catempire
Premium Platinum
Appropriate this is in the “I was wrong” thread. Just not in a self-aware way!
Opinion The I Was Wrong thread- Where Tom Atkins posts go to die
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I was wrong about Zuthrie.
I thought he was done and the only reason he was on the list was his brother, figured he'd struggle to play a game this season, especially if we were contending, and he'd likely be gone.
Nup.
He's been very good to great all year holding down a key post and has brought some quality ball movement and offensive play into his game.
Now a key player.
I thought he was done and the only reason he was on the list was his brother, figured he'd struggle to play a game this season, especially if we were contending, and he'd likely be gone.
Nup.
He's been very good to great all year holding down a key post and has brought some quality ball movement and offensive play into his game.
Now a key player.
cats_09
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I'd suggest the club did back him in and gave him opportunities at senior level when his form wasn't exactly warranting of continued selection
At some stage though he needed to take that next step, and play at a level where he wasn't in the omission discussion - he did that in his first season, but he didn't perform at a high level on a consistent basis across seasons 2 & 3, making it an easy choice for the MC to look at other players
As for the trade deal, here's the main question from that - if instead of receiving pick 22 in the trade for Clark, we negotiated to get Fremantle's pick 19 instead, would we have still selected Conway or one of the 3 players taken before we called out Toby's name?
Sure, pick 19 sounds better on paper - but if we're just going to use that selection on the same player we call out 3 names later, is it really worth stressing over or calling the deal a stuff up?
I thought Tom Atkins would only ever be big hearted, but average.
His whole year has been very good. I thought he might have been done too- but there you go- never write off a champion.
- Thread starter
- #1,031
Ahh, it's not unreasonable to write off a champion when they're 34
Almost every one of our other 2007-2011 players has been pretty much cooked by 34, bar Enright, Ablett and Hawkins.
No doubt he can play.
Would he have got a regular game under our regime and setup as it stood back when he made his decision to leave?
Notwithstanding the Scarlett stories, I feel that there were other factors in play that we are unaware of.
Maybe application, or ability to perform the roles required? Perhaps he was just impatient. Not everyone is as stoic as Zac Guthrie.
The go home factor and a virtually guaranteed place in the side that were on offer from Freo would have made it hard to keep him onboard.
Good luck to him. He has obviously landed on his feet.
Still grates a bit when I see his name in Freos best…
fpm84
Brownlow Medallist
I was 100% wrong about Tom Atkins. His form over the last three months has been a key reason why we are currently on top.
Reality of the situation with Clark was he desperately wanted to go home and his family wanted that as well- big time.No doubt he can play.
Would he have got a regular game under our regime and setup as it stood back when he made his decision to leave?
Notwithstanding the Scarlett stories, I feel that there were other factors in play that we are unaware of.
Maybe application, or ability to perform the roles required? Perhaps he was just impatient. Not everyone is as stoic as Zac Guthrie.
The go home factor and a virtually guaranteed place in the side that were on offer from Freo would have made it hard to keep him onboard.
Good luck to him. He has obviously landed on his feet.
Still grates a bit when I see his name in Freos best…
I don’t think he would be the player he is now if he stayed - Freo value run off half back and his skill set suits the wide expanse of Optus extremely well.
He’s a very good user in space and good on him , he’s making it count
Win / win for both Clubs.
Haha. Yep- he’s amazing. Not sure if his body is just pretty right after a couple of patchy years, or it’s just his old stalwart -will power. Extraordinary really.Ahh, it's not unreasonable to write off a champion when they're 34
Almost every one of our other 2007-2011 players has been pretty much cooked by 34, bar Enright, Ablett and Hawkins.
cats_09
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No doubt he can play.
Would he have got a regular game under our regime and setup as it stood back when he made his decision to leave?
Notwithstanding the Scarlett stories, I feel that there were other factors in play that we are unaware of.
Maybe application, or ability to perform the roles required? Perhaps he was just impatient. Not everyone is as stoic as Zac Guthrie.
The go home factor and a virtually guaranteed place in the side that were on offer from Freo would have made it hard to keep him onboard.
Good luck to him. He has obviously landed on his feet.
Still grates a bit when I see his name in Freos best…
I do wonder how things would have played out without that shutdown period due to covid during early 2020 and the impact that had on what came next - Clark seemed to be one of the few Geelong players who went back interstate during the league shutdown period; our Irish lads stayed out here for that period, we then had Cooper team up with Selwood to be training buddies etc.
I don't blame Clark for wanting to go home & be with family during that time especially as there was a lot of uncertainty, but when you then read him talk about that time at home you start to get an impression that returning to Geelong wasn't necessarily going to be an easy thing - obviously back home he was isolated from the club & his teammates with the need for self motivation to keep on top of things, and he spoke about the struggle with that at times because there wasn't someone pushing you to make sure you kept up with the fitness program or doing those extra drills etc
Then when returning to the club, there's restrictions on player movements during the week before ultimately going into a hub situation where there's a lack of family. And while there was ultimately a family hub environment up in Qld, that was wives/partners & kids, not you mum & dad or siblings, so again it could potentially be isolating for a younger player who is away from their family & friends and thrust into a totally football environment without too many options for an escape
We then dealt with further issues again during the 2021 season, and for some players the best environment for them is one that's closer to home, especially during somewhat uncertain times - that may be the exact situation for Clark
I doubt there's any Geelong fan who didn't want to see Clark become a top line player for the club, but after a couple of difficult years he did seem to stagnate with us and you get to the point where the best option for all involved is a fresh start & clean slate - good luck to him with things at Freo
Pure_Ownage
TheBrownDog
The first one i agree.
