his club is clean, but can't guarantee it.

Do you accept that that's what he said, or do you still insist that Worsfold admitted that the club has "a drug problem"?

If you can't understand that, then maybe you need some English lessons because you don't comprehend semantics.

Is this what you've been reduced to?

You're trying to claim vindication because of someone else's sloppily-reported quote?

Come on. That's lame.

You're not that desperate, are you?

 

[understudy]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Semantics are irrelevant Gunner, there are problems at WC and it is hurting the club and your prospects for 2007.

Denialism wont help.

 

[lovesmahfooty]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

You haven't made an argument. Your condescending tone isn't going to conceal the fact that everything you've posted is completely hollow.

only thing hollow here sport is your mushy melon, now run along and why don't YOU print an article refuting all these vicious media beatups?

Surely you being a journalist can talk to your editor to allow you to print the other side story. You say theres no proof, get your newspaper to allow you to print a two page expose on why these stories are spreading quicker than hotcakes even though you know them to be fallacious, you do that my son and I'll buy a copy for everyone of the misguided majority on bigfooty.

The proof is out and it's spreading quicker that Benny leaving a booze bus, surely you can be the hero of the day and get Benny his job back

 

[Chewy]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

I'm still waiting for definitive proof that the moon is round and not just a big block of cheese.

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Semantics are irrelevant Gunner....

Semantics are irrelevant.

Why do people keep insisting that's what argument rests on?

Do you even know what that word means? Can you illustrate how my argument is based on semantics? Or do you just drop it in because you think it makes you sound clever?

there are problems at WC and it is hurting the club and your prospects for 2007.

Time will tell.

Denialism wont help.

Denialism?

Who made this word up?

I'm asking for evidence before drawing a conclusion. Do you think that's unreasonable?

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

only thing hollow here sport is your mushy melon, now run along and why don't YOU print an article refuting all these vicious media beatups?

Surely you being a journalist can talk to your editor to allow you to print the other side story. You say theres no proof, get your newspaper to allow you to print a two page expose on why these stories are spreading quicker than hotcakes even though you know them to be fallacious, you do that my son and I'll buy a copy for everyone of the misguided majority on bigfooty.

The proof is out and it's spreading quicker that Benny leaving a booze bus, surely you can be the hero of the day and get Benny his job back

Still no argument.

Even the people who agree with you are going to recognise the fact that you're whistling in the wind.

You can attack me all you want. It doesn't diminish the argument I've made.

 

[m0nty]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Gunnar, I heard the quote myself on 6PR just then, and Howard Sattler even repeated the word as being "bordering". Trust me on this one, at least.

You're the one who is sounding desperate. I'm not going to state it a third time, but if you continue to deny that Worsfold is admitting that there is a drug problem, then it's useless talking to you because you're not even trying to stay logical.

If you are a journalist, you must know as well as anyone how the media, and those who speak through it, constrain their public statements in a situation like this to avoid liability. Thus we get all these double negatives and passive sentences to make sure that the issue is not alleged directly. You are hiding behind this practice and pretending that there is not an elephant in the room.

If there was not a problem, then why is everyone dancing around it? It's just common sense, Gunnar. Use it. Even your buddies in the West Coast forum think you're being obnoxious.

 

[Milkman]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Denialism wont help.

How can it?

It doesn't exist.

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Gunnar, I heard the quote myself on 6PR just then, and Howard Sattler even repeated the word as being "bordering". Trust me on this one, at least.

OK.

but if you continue to deny that Worsfold is admitting that there is a drug problem, then it's useless talking to you because you're not even trying to stay logical.

This is what Worsfold said:

“We are bordering on a club that is totally free from drug use. I believe our club is drug free at the moment but I can't guarantee it.”

You think that's an admission that WC has a "drug problem"?

That's not what I read from that quote.

You are hiding behind this practice and pretending that there is not an elephant in the room.

I've maintained one line throughout: show me the evidence.

People are claiming Gooding and Worsfold are admitting to all sorts of stuff that simply isn't borne out in their actual quotes.

 

[understudy]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Semantics are irrelevant.

Why do people keep insisting that's what argument rests on?

Do you even know what that word means? Can you illustrate how my argument is based on semantics? Or do you just drop it in because you think it makes you sound clever?

Time will tell.

Denialism?

Who made this word up?

I'm asking for evidence before drawing a conclusion. Do you think that's unreasonable?

Facts are Cousins has been suspended, will definitely miss round 1 and likely many more. You need to face facts and accept the problems at hand, whether they be with alcohol, illicit drugs or whatever else.

 

[m0nty]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Yes, that's an admission. If West Coast was clean, he would say so. He said they were only bordering on it. Thus he's admitting, to the many people who are asking and want to know, that the club is not clean.

 

[doppleganger]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

For a club to have "a drug problem", it has to be more widespread than 1-2 guys. Agreed?

for an entire club yes, but what about ben cousins?? is he is one of those two players u refer to??

If the minority is small enough, then it's not really "a drug problem".

seems it is a problem for ben cousins tho

If you have two guys who have a substance issue, then it's a bit rich to say the club has "a drug problem".

again, seems that cousins has a problem

You're yet to produce a direct quote where Worsfold admitted that the club has "a drug problem".

you fail to produce a quote where any west coast person has denied that they have a prodblem, they still plead ignorance

I've produced a direct quote. You haven't.

