The never ending Priddis debate - part II

[kranky al]

Glenn Mitchell was a longtime ABC commentator and someone who I think actually deserves the term 'expert'.

Sorry but what has this got to do with the price of goldilocks in the midfield? Did I miss something here?

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Why is our no 1 mid not even close to being our best footballer though - when :



Shuey is close to our best player. He is a midfielder. Ergo what Johnny says makes sense.

Our no1 starting mid is not in our top players - yet has a Brownlow.

What an interesting dichotomy.

What is a number one mid exactly and why is it necessarily Priddis? Does he line up at more centre bounces than say Shuey?

Not sure about him being "not in our top players" either. His teammates and coaches have consistently put him in their top three, for example, when you look at the B&F votes and the nominations for the AFLPA MVP.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Sorry but what has this got to do with the price of goldilocks in the midfield? Did I miss something here?

I thought Pottering was referring to him as an ex-player so I was correcting him. Is that a problem?

 

[Pottering]

You are missing the point ENTIRELY. It is bloody hard to win a premiership. It takes a lot more than one exceptional midfielder to do it. We struggled to so it in 2006 with 3 exceptional midfielders. But THE starting point IS an exceptional midfielder (or 2 or 3 if you are lucky).
No it isn't Priddis' fault entirely we haven't won a premiership with him in the team. But we start with our so called exceptional midfielder who has won a Brownlow with all of his flaws and we are already behind the eight ball. Yes, Priddis would look better with other exceptional midfielders around him like he did when we had Judd and Kerr there but our other midfielder's don't look better with Priddis there. He is a serious deficiency that they have to make up for.

You mention these other players as if they have the same deficiencies as Priddis. This is the difference between them and Priddis, in their case, they can hold their heads high and say they by and large do everything skill wise and performance wise to get their team as far as possible. But the whole team needs to perform at a high standard to win one.

In our case we don't even start with a great midfielder.

Winning a Brownlow means shit compared to team success. Like I said even the players themselves would trade it for a premiership in an instant. But posters in this board like you can't accept that. You think that this medal and coaches votes cancel out all the shit he has put in over the years.

I get it alright, despite you saying "it isn't Priddis' fault entirely we haven't won a premiership with him in the team", the constant cry in here is we can't win one with him in. Nobody says that about any other player bar a few stragglers like McGinnity. There seems to be a school of thought that unless you're a certified superstar then you're nothing but a list clogger. You say we are behind the eight ball relying on Priddis, I say without Priddis we'd be getting flogged because nobody else has shown an ability to win the hard ball. It's all very well to whine that he's no Ablett, no Dangerfield, no Pendlebury. Many have whined about Priddis geting 3 votes in round 10 last aganist the Pies and Pendlebury 2. Nobody talks about the round 20 clash where we won by 10 goals. AFL.com gave Collingwood's 2 best players as Beams and Pendlebury and ours as Priddis and Butler. Surely 2 gun midfielders like Pendlebury and Beams should have seen another Pies victory? Or maybe it isn't solely about 1 player?

You say it's a whole team exercise but then pretend that that we are held back by one player and the other sides are held back by many, despite having a gun midfielder. What a load of poppycock!

NOBODY is arguing that a Brownlow is preferable to a premiership, NOBODY! That's simply a pathetic attempt to avoid the fact that Priddis was good enough to win a Brownlow despite the massive negatives many people ascribe to him. That says way more about their judgement than Priddis' ability.

 

[Pottering]

I thought Pottering was referring to him as an ex-player so I was correcting him. Is that a problem?

As I never mentioned Glen Mitchell at any stage how did you deduce I might be referring to him as an ex-player? Ergo, no need for any correction as no mistake made.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

As I never mentioned Glen Mitchell at any stage how did you deduce I might be referring to him as an ex-player? Ergo, no need for any correction as no mistake made.

He was the author of the article linked in the post you quoted, with "expert" under his name, so I assumed it was him you were referring to. Never mind, play on.

 

[Pottering]

He was the author of the article linked in the post you quoted, with "expert" under his name, so I assumed it was him you were referring to. Never mind, play on.

Sounds like 6 degrees of Danny Dickfos to me, yes let's play on.

 

[kranky al]

I thought Pottering was referring to him as an ex-player so I was correcting him. Is that a problem?