The second one i disagree strongly...it comes down to 2 things...1. Was he going to ask to go again this year if not best 22? Yes. And 2. Would we have got far less for him in a trade at end 2022? Absolutely yes.
Which is why trading him for 24 and a future 3rd was the right call as it was selling high.
Anything else would have been selling low.
- Thread starter
- #1,038
I should be a bit clearer: if we had done the first (played him in the seniors off half-back) then we wouldn't have had to trade him for a pick in the 20s. Once we were into October, yep, we were only getting p22 and fair enough.
dazbroncos
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Clark ( who dont wanna be here) become Conway ( who do wanna be here) and Conway fills a bigger list need now than Clark ever could.
Net net its a win for Clark and a win for us.
Im moving on .... ir is this gonna become Caddy like.
GO Catters
Net net its a win for Clark and a win for us.
Im moving on .... ir is this gonna become Caddy like.
GO Catters
Blitz - really doubted his ability to play effectively as a utility in the middle/wing after ( some time ago) Gaff torched him and Townsend got hold of him in a Final.
Thought he'd best be used exclusively in defence.
What a weapon he's turning out to be - very happy to have got this one wrong
Thought he'd best be used exclusively in defence.
What a weapon he's turning out to be - very happy to have got this one wrong
I was wrong about Joel. Whenever we have a bad trot (it’s been a while), I keep saying he should have retired a few seasons ago. I will now keep my mouth shut on that topic - he will know when it’s time to go.
Jackington
Back Flank Battler
You're not alone here. I thought this for much of the first half of the season.
Bloke's come back with a vengeance.
MacStradbroke
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Remember when we drafted him, big get but we’d only have him until 25 due to degenerative knees
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The first two paragraphs could now be read with Sav in mind.
catempire
Premium Platinum
Still would have been worth it. Last 11 years have been cream. Incredible.Remember when we drafted him, big get but we’d only have him until 25 due to degenerative knees
Great story from Lingy on the club podcast this week about when the skipper came down to training at the Cattery (as part of the AFL Academy) in the early stages of 2006. After a couple of days, a number of players went to Wellsy and told him you have to do whatever you can to get this bloke. He already looked like he was part of the group and it was as if he had been around the place for several years.
Wells told them thanks very much but that there was next to no chance that a gun like Selwood would be available at their pick. We were coming off PF/SF finishes in the previous two seasons, and Joel was pretty much expected to go at pick 1. As events unfolded, of course, our 2006 season imploded, leaving us with pick 7 to take to the draft. And Joel did his knee and slid (somewhat) down the pecking order.
And this is where it gets even better. Wells apparently told his wife before heading off to the draft that if he was able to call out the name of either J. Selwood or T. Boak on the night, he would be a very happy man. So when Boak went at pick 5 to Port, Wells thought he was done and started formulating his next plan for how to salvage the pick. When, lo and behold, the Hawks called out the name of M. Thorp at pick 6 instead. Supposedly he couldn't get the words out quick enough (and was stumbling over the syllables) when he then announced J. Selwood with our pick. Only to coolly slide one T. Hawkins onto the list with pick 41 (father/son) a little later on as well.
And so, through the acquisition of the skipper, a huge component of changing our club's trajectory was locked into place. Not mostly through astute talent identification but instead through a series of unforeseen circumstances and missteps from others (and even ourselves, in having such a pitiful '06 season). And the Hawks (who have supposedly 'cost us' so much, according to some) actually played their part in confirming our '07 - '11 ascendancy.
Sometimes truth is absolutely stranger than fiction.
Jackington
Back Flank Battler
I think my biggest "I Was Wrong" this year has been about Tom Atkins.
Before the season started, I took a look at our list, and I couldn't squeeze him into our best 22. Much as I loved his endeavour and heart, I thought he was fringe at best.
Behind the footy, there was no way Tuohy, Duncan or Bews were missing out for him, and forward of the ball, the addition of Stengle meant he was going to struggle to fit back into his old home.
But boy did I underestimate the damage he could cause in the middle.
The biggest points of difference for 2022 Geelong over 2020 & 2021 Geelong for me have been:
Before the season started, I took a look at our list, and I couldn't squeeze him into our best 22. Much as I loved his endeavour and heart, I thought he was fringe at best.
Behind the footy, there was no way Tuohy, Duncan or Bews were missing out for him, and forward of the ball, the addition of Stengle meant he was going to struggle to fit back into his old home.
But boy did I underestimate the damage he could cause in the middle.
The biggest points of difference for 2022 Geelong over 2020 & 2021 Geelong for me have been:
- Stengle
- De Koning
- Midfield Atkins
- Freedom Blicavs
- Full Cylinders Stanley
I was wrong about the club never being able to assemble another potent forward line around Hawkins before he retired. Around 2014-2019, it was dire at times and I think a key reason why we didn't nab a flag during that period.
Rohan, Cameron, Close and Stengle later (I know a couple of those we already had, but as an overall unit it was still lacking) - our forward set up is now a strength rather than an Achilles heel.
Rohan, Cameron, Close and Stengle later (I know a couple of those we already had, but as an overall unit it was still lacking) - our forward set up is now a strength rather than an Achilles heel.
Pure_Ownage
TheBrownDog
Fair point and i agree we should have played him last year more (think scarlett had too much say there) but once we didnt and he asked for a trade pick 22 + future 3rd was a good return there was no way known we were getting more in a trade for him at the end of this year.
