Not helping that the mum is absolutely scum, the jury like most of Australia probably wants to see in jail which plays into the defences it was the other POS who did it strategy
On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app
-
AFLW 2024 - Round 4 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Current Trial The Murder of 9yo Charlise Mutten - Blue Mountains * Justin Stein Sentenced to Life in Prison
- Thread starter Dogs_R_Us
- Start date
- Tagged users None
On SM-A125F using BigFooty.com mobile app
Absolutely agree. I think we all want to see KM punished but it shouldn’t cloud the jurors decision.
- Apr 2, 2013
- 11,646
- 17,623
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
Nearing 7 days deliberation now.
You'd expect a verdict anytime. This goes to end of week =10 days and begins to look like a hung jury
You'd expect a verdict anytime. This goes to end of week =10 days and begins to look like a hung jury
I think she probably had an abortion while in hospital. It can be done at the woman’s request up to 22 weeks gestation (after that there are medical sign-offs required, by more than one doctor ). .. and could understand her request, if she did. I certainly would struggle big time carrying the child of someone who had just murdered my daughter.
The other possibly more important consideration however would be for the health of that unborn child, with the mother admitting to her regular use of heavy drugs.
Spectrix
Debutant
- Mar 11, 2024
- 135
- 367
- AFL Club
- Carlton
I'm honestly surprised that the jury have taken this long.
Well after the apparent times that either of the pair were alleged to have killed CM, Kallista was sending text messages to Stein consistent with her encouraging him to look for Charlise and 'Bring our daughter back'. That to me makes ot pretty clear she had no idea that CM was dead.
I suppose Steins defence may be claiming that Kallista was sending those texts to support her plans to report the girl missing.
When I heard this evidence originally, I felt that she was probably running away from him when he shot her from behind. She would’ve fallen from that shot & it seems the a*h has then walked up & shot her in the face. Can you imagine the terror that poor child must’ve endured.What appears to be conflicting specifics on the location of the Pelvis area shots (left lower buttock or above the right hip) as reported by the media about what Forensic pathologist Dr Marna Du Plessis's evidence to the jury in Court.
Interestingly, there is no reported bullet hole damage to the boys track pants, unlike the skirt which had a penetrating damage to the back of it.
If the above the right hip is more accurate than the left lower buttock for where the bullet entered, the bullet might have entered just above where the top of the track pants which might have also been sitting low on the hips.
Alternatively, the conflict in the reporting of what the Pathologist said might possibly be due to the bullet entering above the right hip and exiting or damaging the left lower buttock. I would assume that the jury might have been provided with more details on all of this, and we are just left with court reporters interpretations on what they could see and hear in court.
Charlise Mutten shot directly in the face with gun only a foot away
Nine-year-old Charlise Mutten was fatally shot in the face by a gun held about a foot or 30cm from her, a forensic examiner has told the murder trial of her accused former stepfather, Justin Stein.www.dailymail.co.uk
'Apart from the pink Nike slides, Charlise clothes included a black jacket, red shirt, boys' boys black track pants, a size 10 black Target skirt 'with penetrating damage to the rear' and a sole black, hooped earring in her left earlobe.
An internal examination during the post-mortem revealed lead fragments in the deceased girl's brain and in her left hip.
Examination of the body also found a 5mm x 5mm entry wound to the right cheek where the bullet struck and dislodged a tooth and stuck in the base of the skull.
There was also an oval-shaped entry wound to the lower left back above the right hip which was 5mm high and 8mm wide and had perforated the pelvic bone.'
'Charlise Mutten was still alive when she was shot in the face from 30cm away, jury told'
Forensic pathologist Dr Marna Du Plessis took to the witness stand on Thursday where she told the jury she conducted a post mortem exam on Charlise’s body after it was discovered in the barrel.
The doctor described “powder tattooing” marks around the gunshot wound, which entered just below the girl’s right cheekbone, led her to the conclusion the “end of the muzzle was about a ruler’s length” from Charlise’s face.