Sorry - I have pottering on ignore - that's why your post looked like it didn't belong.

 

[kranky al]

What is a number one mid exactly and why is it necessarily Priddis? Does he line up at more centre bounces than say Shuey?

Not sure about him being "not in our top players" either. His teammates and coaches have consistently put him in their top three, for example, when you look at the B&F votes and the nominations for the AFLPA MVP.

He starts in the middle - plays more minutes than anyone else in the middle .......


As for your second point - if you had to get rid of one of: shuey, eMac, nn, Bunga, lecras, gaff, Kennedy, McGovern, darling and Priddis : now let's say for the sake of argument they are all 25

Which one would you ditch?

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

The one who'd get the most value at the trade table I suppose.

What an unlikely hypothetical. Our best ten players are suddenly all the same age, and for some reason we need to get rid of one of them?

 

[kranky al]

The one who'd get the most value at the trade table I suppose.

What an unlikely hypothetical. Our best ten players are suddenly all the same age, and for some reason we need to get rid of one of them?

Way to completely dodge the issue - on the completely and utterly, unashamedly shirk the contest-o-meter - five strings has pulled a 9.9999999 with every single judge dishing out a 10 and even the East German judge chipping in with a 9.9999

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Way to completely dodge the issue - on the completely and utterly, unashamedly shirk the contest-o-meter - five strings has pulled a 9.9999999 with every single judge dishing out a 10 and even the East German judge chipping in with a 9.9999

I said based on coaches votes and teammates' votes he's been in our best two or three players the past few years. You then respond with some ridiculous hypothetical about having to cut one of ten 25 year old players, but I'm the one dodging?

He's clearly been a better player than eg McGovern over the past three or four years. Ditto LeCras who has been a shadow if the player he was before he did his knee. Would I axe those guys before Priddis? No, but that's at least partly because Priddis is near on 30 and history shows players drop off pretty quickly at that point. If they were all the same age? Who knows? Why do I have to cut one? Have I got younger players coming through who could fill in any of their positions? Are any of them overpaid? Am I under pressure to ease the salary cap? Has one of them asked for a trade? That'd make it easier.

 

[kranky al]

I said based on coaches votes and teammates' votes he's been in our best two or three players the past few years. You then respond with some ridiculous hypothetical about having to cut one of ten 25 year old players, but I'm the one dodging?

He's clearly been a better player than eg McGovern over the past three or four years. Ditto LeCras who has been a shadow if the player he was before he did his knee. Would I axe those guys before Priddis? No, but that's at least partly because Priddis is near on 30 and history shows players drop off pretty quickly at that point. If they were all the same age? Who knows? Why do I have to cut one? Have I got younger players coming through who could fill in any of their positions? Are any of them overpaid? Am I under pressure to ease the salary cap? Has one of them asked for a trade? That'd make it easier.

BOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

Compelling retort that

 

[Smotie]

I get it alright, despite you saying "it isn't Priddis' fault entirely we haven't won a premiership with him in the team", the constant cry in here is we can't win one with him in. Nobody says that about any other player bar a few stragglers like McGinnity. There seems to be a school of thought that unless you're a certified superstar then you're nothing but a list clogger. You say we are behind the eight ball relying on Priddis, I say without Priddis we'd be getting flogged because nobody else has shown an ability to win the hard ball. It's all very well to whine that he's no Ablett, no Dangerfield, no Pendlebury. Many have whined about Priddis geting 3 votes in round 10 last aganist the Pies and Pendlebury 2. Nobody talks about the round 20 clash where we won by 10 goals. AFL.com gave Collingwood's 2 best players as Beams and Pendlebury and ours as Priddis and Butler. Surely 2 gun midfielders like Pendlebury and Beams should have seen another Pies victory? Or maybe it isn't solely about 1 player?

You say it's a whole team exercise but then pretend that that we are held back by one player and the other sides are held back by many, despite having a gun midfielder. What a load of poppycock!

NOBODY is arguing that a Brownlow is preferable to a premiership, NOBODY! That's simply a pathetic attempt to avoid the fact that Priddis was good enough to win a Brownlow despite the massive negatives many people ascribe to him. That says way more about their judgement than Priddis' ability.

