The PSD 'Threat'

[DangerSloane]

Its a big game of Chicken! If Crows are willing to get nothing, they can push hard. If they are frighten of getting nothing, they will be weak in their dealings.
If Cats are willing to let him stay at Crows or go to the draft, they will push a hard deal. If they are desperate to get him, they will be more likely to give up more.

In reality, something in the middle happens and you hope for a fairish deal.

Its naive to think that the crows hadnt sounded out Geelong to see if a deal could be done.
Theyve known for like 6 weeks (and suspected a lot longer) that he isnt coming back.

We arent in a position of power, but I believe we wouldnt be matching unless we know that the parties are pretty close to deal.
I would've said a first rounder either this year or next plus an average player would probably get the deal done.

Personally i suspect last years pick swap might be seen as a bit of good faith from Adelaide and maybe Geelong will now not screw us too much.

 

[Theseventhhamster]

How do you know this?
Who at your club is that stupid?

I know this is an emotional time for you but it would be in no way stupid. We'd be spending a nothing pick and money we have to spare on a gun player who would either come to love the club like the vast majority of players who ever went to a club that wasn't their first preference OR he'd give us a year of service then we'd get a trade for him for a haul which would obviously far outweigh the outlay.

 

[mollyfud]

Its naive to think that the crows hadnt sounded out Geelong to see if a deal could be done.
Theyve known for like 6 weeks (and suspected a lot longer) that he isnt coming back.

We arent in a position of power, but I believe we wouldnt be matching unless we know that the parties are pretty close to deal.
I would've said a first rounder either this year or next plus an average player would probably get the deal done.

I never thought the crows were naive! I think if both the Crows and Cats were smart they would trade in a way that they got the deal done on the side and let Danger go as a FA so one of the picks was the compo picks.

IN the end, the system of FA we use is just bad! If they asked me (and they never would) I would put forward these changes:

• Players become a Free Agent after 6 years but ALL players are Restricted Free Agents (when out of contract) till they are in their 9th or 10th year if there team offer any contract
• None of this going to the draft if you are unhappy with having your contract matched by your original club. If they match, you play for them
• Players shouldn't have the right to veto a trade
• Get rid of the Preseason Draft.
• Any player not on an AFL list at the time of the nation draft become available in that draft.
• Any player not on a list after the National Draft that were available in that draft become unrestricted Free Agents until they join a list (even over different years)
• Free Agents can sign with a club up to round 17 (just a number, can be different number)
• Trading runs till round 7 (or 11 or something) into the season.
• No compensation for losing a free agent.

(Would also be happy if they had a rule where players signing with their current club get a 20% discount on the salary cap hit amount)

JMTC

 

[master bate]

This is my point though.
The blues WILL NOT take him.
Brisbane WILL NOT take him.
They wouldnt be that stupid.

People can say what they want from their clubs perspective, but when it came down to it and they spoke with the player and he said theres no way I'm playing for anyone bar club x, then he gets to his favoured destination.

If you think that's the case... Why didnt GWS take Chad Wingard?

Because there were 5 very good players at the top of the draft for them to take and creating a loyal team was more important to them than getting Wingard especially given that Wingard's value would likely drop after 2 years if he was homesick and not playing well with only 2 SA clubs to bid for him. When Tom Boyd tried the same trick they took him knowing that if he did go back to Victoria that they'd get a fair price for him.

It's risk v reward.

If Dangerfield went in the PSD Carlton would take him for sure.

If he goes in the National Draft then every club between pick 1 and pick 9 have to consider the risk of him sitting out or demanding a trade with the reward. Carlton would probably stick with the number 1 pick because they need to rebuild with youth. The 2 QLD clubs would proper head to the draft as well, no point dragging a guy to QLD who wants to be in Geelong as he'll either sit out or request a trade year after year. But the Victorian clubs next in line would seriously consider him and one of them would pick him up unless Geelong structure a contract that deters them to and with Geelong's salary cap I doubt they can front load a contract big enough to scare off Melbourne, Essendon and St Kilda.

From a Melbourne perspective I'm sure Danger has a decent relationship with Simon Goodwin and Bernie Vince and the club could work with him to even split time between an inner city house/apartment and time in the Geel/Moggs creek region. If he's lived 8 years in Adelaide without complaint I'm sure he could play out the rest of his career in Melbourne. Geelong players live in Melbourne, no reason it can't work the other way around.

I'm sure Essendon and St Kilda would have similar connections.

It's all hypothetical because a trade will almost certainly get done to avoid the situation.

 

[DangerSloane]

Because there were 5 very good players at the top of the draft for them to take and creating a loyal team was more important to them than getting Wingard especially given that Wingard's value would likely drop after 2 years if he was homesick and not playing well with only 2 SA clubs to bid for him. When Tom Boyd tried the same trick they took him knowing that if he did go back to Victoria that they'd get a fair price for him.

It's risk v reward.

If Dangerfield went in the PSD Carlton would take him for sure.

If he goes in the National Draft then every club between pick 1 and pick 9 have to consider the risk of him sitting out or demanding a trade with the reward. Carlton would probably stick with the number 1 pick because they need to rebuild with youth. The 2 QLD clubs would proper head to the draft as well, no point dragging a guy to QLD who wants to be in Geelong as he'll either sit out or request a trade year after year. But the Victorian clubs next in line would seriously consider him and one of them would pick him up unless Geelong structure a contract that deters them to and with Geelong's salary cap I doubt they can front load a contract big enough to scare off Melbourne, Essendon and St Kilda.