Dr Du Plessis told the jury Charlise was also shot in her left lower buttock, a shot she would have survived.
...'
I would expect there would be quite a lot of blood around from these injuries, but I don’t recall hearing of any being found in the house or grounds ? I know it could / would’ve been cleaned up, but the forensics usually still manage to find traces with luminal lights etc.
I could very well be wrong, but I thought it was both of them that went off for a drug binge when C was missing ( K having been told by Stein at that stage that C was in the care of the Auctioneer)
In their druggie world, that was probably equated to other people taking some date time away for dinner etc, which no one has a problem with.
I feel he’s a master manipulator ( irrespective of whether he’s a murder ), his phone content proves he’s a sick minded individual with kiddie fantasies, imo he was disowned by his brother years ago ( hence why they left W and moved to QLD or wherever), and his mother seems prepared to lie for him, despite the fact that he’s already ‘done time’, that he’s a drug addict, and there’s a lot of evidence suggesting he’s murdered a little girl ( as a Mother of an adult son, if he was in this situation I’d be praying with every fibre of my being that he wasn’t responsible. I’d certainly do whatever I could to help - but I certainly would not Lie for him. IMO, if you have to Lie, there’s a huge question to ask, and a huge answer to face )
On the other hand, I think K is desperate for love, in her ‘sober’ times, she desperately wants a normal functioning life & to be a family with her daughter & partner. However she’s so addicted & her brain is so drug addled, that she’s fair game for all he throws at her.
He obviously spruked that he had some exciting activities to do, which made C ask if she could go with him that day - which I think was his Plan. K had to stay put as we heard the witch wouldn’t allow her to be at the Estate - very convenient.
I’m interested in C’s clothing when found. Has it been established that's what she wearing when she left the Caravan Park ? ( or has he fed K drugs at the park so she wasn’t too with it then ) I’m also interested in why she was wearing Track pants in the heat of Summer - and particularly BOY’s track pants.
I can’t imagine that her Grandmother would’ve packed Boy’s track pants for her to take away with her ( more like she would’ve had a shopping trip for pretty new clothes to wear on her summer holiday with Mummy)
So where did those track pants come from ? No bullet hole trace on them, I think they were put on afterwards. …. which in itself convinces me that she was not shot by K (aside from all the other evidence against Stein )
Why is the jury taking so long to make a decision I wonder ?
Spectrix
Debutant
- Mar 11, 2024
- 135
- 367
- AFL Club
- Carlton
This was a 22 calibre rifle which is tiny, the bullets are 5.6mm.
I don't recall the pathologist noting exit wounds which would indicate that each bullet was lodged in her pelvis and head.
The entry wounds are typically small and neat, it's the exit wound that are messy.
He may have had minimal cleaning up to do, it's also not clear where the girl was shot.
I know Mrs Stein was prompting him to claim that she was shot on crown land.
Night she went to stay with him I believe - he told K that C was initially not feeling well, but he gave her some nurofen that morning and now she was in the care of a ‘pretend auctioneer lady’, so they could have their ‘high’ day.
Did he take K back to the Caravan Park after their drug binge, or to the Estate ?
Next thing C couldn’t be found - haven’t heard what excuse the ‘pretend auctioneer lady’ gave for that!
Someone help me out please - was it that night or very early the next morning that K was told that Charlise was missing ?
Without getting too awful - it’s possible he attempted a cleanup. Also, who knows what state the underwear may have been in.
MrsBlueSky
Cancelled
- Apr 5, 2024
- 521
- 524
- AFL Club
- West Coast
You raise some good points.
One thing's for sure the case has had a big effect on many people far and wide.
I was out on the end of a groyne at Fremantle boat harbour on Sunday where I met a bloke who said he worked on the mines with C's grandfather. He had been following the case and had strong views about who was responsible.