No nobody has argued that at all but what you and others have done is try to justify his position in the team overlooking all his failures and deficiencies by pointing out over and again that he won a Brownlow. This despite the fact that we havent done jack shit with him since he was a regular in our team. You say its everyone elses fault but the team has been changing since he joined it and the only constant really is Priddis.
So all the other midfielders that have come and gone we useless and it was their fault not his. The other mids we have don't butcher the ball like he does, don't turn the ball over like he does, CAN run the other way defensively like he cant, can turn a bit of speed on which he can't....but he won a Brownlow and it is all their fault...
So they don't get the ball 30 times a game like he does.,..and maybe therin lies our problem. Let Shuey get the ball 30 times, or Yeo etc and see the difference. What was that you are about to type? They CAN'T you say? Bullshit...you don't know until he isn't there DEMANDING his prime position.

 

[Smotie]

What is a number one mid exactly and why is it necessarily Priddis? Does he line up at more centre bounces than say Shuey?

Not sure about him being "not in our top players" either. His teammates and coaches have consistently put him in their top three, for example, when you look at the B&F votes and the nominations for the AFLPA MVP.

And yet he wasn't good enough for the AA team and can't hit a barnyard door from 3 meters away by foot...
These are the players I would pick ahead of Priddis.

Darling, Shuey, Kennedy, Yeo, Emac, Rosa, NN, Shephard, Gaff, Lycett and Lecras. So not in my top players at the club.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

None of those players were good enough for AA either. MacKenzie was the only other good enough for the extended squad. And his disposal by foot is just as bad

 

[Godfather32]

When virtually all the players are parroting this line you may have a point. Interesting how he is an "expert", presumably as a current player, but ex players, coaches, ex coaches, umpires and paid professionals are summarily dismissed as of no consequence in this forum when they're labelled collectively as "experts".

 

[Pottering]

No nobody has argued that at all but what you and others have done is try to justify his position in the team overlooking all his failures and deficiencies by pointing out over and again that he won a Brownlow. This despite the fact that we havent done jack shit with him since he was a regular in our team. You say its everyone elses fault but the team has been changing since he joined it and the only constant really is Priddis.
So all the other midfielders that have come and gone we useless and it was their fault not his. The other mids we have don't butcher the ball like he does, don't turn the ball over like he does, CAN run the other way defensively like he cant, can turn a bit of speed on which he can't....but he won a Brownlow and it is all their fault...
So they don't get the ball 30 times a game like he does.,..and maybe therin lies our problem. Let Shuey get the ball 30 times, or Yeo etc and see the difference. What was that you are about to type? They CAN'T you say? Bullshit...you don't know until he isn't there DEMANDING his prime position.

Yet again you spin a line that is just plain false. Priddis winning the Brownlow is just ONE measure of how highly regarded he is, by me and others. I have listed other things like the F&B results, AFL coaches awards, All Australian squads, etc. To suggest "all" I have done to justify his position is note his Brownlow is either an outright lie or you have not bothered to read what I've written. You tell me.

You seem to be suggesting that for the other midfielders who haven't been good enough to take over from Priddis that it wasn't actually their fault, but Priddis'! What kind of drugs are you on? You prattle on about how they don't butcher the ball as if though there all elite ball users, they ain't. And more importantly they aren't hard ball winners, that's where Priddis stands out like a beacon in this team. You say "let" Shuey or Yeo get it 30 times a game as though that's merely a matter of removing Priddis and this will magically happen. And now it's Priddis himself "DEMANDING his prime position"! Does he have the match committee hypnotised? Perhaps he's blackmailing them? Again, you tell me.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

This despite the fact that we havent done jack shit with him since he was a regular in our team. You say its everyone elses fault but the team has been changing since he joined it and the only constant really is Priddis.

And LeCras, and Hurn, and Kennedy.

 

[Godfather32]

Yet again you spin a line that is just plain false. Priddis winning the Brownlow is just ONE measure of how highly regarded he is, by me and others. I have listed other things like the F&B results, AFL coaches awards, All Australian squads, etc. To suggest "all" I have done to justify his position is note his Brownlow is either an outright lie or you have not bothered to read what I've written. You tell me.