From a Melbourne perspective I'm sure Danger has a decent relationship with Simon Goodwin and Bernie Vince and the club could work with him to even split time between an inner city house/apartment and time in the Geel/Moggs creek region. If he's lived 8 years in Adelaide without complaint I'm sure he could play out the rest of his career in Melbourne. Geelong players live in Melbourne, no reason it can't work the other way around.

I'm sure Essendon and St Kilda would have similar connections.

It's all hypothetical because a trade will almost certainly get done to avoid the situation.

If Wingards value would drop after 2 years why wouldnt the player who is almost certain to leave after 2 years if you take him against his will?

Its the same thing.

Even worse because the established player would be a FA and can leave for nothing.

 

[Furn2]

If Wingards value would drop after 2 years why wouldnt the player who is almost certain to leave after 2 years if you take him against his will?

Its the same thing.

Even worse because the established player would be a FA and can leave for nothing.

Danger wont be a free agent, he wouldnt have done 10 years at one club. If Melbourne pick him up, they can trade him at the end of their contract.

They have nothing to lose. they dont have to pay him if he sits out, which will never happen and they get to trade him if he wants to leave.

 

[master bate]

If Wingards value would drop after 2 years why wouldnt the player who is almost certain to leave after 2 years if you take him against his will?

Its the same thing.

Even worse because the established player would be a FA and can leave for nothing.

1. Not a free agent
2. Not as likely to leave once he's settled in and living 1 hrs drive from his ideal destination compared to hours away from his friends and family
3. You're very likely to get at least 2 All Australian level seasons out of him, where as Wingard produced a brilliant 2nd season that was rare for any player his age. The expected return from Wingard at GWS in his first 2 years would've been maybe 20-30 games, a few freak goals, glimpses of his future output.

Crazier things have happened than Melbourne, St Kilda or Essendon with Dangerfield finishing higher on the ladder than Geelong without Dangerfield for the next 2 years which would also help change his mind on moving anyway.

If no one else would take Dangerfield he'd go on the PSD not the ND anyway. Which backs up the point that there's every chance someone will do it if it happened (which again it won't)!

 

[BM123]

Why would Carlton pay 800k plus for a player who doesn't want to play for us?

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

Why would Carlton pay 800k plus for a player who doesn't want to play for us?

Because he is quality and may stay like Nick Stevens.

 

[DangerSloane]

1. Not a free agent
2. Not as likely to leave once he's settled in and living 1 hrs drive from his ideal destination compared to hours away from his friends and family
3. You're very likely to get at least 2 All Australian level seasons out of him, where as Wingard produced a brilliant 2nd season that was rare for any player his age. The expected return from Wingard at GWS in his first 2 years would've been maybe 20-30 games, a few freak goals, glimpses of his future output.

Crazier things have happened than Melbourne, St Kilda or Essendon with Dangerfield finishing higher on the ladder than Geelong without Dangerfield for the next 2 years which would also help change his mind on moving anyway.

If no one else would take Dangerfield he'd go on the PSD not the ND anyway. Which backs up the point that there's every chance someone will do it if it happened (which again it won't)!

The thing is if it was about being in melbourne he would've said any victorian team
if it had been about money he would've stayed, as he would've got more
if it had been about success he probably would've stayed or gone to a hawthorn type club.

Fact is he wants to play for Geelong. Any club getting in the way of that would end up wasting their time and/or money.

 

[Theseventhhamster]

Wasting their time by getting a gun player they could on trade for much more value than he cost if he didn't want to stay after a year/s.

 

[DangerSloane]

Wasting their time by getting a gun player they could on trade for much more value than he cost if he didn't want to stay after a year/s.

He'd be a free agent as soon as his contract ran out. and unrestricted now.
So bye bye for nothing. How could you possibly think you'd get a trade in 2 years time if he didnt go via trade now?

 

[Theseventhhamster]

I'll take him for two years for a PSD pick no worries.

 

[Seedsfan]

But Danger would prefer to play for the Blues for 2 seasons then be banned from the AFL on no income

 

[Blues_Man]

Blues were already in discussions with Stevens when the deal broke down.
They were already a player and he was content to end up there.

Nope ..they wouldn't trade so carlton picked him up in the PSD ..the OP is wrong

 

[Cleric]

If any Vic club didnt pick up Danger for free in the PSD they should sack every single person on their staff and burn the club to the ground. Every damm year they draft players who would most likely prefer to be somewhere else.
Please.

 

[Reservoir tiger]

He'd be a free agent as soon as his contract ran out. and unrestricted now.
So bye bye for nothing. How could you possibly think you'd get a trade in 2 years time if he didnt go via trade now?

But he won't be a free agent...

 

[Crows4Eva]

I think alot of people underestimate how much clubs wish to keep good faith relationships with the other clubs. Sure, they could try to screw another club at the trade table but to do so would be very short-sighted as people have long memories and sooner or later it'll be you with a gun player wanting out and you'll want to be treated fairly when it happens and the best way to do that is to stay on the good side of the other clubs by doing good business for yourself while still treating them fairly.

 

[DangerSloane]

So I thought you couldnt do it this way, but Danger is now saying if picked up in the pre-season draft by another club, he would sign a 1 year deal and then leave.

I thought this wasnt allowed under the current rules? I was certainly told that on this thread.