Most people would like to return a guilty verdict in 30 minutes but a jury has to work under a fair few constraints, which is probably a good thing to try and get their decision correct.
maggiethecat
Senior List
- Oct 30, 2021
- 183
- 420
- AFL Club
- Richmond
I was under the impression that he took Charlise from the caravan park but K stayed. The next day he said Charlise was sick but left her with the fantasy auction woman and went back to the park to get K and score drugs
Underarrest_
All Australian
- Apr 11, 2024
- 923
- 1,634
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
and then S and K returned to the Estate and neither C or the fantasy auctioneer lady were there.
MrsBlueSky
Cancelled
- Apr 5, 2024
- 521
- 524
- AFL Club
- West Coast
It doesn't seem to be good enough that the jury are out making a decision and we are left in the dark to what the events were for the jury to reach their decision.
How can the jury know what was going on when people following this case do not.
If the jury says Stein is guilty of murder then they should know how that happened.
Otherwise, if the jury know as much as anyone else then it's just a guess if he's a murderer or not.
For example, the auctioneer. If this person existed then why weren't they called to give evidence?
If there is confusion about what happened after C was killed then perhaps it doesn't matter anyway. The jury only has to decide if Stein had killed her not what he did afterwards.
I haven't followed this case but was there any evidence that police gave at the trial that could not be refuted by the defence that pinpointed Stein as the killer?
Does anyone know what I mean?
Underarrest_
All Australian
- Apr 11, 2024
- 923
- 1,634
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
In Stein’s own words, the auctioneer didn’t exist. In about his third story, he said it was K’s idea to come up with that scenario. I’m not sure how much evidence they have on Stein but I think at the start of the trial there was mention of one day being suppressed from the media.
rdhopkins2
Carpe Diem
Stein guilty. Gutless coward.
Poor kid. Her family left to cope as best they can for the rest of their lives.
Poor kid. Her family left to cope as best they can for the rest of their lives.
BFew
Don Pyke Fan Clubber
- Mar 5, 2017
- 16,026
- 40,770
- AFL Club
- West Coast
- Other Teams
- West Coast Lions
Percel
Victorian’s love a good potato scallop
Cooked
Dogs_R_Us
Space Traveller
- Thread starter
- #1,069
How Davenport could bring herself to utter this outrageous nonsense is a disgrace.
“My submission to you is the accumulation of the things happening in Kallista Mutten’s life that week … taking ice every day, being rejected by Justin Stein, being rejected by her daughter and knowing she was no longer able to go and live at Mount Wilson had a cumulative effect upon her,” Ms Davenport told the jury in her closing address.
“In order, who knows, to gain attention, to win Justin Stein back, she killed her child.”
She told the jury Ms Mutten was someone who didn’t “take rejection well” and becomes “quite psychotic as a result of being rejected”, claiming it was “the last straw”."
“My submission to you is the accumulation of the things happening in Kallista Mutten’s life that week … taking ice every day, being rejected by Justin Stein, being rejected by her daughter and knowing she was no longer able to go and live at Mount Wilson had a cumulative effect upon her,” Ms Davenport told the jury in her closing address.
“In order, who knows, to gain attention, to win Justin Stein back, she killed her child.”
She told the jury Ms Mutten was someone who didn’t “take rejection well” and becomes “quite psychotic as a result of being rejected”, claiming it was “the last straw”."
- Dec 27, 2016
- 29,571
- 62,121
- AFL Club
- Western Bulldogs
- Moderator
- #1,070
How quickly did they turn on Kallista to try and frame her for the murder of Charlise?
Grubs, the lot of them.
Hallelujah! I was getting very nervous.
Academic Law has no morals
BFew
Don Pyke Fan Clubber
- Mar 5, 2017
- 16,026
- 40,770
- AFL Club
- West Coast
- Other Teams
- West Coast Lions
Probably something his fellow inmates and Correctional Service workers are going to be very interested in finding out too.
He'll probably have a lifetime to explain himself to his fellow inmates.
Similar threads
