Solved The Peter Falconio Disappearance

[Lace_Out]

She recognised it and the police obtained her DNA from it off memory.

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[Bunk Moreland]

Unfortunately many theories postulated are in the 'internet sleuth' style of reverse deduction: start with the crime scene and then backfit things that could somehow make it fit.

Lees and Falconio being drug runners is the perfect example. What shred of evidence is there for this? Who were they working with or for? What evidence is there for that, how did these two tourists from the other side of the world come into contact with them and start working for them?

 

[royboys4eva]

I'm with the Bunk. Where after all these years is the evidence they were dealing in drugs or working for drug dealers/runners? Just because they took drugs for their own personal pleasure doesn't make them suddenly involved in drug deals. Not one person has said anything that would indicate they were involved. Not even anonymous call to Police.

If backpackers were used to move drugs surely someone would have said something in the last 20 years. Stone silence. How does someone like Murdoch who was paranoid about being followed - suddenly decide to deal with a couple English backpackers..

I don't think there is any doubt he murdered Falconio - the only tiny doubt is the reason? But in the end he killed him and thats why he is in jail.

 

[footyfan1978]

AFAIK there was at least one co-driver in his truck( this being the #$%& guy who cleaned her up at the road station), at this point he has not mentioned/confirmed red car. Why wasn't he questioned about this in the documentary?

That guy was asleep, if I recall the episode correctly.
Only the driver was upright, awake and seeing the red car.

 

[MSB ROYS]

Why did the UK police show a JL a picture of Murdoch and others after she knew he was arrested for the crime? Is this procedure or sloppy police work given that they had been pursuing Murdoch for awhile?

Why did they police have to arrest Murdoch to get his DNA sample? It's hard to believe that they hadn't matched it previously from a discarded item.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

Why did the UK police show a JL a picture of Murdoch and others after she knew he was arrested for the crime? Is this procedure or sloppy police work given that they had been pursuing Murdoch for awhile?

Don’t think this happened. It was published on the Internet when he was arrested, which is where she saw it.

 

[Lace_Out]

Unfortunately many theories postulated are in the 'internet sleuth' style of reverse deduction: start with the crime scene and then backfit things that could somehow make it fit.

Lees and Falconio being drug runners is the perfect example. What shred of evidence is there for this? Who were they working with or for? What evidence is there for that, how did these two tourists from the other side of the world come into contact with them and start working for them?

The reasoning for then possibly running some drugs is due to it being common around those parts by all reports.

For example PF & JL are sitting outside a watering hole smoking some Alice Malice, or whatever they call it up there and BM or someone else smells it. The next step is approaching them and asking them if they want to earn a little extra cash. The chance to earn some extra spending money out there are next to none. So maybe a common answer is tell me more etc..

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[Kurve]

If backpackers were used to move drugs surely someone would have said something in the last 20 years. Stone silence. How does someone like Murdoch who was paranoid about being followed - suddenly decide to deal with a couple English backpackers..

They have, I'll try and find the reference. Apparently backpackers are used to take the gear in for the exchange, known heads stay out of the town and under the radar that way.

 

[Kurve]

We'd need more than this though obviously to say that's what was really going on.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

The reasoning for then possibly running some drugs is due to it being common around those parts by all reports.

For example PF & JL are sitting outside a watering hole smoking some Alice Malice, or whatever they call it up there and BM or someone else smells it. The next step is approaching them and asking them if they want to earn a little extra cash. The chance to earn some extra spending money out there are next to none. So maybe a common answer is tell me more etc..

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Yes but that’s that whole point - people come up with these stories.

Ultimately it’s pointless. There’s no evidence.

 

[Lace_Out]

We'd need more than this though obviously to say that's what was really going on.

Interesting, thanks for sharing.

Towns are very small and word gets around quickly.

I think most likely it was as most suspect, a drug run gone bad.