You seem to be suggesting that for the other midfielders who haven't been good enough to take over from Priddis that it wasn't actually their fault, but Priddis'! What kind of drugs are you on? You prattle on about how they don't butcher the ball as if though there all elite ball users, they ain't. And more importantly they aren't hard ball winners, that's where Priddis stands out like a beacon in this team. You say "let" Shuey or Yeo get it 30 times a game as though that's merely a matter of removing Priddis and this will magically happen. And now it's Priddis himself "DEMANDING his prime position"! Does he have the match committee hypnotised? Perhaps he's blackmailing them? Again, you tell me.

The fact that we haven't had great midfielders for the last few years is clearly the fault of our recruitment team. The fact that Priddis still can't kick to an under 12's level is only one mans fault. There's no use having 20 hard ball gets a game if 15 of them end up straight back in the other teams hands.

 

[Smotie]

And LeCras, and Hurn, and Kennedy.

Hmmm nobody in the midfield. So it must be everyone else not Priddis. Let's keep turning over the midfield because it's not Priddis' fault.

 

[Smotie]

Yet again you spin a line that is just plain false. Priddis winning the Brownlow is just ONE measure of how highly regarded he is, by me and others. I have listed other things like the F&B results, AFL coaches awards, All Australian squads, etc. To suggest "all" I have done to justify his position is note his Brownlow is either an outright lie or you have not bothered to read what I've written. You tell me.

You seem to be suggesting that for the other midfielders who haven't been good enough to take over from Priddis that it wasn't actually their fault, but Priddis'! What kind of drugs are you on? You prattle on about how they don't butcher the ball as if though there all elite ball users, they ain't. And more importantly they aren't hard ball winners, that's where Priddis stands out like a beacon in this team. You say "let" Shuey or Yeo get it 30 times a game as though that's merely a matter of removing Priddis and this will magically happen. And now it's Priddis himself "DEMANDING his prime position"! Does he have the match committee hypnotised? Perhaps he's blackmailing them? Again, you tell me.

F&B, Brownlow, Coaches, Boundary Umpires awards, Ball boy awards, Dancing girl awards...Academy Awards..impressive list for Pridda.

Tell me again what finals game he brought us from the brink and saved for us? What game againsta top eight team he busted through and did something remarkable like a Judd, heck I would even accept an Embley type performance in the 06 GF .

All you rattle on about is votes and awards but can't tell me jack shit about any exceptional or remarkable feats he has done for us on a big game.

He won a Brownlow did you know though?

Since he has been a prime part of our midfield which has turned over 100 percent (except Rosa if you classify him in the midfield) since he has been there we have won nothing of note. But it is all the others fault didn't you know. So now we start rebuilding the midfield again...Lamb and Duggan etc..will it be their fault too?

By DEMANDING his position I mean he can't play anywhere else on the field. He has too many deficiencies to do that.

 

[Miguel Sanchez]

How are we starting rebuilding the midfield again? Gaff, Shuey, Masten, Selwood, Wellingham have all been there for a few years now.

 

[Pottering]

F&B, Brownlow, Coaches, Boundary Umpires awards, Ball boy awards, Dancing girl awards...Academy Awards..impressive list for Pridda.

Tell me again what finals game he brought us from the brink and saved for us? What game againsta top eight team he busted through and did something remarkable like a Judd, heck I would even accept an Embley type performance in the 06 GF .

All you rattle on about is votes and awards but can't tell me jack shit about any exceptional or remarkable feats he has done for us on a big game.

He won a Brownlow did you know though?

Since he has been a prime part of our midfield which has turned over 100 percent (except Rosa if you classify him in the midfield) since he has been there we have won nothing of note. But it is all the others fault didn't you know. So now we start rebuilding the midfield again...Lamb and Duggan etc..will it be their fault too?

By DEMANDING his position I mean he can't play anywhere else on the field. He has too many deficiencies to do that.

Thanks for that non-retraction of your claim that "all" I base my stance on is Priddis' Brownlow win.

Priddis' strength isn't the stellar moments of a Dangerfield but the start to finish ball winning ability (like a Josh Kennedy, Sydney version). You, like so many others, are befuddled by his tremendous performances in so many different awards and keep harping on about "what's he done?" as if those awards mean squat and were voted on by dunces. That's just arrogant. Just as silly is this constant whine that our lack of silverware all rests on Priddis' shoulders. His teammates must love him, he takes all the heat, while they get off scot free.

And how, in any universe, is your claim that his "DEMANDING" his position is contorted to mean he can't play elsewhere? Clearly we were taught English differently.