“We are boarding on a club that is totally free from drug use. I believe our club is drug free at the moment but I can't guarantee it.”

perhaps woosha thinks they are drug free because they have suspended cousins, he hopes he is the only bloke with the porblem but can't gaurantee it

You're the one "twisting the language". You're the one insisting that a "small minority" of players can create a club-wide "drug problem".

if ur 'spiritual leader' has a drug problem and has been suspended by the club, what does it suggest about the other players who follow their 'spiritual leader'?

 

[Corpuscles]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Sensational effort Gunnar!

No one who loves footy wants there to be a prob at Wet Toast!

great courage to bat on ( no pun intended )

Journalism isn't your bag!... have you considered comedy?

 

[moistie]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

OK.

This is what Worsfold said:

“We are bordering on a club that is totally free from drug use. I believe our club is drug free at the moment but I can't guarantee it.”

You think that's an admission that WC has a "drug problem"?

That's not what I read from that quote.

That's because you're in denial. Everybody else who is not in denial reads that quote and thinks "(West Coast) is a club that is now (believed by the administration to be) totally free from drug use (but they still can't be 100% sure)".

Given a recent high profile exclusion from the club, that is a damning statement. Prior to Cousins meltdown, he wouldn't have made that statement, would he? And he still cannot be sure the club is drug free.

I've maintained one line throughout: show me the evidence.

Do me a favour:
1. Get an Atlas.
2. Open it to Egypt
3. Tell me de name of the River that runs through it.

As I've been asking you all along, do you think that these respected sporting (and non-sporting) journalists would publish these stories without having solid evidence there was a problem? Please answer that question with a straight yes or no, and if no then WHY?

It's okay, Gunnar. You were strident in defending your club, just as I would have been. I can respect that.

Yes, this blow-up has made you look stupid and opened you for ridicule amongst the BigFooty community, but give it up.

You would be the sole person on this site that is still trying to claim the problems that West Coast are facing are not drug related. Even your own clubs administration is saying as much. Your continuing insistence is just making you look childish.

Admit you were wrong. Move on. You'll at least have people respect you for it and walk away with some semblance of dignity left.

 

[lovesmahfooty]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Hang on Gunnar? how did you make the leap from no players, no factual evidence, no problem, to ok 1 or two players but that does not indicate a drug problem??

For me a captain being stripped of his position, reprimanded and finally suspended certainly seems to be a problem. Kerr is another with a problem, especially after being arrested for illegally obtaining valium, argue the semantics regarding that valium is legal drug, still does not make his actions legal. Chad Fletchers defense seems to be as credible as your flimsy denials.

The eagles are said to have had ultimatums from senior players, punchups between team mates and a recent history of turmoil, but you still argue exactly what constitutes a drug problem?

For me the Ben Cousins saga alone is a massive blow and indicative of exactly what occurs when your type of denial persists, keep thinking up big words and shaking your head but this is only the tip of the iceberg.

 

[The Fireman]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Funny stuff ,a poster has made an absolute knob of himself and instead of just saying "Ok I was wrong" has continued to defend the indefencible.
Has anyone thought he may be taking the pi$$ ? Can someone be so sarcastic ?I think not.
Champagne comedy.
Here is to you Gunnar longshanks

 

[FuManchu]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Hey Gunnar, have a look at the Herald Sun home page.

He's in drug rehab

 

[lovesmahfooty]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Hey Gunnar, have a look at the Herald Sun home page.

He's in drug rehab

Don't be silly it just shows the character of the man, taking time off a decorated footy career to fly to the states and help out people with drug problems, I mean if he can use all the drugs over there there wont be any left for the poor unfortunates will there

 

[Polo_14]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Can either of you make an argument?

There's four pages of people baiting me to return.

So many muppets giving themselves high fives when I wasn't around.

I'm here now, and you've still got nothing.

The only muppet is you mate. How's damage control treating you. Aarogant piece of ****, even in light of everything that is surfucing, you still cannot admit your wrong.

There is about 33 pages of evidence right here that you are an absolute knob

Well done ****bag

 

[skilts]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Hey Gunnar, have a look at the Herald Sun home page.

He's in drug rehab

Which shows how much you know. As Gunnar will tell you, Cousins is in rehab. for treatment of an addiction to chocolate. I wish Cousins all the best for a speedy recovery and look forward to the day when he has no need for such unsavoury substances.

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Facts are Cousins has been suspended, will definitely miss round 1 and likely many more. You need to face facts and accept the problems at hand, whether they be with alcohol, illicit drugs or whatever else.

I accept that he's been suspended and will miss some footy.

I accept that he has some issues, whatever their nature.

But I don't automatically accept that his issues are related to illicit drugs.

I haven't seen any hard evidence that points to that - that's been my position throughout this thread, so maybe you should try to engage it.

 

[giantsully]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Wow, indefinitely suspended without pay, told not come anywhere near the club, sent off to drug rehab - and all for just missing training?

Hey Gunnar, any idea what sort of punishment he faces if, just say, they find out he's been using drugs?

 

[Gunnar Longshanks]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Yes, that's an admission. If West Coast was clean, he would say so. He said they were only bordering on it.

It's got more to do with the fact that he can't guarantee the club is clean.

Also, how many players need to be using for the club to have a "drug problem"?

If there are 2-3 guys involved, does that constitute a pattern widespread enough to say the club has a "drug problem"?

I don't think it does.

I reckon most clubs have a few players who have used drugs. Do all of those clubs have a "drug problem"? Of course not - for that phrase to apply, the problem needs to be widespread.

 

[giantsully]

Re: The Great Beat-Up: The Drug Problem at West Coast

Also, how many players need to be using for the club to have a "drug problem"?

Mike Sheahan spoke about rumours of 12 Eagles players (current & some recent retired) - will that do for starters?