There's the possibility JL was the one who organised it and was stupid enough to think she could get away with it, she seems the type. PF could of been blind sided by it..

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[zedx]

We'd need more than this though obviously to say that's what was really going on.

worst video ever but I think, quite a plausible scenario!!

 

[Kurve]

worst video ever but I think, quite a plausible scenario!!

Yeah I know but I quite like him in a very laid back common sense kind of way

 

[Kurve]

By admission, they were smokers and apparently stoned when Murdoch pulled them over. Does anybody recall the police finding any marijuana, loose or otherwise in the kombi, how much of it there was and where it was? Does anybody remember if in the list of stuff they took out of the kombi and inventoried how many packets of cigarettes, loose tobacco and papers were found? Any smoking or rolling kit at all?

I don't recall seeing any. So where was their smoke/paraphernalia? I'm not sure Murdoch would have been interested enough to steal a little bit of personal.

 

[zedx]

By admission, they were smokers and apparently stoned when Murdoch pulled them over. Does anybody recall the police finding any marijuana, loose or otherwise in the kombi, how much of it there was and where it was? Does anybody remember if in the list of stuff they took out of the kombi and inventoried how many packets of cigarettes, loose tobacco and papers were found? Any smoking or rolling kit at all?

I don't recall seeing any. So where was their smoke/paraphernalia? I'm not sure Murdoch would have been interested enough to steal a little bit of personal.

I haven't seen the list. Does any one have access to it??

 

[Girlnextdoor]

Yeah I know but I quite like him in a very laid back common sense kind of way

He drove me crazy the way he filmed with one side of his face not visible. He looked and sounded like Paul Hogan does Phantom of the Opera! Crikey!

 

[megadeth92]

There are a large number of strange things in her testimony. For example, the man and dog could not find her after searching for ages and the fact she had no sign of frostbite when it was about zero degrees that night and she says she was out there for hours. Also nobody has ever heard of or seen a utility where you can get from the front seats directly into the back. There were many more problems but it's a while since I read the books.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

There are a large number of strange things in her testimony. For example, the man and dog could not find her after searching for ages and the fact she had no sign of frostbite when it was about zero degrees that night and she says she was out there for hours. Also nobody has ever heard of or seen a utility where you can get from the front seats directly into the back. There were many more problems but it's a while since I read the books.

Exactly!
NT Police had access to the nations database of vehicles yet couldn't find one which matched the description given by Lees and said it during their interview to which Lees deflected as she had no explanation.
Look at her timeline of events, she claims theyre pulled over, Pete gets out, she gets behind the wheel to rev the engine, hears a bang and the gunman appears, at this point in time PF must be still lying on the road between the assailants ute and the rear of the Kombi, yet when she's marched to his cabin and placed inside she doesn't see PF nor does she see him between then and when she miraculously makes her way into the utes tray.
So where is Pete, he couldn't have been moved already as there was no time between gunshot and her capture and he wasn't moved whilst she was looking out the windscreen of the cab, for this to fit he must have been lying there the whole time, who leaves a body lying on the ground on the side of the road for that long and what was the assailant doing during this time.
The only other thing she claims he did was search for her after she escaped and moved the Kombi, she hadn't escaped at this point so he wasn't searching for her, there is no other evidence other than the bloodstain of PF and no drag mark evidence so Pete didn't get put anywhere other the back of the ute and Lees was yet to find her way in there to escape so he couldn't have been in there yet.
We are to believe BM leaves PF lying on the side of the road dead whilst he restrains Lees, puts her in his ute, moves the Kombi, searches for her and then decides he better hide his murder victim in his now vacant ute tray.
It makes no sense at all when you think about it and that's before you even consider the lack of additional footprints, the time she claims to have been hiding whilst he searched, the weather conditions and her state when discovered.

This is one of those scenario's given whereby you have to want to believe it even though logic, common sense and probability strongly suggest otherwise.

But, but, but DNA they say, that's right, she had BM's DNA on her, the Kombi and lets say it was her hair tie, it still doesn't prove BM pulled the trigger, just that he was there and I have no doubt he was, but I don't believe he's the murderer he's convicted of being.
Should he have done jail time, no doubt, but he shouldn't be kept forever just because he cant say where PF is because i genuinely don't believe he knows.

 

[zedx]

Exactly!
NT Police had access to the nations database of vehicles yet couldn't find one which matched the description given by Lees and said it during their interview to which Lees deflected as she had no explanation.
Look at her timeline of events, she claims theyre pulled over, Pete gets out, she gets behind the wheel to rev the engine, hears a bang and the gunman appears, at this point in time PF must be still lying on the road between the assailants ute and the rear of the Kombi, yet when she's marched to his cabin and placed inside she doesn't see PF nor does she see him between then and when she miraculously makes her way into the utes tray.
So where is Pete, he couldn't have been moved already as there was no time between gunshot and her capture and he wasn't moved whilst she was looking out the windscreen of the cab, for this to fit he must have been lying there the whole time, who leaves a body lying on the ground on the side of the road for that long and what was the assailant doing during this time.
The only other thing she claims he did was search for her after she escaped and moved the Kombi, she hadn't escaped at this point so he wasn't searching for her, there is no other evidence other than the bloodstain of PF and no drag mark evidence so Pete didn't get put anywhere other the back of the ute and Lees was yet to find her way in there to escape so he couldn't have been in there yet.
We are to believe BM leaves PF lying on the side of the road dead whilst he restrains Lees, puts her in his ute, moves the Kombi, searches for her and then decides he better hide his murder victim in his now vacant ute tray.
It makes no sense at all when you think about it and that's before you even consider the lack of additional footprints, the time she claims to have been hiding whilst he searched, the weather conditions and her state when discovered.

This is one of those scenario's given whereby you have to want to believe it even though logic, common sense and probability strongly suggest otherwise.

But, but, but DNA they say, that's right, she had BM's DNA on her, the Kombi and lets say it was her hair tie, it still doesn't prove BM pulled the trigger, just that he was there and I have no doubt he was, but I don't believe he's the murderer he's convicted of being.
Should he have done jail time, no doubt, but he shouldn't be kept forever just because he cant say where PF is because i genuinely don't believe he knows.

Thanks Penfolds, your right the time line of events does not makes sense, where was Pete whilst all this was happening to Joanne? If hypothetically, others were involved and after being shot Pete was taken up to the road and put into the 'little red car' (which the truck driver allegedly saw), it would have mean't the little red car came along much later than the alleged shooting. Which does not make sense as it would have still left Pete by the side of the road for hours. Also why didn't Joanne not see the little red car? I think that knocks the sighting of the little red car out of the water. The only feasible scenario here would be that if others were involved they pulled up directly behind BM's ute (so they couldn't be seen)and immediately took Pete away. But in that case, why did only BM let Joanne see HIS face?? And I still don't understand the moving of the Combi?? It didn't look hidden!

 

[johnymac1]

Has everyone seen the picture of the blood stain on the road, from the TV show.
To me it looks like a pint of blood, the same volume as in a blood collection bag.
It looked to me like an odd pattern.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

Thanks Penfolds, your right the time line of events does not makes sense, where was Pete whilst all this was happening to Joanne? If hypothetically, others were involved and after being shot Pete was taken up to the road and put into the 'little red car' (which the truck driver allegedly saw), it would have mean't the little red car came along much later than the alleged shooting. Which does not make sense as it would have still left Pete by the side of the road for hours. Also why didn't Joanne not see the little red car? I think that knocks the sighting of the little red car out of the water. The only feasible scenario here would be that if others were involved they pulled up directly behind BM's ute (so they couldn't be seen)and immediately took Pete away. But in that case, why did only BM let Joanne see HIS face?? And I still don't understand the moving of the Combi?? It didn't look hidden!

I believe BM was the handler and had been in constant contact with PF and JL since they arrived in Adelaide, i'd say his role was to provide them the drugs and make sure they made it to Alice Springs. They definitely wouldn't have been taking it up the Tanami track in the Kombi which was BM's route of choice so AS would have been the drop point.
Its been suggested that the Kombi had a few issues en route and i'd say Brad being the bush mechanic he was known for, kept it rolling throughout.
There is reference in some literature to the Kombi being seen on the opposite side of the road somewhere between Pt Augusta and AS with someone working on it.
This would explain why BM didn't have an issue with JL seeing his face, she knew him anyway, could also explain his Low Copy DNA on the ignition, steering wheel and gear shift, he might not have even hidden the Kombi, JL might have done it and hid there until she heard the truck coming which would explain the poor attempt at hiding it, there's no way BM would have left it there and thought it hidden knowing that area, it would have stood out like dogs balls, he's not that silly.

I think somewhere before AS PF decided he'd do a runner and JL didn't want to know about it which is why they were seen arguing in AS but she had little choice other than to continue on the journey to Darwin where she had booked a flight to return to Sydney and likely the new flame whilst PF went his own way.
I'd say they became aware of the gravity of the situation at Aileron which is why JL went out and spoke to the person the roadhouse attendant served the pie without sauce with reference to the dog, she was probably pleading her disapproval at PF's antics in hope of distancing herself from the fallout and it looks like if that's the case, it worked.

This is all just IMO, but certainly fits the jigsaw much easier than the OS Lees bumbled her way through.

 

[zedx]

Has everyone seen the picture of the blood stain on the road, from the TV show.
To me it looks like a pint of blood, the same volume as in a blood collection bag.
It looked to me like an odd pattern.

it has been mentioned some where, that forensics could make out the 'pattern' of the blood on the road, meaning they did not know what type of wound could have caused the blood to fall onto the road in that way, they didn't think it could have been from a gun shot wound.

 

[Krusty Crab]

Yep, Bulls Transport ran 2up from Darwin to Adelaide, the reason you run 2up is to keep moving, in order to keep moving one has to sleep whilst the other drives.
Think about it, old mate wouldn't have woken over the gradual stopping due to the red car which is why he wasn't mentioned, but standing on the anchor as a woman runs out in front of the truck would certainly get your attention.

ive talked about this with some truckie mates before about sleeping while someone else drives. they all say if you trust the guy driving then you can sleep pretty solidly, and the motions of the truck/engine noise gets filtered out. a slow down wouldnt of woken old mate in the bunk as slow downs would be usual through towns or other incidents. jamming on the brakes would get old mate out of bed pretty fast though as you say.

 

[Kurve]

She recognised it and the police obtained her DNA from it off memory.

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No DNA on the hair tie. I looked.

Blood/DNA match to BM on Lees T shirt, actually blood isn't as good for DNA as say skin cells, it can be hit and miss. Low copy DNA mixed match to BM on the steering wheel of the Kombi van and a match on those ridiculous manacles which incidentally look very similar to the ridiculous cuffs Roman Heinze used in South Australia.

EDIT: Not the steering wheel but the gearstick.

 

[Krusty Crab]

Lees admitted to smoking weed with PF earlier on. given the level of security at australian ports of entry, where did the mary jane come from?

not like as a tourist you can roll into an outback town, go to the local bar and ask around for some herbs.

how often did they smoke? how much did they bring with them? did the cops find any during their search? should we believe that they only had one joint on them the whole time, and that when they sparked it up, this was the only time they smoked on their road trip? sounds a bit unlikely to me

was any weed or weed residue found in BM vehicle? i have heard that forensic scientists are now able to check plant structures to see if plants came from the same source, or if they were simply similar plants. would be interesting to see a comparison between BM weed and lees/PF weed.